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Why won't drummers use electronic kit live?
Old 23rd October 2013
  #91
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shreddinator's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sounds Great View Post
But you are kind of making our point for us. I'm sure you do a good job for what you do, but you could easily be replace by a DJ and attendance for these events would not drop. They aren't coming to hear a band.
Aren't we all being replaced by DJ's? Or the next up and coming pop soloist with their backing track band. Or some rap or hip hop artist with their beats. Or EDM producers. Most of the new money in music actually is generated by this part of the industry. And this is where the e-kit truly holds it's own. And no, an acoustic kit wont always work in these genres if at all. I personally am a Zeppelin fan and a dinosaur.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #92
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imloggedin's Avatar
For me its a simple answer: RELIABILITY! sure some e-kits might have reliable brains, but theres always a chance! An acoustic drum is never going to just stop working.

Also, the feel is vastly different. Cmon .. LIVE MUSIC SHOULD SOUND LIVE
Old 23rd October 2013
  #93
Gear Nut
 
raincityrecorder's Avatar
 

Asking a drummer to play on electric drums at a live show would go over about as well as asking the guitar player to play all his parts on a keytar.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #94
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The OP's argument against drummers playing actual drums in live performance has careened from "the drummer can't control his volume"...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jumbo View Post
Seems like such a battle to control just the levels of an acoustic kit and keep it balanced with the rest of the band.
to "real drums can only sound like one particular drumkit at a time"...

Quote:
Also, acoustic kits....only have one sound that can't be interchangeable for different songs.
to being convinced that "the audience wants it to sound EQ'd, time-corrected and compressed like the record"...

Quote:
...Audience ears are changing, they hear recorded music that is quantized and bright, and if your band plays without a click.... For today's audiences, It sounds too loose. Likewise, drum kits on stage particularly in a small venue where it is not tamed sound nothing like a drum kit on a modern recording.... Once a casual listener experiences a live drum kit for the first time in a long time, remember their ears are accustomed to what they hear on iPods, and the live drum kit all of a sudden sounds way too dynamic, muddy, and dominates, and to those listeners... It sux...
to "I don't even want a drummer at the gig, period"...

Quote:
I would quite happily replace the drummer, bass player and everybody and maybe just keep the trusted guitarist if I could... One or two less headaches to worry about, and put up with. ...Only reason really I have a drummer for my shows is because people come in and sit down and watch. Maybe more of a spectacle thing that I feel the need for us to look like an ensemble.
At least by the time we've gotten to this last argument, we're finally getting some upfront honesty from the OP. Who wouldn't want to sign up for a gig to play in that "band."
Old 23rd October 2013
  #95
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cavern's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailor View Post
The OP's argument against drummers playing actual drums in live performance has careened from "the drummer can't control his volume"...



to "real drums can only sound like one particular drumkit at a time"...



to being convinced that "the audience wants it to sound EQ'd, time-corrected and compressed like the record"...



to "I don't even want a drummer at the gig, period"...



At least by the time we've gotten to this last argument, we're finally getting some upfront honesty from the OP. Who wouldn't want to sign up for a gig to play in that "band."
Great detective work and darn hilarious too.
As some of us said,just play the CD.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #96
Lives for gear
Deantoni Parks $ Luis Carreras drum solo - YouTube

the Bad Plus LIVE - YouTube

Nerve in the studio recording 'catachresis' - YouTube

This is just a small example of drummers who realize the importance of being able to emulate electronic sounds on their acoustic sets. It can be done. And in my experience, it sounds even better than playing an electronic kit.

Maybe you need a new drummer!!!
Old 23rd October 2013
  #97
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Beardhead's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wcx08 View Post
Deantoni Parks $ Luis Carreras drum solo - YouTube

the Bad Plus LIVE - YouTube

Nerve in the studio recording 'catachresis' - YouTube

This is just a small example of drummers who realize the importance of being able to emulate electronic sounds on their acoustic sets. It can be done. And in my experience, it sounds even better than playing an electronic kit.

