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Recording live rehearsal. Making a studio for both band rehearsal and recording.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #31
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
it's true many sound companies will provide a backline and you don't have to bring your amps.
That's only true for festivals and other special events. Good luck getting a bar or club to provide a backline for a new band playing originals - will not happen. A new band needs gear and needs to know how to setup by themselves - even without a soundguy.

Also, a backline is usually pretty generic amps - fender hot rods etc. You need a pedal board to make those work and there is a learning curve for that.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #32
Gear Guru
 
henryrobinett's Avatar
For my band/studio, I have 34 I/O of mic/line spread throughout 4 rooms. The same amount outputs for phone and cue mixes. I bought a very nice drum kit - Gretsch Renown and a nice keyboard, Yamaha MX88. I record the keyboard direct from the keyboards stereo outputs as well as midi, though that's not playing midi to avoid latency. It's just recording the midi information. There's an adequate bass amp, only for live rehearsal. GK Backline 115. For electric bass I put him through the Millennia TD-1 DI. I have a couple of Fractal guitar modellers - AX8 for live playing in the tracking room and the Axe Fx III racked in the control room. I also have a few nice guitar amps I rarely play any more. Sue me.

Each musician has headphones by their "station". A couple of guys bring their own and just plug into the extension cord. I use the Metric Halo ULN-8 3d system. So the first few sessions we get the levels set up, both the recording levels and each musicians cue mix. And those are saved, so he next sessions are ready to go.

I also have an iPad, so if I want to track from the tracking room myself I can control the DAW from there. But I rarely do that.

We're a jazz group. The bass player plays an upright a lot so he's stationed in the kitchen iso room. I'm in the Control Room. We have windows so we can maintain visual.

Everything is mic'ed and the mics remain up. I just cover them with plastic freezer bags to keep the dust off.

When we're rehearsing alone, we all set up in the Tracking Room. Recording we all go to our rooms. Time out. LOL.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #33
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett View Post
Not everyone has a cottage in their backyard they can turn into a studio.
Elect me president, and everyone will get a cottage in their backyard they can turn into a studio.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #34
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverb View Post
That's only true for festivals and other special events. Good luck getting a bar or club to provide a backline for a new band playing originals - will not happen.
well the OP said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stelladevania
I meant, in live music events, the event orginazer takes care of all the stage and equipments needed.
...indicating to me he was thinking of more of a festival type thing.
In any case, the OP is in Indonesia. Who knows what the "club" scene there is like... or even if there is one? He did not seem to be very responsive to statements about his band playing in "clubs". He seems to think the band's path is home rehearsals > Instagram > music "events". Which for all I know, is the way you have to do it in Indonesia!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverb
A new band needs gear and needs to know how to setup by themselves - even without a soundguy.
I totally agree. That was my reasoning when I said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq
...suddenly being asked to play through amps may be a shock.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverb
Also, a backline is usually pretty generic amps - fender hot rods etc. You need a pedal board to make those work and there is a learning curve for that.
Agreed. You need to practice it the way you are going to do it at the gig. If the OP is using sims for his amp sound, they probably are using the sims for pedal sounds as well. So there's another curve ball thrown at them five minutes before they hit the stage! Here, this is a pedal. You step on it to activate that sound.
Old 1 week ago
  #35
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
If there is a click it will much easier technically to keep everybody together if you are going to replace parts, overdub, etc. I had gotten the impression that you were going to record your rehearsals live then replace the vocals and the drums. If you are sending all the guitars in direct with sims, put the singer in a corner, etc you could keep the sound in the room near to zero except for the drums.

But in that case, you could also keep the drums that you got when the band tracked together, which many people (myself included) would say will probably have better feel than an overdubbed performance. If your isolation is good, you could maybe just punch one or two spots etc.

I have worked with a lot of bands that got their basics down with direct guitars and the drums as the only live thing making sound in the room. Usually we reamp the guitars, because most of the people I work with don't care for the sims. Or we have amps in closets, isolated away from the drum set.


If you are running all your guitars direct with no amps, what bleed are you worried about?


I personally am not a fan of "kits", even from respectable brands like Lewitt. I like to choose my weapons and mix and match as the situation requires. Buying mics one at a time also gives you some breathing space financially. Get one kick mic, one snare mic and an overhead mic and you can start recording. Add a second overhead for stereo and add tom mics and so on later.

And if you are limited to mics available in your country, do some research and find out what mics are often recommended for snare? SM57? Maybe they already have those where you are and don't need to be directly imported? What mics are often recommended for overheads? MK-012? Do they have those there? etc.

Also try to think about multi-use mics. A nice LD condenser could be a good overhead and also a good vocal mic. If the vocals you are recording during the drum tracking are just "scratch" you could give the drummer the condenser mic and give it back to the singer when you do the vocals "for real". A drum mic "kit" may include a condenser for overheads, but it probably won't be ideal for vocals as well.

