The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
Questions about analog mixer and ADA converters
Old 13th April 2019
  #1
Gear Head
 

Questions about analog mixer and ADA converters

Right now i'm using an USB mixer so i'm not familiar with other setups really.

I slowly want to move to getting a bigger mixing console to record live bands or big drum setups.

I have a few questions because i can't seem to figure out which setup to use.

When people have an analog mixing console with say 32 or 48 or whatever channels is it normal to split it in 2? So you'd use the first half of your channels for recording and sending it to your DAW and the other half for working on your individual tracks? You send the recorded tracks from your DAW to channel 16-32 for instance. Or am i seeing this wrong?
Right now with my usb mixer i record on every channel and send it directly back with the usb return button to the same channel.

Also how would a AD/DA converter work with an analog mixer with many channels?

If my mixer is 32 channels do i just need 2 converters with 16 channels each (or a 32 channel one if they exist). It just sends the signal to the DAW and back?

Now let's say i got that all set up. How would i connect my outboard gear. Say i have a few compressors or a rack reverb and i want to insert it on my snare. Do i also plug this in on my AD/DA converter? That would obviously mean i would need extra converters if i have a lot of outboard gear. Or would i plug them in in the insert on my mixer? But that way i wouldn't be able to use it in the DAW, right? I want to be able to record dry and add a hardware compressor to the snare later. What is the usual setup for something like that?

Thank you.
Old 13th April 2019
  #2
Lives for gear
Why not forget about big analog mixing consoles all together and just record straight into the audio interfaces?
Mix i.t.b. if wanted with a good controller (digital mixer)?
Old 13th April 2019
  #3
Quote:
Originally Posted by BT64 View Post
Why not forget about big analog mixing consoles all together and just record straight into the audio interfaces?
Mix i.t.b. if wanted with a good controller (digital mixer)?
+1 I'm with this! If you get an audio interface with enough inputs and outputs, the mixer is not needed. My take on it is to have less in your signal chain to reduce the noise in your song. A mixer is just a bunch of extra gain stages that can introduce noise at every stage.

If you get an audio interface with everything you need, a mixer is obsolete and having a shorter signal chain is way better for you signal to noise ratio
Old 13th April 2019
  #4
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BT64 View Post
Why not forget about big analog mixing consoles all together and just record straight into the audio interfaces?
Mix i.t.b. if wanted with a good controller (digital mixer)?
I was willing to bet this would be my first answer.

For the next 10 people who will suggest me the same thing, please don't.

Any answers to the original questions are highly appreciated
Old 13th April 2019
  #5
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ Mastering View Post
+1 I'm with this! If you get an audio interface with enough inputs and outputs, the mixer is not needed. My take on it is to have less in your signal chain to reduce the noise in your song. A mixer is just a bunch of extra gain stages that can introduce noise at every stage.

If you get an audio interface with everything you need, a mixer is obsolete and having a shorter signal chain is way better for you signal to noise ratio
Don't you think there is actually a reason i want to use a mixer and suggesting i don't need one is just weird? Do you know my situation and my needs?

If i wouldn't need/want a mixer i wouldn't ask for info about it. Thank you.
Old 13th April 2019
  #6
Someone is a bit grumpy. If you do not want a plethora of different answers, don't ask a question in a forum. Make sense!!
Old 13th April 2019
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Poinzy's Avatar
 

How dare you suggest [fill in the blank], you plebs! Don't you know who I am? The OP's on a suicide course.
Old 13th April 2019
  #8
Lives for gear
 
Poinzy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdyUsername View Post
I was willing to bet this would be my first answer.

For the next 10 people who will suggest me the same thing, please don't.

Any answers to the original questions are highly appreciated
Better: "Yeah, I know, I'm probably bucking a trend, but I'd really like to stay inside my comfort zone with the hardware. I appreciate the suggestion, though. Thanks."
Old 14th April 2019
  #9
Lives for gear
Most serious recording consoles are "in-line" (SSL4000, 9000, Neve VR, 88R). They have two channels per strip, one is usually used to send the signal to the recorder and the other to monitor the return from the recorder, although if you don't need much channel you could use them in split mode and use the large faders for mic inputs and tape returns. Some consoles were "split" design, having input channels on one side and "tape" returns (usually with less functionality) on the other (Amek 9098, Soundcraft 2400). Some consoles (SSL Duality, Focusrite Studio) have only one type of inputs and you decide where you want to split them. You could also use all the channels for mic inputs and mix them ITB (Duality allows you to use the faders to control the DAW mixer) or use external preamps and use all the channels for mixing/monitoring.
Old 14th April 2019
  #10
Gear Addict
 
Murky Waters's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdyUsername View Post
Right now i'm using an USB mixer so i'm not familiar with other setups really.

I slowly want to move to getting a bigger mixing console to record live bands or big drum setups.

I have a few questions because i can't seem to figure out which setup to use.

When people have an analog mixing console with say 32 or 48 or whatever channels is it normal to split it in 2? So you'd use the first half of your channels for recording and sending it to your DAW and the other half for working on your individual tracks? You send the recorded tracks from your DAW to channel 16-32 for instance. Or am i seeing this wrong?
Right now with my usb mixer i record on every channel and send it directly back with the usb return button to the same channel.

Also how would a AD/DA converter work with an analog mixer with many channels?

If my mixer is 32 channels do i just need 2 converters with 16 channels each (or a 32 channel one if they exist). It just sends the signal to the DAW and back?

