The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Full Sail University ?? Drum Machines & Samplers
Old 8th December 2011
  #1
Gear interested
 
StudioFiend2012's Avatar
 

Full Sail University ??

I'm new here and I just wanted to ask a quick question. I'm considering going to Full Sail University for a Bachelor's in Recording Arts. Can someone please tell me if it's worth the enormous tuition and if recording studios except their degrees? I keep reading online that Full Sail University is not regionally accredited. I can see how that may be a problem when transferring credits to another University but will this hurt my chances of finding employment ? A reply would be much appreciated, Thank you..
Old 8th December 2011
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Howie J's Avatar
Old 8th December 2011
  #3
Lives for gear
 
mikeg09's Avatar
I would also like to know the answer to that question because I am actually thinking about going there. I have herd that it is a very good school to go to but the cost is ridiculous.
Old 8th December 2011
  #4
Gear Head
 

Hi,
I'm currently going to a different College for Recording Engineering program in orlando and it's right down the road from full sail. A lot of the professors in my recording arts program have either been teachers full sail or have subbed there before. All of them say that the education is lacking at fullsail due to the time schedules, trying to pack 4 years of education into 2 years. I've been told most of the kids never even touch the boards. Apparently the industry isn't looking to hire kids coming out of full sail because the students that have been hired straight out of full sail before have either been really lousy at the job or were not well educated. Also the fact that you will be working mainly in multimillion dollar studio's at full sail means you will know how to run the most top notch equipment in the industry right now, only problem is, MOST studios do not own most of that equipment. I know a kid who just graduated from the Engineering program at fullsail and he is currently employed at Guitar center now, along with most of the employees there have also graduated from full sail. A few kids from my classes went to the audio engineering society last month and there was a mixing competition being held, and full sails students apparently didn't even place. I'm not trying to completely bash full sail and im not saying my education is "better" i'm just saying I'm paying a quarter what you have to pay for full sail and i'm already lining up an internship in new york.
Old 8th December 2011
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Makinithappen's Avatar
 

A guy I know who went to full sail sent me this a couple days ago....

(Full Sail Is A Scam!!!!) Meeting With Fullsail University Admissions Representative - YouTube

I've heard similar stories from quite a few others... Out of all the interns I've talked to who've come from Full Sail (probably at least a dozen over the years), only one has been competent. (and he is now working fr a local cable company as an service installer)

One of them actually didn't know the difference between an mp3 data disc and audio CD.... Inexcusable.
Old 8th December 2011
  #6
Lives for gear
 
kasmira's Avatar
 

I have heard a lot of bad things about full sail to be honest. Any of the schools in America that teach Audio Engineering WILL teach you a lot about certain things - but nothing beats experience. Truth is if you go to ANY of these schools and actually study YOUR ASS OFF, actually learn the ****, and practice the methods outside of work, you might be able to get yourself a great job. Just like any school, there are idiots who graduate, and geniuses who graduate. The real test is if you know what the hell you're doing, you try to learn at any given change, and you push yourself to get better and better every day. Once you go to whatever school, try to get an internship at a studio, try to bring clients in, and just shut the **** up and watch what the engineer does, and write down questions to ask him after the sessions are over.

I live in Arizona, where the Conservator of Recording Arts & Sciences is. I know a LOT of graduates. Some interned at ****ty studios and nothing happened with it, some never interned and are audio-******** and don't even know how to work a compressor, and some are working for extremely pro studios with their own clientele, and actually do tracking themselves now. Its all about how you really apply yourself AFTER school that matters. No school can teach you passion.
Old 8th December 2011
  #7
Gear Head
 

lmao that video is hilarious.
Old 8th December 2011
  #8
Gear Head
 
JyPsycaL's Avatar
 

I'm currently attending Full Sail Online for Internet Marketing, and I think it's a good school. Granted, I know I'm in a different program that costs half as much as the recording program.

The first few months that I was in the program, I had a class in management, and one of the assignments was to find a manager of a business and interview him. I contacted Pachyderm Studios, which is in Cannon Falls, MN. I was only getting in touch for my assignment, but the manager was ready to offer me an internship just because he heard the words "Full Sail." He said all of the guys that came from Full Sail were really good.

That being said, I've also heard that the on campus recording program has some pretty crazy hours, and it's hard to work a job on the side and have time to sleep. While this sounds kind of brutal, it might also be good conditioning for long recording sessions.

The recording program is expensive, but life is about what you put into it. We all know that you don't get a good recording if the performance sucks. Also, you don't get a good education if you don't apply yourself when you're in school. I think there are lots of rich kids that want to be producers who expect a school to make them into producers without any work on their part. If you're serious about recording, I'm sure Full Sail would be a great school for you. On the other hand, if you're concerned about money, you might be able to find a cheaper route.

Full Sail never promises anyone they're going to work with Bruce Swedien, but there are a lot of graduates who have received awards for their work in audio, film and video games. The picture of Barack Obama made out of words that came out on the cover of Time Magazine a couple years back was the work of a Full Sail student. One of my classmates works at a label, and there is a good sense of community with my professors online.

One other thing you may consider is that there is an online production degree program now too, which is cheaper than attending campus. Either way, if you're ready to apply yourself, I think it's a good school.

In regards to the scam, I find that these days people like to complain a lot, but we're in control of our own lives and no one else's. The guy who's running around calling Full Sail a scam could be doing much more productive things with his life, but he's lazy and he'd rather sit around and complain.
Old 8th December 2011
  #9
Gear Addict
 
soulfield's Avatar
 

Honestly Full Sail is probably a good school to attend if money is no object. I would not however borrow the amount of money required to attend.

No studio and I mean no studio is going to hire someone soley based upon them graduationg from full sail or any other school unless the job is to make coffee. Personality, the way someone caries and conducts themself, and PRIOR EXPERIENCE will matter much more.

and No attending full sail does not count as experience in my book.

At full sail you will learn alot, and in particular you will learn about and be able to understand what equipment is, how it works, and what applications are common for said equipment. You will learn a little about the entertainment business in general and the various parts of this business.

You will not learn or be tought how to "mix", "perform", or "paduce." These are things that only time in the saddle will bring.

All that said it will be fun, and you will learn alot, but if one had teh money pay cash for the tuition up front, I'd say that money would be better off spent on a small rig and paying overhead while you get work of any kind for demos or local bands and find a studio willing to let you intern which usually pays very little.

My $0.02 - If your a millionare go for it! If not think long and hard about what the student loans will be like once you graduate and how that will affect what and where you can go to work!

I know beacuse I graduated in 2004 from FS and the loans are still kicking my @$$ to the tune of 45K!
Old 8th December 2011
  #10
Lives for gear
 
JonMiller's Avatar
I agree, if money is no object, go for it.

At the same time, you could that money and build a studio!

even with a degree from Full Sail, you are still going to be running to get coffee and changing guitar strings for 8 dollars an hour for 14 hours a day 7 days a week for your first 5 years in the industry.

Why not look into a music composition degree? or a Music and Technology degree?
Old 8th December 2011
  #11
Gear Head
 
FauxCoup's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by StudioFiend2012 View Post
I'm new here and I just wanted to ask a quick question. I'm considering going to Full Sail University for a Bachelor's in Recording Arts. Can someone please tell me if it's worth the enormous tuition and if recording studios except their degrees? I keep reading online that Full Sail University is not regionally accredited. I can see how that may be a problem when transferring credits to another University but will this hurt my chances of finding employment ? A reply would be much appreciated, Thank you..
Just don't go. If you are interested in going to college and want a college experience, go to a fully accredited school that will allow you to transfer from one school to the next. Transferring is never very easy, transferring with credits from an unaccredited school I'm sure is a nightmare.

If you're looking to be a studio engineer, there is no better way than just start getting into studios, talking to engineers and interning. If you don't care about having a college degree, take the money you would spend on it, move to a big city with lots of studios, and start working your butt off now, learning as much as you can.

You will find as others have said that it largely comes down to you and how hard you work regardless of where you go to school. Also, as others have said, you will find that even with a degree you will be getting coffee and running to guitar center to buy strings at whichever studio you start your career. Either way, you're gonna be a studio gofer with or without a degree. If you are the kind of person that can work hard and learn without a syllabus, I would reconsider going to Full Sail.
Old 9th December 2011
  #12
Lives for gear
 
ears2thesky's Avatar
Go get a degree from a real college in something you could actually make a living with (like business administration or electrical engineering).
I have yet to meet a competent grad of any of the so-called "music production" schools.
This business is tough, and spending thousands on a dubious certification only gets you in debt--not work.
Old 9th December 2011
  #13
Gear Addict
 
a2dpapi's Avatar
 

I am a Fullsail grad (2002). I also have an economics degree from another university. Not one university here in Florida would accept my coursework from FS as transfer credit. $50K+ for what really amounted to a great apprenticeship. There are certainly some benefits to be had by attending FS, but in my view, if I were to do it again, I would have saved the cash. I graduated near the top of my class of roughly 100, and loved every second I got to use the gear. The teachers knew there stuff and we had a ton of hands on "labs" on large format consoles, smaller ones, DAW, midi, classes etc.
Learned to cal 1/2" and 2" Studer machines! Whenever I wanted more, I would simply ask to sit in on extra labs, which was never a problem. In this respect, the school was great- like everything else in life, you could get out of it exactly what you put in.
During my time there, it seemed like anyone willing to take out a student loan could attend. Half the class was completely clueless and daft and seemed to be attending because they bought into the dog and pony show FS had brought to their local town. A lot of drugs. Not the brightest bunch by any means. There were those too who really wanted that hands on type of education, had the aptitude for the coursework, and ultimately flourished.

Ten years removed, I have finally paid off my student loans. If I were a betting man I would guess that less than 2 percent of graduates from the RE program are making a living in either studio or live recording.

My recommendation has always been the following-
1)Save your money.
2)Save your money.
3) Take inexpensive recording courses at your local STATE school, community college, etc. Do not spend private school money unless you are (a) wealthy, (b) assured that you are receiving regionally accredited, fully transferable credits. Here in Miami we have Miami Dade Community college, FIU, and a few others with killer CHEAP programs.
4) With the money you have saved, get an internship at the best studio you can find.....where there are still primo engineers passing through. The longer you are able to hold out from leaving for financial reasons the better your chances of developing a career. Live frugally, and absorb everything. Take risks and get in on sessions, even if it is to bring coffee in.

I hope some of this helps.
Old 10th December 2011
  #14
Gear interested
 
StudioFiend2012's Avatar
 

Thank you to everyone who replied to my post. After everything I just read, I've come to the conclusion that there is no way I'm going to FS. I think I'll just look into other schools then do as many internships as I can.. Anyone have any suggestions on what schools are best for this field ?
Old 10th December 2011
  #15
Gear Head
 
Tha_SkyWalker's Avatar
 

Let me just say that if its something that your interested in then do it. Nothings guaranteed, getting a degree from a University, doesn't guarantee a job, no body's going to call and start paying you a lot of money out of the blue. You have to work hard for it and of course you always have to start from the bottom. Harvard students who studied law don't automatically become lawyers, they work their way up. Same with the this industry.

Simply learning will give you that edge, I say most of the sharp people that go to those type of schools, go to understand the industry better cuss lets face it learning the hardware and software can be easily mastered on your own.

It takes dedication!
Im just saying you only live once, why not live your life doing what you love?
Old 11th December 2011
  #16
Gear nut
 

I went to Full Sail for a tour and i almost got brain washed lol

anyway here is a couple of music schools to check out:

i like this school in chicago, IL called Tribeca Flashpoint but the bad thing is that they don't take FAFSA - Tribeca Flashpoint Media Arts Academy - Home :(

Then i checked this school and was interesting - BERKLEE | Music Production and Engineering Major

But ending up going to this school cause not it's not expensive and it's close where i live and perfect - Institute of Audio Research NYC - Providing Education in Audio Recording, Audio Engineering, and Music Production

But if you rich and wants to party a lot with $77,540 then go straight to the link - Full Sail University: Campus and Online Degrees
Old 11th December 2011
  #17
Lives for gear
 
mattjew24's Avatar
 

The studio manager from the studio I interned at was from Full Sail. He seems to know his stuff, but is very one dimensional in his approach to engineering. Could just be his thing, though.

He, and several other Full Sail graduates, told me it was a scam, and that they offer false promises about employment.

Definitely NOT worth the HUUUUGE cost of going.

My school was far cheaper, and did I mention I spent every night 7 days a week on my own with a Neve or Neotek console? Occasionally the SSL's?

I definitely got my money's worth by using the gear on a nightly basis...
Old 11th December 2011
  #18
Lives for gear
 
mattjew24's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by StudioFiend2012 View Post
Thank you to everyone who replied to my post. After everything I just read, I've come to the conclusion that there is no way I'm going to FS. I think I'll just look into other schools then do as many internships as I can.. Anyone have any suggestions on what schools are best for this field ?
The Conseratory of Recording Arts and Sciences in Arizona was great.

Also, they have dedicated Internship Coordinators who get EVERY single student an internship in some field in the industry.

Don't think full sail can claim they get their kids internships
Old 11th December 2011
  #19
Lives for gear
 
Howie J's Avatar
Didn't mean to downplay the OP's question with my smiley, but most of these questions turn into a $hit$torm of random school vs. no school arguing.

I'm a record school grad. McNally Smith College of Music in St. Paul. (Was Musictech then...2003) I enjoyed it. I learned a ton and spent all the time I could in studio. At that time, from talking with some others, it seemed like MNS was one of the few where students got to spend time alone in the studios. By the time I graduated, I was spending 30+ hours in the studio a week outside of class. There were a lot of guys who didn't put much into it and just didn't have a clue. Just like anywhere.

I did the AAS program. (there is now a bachelors, but not at that time). It took me 18 months and ran about $20k..I think. I didn't have to take any general ed courses since I was at a 4 year college before that.

Now, the pattern I'm seeing with a lot of these schools was mentioned here. Very few of them seem to have good transfer credit programs. I went on to finish my bachelor of music ed right after and didn't use any credits. Once again, they used all the stuff from my former 4 year university. And I went to a school that was supposedly partnering with them on that side of things.

Now, there is something to be said for the specific nature of the program. Stuff like music theory should be a transferrable credit. Arranging, composition, etc. But stuff like recording theory/lab, analog synthesis, MIDI systems, etc. None of those specific classes fit anywhere in almost any other major area...music included. Look at a BA or BM in music/performance/ed/musicology. Not much like that. So those type of courses don't land up covering any coursework in a university setting. However, they are kind of important in the audio program.

I don't regret it. I got a lot out of the program and it helped me get my job today. They still seem to have a great and growing program, they just need to fix the credit transfer thing.

But I'm crazy with the school stuff. I'm waiting on my final acceptance to grad school right now for a master in music, soooo take that into account.

Seems like for the money that people are quoting for Full Sail, you could get a solid 4 year degree from a University or college like MTSU, IUPUI, West Chester, Georgia Tech, etc. These were some of the schools I was looking at for possibly doing masters level recording work.

Howie J
Old 11th December 2011
  #20
Lives for gear
 
projektk's Avatar
 

I paid $14 k for my education at sound master, now Pinnacle in Alhambra CA. No real degree but unless you're trying to become partner or some crap you are better getting a bachelors or masters in business at a local campus to save some money. Pay as little as piss le as you can for audio but do every thing you can to know what's up.

I say this because if your goal is to become an engineer or even a producer, more of your business will happen based on your connections, so you should spend more of your energy finding people that you need to know, but still you need to be good at what you do. I love mixing and recording anything, but I find mastering to be a painful process so I try to avoid it... good luck.

Sent from my LG-P925 using Gearslutz.com
Old 11th December 2011
  #21
lds
Gear Nut
 
lds's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Makinithappen View Post
A guy I know who went to full sail sent me this a couple days ago....

(Full Sail Is A Scam!!!!) Meeting With Fullsail University Admissions Representative - YouTube
LOL! He mentions MTSU and Belmont!!
Old 11th December 2011
  #22
Lives for gear
 
mattjew24's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lds View Post
LOL! He mentions MTSU and Belmont!!
Haha I know...
Old 12th December 2011
  #23
Gear Head
 
TheDrumschlag's Avatar
 

I have at least 3 friends who graduated from Full Sail, and are currently working at Apple Stores. I have at least as many who have the same story but from Berklee. I'm studying at Berklee right now (I start the MP&E classes next semester, so I don't know a ton yet), and I have some friends who graduated that have gone on to make a comfortable living working as engineers.

That being said, the "student examples" from Full Sail are not nearly as good as the ones I've heard coming out of Berklee. I'm not saying Berklee will make you a better engineer than Full Sail, but it is a fully accredited college, and transferring credits from Berklee is not difficult (I attended a different school for 2 years after 1 year at Berklee and I had a music minor in that school simply from my Berklee transfer credits). Do your homework, and remember, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
Old 12th December 2011
  #24
Lives for gear
 
mattjew24's Avatar
 

The best thing a school can do is teach you everything you'd never learn in a home studio, ie Big consoles, tape machine alignment, pro tools.... And then let you play with it all. Also making good friends is important...

I moved with a friend from school to Nashville and we stay in contact. I freelance, he does the sound for a bar.
Old 14th December 2011
  #25
Gear interested
 

I would do my research on a few different schools, as well as the industry. I know several people who graduated from the F.I.R.S.T. School in Orlando, FL who are working in the industry, and pursuing their careers with out that much debt. Also, having a degree will not get you a job at a studio, you must have a solid portfolio. Think entry level, your just starting out once you graduate from any school. Check out Film & Video Production | Recording Arts Studio | The F.I.R.S.T. School Orlando, Forida I hope this helps.
Old 15th December 2011
  #26
Gear Maniac
 

Another school to check out is Recording Workshop in Chillicothe,Ohio.

Been around since the late 70's. Not too expensive.

Recording Workshop - Music, Audio and Sound Production School
Old 15th December 2011
  #27
Gear Maniac
 
Spanzor's Avatar
 

Depends

How much do you already know about recording?
Old 16th December 2011
  #28
Gear interested
 
StudioFiend2012's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spanzor View Post
How much do you already know about recording?
Well, everything I know is all self taught knowledge. But I feel I know a decent amount about recording and production. I want to open a recording studio where I live and I would feel more confident about doing it with a decent education and experience in an actual studio. For vocal recording I use the SE Reflection Filter, a Studio Projects C1 or the Blue Bluebird Mic into the Presonus tube preamp then, that goes into the M-Audio Projectmix i|o and I put everything together in Pro Tools where I might add a gate plugin, D-esser, reverb or whatever I feel the vocals need. For music production I use the Mpc 5000, Roland Fantom G6, Fl Studio, Ltd Ax 50 electric guitar, Yamaha Bass guitar and a Stanton turntable for sampling records which I rarely do. I just like to dabble in different styles and genres so I have a little of everything. I also mix the music in Pro tools where I track bounce or bus all the instrument tracks to an aux track then, I mix in the vocals and compress it all with Izotope Ozone..
Old 16th December 2011
  #29
Gear Maniac
 
Spanzor's Avatar
 

save your money

if I were you and I wanted to open a studio I wouldn't go- sounds like you already know most of the basics and not to clip etc.

full sail probably ranges around 5 figures. why don't you take like $4500 and buy a used HD3 system and take another little chunk and buy a couple good preamps.

it seems like most of the kids that end up in an audio school never end up doing massive ****, maybe because of the drive. Also they usually don't know the first thing about recording when they enroll. supernoobs. We used to interns come over from BIG schools, and didn't know **** about anything going on in the studio or how to deal with artists. Basically the mentality was like, they thought they could do things better, so you give the opportunity to get their foot in the door and ask them to do a small task like getting some In-n-out, and they come back an hour later with the wrong burger. Intern 101 fail.


then there's dudes like you already have a setup and are already making the effort to figure it out on their own. full sail will probably teach you how to use like an API legacy console, or better, a VR, something you may never use again unless you plan to buy one for your studio. They will NEVER be able to teach you the drive that it takes to become a working engineer. You'll be more worried about making it to the financial aid officer to pay up or seeing your guidance councilor to get transferred out of a dumb class.

That said, if you're going to be opening a studio are you going to be engineering there? If you are i would invest in tools you need to make your records sound the best. You've got to weigh the options you'll have in the future once you're done going to school. Right now it looks like you should just keep working on your own stuff and maybe intern somewhere, where you can learn probably way faster than in a school and it's essentially a free education.

One kid came over to the first studio i ever worked at to intern. I say kid but i mean 40 year old man. This guy was married, and had a son, and had just graduated from SAE or something. Some big school.

anyway he can kind of clean well and isn't too slow on the road. So we let him hang around. Never really figured out his place in the chain though and he was not good in social settings, which are things schools must not be teaching.

Anyway, dude asked one day if he could borrow a really small production room with like, a vocal chain, and just track some vocals for his session. Nothin in there but like, a focuswrong channel strip, and a mic.
So we let him use the room...and he comes out an hour later with like, this **** eating grin on his face. "Can't figure it out" he says. So an intern went in to hook him up. He had this funny little knob, actually, one of the biggest ones on there, and very isolated from the others, which said "OUTPUT LEVEL" or something, turned all the way down.

I would have wiped my ass with his degree if he showed it to me.
Old 17th December 2011
  #30
Lives for gear
 
mattjew24's Avatar
 

Just so ya know, my VR skills were handy at the studio I interned at... Did a lot of recalling mixes too.

And not to be a dick, but a lot of "engineers" in this music city don't know ****. They just got lucky and have the right friends...the assistant engineers do everything while the engineer basically produces. They would benefit from a school...

anyway, schools are not really always a waste of money. If one feels they have learned more in a year than possible making coffee and cleaning bathrooms, its a good deal..

Sometimes I wonder what studios would do without interns???
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
Igotsoul4u / The Moan Zone
49
chrissh / So much gear, so little time
17
JustinPhelps / Geekslutz forum
32
JFork / So much gear, so little time
4
ChrisG / Gear free zone - shoot the breeze
12

Forum Jump
Forum Jump