Maybe you need a new drummer!!!
You may also have a look at this: Jojo Mayer Clinic Groovin very fast drum and bass in the end - YouTube

I've seen bands having the drums coming from the keyboard and the drummer just pretending to play.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #98
[pointless old guy reminiscence; you've been warned ]

Once, way, way back, after I'd been out of the hospital after a nasty motorcycle wreck for about a month or so (early 1981) -- I was still using a walker (fractured hip, blasted out femur, ankle, everything rodded and plated), my band ended up at my flop after practice. The drummer had been drinking, powering down about a quarter of a liter of sweet tequila (that nasty Cuervo stuff).

The guy driving him and his kit (drummer with no car, curse of the starter band) 2/3 across the infamously unfriendly-cop Orange County about 2:20 AM (bars close by 2, meaning this is DUI harvest time) wanted him to leave the half-empty half-liter bottle at my place. (Cali has nasty open container laws and there was no trunk in my pal's little runabout.)

But the drummer (underage so he had to have someone buy his booze) kept yelling about how the bottle was "his weekend" (it was Thursday night and it looked like it was gonna be a short weekend for that bottle, no matter) and getting increasingly bellicose, yelling and sputtering.

I adopted my friendliest, most paternal (as always, I was the old guy) voice and gently laid an open hand lightly on his shoulder.

Wrong.

Next thing I knew, the guy -- all 220 ex-football pounds of him -- was on my then 110 pound frame (6 weeks in traction) knocking me over like a feather. The other guys had him off me before he could do any damage (and somehow the fall didn't hurt me) but it was a real moment. The other guys decided to fire him (I didn't complain) but the band ended up breaking up.

Not too long later, I bought my first drum machine. heh


That said, me and the guys (sans the old drummer) put together a loose jam outfit with some other guys and a really excellent young drummer who had his own car and was an easy going Christian whose parents were hippies ['so, what you guys are smoking doesn't bother me at all']; He was happy to play in any style, never got angry, and, though he was clearly the 'best' player in the band (in terms of being consistent and on the money), he never gave us a hard time.

So it probably wasn't too surprising when he eventually left our loose jam circle for a permanent home in a working band. We missed him, for sure. But it was so nice letting him get the taste of the other guy out of our mouths.*

Happily, the practice studio we worked at had one of those old Roland organ-ready rhythm boxes (with all those beats you never knew what they were) and we decided to go techno...


* That first drummer wasn't any kind of monster; he just drank too much and got belligerent and would then get physical. He was out for a broken ankle of his own for a month or so after he broke it as he was beating the crap out of one of his old high school pals for giving him a hard time because he was in a punk band. Handwriting on wall.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoundBadge View Post
I cant stand it when I walk into a club and see an electronic kit with a rock band..looks dorky and sounds fake.
Exactly. E-drums don't work for live rock. It makes you puke just seeing and hearing it. The drummer should hand out barf bags at the door in those situations.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #100
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank_Case View Post
Exactly. E-drums don't work for live rock. It makes you puke just seeing and hearing it. The drummer should hand out barf bags at the door in those situations.
Oh, come on, quit holding back, Frank. Tell us how you really feel!

heh
Old 23rd October 2013
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theblue1 View Post
Oh, come on, quit holding back, Frank. Tell us how you really feel!

heh
Well, I have two real drum kits, my favorite being a thin maple shelled Pearl MMX set. It has tone for miles and miles. But recently I got a Yamaha DD-65 which I have to say is a lot of fun to play. It's bottom of the line E-drum stuff but that doesn't keep it from working quite well, actually. But I don't think you're gonna see anyone playing one in a metal band anytime soon. Visually it would have that "WTF?" factor. Now that I've said, the next metal band I see will probably have a DD-65. But E-drums can be fun and require no tuning which is a plus.

DD-65 - DD/YDD Drums - Portable Digital Drums - Digital Percussion - Drums - Musical Instruments - Products - Yamaha United States
Old 23rd October 2013
  #102
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T'Mershi Duween's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Format C: yes View Post
The next generation will be playing edrum's as that is mostly what they are learning to play on.
Why edrums because they sound better out the front which is what counts....
The next generation of what? Talent-less poseur "fake musicians" who can't be arsed enough to learn how to play their instruments properly?

Judging by the the mediocre, forgettable "music" that this "next generation" is spewing forth, you're probably right about this unfortunate development in live (faux) performing.

