The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 All  This Thread  Reviews  Gear Database  Gear for sale     Latest  Trending
Turning my living room into a studio
Old 16th June 2019
  #31
Lives for gear
 
Deckdaddy's Avatar
Have you considered something like this for the table? I wonder why not many use them, the mastering studio I often get my masters from use that sort of thing for a pretty large desk with little acoustic interference.
Attached Thumbnails
Turning my living room into a studio-56957120-0f31-4247-8c10-681170ee8be6.jpeg   Turning my living room into a studio-c717d69a-636c-4683-bca9-e8b137423873.jpeg  
Old 2 weeks ago
  #32
Lives for gear
 
johannburkard's Avatar
This thread delivers.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #33
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ostfisk View Post
Tried different desk designs! I only need a flat surface where I can put my audio interface, a keyboard, a mouse and then some room for a plate or sheet of paper or whatever. So no rack units or anything. Just four legs and a flat surface.

I bought plywood sheets in different sizes and put them on a keyboard stand. Like this:


Then I did a measurement and looked at the ETC. How loud is the reflection? This was the result:

First I tried different widths.
70 cm (27in) gave a desk reflection of -14.6 dB


60 cm (23in) equaled -15.9 dB


With 50 cm (19in) I got -19.9 dB.


So I figured 50 cm is the maximum width. (-20 dB is my goal)



Next I tried depth.

70 cm gave me a desk reflection of -8.4 dB (the width was 90 cm)


60 cm = -8.3 dB (still 90 cm width)


50 cm = -8.2 dB (I guess the width is the problem here! This board was 90 cm wide too)



Went straight to the 30 cm (12in) deep board.

Now I got -16.9 dB. A lot better but still over -20 dB.


Next strategy was to use the 30 cm deep board and try different distances to the front wall and 75 cm (30in) from the TV got me -20.5 dB. Hurray!



So if I make a design where the desk is no more than 50 cm wide up to 75 cm from the TV I should be good. Like this:



Result:

-15.5 dB! Reflection is still there! Acoustics is not intuitive sometimes! After some talking to Jens (Eklund) he said that the sound is affected by the entire surface and he wasn't surprised by the result! He suggested a perforated surface and that's what I tried next!



Drilled holes into the board in a 60 degree pattern. This was the result:


Well -18.2 dB. Not bad actually. But not -20 dB!



Instead I tried to cut slats into the board!

Now I got - 18.4 dB. But I give up here! I think it's OK! The final version will have slightly wider slats so even better performance! I'm happy with the design now!

Next step is to make this desk out of wood. I'm planning to buy a rectangular keyboard stand with four legs and use that as a base. This one:
https://www.thomann.de/se/km_18950.h...2a50d29c25bb55 It's 40 cm deep, just like my desk.

Then I will try different heights for the monitors and also put the tv on the wall. The project continues!
/Jens
from looking at the pics, i'm pretty sure (some) issues stem less from the ideal desk you're trying to find but from the huge screen; to some extent, sound bends around speakers and causes reflections - did you try moving it closer to the front wall?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #34
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deckdaddy View Post
Have you considered something like this for the table? I wonder why not many use them, the mastering studio I often get my masters from use that sort of thing for a pretty large desk with little acoustic interference.
Thanks for the suggestion!
I don't think I want metal on my desk. (I prefer it to come out of my speakers) Even though it might overperform my design I think I prefer wood!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #35
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah View Post
from looking at the pics, i'm pretty sure (some) issues stem less from the ideal desk you're trying to find but from the huge screen; to some extent, sound bends around speakers and causes reflections - did you try moving it closer to the front wall?
Yes I did try it! More on that in the upcoming post!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #36
Gear Maniac
 

Well, tried to put the TV close to the wall:


Measurements:

The red line is the bare wall (no TV), the blue one is the TV on a stand (26 cm (10in) from the front wall), the green one is the TV on a wall mount. (5 cm (2in) from the front wall). So a lot better with the TV closer to the wall!


Now what about the TV furniture? The computer? Do they cause reflections? The computer sticks out to the right, is it messing with the stereo image?

Well here's measurements with the setup like in the picture above, versus no TV furniture and computer in the middle:

The green line is with the furniture and red one is without it. Like this:


So flatter frequency response without the TV furniture!

Now I've arrived at the finished studio! No more things to try except monitors. Which you might have red about in my other thread in the main forum.


