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The "Old school" sound Reverb/Delay Processors (HW)
Old 18th January 2017
  #91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
So you had to derail my thread by posting a sh1tty song from the early 80's that has nothing to do with this thread soundwise?
Really, you're going to criticize someone for trying to help? really?

Get off my lawn.
Old 18th January 2017
  #92
Lives for gear
 
norfolk martin's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
My point here is that unless you know how to mic and record drums, have a really nice live room and a great drummer at least i would in that case steer to superior rather. Superior Drummer samples are recorded in one of the best rooms in the world there is, by top notch engineers and with top notch hardware, and it sounds like that.
.

The use of artificial digital environments has made it a lot easier to record reasonable sounding drums in a domestic studio, but it's still one of the hardest things to do to a modern professional standard without a good sounding room.

IMO, getting a good drums sound is very largely about recording technique. I can think of a number of "top studio" albums of the 70s , where the drums were being recorded on exactly the type of analog gear that that is now idolized, if not mythologized, and the drums sound flat, weak and dead

As for amateur drummers, many of them are amateurs for a reason. Occasionally I'll see someone who really surprises me, but mostly they don't have good recording technique. Although a lot of people worry primarily about tempo or "feel," I find the biggest trouble with amateur drummers is a lack of ability or inclination to tune drums properly, (hitting a cardboard box in a good acoustic room still sounds like a cardboard box) and extreme inconsistency between hits.

I know one guy locally who hits the last kick drum beat before a fill literally twice as loud at the others. The difference in tone is so great that even a limiter won't help, and I usually have to edit individual hits to get a usable track.

Another one hits the snare like he's pile driving in slower tempos, but the snare practically disappears on faster tempos.

I know a third one who seems incapable of keeping his hi-hat closed, and makes a Ringo-type "Swoosh sound" through everything, which sound like hell on a tight, intimate ballad.


A good drummer is better than programmed drums

Programmed drums are better than a bad drummer
Old 18th January 2017
  #93
Motown legend
 
Bob Olhsson's Avatar
 

Actually it's trivial to get a great drum sound in a living room. Vocals are where a real studio makes the biggest difference.
Old 19th January 2017
  #94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
It is also unreasonable because the moment you put your work online for others to listen, you're automatically putting it on a pedestal for us to criticize it, without us needing to show you anything back. :^)

I think this should be pretty obvious to everyone on the internet already.
But that is the whole point. It puts the advice you get in perspective. If someone criticizes your work and tells you it's crap and that its all wrong, but the recordings they themselves have done sound like crap... then is that really advice you want to take?

If you are trying to achieve the perfect 80's rock/metal sound, and some guy comes on here saying all the advice everyone has given is crap... yet his own records sound like the Wesley Willis Fiasco... then you shouldn't really put too much weight and stock into what that guy is saying.

Also, the ultimate goal here (i am assuming) is to release music to the public, right? so the more you release the public the better you get... the more you see what works and doesn't work for your audience. The only way to get really good at something is to do it over and over again as many times as you can. The more you release your recordings to the public and the more you perform live, the better you get.

So people in general should always be releasing their music that they have done. It's an invaluable learning experience.
Old 19th January 2017
  #95
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by donsolo View Post
Really, you're going to criticize someone for trying to help? really?

Get off my lawn.
You're quoting a wrong message, and i don't think that i need to repeat myself.


Quote:
Originally Posted by norfolk martin View Post
The use of artificial digital environments has made it a lot easier to record reasonable sounding drums in a domestic studio, but it's still one of the hardest things to do to a modern professional standard without a good sounding room.

IMO, getting a good drums sound is very largely about recording technique. I can think of a number of "top studio" albums of the 70s , where the drums were being recorded on exactly the type of analog gear that that is now idolized, if not mythologized, and the drums sound flat, weak and dead

As for amateur drummers, many of them are amateurs for a reason. Occasionally I'll see someone who really surprises me, but mostly they don't have good recording technique. Although a lot of people worry primarily about tempo or "feel," I find the biggest trouble with amateur drummers is a lack of ability or inclination to tune drums properly, (hitting a cardboard box in a good acoustic room still sounds like a cardboard box) and extreme inconsistency between hits.

I know one guy locally who hits the last kick drum beat before a fill literally twice as loud at the others. The difference in tone is so great that even a limiter won't help, and I usually have to edit individual hits to get a usable track.

Another one hits the snare like he's pile driving in slower tempos, but the snare practically disappears on faster tempos.

I know a third one who seems incapable of keeping his hi-hat closed, and makes a Ringo-type "Swoosh sound" through everything, which sound like hell on a tight, intimate ballad.


A good drummer is better than programmed drums

Programmed drums are better than a bad drummer

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
Actually it's trivial to get a great drum sound in a living room. Vocals are where a real studio makes the biggest difference.
I think the better question to ask from myself would be that which thing gets the job done, and that would be the superior drummer to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Etch-A-Sketch View Post
But that is the whole point. It puts the advice you get in perspective. If someone criticizes your work and tells you it's crap and that its all wrong, but the recordings they themselves have done sound like crap... then is that really advice you want to take?

If you are trying to achieve the perfect 80's rock/metal sound, and some guy comes on here saying all the advice everyone has given is crap... yet his own records sound like the Wesley Willis Fiasco... then you shouldn't really put too much weight and stock into what that guy is saying.

Also, the ultimate goal here (i am assuming) is to release music to the public, right? so the more you release the public the better you get... the more you see what works and doesn't work for your audience. The only way to get really good at something is to do it over and over again as many times as you can. The more you release your recordings to the public and the more you perform live, the better you get.