Music is suffering because of this loser, defeatist attitude. Being a real musician is just too hard I suppose. It's much easier be a pretend "musician" with no balls, passion or skill.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T'Mershi Duween View Post
The next generation of what? Talent-less poseur "fake musicians" who can't be arsed enough to learn how to play their instruments properly?

Judging by the the mediocre, forgettable "music" that this "next generation" is spewing forth, you're probably right about this unfortunate development in live (faux) performing.

Music is suffering because of this loser, defeatist attitude. Being a real musician is just too hard I suppose. It's much easier be a pretend "musician" with no balls, passion or skill.
I'm not trying to defend any generation here, but it's somewhat ignorant to lump all the music of a generation together and say ALL of it sucks. That's just simply not true.

I don't think it's the loser, defeatist attitude. It's the fact that younger generations are growing up with so much technology, that they want things now and fast because that's what is expected...They want to have the knowledge now and not have to waste time learning about it. A la electronic music. Why would you want to spend decades learning to play the piano when you can just punch some data in to a MIDI controller and it plays it for you? Don't get me wrong..Some electronic music is great. But I find the majority of it sucks because it's easier than ever for any no-talent ass clown to buy a chaos pad app for their iPad and call themselves an electronic musician.

Sure, you can be creative in that sense, but the depth of that creativity is shallow and short lived. It grows old fast.

Today, in 2013, there is more music than there ever was. Unfortunately, more and more of it is mediocre, if that, by and by.

I'm 26 and just started taking piano lessons, because I want to learn the ART of playing the piano. But there is also an art to studying and practicing that a lot of people don't want to take the time to do. Fortunately, I've been playing the drums since I was six and this is not a problem for me. But this is the main reason why you often hear adults say things like "OH I'm too old to start learning an instrument!" or, "I'm just not the creative type!!!"

Bull****...If you're of the human species, you're creative. Creativity is a function of our species. In fact it can be said that it may be the only thing that really defines us as a species. All animals eat, ****, reproduce, fight...But abstraction and high level thought? That's us!

Sorry for this rant.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #104
Gear Maniac
 
Tirmu's Avatar
Imo theres 2 things.
1: the sound. No explanations needed.
2: feel. What does a pianist say if you ask him/her to perform on synth action keys?

- Tiko
Old 23rd October 2013
  #105
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jumbo View Post
Very true... We are all replaceable and can be obsolete in many cases. It has happened that we have played alongside a dj at a wedding, and the crowd preferred the dj, and vice versa.


If you play safe quiet 'controlled sounding' music YES you are replaceable by a DJ.

the only hope we have going forward is play the kinds of music that are not replaceable by a DJ or canned music!

No DJ system can sound like a real drumset in the room, for example. The transients are simply not there. Never mind the feel and the excitement and the obvious visuals.

As I see it there are only two choices,

1. go down the road you are going, keep removing humans until it is just a singer and a tape at which point, they might as well have a DJ

2. realize that live music provides an opportunity for people to see and hear something they CAN'T get from a DJ

you can continue to pursue something where you are worse at it than a machine, or you can go into an area where no machine can ever touch you. Your choice.

In any case, considering your world-view as a whole, I find your focus on "electronic kits" to be almost beside the point.


*** You know I was a little surprised that you so readily took me up on my suggestion to simply not have a drummer. I find it doubly sad to see that all the fight has gone out of you at the age of 36. ***
Old 23rd October 2013
  #106
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
If you play safe quiet 'controlled sounding' music YES you are replaceable by a DJ.

the only hope we have going forward is play the kinds of music that are not replaceable by a DJ or canned music!

No DJ system can sound like a real drumset in the room, for example. The transients are simply not there. Never mind the feel and the excitement and the obvious visuals.

As I see it there are only two choices,

1. go down the road you are going, keep removing humans until it is just a singer and a tape at which point, they might as well have a DJ

2. realize that live music provides an opportunity for people to see and hear something they CAN'T get from a DJ

you can continue to pursue something where you are worse at it than a machine, or you can go into an area where no machine can ever touch you. Your choice.

In any case, considering your world-view as a whole, I find your focus on "electronic kits" to be almost beside the point.


*** You know I was a little surprised that you so readily took me up on my suggestion to simply not have a drummer. I find it doubly sad to see that all the fight has gone out of you at the age of 36. ***

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Also, let's not forget, machines can only understand 0 and 1. Humans can understand the space between that. That makes us far more valuable.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #107
Gear Guru
 
Sounds Great's Avatar
 

My brother is a very talented piano player and my nephew followed in his footsteps at a very young age. He recently spent a couple of years attending the Berklee College of Music and one of his songs was featured on the Berklee Electronic Production and Design Department CD 2013.

I guess this is really good for this sort of music, but it gets boring to me pretty easily. But yes, there certainly is a market for it.
Attached Files
Old 23rd October 2013
  #108
Gear Addict
 
Format C: yes's Avatar
 

Edrums are the future. They are out selling real kit's at about 5 to 1. Arguing that live should mean a real kit should also mean no PA no amps no electronic anything which can sound great but doesn't work everywhere. Once you go down the track of electronic keyboards,guitars, etc doesent mean its any less live.
You can argue you don't want to see a band with an electric kit but most people don't care its what they sound like and stage craft.
Not using samples ever heard of Van Halen? Alex Van Halen also uses a lot of electronic pads.
One of the great stadium bands Def Leppard the electronic kit cannot have stopped to may people from turning up.
If you want an edrum find an edrummer or a drummer who is happy to play one and treat it like its own instrument. If you want to play real drums thats ok to. In the end it's all music if played well.
Old 23rd October 2013
  #109
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Format C: yes's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tirmu View Post
Imo theres 2 things.
1: the sound. No explanations needed.

- Tiko
This is where the is no right or wrong answer IMO I think the drums sound better coming from the mains and mixed with everyone else. For low budget gig's and now some high budget one edrums fit the bill. But other's have different opinions and there is no right or wrong.
Old 24th October 2013
  #110
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailor View Post
The OP's argument against drummers playing actual drums in live performance has careened from "the drummer can't control his volume"...



to "real drums can only sound like one particular drumkit at a time"...



to being convinced that "the audience wants it to sound EQ'd, time-corrected and compressed like the record"...



to "I don't even want a drummer at the gig, period"...



At least by the time we've gotten to this last argument, we're finally getting some upfront honesty from the OP. Who wouldn't want to sign up for a gig to play in that "band."
Yes, you got me, the gearslutz police is out doing a great job! I think that one things for certain, starting his thread and you guys contributing has made me realize I can maybe no longer tolerate playing in a larger ensemble.

This May or may not be true for everybody, however, I find that we romanticise this whole notion of live music and bands..... It is bloody hard work, And when it is done right, it is the most beautiful thing, but that is rare. Although I'm in a few working bands and perform for a living for the majority of my adult life, it is far from truth to suggest every musician I've worked with is a pro, on top of their game, has great gear and a great reliable attitude etc. we look at big named artists,with their top of the range session muso's, worlds best PA's and gear we can only dream of, and romanticise that that's what we want to sound like, and have a touring act similar.

The reality is as such:
You play with musicians who have families, other jobs, other commitments, different personalities, varying opinions, and most never really commit to learning repertoires and intros! and outros etc because of other **** going on in their lives....so gigs more or less turn out to be 60% tight! and 40% a jam session. I'm not playing originals, these are gigs where we can typically play more than 40 songs in a night. You also find, the consistency varies, all the drummer needs to do is start off the song 10bpm faster or slower, and the whole feel of the song is gone. There are too many variables connected to make the whole thing go haywire, and that's not including if you've got the sound and balance right as well.

When you find say a drummer or guitarist who is amazing, something else is missing, like they are an asshole to work with, or are on drugs, or very unreliable.

Or you find a great player, who is committed and very reliable, however, has **** gear, and hasn't got a care in the world about how the band sounds as a whole, but rather that their kit sounded hot!

I don't know about you guys, but in Sydney Australia, there doesn't seem to be many top level musicians who take their craft seriously, they're hard to find, and by having a bigger ensemble only exacerbates problems that may arise, thus increasing the suck factor.

