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My EQ won't remove frequencies below 20hz completely! Metering & Analysis Plugins
Old 17th July 2014
  #1
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My EQ won't remove frequencies below 20hz completely!

So I've been producing for a little while and I always try to eq all of my instruments to get a cleaner sound. But I can't seem remove frequencies below 20hz from my Sub bass :/

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dodtc6un0u...0-43-35-73.jpg

There's a screen shot of the eq, I have layered eq upon eq to try get rid of it but I just can't seem to!

I wondered if this could be why my mix sounds a bit dull and lacking a fullness! If I increase gain I lose too many dynamics so how else would I get that full effect? :/

Here is a link to the mix for comparison sake

https://soundcloud.com/ramanan-alvapillai/test-7
Attached Thumbnails
My EQ won't remove frequencies below 20hz completely!-ilbridge-2014-07-17-20-43-35-73.jpg  
Old 17th July 2014
  #2
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spambot_2's Avatar
You have your analyzer set to pre + post mode, which means you're both seeing what comes in and what goes out o the compressor.
You are effectively removing said frequencies from your signal.
Remove all them EQ bands and tick with a 4th order low cut filter if you want a steep cut.

That "full" effect is created by compressing your signal and filling the frequency spectrum with stuff.

To retain some dynamics when compressing, try parralel comporession.

Plus, that link doesn't work.
Old 17th July 2014
  #3
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Even after setting it to simply Post EQ mode I still just a tiny bit LESS frequency below the 20hz range but I will give parallel compression a go as well. I think I fixed the link now. :/

Thanks for the reply!
Old 17th July 2014
  #4
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I'm a little confused on this one.

Firstly, how do you know it's not removing them? You need to pull up a spectrum analyzer on your master fader or post the EQ plugin on the channel strip and see what's showing up there. I wouldn't trust the analyzer within the plugin personally.

Secondly, I want to clarify that you aren't making this assumption based on low cutting at 20hz and simply not "hearing" a change. It is very unlikely that your speakers can even produce signal below 20hz and even more unlikely that you could hear it even if it did. This doesn't mean that 20hz can't add something to your mix as we can "feel" frequencies that we can't hear...but frequencies below 20hz would have to be amplified fairly significantly for them to start messing with your mix.

Now if we were talking 50-60hz...then I would understand.
Old 17th July 2014
  #5
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spambot_2's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Korbin View Post
Firstly, how do you know it's not removing them? You need to pull up a spectrum analyzer on your master fader or post the EQ plugin on the channel strip and see what's showing up there. I wouldn't trust the analyzer within the plugin personally.
Well the post section shows (or should show) what's going out of the plugin, and I wouldn't see why not trusting it.
Double checking though might be a good idea, as well as re-installing the plugin.

I agree with the rest though - don't base yourself of what you're hearing down there 'cause you probably aren't hearing it in any case.
The reason to cut such low frequencies is not to overload amps with stuff you can't hear and to reduce speaker distortion, but if it wasn't just for the sound you might as well leave the stuff under 20Hz there.

Yeah, the link works now.

On the second section the voice gets annihilated by the rest of the instruments, so you may wanna make it stand out more.

Everything lacks high end, something more and something less, but the voice in particular lacks high end quite a bit.

The rest lacks low end IMO.
The only piece of consistent low end you're giving the listener is the bass drum "puuk" around 100-120Hz, and that's why your mix doesn't sound full imo.
I'd put a bass somewhere and compress the low end end of the mix more than the rest, say below 160-240Hz according to taste.
Old 17th July 2014
  #6
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Jazz Noise's Avatar
The problem comes from how these graphs are generated. They're not very accurate at low frequencies at all without very large window sizes, which is unlikely for a little built in graph for an EQ.
Old 17th July 2014
  #7
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I am basing it on the eq spectrum that's shown, not on what I hear. ProQ's analyser shows the eq spectrum on the graph, granted that picture was taken with the spectrum on pre AND post eq mode shown BUT if I change to simply post eq the it still shows large amounts of frequency in the 20hz region. Someone suggested I try an engineer's EQ like rs met's engineer EQ, so Im gonna give that a shot and see as well.
Old 17th July 2014
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spambot_2 View Post
Well the post section shows (or should show) what's going out of the plugin, and I wouldn't see why not trusting it.
Double checking though might be a good idea, as well as re-installing the plugin.

