The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
union budget
Old 1 week ago
  #1
Gear Nut
 

Thread Starter
union budget

Hello!

I'm looking to connect with other union members here who are responsible for drafting budgets.

My main question is how you itemize.

I've been supervising non-union films for a long time, and now that union films are coming around more frequently (tier 1 or below), I need to know the best way to approach estimates.

I've got labor and kit rental separated for each editor (and for the mix), but that's really where my union know-how ends.

I would love to see a blank budget (no numbers, just items) from someone here, or any other form of guidance.

In an old post, I saw 18% mentioned as fringe cost. Is this accurate? I don't plan on adding fringes into my budget (unless that is the norm), but I'd like to take that into account for the total amount.

Haven't seen too many of these types of questions asked around here, but I figured I'd give it a shot before I get on the phone with the union.

Thank you!
Old 1 week ago
  #2
Lives for gear
 
dr.sound's Avatar
 

Check your PM.
Old 1 week ago
  #3
Lives for gear
 

Hi there,
You have to include Fringe in the budget because you have to pay it to the Union, there's no getting around it, along of course with the standard payroll taxes and Workman's Comp, FICA, etc. Oops, I re-read your post and would say that there's no reason not to put Fringes down as a line item, that lets the producer know that you're agreeing to pay the fringes into the Union (unlike a certain facility that got in big trouble for not paying fringes, "What do you mean my insurance expired????")

That said, I don't normally put the actual $$ rates in my line items, just the job titles, number of editorial weeks/mix days, etc

I don't want a producer questioning who I crew up with based on their individual rates- remember, "Union Scale" is the MINIMUM you can pay for a given job title. It doesn't mean "standard rate for everybody"......."How much would it be if you used a cheaper ADR editor?" No way.

I'm sure you knew that part already, just saying it for those who don't

Good luck!
Old 1 week ago
  #4
Lives for gear
 
ggegan's Avatar
Most budgets I've seen use 32-35% of gross pay to figure fringe, and that includes not just MPIPHP health and pension, but also IATSE holiday/vacation pay and, as Joe indicated, payroll taxes such as the employer's share of FICA, Workmans Comp, etc.
Old 5 days ago
  #5
Gear Nut
 

Thread Starter
Thank you all for the help, very useful!
Old 5 days ago
  #6
Kit rental... is anyone actually getting that on low budget films anymore? (tier 0-2?)
Old 5 days ago
  #7
Lives for gear
 
ggegan's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sventeck View Post
Kit rental... is anyone actually getting that on low budget films anymore? (tier 0-2?)
Sometimes. It depends on how you structure the bid. Even on low budget movies, if you basically just have 2 people handling the sound edit and mix then you could very well choose to put some of the money into equipment rather than salary, especially if one of the people owns all the gear.
Old 3 days ago
  #8
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggegan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sventeck View Post
Kit rental... is anyone actually getting that on low budget films anymore? (tier 0-2?)
Sometimes. It depends on how you structure the bid. Even on low budget movies, if you basically just have 2 people handling the sound edit and mix then you could very well choose to put some of the money into equipment rather than salary, especially if one of the people owns all the gear.
Hmm... I haven't put kit rentals in for years now because they're always the first to get cut... I guess putting in something to get cut isn't the worst strategy either...

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeMilner View Post
Hi there,
That said, I don't normally put the actual $$ rates in my line items, just the job titles, number of editorial weeks/mix days, etc
That's an interesting approach... do you get pushback from producers? I tried that once and they requested actual numbers (so they could nickel and dime...)
Old 2 days ago
  #9
Lives for gear
 

That's an interesting approach... do you get pushback from producers? I tried that once and they requested actual numbers (so they could nickel and dime...)[/QUOTE]

Hi there,
So far no, and that's exactly why I just put in the time, and not the rates.

I find that, when comparing bids, producers are looking at the total $$ amount of course, but also (hopefully) the amount of services they GET for that number and then are thus (again, hopefully) comparing apples to apples, along with making sure their director is happy with the key personnel, and with LA traffic, sometimes even the physical location of the stage
Old 2 days ago
  #10
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeMilner View Post
That's an interesting approach... do you get pushback from producers? I tried that once and they requested actual numbers (so they could nickel and dime...)
Hi there,
So far no, and that's exactly why I just put in the time, and not the rates.

I find that, when comparing bids, producers are looking at the total $$ amount of course, but also (hopefully) the amount of services they GET for that number and then are thus (again, hopefully) comparing apples to apples, along with making sure their director is happy with the key personnel, and with LA traffic, sometimes even the physical location of the stage [/QUOTE]

I'll definitely have to try that again...
... how do you then deal with overages if there are no rates established?... do you agree on beyond package rates ahead of time?
Old 2 days ago
  #11
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sventeck View Post
I'll definitely have to try that again...
... how do you then deal with overages if there are no rates established?... do you agree on beyond package rates ahead of time?
Yes, I have a clause for changes and overages based on picture lock and agreed delivery dates, and quote an overall hourly rate for any sound editorial and a separate one for stages, with escalations for evenings, Saturdays and Sundays, pretty much based on the standard Union escalations for 1x time, 1.5x, 2x, etc.

So far, it's rarely questioned, and when it is, I just say, "You know, I've been doing this a long time, and I've done all the all-nighters I'm gonna do. Life's too short"

And if THAT loses me the gig, well, they probably weren't a good fit for me anyway

Granted, I do mostly Independent films and Feature docs- because of budget the picture changes and schedules are NOTHING like years ago when I was working in the studio system......maybe that's one of the reasons I got out!
Old 2 days ago
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeMilner View Post
Granted, I do mostly Independent films and Feature docs- because of budget the picture changes and schedules are NOTHING like years ago when I was working in the studio system......maybe that's one of the reasons I got out!
Yeah that's my market too... more of ten than not the money they have is the money they have.... there's something to be said for that ;-p

thanks for the info.
Loading mentioned products ...
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get instant access to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump