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How to use subgroups and inserts! Dynamics Plugins
Old 2nd March 2014
  #1
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How to use subgroups and inserts!

I just purchased a Behringer Feedback Destroyer FBQ1000, and currently have a Behringer XENYX 2442FX Mixer. I have read the manuals up and down, and it says the best way to prevent feedback in my FOH mix is to either use the feedback destroyer with the mixer's inserts or subgroups - preferably the subgroups.

Anyone have any idea on how to use the subgroups on this mixer? I want to be able to use the feedback destroyer on just the vocal mics in the mix, as not to affect wanted feedback from guitars. But I can't figure out how to make the subgroup connections. Help!

Thanks,

Vince
Old 2nd March 2014
  #2
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matt thomas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dradmv3 View Post
I just purchased a Behringer Feedback Destroyer FBQ1000, and currently have a Behringer XENYX 2442FX Mixer. I have read the manuals up and down, and it says the best way to prevent feedback in my FOH mix is to either use the feedback destroyer with the mixer's inserts or subgroups - preferably the subgroups.

Anyone have any idea on how to use the subgroups on this mixer? I want to be able to use the feedback destroyer on just the vocal mics in the mix, as not to affect wanted feedback from guitars. But I can't figure out how to make the subgroup connections. Help!

Thanks,

Vince
How are you currently using the subgroups on the mixer?

Did you try using a graphic eq before you got the feedback destroyer?

matt
Old 2nd March 2014
  #3
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I do have a graphic eq, but as I am the drummer in the band as well, I needed something that would kill feedback when I'm not at the mixer. I've never used subgroups before - I guess that's what I am asking. I don't know how I would use them. I've read all the hypotheticals about how to use them, but it would be helpful to have a concrete example, in this case for instance.
Old 3rd March 2014
  #4
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matt thomas's Avatar
OK, I've never used a feedback exterminator, but I would guess they mean to put it as an insert on whatever bus is causing the feedback (if it has inserts). So if you are using a vocal bus, put it on that bus. I'm guessing you could also put it on a monitor send that is causing the feedback (if your feedback is coming from the monitors and not front of house).

If you are not using busses for subgroups and just using the mixer as separate channels all going to the master bus, then you could put it on the channel causing the feedback, but this would mean it is only working on the one channel.

Actually, I would GUESS that it is best to put it on monitor sends, and not the actual channels, so that you don't effect the front of house sound. If you don't have inserts in your monitor sends you could just put it after the monitor send output.

then again, I'm not a live guy, I'm a studio guy, so I'm all this is only guessing. Perhaps someone with more knowledge in this area could chime in.

matt

ps. I would also add, that in a properly set up PA, you shouldn't be getting feedback, but I understand that this is a kind of band-aid just in case.
Old 3rd March 2014
  #5
If feedback eliminators are used, they usually get inserted on the mix-out insert of a monitor desk, or an aux insert if the monitors are being mixed from front of house. Usually, if your house is eq'd you should be able to get enough gain out of cardioid mics by just using the channel strip EQ to notch any spikes in the mic's frequency response. If there's a resonant ring that's consistant and relative to several mics, a slight notch of a single filter on your house (or monitor) 1/3 octave eq should fix it.

Usually your groups are set up so that vocals, keys, bass, drums, are assigned to a group, and the group feeds the master bus - so for instance; if you wanted to eliminate feedback on the vocal group you would insert the FBX on the vocal group/s

It's usually best to try to tune your system for flat frequency response, and just eq your mics on the channel strip. Feedback eliminators really shouldn't be necessary on the main mix.. Using good cardioid mics, and speaker placement can go a long way towards eliminating feedback.... anyhow, if you want to use one on a group; assign your channels to separate groups, and assign the groups to the master, and then insert the feedback eliminator on the group.
Old 3rd March 2014
  #6
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Thanks - my subgroups on my mixer do not have inserts, but I can run the bus out to the feedback eliminator and then back to the board to another input or aux. It works! Sadly, as a live band that plays bars, we don't have the space to be able to run the mixer out to the crowd, nor do most bars tolerate the sound check time it takes to get everything right, ring out speakers, eliminate feedback, etc. So we end up doing what we can and rolling with it. So the feedback eliminator is good for us. Thanks for all your help!
Old 5th March 2014
  #7
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Glad that your solution is working. I just thought to add my two cents, which may or may not helpor be advantageous but the more knowledge of options, the better!

Since you said you read up on trying to prevent feedback in your FOH mix, I'm assuming the feedback is between the FOH PA and the mics. IMO, I would just connect the main output of the mixer to the input of the FBD, then the output of your FBD to your PA, assuming that you are not using a powered mixer. If the feedback was caused between the monitors/mics, place the FBD between the bus/aux output and the monitor amp/powered wedge. If you reroute the post FBD signal back into your board, you would be adding extra noise into your mix and/or degrade the signal quality. Depending on the board, this can sound really obvious or not at all. Or maybe someone with a well trained ear is listening in your audience. But Generally, you want the cleanest mix as possible.
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