I agree with the rest though - don't base yourself of what you're hearing down there 'cause you probably aren't hearing it in any case.
The reason to cut such low frequencies is not to overload amps with stuff you can't hear and to reduce speaker distortion, but if it wasn't just for the sound you might as well leave the stuff under 20Hz there.

Yeah, the link works now.

On the second section the voice gets annihilated by the rest of the instruments, so you may wanna make it stand out more.

Everything lacks high end, something more and something less, but the voice in particular lacks high end quite a bit.

The rest lacks low end IMO.
The only piece of consistent low end you're giving the listener is the bass drum "puuk" around 100-120Hz, and that's why your mix doesn't sound full imo.
I'd put a bass somewhere and compress the low end end of the mix more than the rest, say below 160-240Hz according to taste.
Do you have any ideas on how to make the Vocals stand out better? I tried carving out some EQ notches but haven't had much luck sadly :/

I'll definitely try add somemore low end compression and frequency at 160hz. Thanks
Old 17th July 2014
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazz Noise View Post
The problem comes from how these graphs are generated. They're not very accurate at low frequencies at all without very large window sizes, which is unlikely for a little built in graph for an EQ.
This.
You need an extremely high resolution spectrum analyzer to see what's going on at 20 Hz.
Old 17th July 2014
  #10
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I agree that the plugin itself should be trust worthy. My point was in this case who knows. Could be a bug...could be something else causing it to not visually show the change so yes to double check with another plugin.

The point is that something within the original plugin (even when set to post eq) is not showing what we think it should based on those extreme eq settings...so checking in another plugin would be my first step .
Old 17th July 2014
  #11
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If love to see the screen shot with just post selected as well...
Old 17th July 2014
  #12
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stinkyfingers's Avatar
 

see what voxengo span shows with block size of 65,536...
what you are seeing on pro-q is just low resolution analyzer as previously stated
Old 17th July 2014
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korbin View Post
If love to see the screen shot with just post selected as well...
Here is the POST EQ only screen shot

I will try Voxengo too I think
Attached Thumbnails
My EQ won't remove frequencies below 20hz completely!-ilbridge-2014-07-18-01-25-01-22.jpg  
Old 17th July 2014
  #14
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stinkyfingers's Avatar
 

use a simple input signal like a 20 Hz sine wave and see what the analyzer shows for that. i bet its a fat lump. ideally it would be a thin line with maybe a little skirt down low...

edit:
this is span w/ 20 hz sine...
resolution: red = 4096, green = 65,536
Attached Thumbnails
My EQ won't remove frequencies below 20hz completely!-ffts.jpg  
Old 17th July 2014
  #15
What happens if you drop a high-pass filter in front of the EQ?
Old 17th July 2014
  #16
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Okay I set Pro Q to the maximum resolution setting and there's no frequencies in the 20hz range! Guess there wasn't really a problem! >.<
Thanks everyone!
Old 17th July 2014
  #17
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skillz335's Avatar
have you tryed trimming your levels to a more manageable "input" amplitude? With the stock PT 11 eqs it makes all the difference. maybe that will translate to the fab filter eq.
Old 17th July 2014
  #18
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Jazz Noise's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by skillz335 View Post
have you tryed trimming your levels to a more manageable "input" amplitude? With the stock PT 11 eqs it makes all the difference. maybe that will translate to the fab filter eq.
Your saying that the plugins suffer from internal clipping/lower headroom than PT itself? That seems a little outrageous - can you post anything to verify this?
Old 20th July 2014
  #19
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Human beings can't hear below 20hz. It shouldn't matter at all.
Old 20th July 2014
  #20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logical Mind View Post
Human beings can't hear below 20hz. It shouldn't matter at all.
I would broaden that to claim that below 20hz it's not sound anymore - you start to hear individual peaks as clicks. A bit like seeing individual frames in a movie.

Conclusion: don't worry, be happy
Old 20th July 2014
  #21
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spambot_2's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Logical Mind View Post
Human beings can't hear below 20hz. It shouldn't matter at all.
Speakers though try to reproduce sounds that low, which is one of the reasons why you hear distortion when you leave too much unnecessary low frequency material.
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