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how to cope with peaks
Old 3 weeks ago
  #1
Here for the gear
 

how to cope with peaks

so i cant wrap my head around about why the kick in the picture is hitting like a truck when its only peaking -15db while the rest of the song peaks at -6.

its just how the soundwave is? i need the theory behind it, why its so huge when looking from limiter when its not loud at all and how to cope with it? i cant even put limiter to that, or i can for a couple db but thats it and the song will just end up sounding worse.

all sounds good atm but i cant manage to do any mastering to that.
Attached Thumbnails
how to cope with peaks-111.png  
Old 3 weeks ago
  #2
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by architecture View Post
so i cant wrap my head around about why the kick in the picture is hitting like a truck when its only peaking -15db while the rest of the song peaks at -6.

its just how the soundwave is? i need the theory behind it, why its so huge when looking from limiter when its not loud at all and how to cope with it? i cant even put limiter to that, or i can for a couple db but thats it and the song will just end up sounding worse.

all sounds good atm but i cant manage to do any mastering to that.
why would you put a limiter on only a kick?

You should be mixing based on how things sound.

Putting a limiter or compressor on something just to do it is the wrong way to be thinking.

If you are looking for any theory then you will need to post an actual scale range in DB of the waveform and a spectral graph of the wave form.

If you haven't already, look into how to set gain structure in a DAW.

Also post what DAW you are using and what meter scale.

Putting a limiter on the main BUS and mastering are not the same thing.

If you want to mix INTO a limiter/compressor you should do that, but then disable all main bus compression/limiting and export your track that way.

Now in the mastering you are not locked into the compression/limiting you were using to mix. You can still duplicate those settings but you are free to try other things.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #3
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
why would you put a limiter on only a kick?
i dont know why you would think that i would.

Quote:
You should be mixing based on how things sound.
read last sentence.

Quote:
Putting a limiter or compressor on something just to do it is the wrong way to be thinking.
just to do what? i limit when needed, compress when needed.

Quote:
If you are looking for any theory then you will need to post an actual scale range in DB of the waveform and a spectral graph of the wave form.
i can share the flp if needed but i think you can clearly see from that picture that the kick is 2x "louder" than the mix on average.

Quote:
If you haven't already, look into how to set gain structure in a DAW.
if you are talking about gain staging, im doing it as good as i know to.

Quote:
Also post what DAW you are using and what meter scale.
fl studio 20, also dont know how that helps

Quote:
Putting a limiter on the main BUS and mastering are not the same thing.
you are jumping fast to conclusion

Quote:
If you want to mix INTO a limiter/compressor you should do that, but then disable all main bus compression/limiting and export your track that way.
i dont even know what main bus is, sounds like second master for no reason

Quote:
Now in the mastering you are not locked into the compression/limiting you were using to mix. You can still duplicate those settings but you are free to try other things.
appreciate it but any help regarding to the topic?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #4
Gear Nut
 

Friend, your original post is extremely unclear. You didn't specify that the wave form you posted was NOT just a kick but was a mixdown. That would help explain a lot.



I am not familiar with FL but IF you don't already know the difference between peak and RMS metering then that is a good place to start

A kick, with HIGH spl over a short amount of time can show up as a lower SPL on an RMS meter, while music that has a more constant SPL can show up higher than the kick on an RMS meter.

Without knowing the logic of the meter I can't say for sure.

One way to see is to pan your Kick to the far left, pan all the other music to the far right, and switch between RMS and PEAK meters to see how things change.

EDIT--
I was responding and didn't see this was the newbie section, My bad.

"Main bus", "master bus", this is the last set of faders/processing before the music leaves your DAW.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #5
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Friend, your original post is extremely unclear. You didn't specify that the wave form you posted was NOT just a kick but was a mixdown. That would help explain a lot.

Without knowing the logic of the meter I can't say for sure.
my bad

the picture is from limiter so i believe its peak? and fl studio meters peaks by default in the mixer. i dont see how any RMS metering would make difference since its still going to jump in plugins's meters?

my concern is to make the mix balanced in order to push it loud as possible but the kick is already so low volume that i cant pull it anymore down. and since its 2x "louder" than the average mix in the limiters meter i cant push it at all.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #6
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by architecture View Post
my bad

the picture is from limiter so i believe its peak? and fl studio meters peaks by default in the mixer. i dont see how any RMS metering would make difference since its still going to jump in plugins's meters?

my concern is to make the mix balanced in order to push it loud as possible but the kick is already so low volume that i cant pull it anymore down. and since its 2x "louder" than the average mix in the limiters meter i cant push it at all.
This seems like a mixing issue. Do you have a multi track session you can adjust the mix in? or are you trying a master a track that is already mixed down.

Often times if a mix is so out of balance even a pro mastering person will send it back to get remixed.

Can you upload a sample of the audio file?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #7
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DownTheLine View Post
This seems like a mixing issue. Do you have a multi track session you can adjust the mix in? or are you trying a master a track that is already mixed down.

Often times if a mix is so out of balance even a pro mastering person will send it back to get remixed.

Can you upload a sample of the audio file?
There are a few ways to compress just the low end/kick

You can use a multi band compressor plug in.

You can copy the and past the track and use and EQ with HPF/LPF to make a poor mans multiband compressor

If your FL has a built in multiband, start with that.
https://www.image-line.com/support/f...Compressor.htm
Old 3 weeks ago
  #8
Lives for gear
So it's dynamic, nice.
Why squash the life out of it?
Loudness war is over, turn up the volume.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #9
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
This seems like a mixing issue. Do you have a multi track session you can adjust the mix in? or are you trying a master a track that is already mixed down.
yeah i can adjust all i got the poroject.

theres a sample of how it sounds. i found out that if i mute the pad melody, the kick wont go even nearly as high. so they are clashing together or something? but the melody already has a lpf to 350hz, i tried sidechaining but it didnt really have any impact, also if i routed the pad melody from my drum bus it kinda made the problem disappear but then the melody would get too distorted coz i got saturation in the drum bus. so now idk what to do

Quote:
So it's dynamic, nice.
Why squash the life out of it?
Loudness war is over, turn up the volume.
i havent really gotten into LUFS yet but if the kick stays like that my tracks LUFS wont be even half of the average. its too dynamic, so dynamic that i cant enhance anything else's dynamics
Attached Files

clip.wav (14.56 MB, 298 views)

Old 3 weeks ago
  #10
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by architecture View Post
yeah i can adjust all i got the poroject.

theres a sample of how it sounds. i found out that if i mute the pad melody, the kick wont go even nearly as high. so they are clashing together or something? but the melody already has a lpf to 350hz, i tried sidechaining but it didnt really have any impact, also if i routed the pad melody from my drum bus it kinda made the problem disappear but then the melody would get too distorted coz i got saturation in the drum bus. so now idk what to do


i havent really gotten into LUFS yet but if the kick stays like that my tracks LUFS wont be even half of the average. its too dynamic, so dynamic that i cant enhance anything else's dynamics
That's a great start!

What I'm hearing is not so much an issue with peaks but just general mixing issues.

That underwater dolphin sound that has some long delay and reverb on it takes up a lot of the sonic space and sounds kind of harsh on the higher notes.

If you have reverb and delay making that sound, if the "time based" effects like reverb and delay are on the synth track, move them to an "effects buss" if you can in your program, no you can EQ sonic space out of the reverb/delay. Start making cuts around 500hz and also around 6000-7000hz

All that reverb/delay is causing a mucky mix.

If you can't create and effects send/buss in FL then just EQ a little 400hz and 6000hz out of the synth.

I can barely hear the bass. It sound dull and has no power to it. There are many things you can try. Compressors, parallel compression is coo, read up on it when you can if you don't know already.

You have a quick hitting kick, and a melodic, floaty, wet synth. In Reggae music the put a lot of wet sound onto the vocals and delay onto the rhythm parts to make it blend.

If you want a kick to sound loud and strong in a mix, you have to make it sound that way by itself. Just turning up a weak sounding kick will not make it sound strong.



Old 3 weeks ago
  #11
Quote:
i havent really gotten into LUFS yet but if the kick stays like that my tracks LUFS wont be even half of the average. its too dynamic, so dynamic that i cant enhance anything else's dynamics
Attached Files
Most tracks start out with dynamics, so dynamics are not your problem. I personally think you just need to learn some basics on mixing, then you'll understand some basic concepts of gain staging, signal chains and the use of tools that are commonly use din the mixing stage.

Kicks being dynamic are normal. Kick drums are peaks and then they fall down. Every kick is like that. Nothing unusual here. If you listen to any kick, you'll hear a boom and then it will fall fast. That makes it dynamic. EQ, compression, sided chain, mid EQ and other tools are used.

If the kick are not at the same volume, like some are softer and some are louder, then you can use volume automation, like envelopes to fix that problem or re-record it properly.

Either or, they are both easy to mix into a song
Old 3 weeks ago
  #12
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Sigma's Avatar
Lol "i mix by pictures"
Old 3 weeks ago
  #13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
Lol "i mix by pictures"
At least you do not paint with your ears
Old 2 weeks ago
  #14
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Sigma's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ Mastering View Post
At least you do not paint with your ears
Lolz..MY LEFT EAR...
I literally went through this yesterday with my summer intern while doing intense vocal rides.. " screen draws of amplitude have nothing to do with apparent volume of a source"..i use edit screen in PT as the marker i never had for 30+ years..its great as a marker ..er only..lo flipping from 3 months at 30 IPS to a 15 IPS session always messed with my FF/REW rocker time..seeing an instrument's enter and exit points is a great time saver for me..but only again AS A MARKER ..don't look at that crap for anything else

Last edited by Sigma; 2 weeks ago at 04:59 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #15
please remember phase correlation ..there might be something fooling your ears and not your eyes!
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