So people in general should always be releasing their music that they have done. It's an invaluable learning experience.
Exactly, of course i don't take his advice seriously if he posts his material and i don't find it good, that's what i'm trying to say here.

Look, no one needs to take my criticism seriously either, but i'm still allowed to do that, whenever they like it or not.

Sure, but for some people no matter how much they release and show their music to the public it just stays sh1tty, but i guess it still has a comical value in it. :^)
Old 19th January 2017
  #96
Lives for gear
What about winger. nice modulation at the end, what do you think of the production?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NozSLdxAVnw
Old 19th January 2017
  #97
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dude24man View Post
What about winger. nice modulation at the end, what do you think of the production?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NozSLdxAVnw
Winger has exactly the tone that i'm looking for. I actually thought the other day that i would probably use the "miles away" as a reference track sometimes when i'm doing a song.
Old 19th January 2017
  #98
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dude24man View Post
What about winger. nice modulation at the end, what do you think of the production?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NozSLdxAVnw
I have to confess that whenever I see a video with guys twirling around like that, I get all distracted, trying to see if the guitars are plugged in. In this case, sometimes.
Old 19th January 2017
  #99
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
I have to confess that whenever I see a video with guys twirling around like that, I get all distracted, trying to see if the guitars are plugged in. In this case, sometimes.
I think they were using wireless systems on videos or they did not plug the guitars at all in the first place.
Old 19th January 2017
  #100
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
I think they were using wireless systems on videos or they did not plug the guitars at all in the first place.
Wireless systems aren't entirely wireless. It's not like telepathy.
Old 19th January 2017
  #101
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Wireless systems aren't entirely wireless. It's not like telepathy.
Have i said somewhere that they aren't entirely wireless?

Edit: Ayo hol up boi, https://www.thomann.de/fi/line6_relay_g10.htm this is completely wireless.
Old 19th January 2017
  #102
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
Have i said somewhere that they aren't entirely wireless?
Oh, lighten up.

And actually, you kinda did say that. When you suggested that unplugged guitars could be using wireless systems.

At any rate, shooting a video to playback on a soundstage like that, it's highly unlikely that there would have been any amplified guitars on-set. Hence, no need for a wireless.
Old 19th January 2017
  #103
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Oh, lighten up.

And actually, you kinda did say that. When you suggested that unplugged guitars could be using wireless systems.

At any rate, shooting a video to playback on a soundstage like that, it's highly unlikely that there would have been any amplified guitars on-set. Hence, no need for a wireless.
People on this site seriously have problems with reading comprehension.

What i meant is that they probably were using wireless systems OR they didn't plug the guitars in anything at all. A huge difference.

Quoting h3h3 on this, it's time to stop.
Old 19th January 2017
  #104
Lives for gear
I think they used click track live with recorded bass so kip could jump around. Dont Quote me on that. Check out some live vids
Old 19th January 2017
  #105
Gear Guru
 
Brent Hahn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
Have i said somewhere that they aren't entirely wireless?

Edit: Ayo hol up boi, https://www.thomann.de/fi/line6_relay_g10.htm this is completely wireless.
Okay, the transmitter plugs into the guitar jack, but there's no wire in between them. You win. And enough with the urban patois, already.
Old 19th January 2017
  #106
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Hahn View Post
Okay, the transmitter plugs into the guitar jack, but there's no wire in between them. You win. And enough with the urban patois, already.
Ayo hol up boi t. Urban patois pro
Old 20th January 2017
  #107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Simppu View Post
People on this site seriously have problems with reading comprehension.

What i meant is that they probably were using wireless systems OR they didn't plug the guitars in anything at all. A huge difference.

Quoting h3h3 on this, it's time to stop.
What is your malfunction? This is the newbie section, you came for help and now you're copping an attitude with literally everyone who is trying to help, and has the experience to do so.

Have fun with superior drummer. I'm sure the world is going to care about the result.
Old 20th January 2017
  #108
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by donsolo View Post
What is your malfunction? This is the newbie section, you came for help and now you're copping an attitude with literally everyone who is trying to help, and has the experience to do so.

Have fun with superior drummer. I'm sure the world is going to care about the result.
I'm just worried. I care about the people and their ability to comprehend what they're reading.
Old 5th February 2017
  #109
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Etch-A-Sketch View Post
Also, the ultimate goal here (i am assuming) is to release music to the public, right? so the more you release the public the better you get... the more you see what works and doesn't work for your audience. The only way to get really good at something is to do it over and over again as many times as you can. The more you release your recordings to the public and the more you perform live, the better you get.

So people in general should always be releasing their music that they have done. It's an invaluable learning experience.
This last paragraph really resonated with me as this is exactly what music is about (for me at least). Sharing with other people and having them share the enjoyment. I think I'll put "People in general should always be releasing their music that they have done" on my wall somewhere because honestly I'm so guilty of hoarding everything I create and being a perfectionist. That's one reason why I'm starting out recording. I've always wanted to make a record but I ended up wasting decades doodling in my room. Great advice and great reminder.
Old 24th February 2017
  #110
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Olhsson View Post
Actually it's trivial to get a great drum sound in a living room. Vocals are where a real studio makes the biggest difference.
yup! nothing like being in a big room with the mic in omni!
Old 24th February 2017
  #111
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by KungFuLio View Post
yup! nothing like being in a big room with the mic in omni!
Depends on the music style too, some music styles have so much processing in the vocals that does it really even make a difference anymore where they are recorded.
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