That's why I'm resigned to be most happy when dealing with a few trusted musicians, and don't mind if the rest of the band is electronic, mimicked or not played at all....and when a drummer is put into that fold who's kit we have a hard time taming, making our lives harder on stage dealing with the noise levels, vibrations, balance of the band..... I'm sorry, I don't care how it feels, or sounds.... In my case, it just doesn't seem all that worth it, having to deal with all that just to have an acoustic drum kit on stage.
Old 24th October 2013
  #111
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jumbo View Post
I don't know about you guys, but in Sydney Australia, there doesn't seem to be many top level musicians who take their craft seriously, they're hard to find
I bet there are PLENTY of top level musicians in a city the size of Sydney! But I also would suspect that any of them worth their salt have better gigs to do than Englebert Humperdinck covers with a bandleader who would actually prefer to not use them at all if he had the option!

How seriously are YOU taking their "craft" - to the point that you would not only like to control their volume and dictate their specific sound; not only want to tell them not to play their own instrument, but are now admitting you would actually prefer it if their parts were pre-recorded?

I would not be surprised if you added the further admission that you were not exactly paying "top dollar" to your sidemen, either!

The musicians who are good probably have the option of turning down work in a situation where their employer does not respect them and what they do. The option of turning down 'work' where the audiences don't even care if they are there or if it is a DJ.

The "good" musicians in your town are probably out doing better gigs, for more money, for bandleaders and audiences who are at least enthusiastic and appreciate what they do. The good musicians are probably too busy having fun playing enjoyable music, to join a depressing band with a depressing leader.

Quote:
and by having a bigger ensemble only exacerbates problems that may arise, thus increasing the suck factor.
and by 'bigger ensemble' you mean 4 people, right?

Quote:
In my case, it just doesn't seem all that worth it
So why music? You seem to be approaching music not as an art or even as a career, but merely as a job/business. And you are apparently not even having any fun! Everything sucks, everybody sucks.

Since you aren't having fun, you might want to consider something less stressful, and steadier, where you don't have to depend on anyone else and where your only employees are minimum wage-drones who just have to perform rote tasks to get the job done.

Dry Cleaners? Landscaping? Insurance agency?
Old 24th October 2013
  #112
Gear Addict
 

Sorry didn't read through all the posts but when I saw the cars a few years back on their short reunion tour, David Robinson played a Roland drum kit live.

Sent from my SCH-I545
Old 24th October 2013
  #113
Gear Maniac
There were many obstacles when I played with an electric kit for a year with a live band. I had to for that situation, and we did get used to it in the end, although it was harder for other band members to adjust to the sound coming from the speakers in front of them (as opposed to behind them) than it was for me to adjust to those great Roland V-Drums.

The real killer though? If you wind up with a musician who rushes in the band, especially a bass player, it is nearly impossible to hold them back from the drummers chair and if the band is on IEM's it makes it even worse. You do lose a bit of time keeping authority when you're playing from an e-Kit because the sound is less imposing.

Having an AVIOM type system helps whenever there's an e-kit involved, as does playing to click. I'd happily play an ekit if I had either of those on the gig.
Old 24th October 2013
  #114
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
I bet there are PLENTY of top level musicians in a city the size of Sydney! But I also would suspect that any of them worth their salt have better gigs to do than Englebert Humperdinck covers with a bandleader who would actually prefer to not use them at all if he had the option!

How seriously are YOU taking their "craft" - to the point that you would not only like to control their volume and dictate their specific sound; not only want to tell them not to play their own instrument, but are now admitting you would actually prefer it if their parts were pre-recorded?

I would not be surprised if you added the further admission that you were not exactly paying "top dollar" to your sidemen, either!

The musicians who are good probably have the option of turning down work in a situation where their employer does not respect them and what they do. The option of turning down 'work' where the audiences don't even care if they are there or if it is a DJ.

The "good" musicians in your town are probably out doing better gigs, for more money, for bandleaders and audiences who are at least enthusiastic and appreciate what they do. The good musicians are probably too busy having fun playing enjoyable music, to join a depressing band with a depressing leader.



and by 'bigger ensemble' you mean 4 people, right?



So why music? You seem to be approaching music not as an art or even as a career, but merely as a job/business. And you are apparently not even having any fun! Everything sucks, everybody sucks.

Since you aren't having fun, you might want to consider something less stressful, and steadier, where you don't have to depend on anyone else and where your only employees are minimum wage-drones who just have to perform rote tasks to get the job done.

Dry Cleaners? Landscaping? Insurance agency?
Nice to see someone dissecting everything I say to paint a picture of how my bands and music life is. Yes, you are correct, I do approach music as a business, and yes I am deadly serious about it and making money from it is very important as this is my bread and butter and the only way I know how to make money. There is very little room for you to be artsy farty when a client pays you to create an atmosphere, get a dance floor going and make a wedding party or a corporate gig happening.... Yes, I do enjoy it, and the musicians who play with me know it is a job, and they have certain expectations to meet every gig.... And they get paid much better than what they get with other bands.

There is nothing wrong with monetizing your music and being serious about it. A working band is no different to any other business. If you get paid x to fulfill your job expectation, but fail to deliver x, your out of here... Attitudes, how you fit in, reliability all are part of the job. Same for the band as a whole, and band members as individuals.

If your not getting paid, and you play for the art of music, fair enough, enjoy it, have fun, play what you like, play for yourself.... It's art, let musos express themselves as they wish, don't restrict them.... Of course not, let art be art.

However, If you take that attitude with a working band who gets a job in order to fulfill the clients requirements, I'm afraid you won't get far.
Old 24th October 2013
  #115
Lives for gear
You came on here to garner sympathy for your anti-drums rant and no one's buying it.

Now you've devolved the conversation into some vague anti-music business rant; again, no one is really buying it.

Sage advice was given to improve your on-stage drum situation, but you've chosen to ignore it.

Not sure where else you'd like to take this thread next, but I'm pretty sure we know how it's going to turn out.
Old 24th October 2013
  #116
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
I bet there are PLENTY of top level musicians in a city the size of Sydney! But I also would suspect that any of them worth their salt have better gigs to do than Englebert Humperdinck covers with a bandleader who would actually prefer to not use them at all if he had the option! ?
Joeq, if you respected art and artists like you say you do, you would respect one Engelbert Humperdinck who will be long remembered for many decades more than you and I and a vastmajority on this forum. If it's not your cup of tea fair enough, but that era of musicians and singers still remain in the hearts of many people, and that repertoire still draws people.
Old 24th October 2013
  #117
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gravyface View Post
You came on here to garner sympathy for your anti-drums rant and no one's buying it.

Now you've devolved the conversation into some vague anti-music business rant; again, no one is really buying it.

Sage advice was given to improve your on-stage drum situation, but you've chosen to ignore it.

Not sure where else you'd like to take this thread next, but I'm pretty sure we know how it's going to turn out.
I'm actually enjoying the conversation. If you see my stats, been here a long time, but rarely contribute to many conversations, hence my low stat count. I have accepted and acknowledged many things, and come to realize many things about myself and am not looking for sympathy. I wish I still had the romantic fight most of you have about live bands, and playing live. Thanks for contributing, please feel free to continue.
Old 24th October 2013
  #118
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sleepyhollos's Avatar
Oh what a day can do. I looked in on this thread yesterday and it was all light hearted discussion about v drums for live gigs. I come back today and it has gone somewhere else totally... :-)

I'm still not buying the electronic kit for live gigs though. First electric drums evict the acoustic kits, then pods will evict the guitar amps, then keytars will take the place of synthesisers and pianos and before you know it rubber dolls and manikins will replace the groupies... Because they too are probably easier to carry to gigs, pick up, and control their volume. Sure the"experience"won't be as authentic once in the throws of passionate performance but hey... Who cares about feel, enjoyment, vibe, quality, authenticity or just generally better?
Old 24th October 2013
  #119
Gear Maniac
 

On a side note, since I have gotten most of your attention, and most of you aren't warming to my sentiment here, I''m really in need of some real world critiques. YouTube link of my latest single which I wrote and composed, and spent quite allot on promoting it through YouTube and various other blogs.... What baffles me is I've gotten many hits, and many positive comments, but only sold around a tiny fraction of (148 singles) to date (spent many more times that in promoting it alone not to mention recording a 13 song album).

We Used To Be Darko - We Used To Be - YouTube
Road To Somewhere Darko - Road To Somewhere - YouTube

I appreciate all comments, even if you think it is crap! I did the album for art, and because I enjoy song writing and recording.
Old 24th October 2013
  #120
Gear Maniac
 

It is almost impossible to get anybody to review your material these days... Hopefully you guys can
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