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EQ before or after compression and Reverb ? Multi-Ef­fects Plugins
Old 28th March 2010
  #1
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SoZo's Avatar
EQ before or after compression and Reverb ?

Do you guys find you eq before or after adding compression and reverb ?

Im not talking about sidechain or lowpass etc.... just normal mixing...
Old 28th March 2010
  #2
I like to add reverb first, then compression, then EQ.
Old 28th March 2010
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoZo View Post
Do you guys find you eq before or after adding compression and reverb ?
Yes.
Old 29th March 2010
  #4
Gear Head
 

EQ first then compression. If you EQ after compression you'll be EQing information that is irrelevant. Reverb should always be sent through your aux sends - never as an insert.
Old 29th March 2010
  #5
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Lifted's Avatar
 

I guess everyone has the different approach but I usually EQ first, compress after I get the good sound with EQ, and only then add reverb for flavor.
Old 29th March 2010
  #6
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2Loud's Avatar
I usually cut before compression, boosting after, /not neccessarily/
but its not a rule,really depends...

For usual purposes Im using reverb or delay after compression,
/unless not going for particular effect/

Brgds
Old 29th March 2010
  #7
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lagavulin16's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Peschinator View Post
EQ first then compression. If you EQ after compression you'll be EQing information that is irrelevant. Reverb should always be sent through your aux sends - never as an insert.
This is the complete opposite of what I've always heard. Compressor is "supposed to go" before the EQ.

And yes, I know there aren't any rules, sometimes it's better to do the EQ first especially when doing it subtractively, etc but the general guideline is to use compressor first and EQ second.

I would not track reverb, it should be added after the fact.
Old 29th March 2010
  #8
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bassman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Peschinator View Post
EQ first then compression. If you EQ after compression you'll be EQing information that is irrelevant. Reverb should always be sent through your aux sends - never as an insert.
This is not always true. Sometimes you want the compressor to react to the full spectrum and then do some eq after that. It can work both ways and you must experiment, perhaps even do both as has been suggested earlier in the thread. Mastering especially!

Everything has its sound. You either like it or you don't.

-ashley
Old 29th March 2010
  #9
Gear Addict
 

The order of EQ and compression depends on what you're trying to achieve. You may want to compensate for transient loss with post-EQ or you may want to affect the compressor's peak detection by using pre-EQ. Reverbs are mostly used last (you may also want to use the same reverb for several tracks). The order of a channel reverb and EQ doesn't matter, since both are linear processes.
Old 29th March 2010
  #10
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2Loud's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdtrbn View Post
The order of EQ and compression depends on what you're trying to achieve. You may want to compensate for transient loss with post-EQ or you may want to affect the compressor's peak detection by using pre-EQ. Reverbs are mostly used last (you may also want to use the same reverb for several tracks). The order of a channel reverb and EQ doesn't matter, since both are linear processes.

Old 29th March 2010
  #11
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Johnny Paez's Avatar
 

I EQ----Comp--- and reverb...
Old 29th March 2010
  #12
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Igotsoul4u's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdtrbn View Post
The order of EQ and compression depends on what you're trying to achieve. You may want to compensate for transient loss with post-EQ or you may want to affect the compressor's peak detection by using pre-EQ. Reverbs are mostly used last (you may also want to use the same reverb for several tracks). The order of a channel reverb and EQ doesn't matter, since both are linear processes.
yup
Old 29th March 2010
  #13
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judah's Avatar
 

It all depends on the source and the "quality" of tracking.

If I got a few frequencies that stick out on a particular source I tend to eq before compression so as not have the compressor reacts to those frequencies the most. I also might eq it again after compression if I need a lift in some specific spots.
If I done a good tracking and the sounds are balanced I usually put up a compressor first either to level it out (1176 on bass at 8:1 or LA2a in limit mode for example) or to play with the sound a bit (1176 on guitars at 4:1, slowest attack, fastest release some 3 to 6dB of gain reduction).

Reverb (and effects in general) I use auxes most of the time (let's say 99%). I almost always have a room, plate and delay setup from the beginning. I don't always use them all but it's handy to have them setup and you just have to bring uop an aux send and see if it is doin' anything interesting...

Sometimes I use fx as insert because they are specific to that track and I'm sure I'm not gonna use it all over the mix (like slapback echo on guitars or synced delay on specific parts).

Experiment...
Old 29th March 2010
  #14
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dlmorley's Avatar
All of the above
Old 29th March 2010
  #15
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RoundBadge's Avatar
my first instinct is comp/eq/then maybe send to fx/verb/delay.
but there are No rules .whatever combo sounds good on the day
obviously diff interactions w/ diff orders.
its always fun to experiment
Old 29th March 2010
  #16
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lowfreq33's Avatar
 

There's no rule, but I usually do any cutting of frequencies before compression, and any boosting after. This tends to sound more natural, as the comp isn't reacting to the ugly frequencies you just want to get rid of anyway.

Actually what I should say id that I do my filtering (high pass, low pass) before compression during tracking. Then any other eq goes after.
Old 29th March 2010
  #17
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SoZo's Avatar
great responses.... I read somewhere the guy who mixed Pink Floyd(dont know the era) said he rolls 8k and above down before reverb.... one reason I asked.

That was on tape though...
Old 29th March 2010
  #18
Gear Nut
 

Scrap-sand-paint
EQ-compress-reverb
Old 30th March 2010
  #19
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six_wax's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdtrbn View Post
The order of a channel reverb and EQ doesn't matter, since both are linear processes.
Can I get a judges ruling on this? You're telling me that reverb processing doesn't change (e.g. add) frequency content at all? Experientially, I don't think this is true.

And since I started out an EE, I've got to correct you on the math, too. I'm sorry about this. I really am. I can't help it.

"Linear" means that f(input1) + f(input2) = f(input1+input2). This is called vector addition.

So for an linear reverb, it just means you can send signals from different tracks, and the resulting signal out will be the same as if it originated from one combined signal.

However, applying EQ to a signal before reverb would mathematically look more like this: f(g(input)) ...while applying EQ after reverb would look like this: g(f(input)).

"Linearity" makes no claim that f(g(x)) = g(f(x)). In fact, testing this with 2 simple linear functions like f=3x+1 and g=x-2 makes it clear that this isn't the case.

Think about this sonically, too. Any good reverb sound will account for some degree of absorbtion (attenuating high freqs) and model some sort of acoustic space (replete with resonant peaks & dips). If reverbs only generated tails in the frequency range of the source, EQing before & after might be identical, but they don't. They add frequency content (or cancel it in some cases) dependent on the source.

The moral of the story is, EQing before or after channel reverb gets you different results.

What just happened? Where am I?
Old 30th March 2010
  #20
500 series nutjob
 
pan60's Avatar
 

comp ( depending on source ), EQ, maybe comp, verb ( if used ), then re-think, re-track, then no EQ and maybe some comp, then re-drink, drink, then look at my note and decide tomorrow might be a better day.
i knew i should have used that dynamic mic.
Old 30th March 2010
  #21
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Tom H's Avatar
 

Reverb is usually on a send; post eq/comp/fader.

It's not uncommon for me to setup a dedicated eq and compressor for the send so that the reverb doesn't sound exaggarated at loud or sibilant parts.

On drums reverb can sound cool as an insert before compression, more like an effect to hear the compressor pump and the reverb breath. Or send and bus the reverb together with the drums and compress there for a similar effect.

Order of eq-comp or comp-eq can make a big difference or sometimes not, it's allways cool to swap these around.
Old 30th June 2010
  #22
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Eloheim's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdtrbn View Post
The order of a channel reverb and EQ doesn't matter, since both are linear processes.
I don't think this is true. What you say is interesting about the linearity of the processes, but some null testing will clearly show there's a difference between pre- and post-reverb eq-ing. Maybe it has to do with a reverb's feedback filtering? Like a delay where each FB cycle has less high's than the one before it?

I've always pictured, e.g., like pre-reverb EQ cuts mean those frequencies won't be 'reverberated', whereas a post-reverb cut would mean you are attenuating those frequencies' 'reverberations'.

In general, it must be true that reverb effects other frequencies around the source frequency, right? And therefore it's NOT linear?
Old 1st July 2010
  #23
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DarkSky Media's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoZo View Post
great responses.... I read somewhere the guy who mixed Pink Floyd(dont know the era) said he rolls 8k and above down before reverb.... one reason I asked.

That was on tape though...
That was Alan Parsons IIRC.
Old 1st July 2010
  #24
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoZo View Post
Do you guys find you eq before or after adding compression and reverb ?
whichever one sounds best; try it. heh With spring reverbs it's definitely useful to cut some low end pre-reverb to prevent the damned thing from going BOI-I-I-N-G

M.
Old 1st July 2010
  #25
Gear Nut
 

I find it best to EQ before compression.. since compression brings everything together or "glues" the frequencies I find it perfect to smooth out any EQ I've added.

I send the track to Reverb via Aux sends post fader.. so after EQ and compression.. that way I can add the "space" to the overall sound I've spent time trying to achieve. And I always roll off anything above about 5-6khz on the reverb.. even if I'm not looking for a distant effect I just don't like the sound of bright reverb at all.

Cheers
Old 1st July 2010
  #26
Gear Maniac
I tend to pre-EQ the sound to prepare the compressor for the material that is coming in. Like if I was to work on some drum overheads, I would filter out some of the bass frequencies so that the BD and lower toms on the overhead track does not affect the compressor, so that the snare and the cymbals/hi-hats are worked on. After this I would then add the bass frequencies back in with post-EQ and then I get some more dynamics out of the BD which I would not have had if I just compressed before. Some styles of music call for more compression on the overheads to give some more power, in that case I might use pre-EQ and then 2 compressors, one to bring out the raw power of the kit and another to round off some of the really high transients that are brought out, so I get a really nice sound and then I again use post EQ to add back in what I took out to feed the compressors. If I need to do any cutting, I usually do this at the pre-EQ stage, and then I boost at the post EQ stage if the sound is in real need of it after compression, but usually if you do it right you won't need to boost by much to get the sound you want.

I always use reverbs on an Aux send channels, unless I'm looking for some sort of effect on the sound.
Old 1st July 2010
  #27
deciding the chain order in my opinion is program dependent. Most of the time
I want to eq after the compressor, but there are instance say if I boosting 50hz on a bass drum where I would put the compressor after the eq to keep that boost tight. Also sometimes on vocal tracks because of sibilance or the quality of the vocal it just works better to compress after the eq. This for me only applies during the mix, tracking I don't eq
Old 2nd July 2010
  #28
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DarkSky Media's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Musiclab View Post
deciding the chain order in my opinion is program dependent.
I have stuff normalled though the patchbays so that on tracking paths EQ comes before comp, but on bus paths, EQ comes after. Most often that seems to be what works.

At least I can re-patch it pretty easily if it isn't doing what I want - which isn't the case with most all-in-one channel strips (I knew there was a reason why I prefer stand-lone pres, EQs and comps heh)!

Old 2nd July 2010
  #29
I don't have any of that normalled, I have enough normalling going on with an 80 input console , a 2" 24 track and 48 channels of DAW I/O. Also since I track with no eq I don't want to patch anything unnecessarily. I would have to say that 98% of the time it's compressor into eq, but when it needs to be the other way it's fairly obvious, but although I track most things with compression I save the eq for the mix
Old 23rd July 2012
  #30
Gear Maniac
 
FlametopFred's Avatar
 

buttons

I will try anything in any order.

Sometimes to see what is there, if anything.
Sometimes to see if the result is totally horrible.

And anyway, a good mixing desk has all sorts of buttons and choices.
Anything can be PRE this or POST that.

The way I figure it, if the mixer gods did not want us to play around with signal flow, then they would not have put all those choices and buttons on the boards.

Anyway,
what would Eno do?
what would Lanois do?
what would Emerick do?
what would Ross* do?

maybe reverb should be the first thing in the chain, who knows



one thing I TOTALLY LOVE is when I have the template up for one song (in a mixer with recall) but another song on the 24-track has totally different track assignments

meaning that when I first hit play, there's some great surprises - like maybe a vocal with bass eq, for example or maybe a different reverb on the bass.

* Happy Accidents is what Bob Ross would do, and everything he did is applicable to mixing He also had a pet squirrel but that's besides the point.


http://youtu.be/raXanYjTF18


and sometimes Bob puts reverb on first, painting-wise
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