With the possible exception of kick drum mics, which are kind of specialized, all my "drum mics" are just good mics, period. General-purpose mics, and they get used on guitar amps, acoustic guitars, vocals, piano, horns, - not just on drums.


not sure if you are talking about live or recording. If you want to record the drums, you must have mics! For live, miking up the drums depends on what you need to project to the venue you are in. In a small club, it would be silly to mic the drums. In a big stadium, it would be absurd to not mic the drums.

For a really simple sound reinforcement in a medium sized club, I have seen people take an inexpensive dynamic omni - like the EV 635a - and put it just about over the drummer's right knee. It is now equidistant -and just inches- from the kick, the snare, and the toms. If you just need a little bit of reinforcement, it works pretty well. I often use this mic position for recording, too.



You don't need a lot of mics to record a drum set. Especially if it is the only thing making sound in the room. Besides your drummer's aversion, you need to consider stylistic requirements for using electronic drums. For some kinds of music, electronics will get you closer to where you actually need to be. For other styles, they just sound 'fake'.


Well if you can record 20 tracks simultaneously that way, that would be great. Getting the data off the SD card and into your computer is just one extra step. I recently consulted for a few clients about mixer/interfaces and found you really need to read the fine print. They will all make it seem like "channels" = "simultaneous recording channels" but many times this is not the case!
Thanks for all the advices! I'll keep them in mind!
Old 1 week ago
  #36
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadlessDinosaur View Post
Not sure if this is in your budget or not but this is a board no one has brought up yet and feature set wise I think would cover most of what you need. And you CAN record individual channels not just 4. Look at the new Tascam Model 24
I've already checked it out and i don't think it's the one i want.
Currently i'm leading heavily towards zoom L-20 and Behringer x32 RACK. They're not that much different in terms of price. The x32 rack seems to offer more feature. The only downside to it is the fact that it doesn't have knobs so we'd have to control it through a computer or a tablet. I'm not sure yet how i feel about that.
Old 1 week ago
  #37
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
it's true many sound companies will provide a backline and you don't have to bring your amps. But if you are always rehearsing and recording plugging your guitars straight in to the board and using sims, suddenly being asked to play through amps may be a shock.

I had some students who played and recorded together for years, and did not own any amplifiers, just plugged in direct with sims. They went out and got amplifiers because they had a gig. When they got there, they spent half the night playing too loud and the other half playing not loud enough. And not even at the same time. The gig was a train wreck, and they were not invited back.

Whatever you do, you should practice it the same way as you are going to do it at the show. A live performance in front of a crowd is the last place you want to be trying something "new" for the first time.
We'd still be using amps, we just won't record the amp
Old 1 week ago
  #38
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett View Post
It'll take me a minute. But here's some out of date photos. https://henryrobinett.com/the-studio/

I'm busy. Two hours practicing. After that maybe I'll have a little time to post some of my ideas and details. There are two other rooms not visible. I turned the kitchen into a tracking room and there's another room that was the laundry room.

This is a cottage in our backyard. AS I said this is ideal for me. Not everyone has a cottage in their backyard they can turn into a studio.
Wow your studio sounds great! It's outside my budget but it's good for reference thanks!
Old 1 week ago
  #39
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverb View Post
That's only true for festivals and other special events. Good luck getting a bar or club to provide a backline for a new band playing originals - will not happen. A new band needs gear and needs to know how to setup by themselves - even without a soundguy.

Also, a backline is usually pretty generic amps - fender hot rods etc. You need a pedal board to make those work and there is a learning curve for that.
We'd be playing covers mostly. We'd only bring one of our originals each time. And we know how to setup our own gear. The only thing we've never done is TOUCHING a digital mixer lmao.
Old 1 week ago
  #40
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett View Post
For my band/studio, I have 34 I/O of mic/line spread throughout 4 rooms. The same amount outputs for phone and cue mixes. I bought a very nice drum kit - Gretsch Renown and a nice keyboard, Yamaha MX88. I record the keyboard direct from the keyboards stereo outputs as well as midi, though that's not playing midi to avoid latency. It's just recording the midi information. There's an adequate bass amp, only for live rehearsal. GK Backline 115. For electric bass I put him through the Millennia TD-1 DI. I have a couple of Fractal guitar modellers - AX8 for live playing in the tracking room and the Axe Fx III racked in the control room. I also have a few nice guitar amps I rarely play any more. Sue me.

Each musician has headphones by their "station". A couple of guys bring their own and just plug into the extension cord. I use the Metric Halo ULN-8 3d system. So the first few sessions we get the levels set up, both the recording levels and each musicians cue mix. And those are saved, so he next sessions are ready to go.

I also have an iPad, so if I want to track from the tracking room myself I can control the DAW from there. But I rarely do that.

We're a jazz group. The bass player plays an upright a lot so he's stationed in the kitchen iso room. I'm in the Control Room. We have windows so we can maintain visual.

Everything is mic'ed and the mics remain up. I just cover them with plastic freezer bags to keep the dust off.

When we're rehearsing alone, we all set up in the Tracking Room. Recording we all go to our rooms. Time out. LOL.
Wow thank you! I'm planning on getting the grescth renown and yamaha mx88, i think. The rest we'd have to follow our budget
Old 1 week ago
  #41
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
Elect me president, and everyone will get a cottage in their backyard they can turn into a studio.
Hahaha we'd sure love it if that were possible
Old 1 week ago
  #42
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
well the OP said:


...indicating to me he was thinking of more of a festival type thing.
In any case, the OP is in Indonesia. Who knows what the "club" scene there is like... or even if there is one? He did not seem to be very responsive to statements about his band playing in "clubs". He seems to think the band's path is home rehearsals > Instagram > music "events". Which for all I know, is the way you have to do it in Indonesia!


I totally agree. That was my reasoning when I said:




Agreed. You need to practice it the way you are going to do it at the gig. If the OP is using sims for his amp sound, they probably are using the sims for pedal sounds as well. So there's another curve ball thrown at them five minutes before they hit the stage! Here, this is a pedal. You step on it to activate that sound.
I'm a she... Lmao. We have no problems with live performances, don't worry! And yes we're gonna practice the way we perform! I even practice my speech to hype the audience hahaha.
As for clubs, yes we've never performed in clubs. We may do it one day but we focus more more on events, radio, social media ect.
Old 1 week ago
  #43
Gear Guru
 
henryrobinett's Avatar
I'm so glad to see a SHE onboard!
Old 1 week ago
  #44
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryrobinett View Post
I'm so glad to see a SHE onboard!
And i'm glad to be welcomed :D
Old 1 week ago
  #45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stelladevania View Post
I'm editing the whole original posts since i got a new idea so i'm sorry if the replies below doesn't make sense.

Okay so here's what i want to achieve: i have a band that is serious about making it big. Not only that, i'm also a singer songwriter rapper. At first i only bought a focusrite solo package because it was enough for my needs alone. But then my band's spirit got crazy high, we rethought our band's theme, made songs, planning on releasing an EP and even thought up our marketing strategies. so we want need an upgrade. Then i thought: "why not make a studio that accomodates everything we need not only for my band, but as a business as well? We'd be killing two birds with one stone!" (I have business experiences btw, so no, i'm not a newbie in that aspect).

So we need equipments that accomodates recording and rehearsal, with the focus being on recording because our main marketing for the time being is through social media. We'd be recording our rehearsals and live performances so that we'd have a "natural" live performace content for social media. I thought up 2 different options:

1. Budget gears set up:
- the (kind of) cheap computer i already have. It's enough for our needs, just a bit slow. Sadly, it has high latency so we'd only be using it for final mixing and mastering.
- zoom livetrak L-20 mixer. An affordabale mutitracking mixer, audio interface, and stand-alone recorder. with a lot of inputs. We'd be mainly using this as a stand alone recorder and mixer.
- Rode NT1-A condenser microphone
- KRK rokit 6 g3 studio monitor
- 3 behringer DI600p
- great sounding drums (not sure what to get yet)
- shure PGA7 drum mic kit
- 1 great sounding guitar (not sure what to get yet) for recording our singles and 1 guitar we already have
- 1 great sounding bass
- 3 EXTREMELY cheap amps. We won't use them for recording. We'll only use them for monitoring our rehearsals.
- 2 shure SM58 mics
- 2 cheap behringer powerplay wired personal monitor. One for the drummer, one for me the vocalist.

2. taking a LOAN for more a more proffesional studio:
- upgrading my computer
- behringer x32 mixing console. It's comparable to the StudioLive series 3 with a fraction of the price. And we can use it as an audio interface multi tracking device. So i won't have to record on the mixer, then taking the data to the computer like on the L-20. It can also be controlled through a tablet so we can laze around while mixing lol. (We won't do that often, i swear!)
- rode NTK condenser microphone
- buying drum mics one by one which would cost more. (Please give me your recommendation on these!)
- better DIs (not sure yet what to get)
- better, wireless in ear monitors.
- MUCH better amps so we can use them for recording as well. (Please give recommendation on these as well!)

Any thoughts on these? Are there something i should get but forget to list?


Just saw the major changes to the original posts. Option 2, while riskier on a financial level, will allow you to make much better recordings. Ill post specific suggestions when i have more time to post.
Old 1 week ago
  #46
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeadlessDinosaur View Post
Just saw the major changes to the original posts. Option 2, while riskier on a financial level, will allow you to make much better recordings. Ill post specific suggestions when i have more time to post.
Yes please! I would really appreciate it, thanks!
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