Measurements:
Frequency response:

The blue line is the raw measurement with the microphone centered in the sweetspot, the red line is the same but with EQ added to the monitors via a MiniDSP unit. Managed to get a flat response all the way down to 20 Hz! A boost by 10 dB at 20Hz 8.5 Q and a boost by 3.8 dB at 23Hz 7.8 Q did the trick! Very happy with the result!

Waterfall:


ETC:


Still not done though. I have to build the desk and for that I have to find birch plywood. I did try pinewood but it broke:

Hard to find though. I just want a small piece, 40x90 cm.

And then finally Jens (Eklund) will come over and set the studio up professionally. Looking forward to that!

/Jens
Old 2 weeks ago
  #37
Lives for gear
 

you might try to position the screen quite a bit lower (and then angled), away from the hf/mf tweeters/woofers, more between your subs than the tops; subs are not getting much affected by nearby obstacles (screen/pc tower), lf just gets refracted.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #38
Lives for gear
Do you use miniDSP 4x10 HD or another one?

edit (ok I can see it on your pic )


I'm sure you would get even better results by putting your speakers on dedicated stands.

Sub will send vibrations through this very thin stand. My speakers were on the same kind of stands. My speakers moved because of some vibrations sent from the sub.
I could see it and hear it, I had some distorsions from tweeter.

I think we can't see this kind of distorsion with REW, simply because, when using a sweep for measurement, the sub plays before the speakers. So they don't play at the same time. Speakers is not affected by sub this way. But when we play music...it's different.

Anyway, just my experience! Thank you for sharing your results!

Last edited by JayPee; 2 weeks ago at 06:21 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #39
Lives for gear
And, can you share your last .mdat? And a pic of your rear wall?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #40
Gear Maniac
 

Back wall:

2 feet deep, 1 ft 4 in of rockwool and a 8 in airgap. With 1 cm thick slats on top!

I'll post the .mdat later!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #41
Gear Maniac
 

Here's the .mdat!
Attached Files
File Type: mdat Livingroom studio.mdat (7.38 MB, 5 views)
Old 1 week ago
  #42
Lives for gear
Were these measurements done with the optimised desk? I assume that deep 150hz null is your floor reflection? Clearly visible on your ETC (4ms).

I wanted to create a thread about desk and how they can HELP for this reflection...will do later.

The result is that deep null was compensated by DSP, resulting in a big peak!

How does it sound?

Thanks for sharing!
Old 1 week ago
  #43
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JayPee View Post
Were these measurements done with the optimised desk? I assume that deep 150hz null is your floor reflection? Clearly visible on your ETC (4ms).

I wanted to create a thread about desk and how they can HELP for this reflection...will do later.

The result is that deep null was compensated by DSP, resulting in a big peak!

How does it sound?

Thanks for sharing!
The measurements are without the desk. 150 Hz is probably the floor reflection.

It's still there even after the desk was added. Which is good? Means that the desk is neutral?

I attached a .mdat comparing with and without the desk. The higher bass volume in one of the measurements is due to higher volume on the subs. I must have touched the volume knob accidentally when preparing the second measurement.

Anyway I think it sounds really good. It sounds even and clear. But I haven't much to compare with. Haven't been much to professional studios. And I don't remember how they sounded anyway. It was like five years ago I spent time in one and I wasn't that much into acoustics then as I am now!
Attached Files
File Type: mdat Desk vs no desk.mdat (3.69 MB, 2 views)
Old 1 week ago
  #44
Lives for gear
This is the main question regarding desk.

I don't have THE answer but, you can use your desk to help to reduce (or it can totally disappear) that floor bounce reflection. It's easy to calculate and measure it.

So it's like there are 2 schools :

1. The one who prefers a very minimal desk, iow transparent desk
and
2. The one who uses desk to get rid of that floor reflection.


I will read more about it.

But I had the same problem (we all have this problem before installing desk). And I just use a wood panel as a desk. No more floor reflection. The deep was really deep and really narrow in my case. I will try to do some measurements before/after installing desk.

Anyway! you are in good hand with Jens!


The addition of your desk is barely perceptible on your ETC, the FR changes only between 7k to 10k roughly, but it's very subtle!

Red : no desk
Green : desk
Attached Thumbnails
Turning my living room into a studio-capture-d-ecran-2019-07-13-13.33.21.jpg  

Last edited by JayPee; 1 week ago at 12:37 PM.. Reason: colors
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump