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IEM Mixer question - Pre amps needed ?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #1
Here for the gear
 

IEM Mixer question - Pre amps needed ?

So ! its my first post !

I currently have the Presonus 16r to run 3 stereo IEM mixes for my X3 PSM 900's.
https://www.presonus.com/products/StudioLive-16R

it works perfectly, but the issue i have with it is , that its too long & heavy. i want to make a more compact IEM unit for touring.

Presonus 16r
Height 1.75” (45mm)
Width 19” (483mm)
Depth 12” (305mm)
Weight 8.6 lbs. (3.9 kg)

Motu 16a
(width x depth x height, enclosure only)
19 x 7 x 1.75 inches
48.3 x 17.75 x 4.5 cm
5.0 lbs / 2.27 kg


The main alternative i have been looking at is the motu 16a because it is smaller in depth and i dont have to route cables to the front of the unit also.
https://motu.com/products/avb/16a

so my question is , if my stage splits to the IEM mixer are all line level (kempers/bass di split/microphone) does my IEM mixer need to have pre amps like the personus ? or will the analogue inputs of the motu be fine ?
Attached Thumbnails
IEM Mixer question - Pre amps needed ?-presonus-16r-back.jpg   IEM Mixer question - Pre amps needed ?-presonus-16r-front-.jpg   IEM Mixer question - Pre amps needed ?-motu-16a-back-.jpg   IEM Mixer question - Pre amps needed ?-motu-16a-front-.jpg  
Old 3 weeks ago
  #2
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rotaxhead View Post
So ! its my first post !

I currently have the Presonus 16r to run 3 stereo IEM mixes for my X3 PSM 900's.
https://www.presonus.com/products/StudioLive-16R

it works perfectly, but the issue i have with it is , that its too long & heavy. i want to make a more compact IEM unit for touring.

Presonus 16r
Height 1.75” (45mm)
Width 19” (483mm)
Depth 12” (305mm)
Weight 8.6 lbs. (3.9 kg)

Motu 16a
(width x depth x height, enclosure only)
19 x 7 x 1.75 inches
48.3 x 17.75 x 4.5 cm
5.0 lbs / 2.27 kg


The main alternative i have been looking at is the motu 16a because it is smaller in depth and i dont have to route cables to the front of the unit also.
https://motu.com/products/avb/16a

so my question is , if my stage splits to the IEM mixer are all line level (kempers/bass di split/microphone) does my IEM mixer need to have pre amps like the personus ? or will the analogue inputs of the motu be fine ?

1. The presonus is only 3.5 pounds more on weight. It's set up to be a mixer, interface, IEM solution.

2. The motu was listed as an interface only. It's GUI will most likely not be as nice as the presonus for IEM use.

3. why would you have such an elaborate system to monitor 3 line levels to IEM?

4. You included "microphone" in your list of line level stage splits. Unless you have pre amps for those mics then they are mic level, not line.

There are a lot of things in your post that don't seem to make logical sense yet. If you are looking for advice on what suits your needs then your needs and better description of the IEM set up needs to be clearer.

Oops, sorry, I just noticed this thread was in the newbie section and not the live sound section.

What you have now is probably the best, lightest, most capable solution for what you need.
Going with a 16" 1u rack mount interface doesn't make sense as you will need a computer to run it's internal mixing, and each output for IEM may not, will probably not have ipad/tablet mixing apps for each person to set up in ears like the presonus has.

Mics always need a pre amp to get up to line level.

Why is it a problem that the presonus has mic inputs in the front?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #3
Here for the gear
 

Thanks for the reply ! I posted this in newbie section just for this reason that im not 100% confident with the technical details.

EDIT* the reason for going down the rabbit hole is to eliminate the HUGE iem rigs everyone is using the these days.... the massive 3 rack space Behringer X32 and the huge housing everyone uses with empty space in the back of them.

EDIT EDIT* i Play in a hardcore/metal band.
Inputs needed are only 2 guitars, bass, 2 microphones , click track, FOH drum feed at the minimum. with the possible option of all drums mics if possible.

Quote:
1. The presonus is only 3.5 pounds more on weight. It's set up to be a mixer, interface, IEM solution.
The main issue is the length/depth into the rack , it is far longer then the IEM units so the housing i need to put all these in is turn bigger and then the SKB flight case it goes in is bigger aswell. The Motu is MUCH shorter.

Quote:
2. The motu was listed as an interface only. It's GUI will most likely not be as nice as the presonus for IEM use.
It does however have a onboard DSP mixer that is able to be linked to a router apple airport for example to a wifi app to adjust iem levels.

Quote:
3. why would you have such an elaborate system to monitor 3 line levels to IEM?
I have the money to spend and the want/will to make the most compact system as possible. the 3 psms feed bassist stereo mix , singer stereo mix and the 2 guitars have 2 mono mixes off the 3rd PSM900.

Quote:
4. You included "microphone" in your list of line level stage splits. Unless you have pre amps for those mics then they are mic level, not line.
Heres where my technical knowledge ends, i dont even know the difference between the two, what i mainly want to know is if these signals can be received by the 16a analogue inputs and in turn used in the IEM mixes. Sounds like id need like a ROLLS mini mic pre amp?

Quote:
There are a lot of things in your post that don't seem to make logical sense yet. If you are looking for advice on what suits your needs then your needs and better description of the IEM set up needs to be clearer.

Oops, sorry, I just noticed this thread was in the newbie section and not the live sound section.
Yes newbie hahaha thanks. I am a reasonably well toured veteran but now building a IEM system.

Quote:
Going with a 16" 1u rack mount interface doesn't make sense as you will need a computer to run it's internal mixing, and each output for IEM may not, will probably not have ipad/tablet mixing apps for each person to set up in ears like the presonus has.
the motu 16a does have router and remote mixing capability.

Quote:
Why is it a problem that the presonus has mic inputs in the front?
I have custom patch panels at the back, the front inputs are just directed to the back anyway, it would make it much cleaner.

Maybe the motu 8m with he mic pre amps is on the cards too, even the motu ultralitemk4 for only 2 mics.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #4
Gear Maniac
 

Getting a little closer but you still need to state your goals.

Is your flight case a 2u unit? do you want to whole set up in a 2u, 3u, 4u unit?

Is the depth of the unit the main problem or the weight?


Inputs needed are only

2 guitars, bass: You will need to have a "instrument input" if you wish to plug in with 1/4", or you will need to daisy chain two DI boxes via 1/4", or you need to use a y-splitter post single DI box to send XLR to your IEM rig and to FoH



2 microphones: You can find 1u rackmount mic pre amp units that are probably much shorter then the Presonus you have now, but then you will need to have power for that too.

What size flight case do you have now and what's in it?


click track, FOH drum feed at the minimum.(these do not need a pre amp) can plug into a line level input.

" with the possible option of all drums mics if possible." Even if you put in a 1u 4 channel mic pre amp you will not be able to monitor all drum mics with only 4 mic pres.

How are you splitting signals now and what's the signal flow? Are you sending outputs from the Presonus mix outs to FoH?

I looked a little at the owners manual.

8m, has 8 mic pre amps that are combos, they can handle mic/line/ and guitar/bass inputs.

Your minimum need would be

3 instruments inputs

1 line level click track

1 line level drum feed

2 mics, needing pre amps

Looks like the 8m can handle that low channel count.

Also looks like the 8m has ADAT expansion, so you can add another 8 channels of mic/instrument input and send it in via adat to the Motu 8m.

Although, I would just separate the Presonus 16 from the flight case and put the in-ear transmitters in a separate case.
It looks like the Motu 16A is only line level input. Meaning it won't meet your needs.
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