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Haas effect
Old 9th September 2019
  #1
Gear Head
 

Haas effect

Im mixing some recordings of a 3 piece and I'm hitting a brick wall.

1 distorted/driven guitar track
1 over shoulder drum (just tom and snare)
1 snare mic
1 bass mic
1 vocal

the guitar and drums were recorded live so there is some bleed into the drum mic.
everything else overdubbed.

I want to get the guitars stereo and have tried Haas. It made the guitar thin and papery with artifacts in the high end. And when I check in mono it just sounds terrible, no definition at all.

I tried Haas with 2 delayed tracks and the original centered. L delayed 11ms/R delayed 17ms. still artifacts in the high end.

I tried MS using the slightly delayed track/original track. Sounded a bit better in stereo but checking in mono it still loses all definition.

The vibe is velvet underground white light/white heat, and i was hesitant to do a 'modern guitar' thing to it but in mono the guitar isn't up front enough without obscuring other elements. And with one guitar panning it just L or R it makes the mix lopsided. I tried panning the drums/guitar opposite but the mix loses the impact.

maybe pan drums/guitar opposite and send reverbs to the opposite track?

Im kinda at a loss right now
Old 10th September 2019
  #2
Gear Head
 

I'm the guitarist, so if I was in this scenario, I'd record another take, then pan the original somewhat left and the new track somewhat right. The nice thick stereo guitar tone you hear on most recordings is usually the result of 2 or even more takes blended together, NOT one take with effects applied to it.

If another take isn't an option, I'd take the original guitar track dead center, and send the output to a stereo aux track, then add a chorus and maybe just a little delay as inserts and then take the output of that to your main mix, panned where you like it. Unless you are trying to recreate weird flanging and phasing sounds, doing things like copying the track and applying time-shifting or sliding it around a little are sure ways to get phase issues that sound bad - and I'm not saying you are doing that, but it kind of sounds like you are, based on the sound you describe. Phase issues almost always sound the worst when you pan the 2 sources exactly into the same spot, and manifest as weird artifacts in the mid/high end and generally "thinner" sound.
Old 10th September 2019
  #3
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by SometimesAlways View Post
... the original centered. L delayed 11ms/R delayed 17ms. still artifacts in the high end.
Difference between L and R is 6ms, this is probely giving you problems.
Use only two tracks and delay only one.
Or, beter what Dave said.
Old 10th September 2019
  #4
Gear Head
 

Solved the problem - said **** that and just made the mix mono
Old 10th September 2019
  #5
Lives for gear
 

I was going to suggest you try and minimize phase shifting caused by the mic bleed but if mono worked for you then you're good.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #6
Lives for gear
 
Owen L T's Avatar
The effect works great, but there were a couple issues with the implementation: (i) keeping a center guitar; (ii) too short a delay time between any of them.

Classic Haas effect setup: pan one guitar hard left. Pan the other hard right, starting with a 20ms delay. You may want to lowpass the delayed guitar a bit, and play with the level.

But three guitars with 7 and 4 ms between them, including one up the middle will guarantee no width, and just a phase cancellation-y mess.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7
Lives for snowflakes
 
12ax7's Avatar
 

Try the "ADT" preset on this thing:
Tokyo Dawn | Proximity
(Its FREE.)

.
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