Now let's say i got that all set up. How would i connect my outboard gear. Say i have a few compressors or a rack reverb and i want to insert it on my snare. Do i also plug this in on my AD/DA converter? That would obviously mean i would need extra converters if i have a lot of outboard gear. Or would i plug them in in the insert on my mixer? But that way i wouldn't be able to use it in the DAW, right? I want to be able to record dry and add a hardware compressor to the snare later. What is the usual setup for something like that?

Thank you.
Highly dependant on the mixer you choose. If you want to record, say 32 tracks, through a desk into the computer, you will need 32 channels of A-D running (mixer-dependant) on the channel direct outs. To mix, you would need 32-channels of D-A back into the channel strips. Some mixers have 'tape returns' or A/B inputs etc for this double duty.

As others have said, this is a bit of an obsolete method, and recording through whatever processing hardware you have straight into the converters is the present common practice. A digital control surface is also commonly used for hands on control of the software.
Old 14th April 2019
  #11
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NerdyUsername View Post
Right now i'm using an USB mixer so i'm not familiar with other setups really.

I slowly want to move to getting a bigger mixing console to record live bands or big drum setups.

I have a few questions because i can't seem to figure out which setup to use.

When people have an analog mixing console with say 32 or 48 or whatever channels is it normal to split it in 2? So you'd use the first half of your channels for recording and sending it to your DAW and the other half for working on your individual tracks? You send the recorded tracks from your DAW to channel 16-32 for instance. Or am i seeing this wrong?
Right now with my usb mixer i record on every channel and send it directly back with the usb return button to the same channel.

Also how would a AD/DA converter work with an analog mixer with many channels?

If my mixer is 32 channels do i just need 2 converters with 16 channels each (or a 32 channel one if they exist). It just sends the signal to the DAW and back?

Now let's say i got that all set up. How would i connect my outboard gear. Say i have a few compressors or a rack reverb and i want to insert it on my snare. Do i also plug this in on my AD/DA converter? That would obviously mean i would need extra converters if i have a lot of outboard gear. Or would i plug them in in the insert on my mixer? But that way i wouldn't be able to use it in the DAW, right? I want to be able to record dry and add a hardware compressor to the snare later. What is the usual setup for something like that?

Thank you.
If I understand correctly, you want to, in fact, work OTB and use the DAW just as the recording/playback medium; as a digital recorder sec.
You'd not only be recording through the console, but will be mixing on it as well.

I that case you would need as many AD channels as the number of tracks you expect to be recording simultaneously, limited by the busses (8 - 16 - 32) that your console has.
For the AD conversion, you want as many as the number of tracks that you want/need to record and mix, limited by the available channels on the console or DAW tracks.

With an inline console (which I'm most familiar with) you can use any of the channels, routed to the sub out busses, for recording, while monitoring the post-recorder-signal on the (limited) inline monitor section on the same channel.
At mixing time, by pressing a button, you get the post recorder signal on the main channel, with all channel functionality for the mixing process.

Still assuming that you'll be mixing on the console, any outboard gear will be connected to the AUX sends and returns of the console, so not requiring any additional adda conversion.

I hope that I managed to answer some of your questions.

Regards,
Old 14th April 2019
  #12
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jetam View Post
Most serious recording consoles are "in-line" (SSL4000, 9000, Neve VR, 88R). They have two channels per strip, one is usually used to send the signal to the recorder and the other to monitor the return from the recorder, although if you don't need much channel you could use them in split mode and use the large faders for mic inputs and tape returns. Some consoles were "split" design, having input channels on one side and "tape" returns (usually with less functionality) on the other (Amek 9098, Soundcraft 2400). Some consoles (SSL Duality, Focusrite Studio) have only one type of inputs and you decide where you want to split them. You could also use all the channels for mic inputs and mix them ITB (Duality allows you to use the faders to control the DAW mixer) or use external preamps and use all the channels for mixing/monitoring.
Ah thanks, good info. No idea they had two channels per strip. But i wasn't looking to buy a Neve in the first place haha.
Old 14th April 2019
  #13
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodba View Post
If I understand correctly, you want to, in fact, work OTB and use the DAW just as the recording/playback medium; as a digital recorder sec.
You'd not only be recording through the console, but will be mixing on it as well.
Correct!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prodba View Post

I that case you would need as many AD channels as the number of tracks you expect to be recording simultaneously, limited by the busses (8 - 16 - 32) that your console has.
For the AD conversion, you want as many as the number of tracks that you want/need to record and mix, limited by the available channels on the console or DAW tracks.

With an inline console (which I'm most familiar with) you can use any of the channels, routed to the sub out busses, for recording, while monitoring the post-recorder-signal on the (limited) inline monitor section on the same channel.
At mixing time, by pressing a button, you get the post recorder signal on the main channel, with all channel functionality for the mixing process.

Still assuming that you'll be mixing on the console, any outboard gear will be connected to the AUX sends and returns of the console, so not requiring any additional adda conversion.

I hope that I managed to answer some of your questions.

Regards,
Yes, that certainly answered some of my questions! Awesome, thanks a lot!
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Similar Threads
Thread
Thread Starter / Forum
Replies
Simonluka / Music Computers
5
mrfrequency / So Much Gear, So Little Time
1
sgventil / Electronic Music Instruments and Electronic Music Production
10
Deleted User #147857 / So Much Gear, So Little Time
1

Forum Jump
Forum Jump