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Stam Audio Stamchild SA-670
Old 14th June 2019
  #661
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmin View Post
Are you serious? $500 for four switches? These cost like $20 each. Or even less actually

In fact, it'll cost you way less having someone mod it for you.
Stam is using Blore Edwards swtiches so something like this (https://www.blore-ed.com/product-page/opz-51242-2)

So assuming about $34.31 USD (non-wholesale price) each x 4 switches ≈ $137.24 plus cost of resistors and labor to assemble. They are of course time consuming to put together. Not saying anything negative about Stam just sharing so we can all make an informed decision.
Old 14th June 2019
  #662
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adamj31's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEMAS View Post
That’s presuming the inputs are properly calibrated and steps are the same on both sides. I’m thinking un-stepped will be useable for non critical stereo sources. If I was sure the stepped version would be perfect then I’d be more keen.
Wouldn’t the 2-buss be a critical source?
Old 14th June 2019
  #663
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adamj31's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmin View Post
Are you serious? $500 for four switches? These cost like $20 each. Or even less actually

In fact, it'll cost you way less having someone mod it for you.
Chandler RS124 is $275 more for a stepped version. That's for a single unit with 2 stepped controls. $500 is pretty much right in line with what these things cost. Welcome to boutique gear.
Old 14th June 2019
  #664
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andersmv's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cgarges View Post
Also, no video, which was promised LONG ago.
It's being edited.
Attached Thumbnails
Stam Audio Stamchild SA-670-michael-bay-stamchild.jpeg  
Old 14th June 2019
  #665
Quote:
Originally Posted by adamj31 View Post
Wouldn’t the 2-buss be a critical source?
Yes. I guess you’re right. I’m just trying to talk myself out of spending the extra. Also wondering about resale value. If I try it for a few months and decide to sell it will I see that money back?
Old 14th June 2019
  #666
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedoormouse View Post
Stam is using Blore Edwards swtiches so something like this (https://www.blore-ed.com/product-page/opz-51242-2)

So assuming about $34.31 USD (non-wholesale price) each x 4 switches ≈ $137.24 plus cost of resistors and labor to assemble. They are of course time consuming to put together. Not saying anything negative about Stam just sharing so we can all make an informed decision.
Gain, threshold and time constants = 6x
I asked
Old 14th June 2019
  #667
Quote:
Originally Posted by casiotone View Post
Gain, threshold and time constants = 6x
I asked
Time Constants are continuously variable on non-stepped version? Surely these are fixed attack release settings?

Variable constants. How ironic.
Old 14th June 2019
  #668
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEMAS View Post
Time Constants are continuously variable on non-stepped version? Surely these are fixed attack release settings?

Variable constants. How ironic.
Now that you say that i'm not sure. I asked Josh which controls would be stepped in the switched version and that's what he answered. He didn't specify that they were not in the non-switched, so i don't know.
Old 14th June 2019
  #669
Lives for gear
 
adamj31's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEMAS View Post
Yes. I guess you’re right. I’m just trying to talk myself out of spending the extra. Also wondering about resale value. If I try it for a few months and decide to sell it will I see that money back?
From what I’m seeing, Stam pieces has excellent resale value. He has built a reputation of quality along with the reputation of long wait times. People who don’t want to wait are generally happy to snag a piece on the used market that they will have in a matter of days.
Old 14th June 2019
  #670
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
At least the tubes will be cheap. Less than 1/10th of the 6386 in price.
Are these ones inferior in your opinion? I know you know your tubes!
Old 14th June 2019
  #671
Quote:
Originally Posted by TEMAS View Post
Are these one inferior in your opinion? I know you know your tubes!
I'm no tube expert by any means but if they are 6BA6 (from what I can read in the picture) on eBay you can buy a pair for £5.
They will all have a hard time staying matched and behaving the same.
The compression won't sound like a Fairchild as it will make a kind of clacking sound as it compresses if you slam it and the distortion figures from the Pentodes will be worse than expected. It will however have colouration if so desired.
The Fairchild is usually much cleaner than people expect even when driven hard, which is what makes the original circuit so clever.

This is obviously how Stam are saving £1000 on JJ tubes.
Old 14th June 2019
  #672
Company Rep
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
I'm no tube expert by any means but if they are 6BA6 (from what I can read in the picture) on eBay you can buy a pair for £5.
They will all have a hard time staying matched and behaving the same.
The compression won't sound like a Fairchild as it will make a kind of clacking sound as it compresses if you slam it and the distortion figures from the Pentodes will be worse than expected. It will however have colouration if so desired.
The Fairchild is usually much cleaner than people expect even when driven hard, which is what makes the original circuit so clever.

This is obviously how Stam are saving £1000 on JJ tubes.
Will all due respect, what you just posted is not true.

We don't save a lot if anything at all using NOS 6BA6 tubes, a JJ 6386 is 75 USD and getting a pair of excellent and matched 6BA6 costs us about 50 to 70 USD. We have to buy 6 tubes at 15 USD each on average to get 2 perfect ones.

We bought five thousand NOS tubes. Mostly RCA, GE JAN

Every Stamchild will be equipped with same brand tubes.

We built a custom tube rig to burn 100 tubes daily.

Every tube has its own emission curve plotted with 2 custom built uTracers.
Every Stamchild is equipped with a set of 16 matched 6BA6 tubes and every user will have its own matching chart, so to have a record of its specific tube set for future tube replacement and maintenance.

Slamming is not the typical way you would use a VARI-MU compressor, but in the case you'd want to you can slam the Stamchild up to 20dB GR with no audible thumps. Pentodes are of course triode wired.
In typical operation the machine has very low distortion figures indeed, like original FAirchild has.

They also happen to be more consistent for this circuit than the current made 6386 tubes... readings on those are nothing like the old NOS 6386

It's not about money, it's about getting the original tone and performance.
Old 14th June 2019
  #673
Gear Head
Personally Joshua, I'm so stoked, for the sake of future maintenance costs, your not using those crap JJ 6386 preamp tubes, because

A) They usually retail around $120 each

B) JJ Preamp tube quality, in general these days, is hit and miss, mostly miss. My local Dealer/Tech in Western Australia who owns a Amplitrex AT-1000 tester, says your lucky to get 2/10 JJ preamp tubes like ECC83, that test within spec. Has refused to sell me or anyone, JJ preamp tubes since 2009. JJ factory matched Power tubes, on the other hand like EL34, test consistently good, and he still sells those only.

C) Totally agree with Joshua that JJ6386 sound nothing like or behave the same as NOS 6386. Check the audio forums. It's a known fact.

D) Heres a post from Manley who make the Vari-Mu, which is their loose 'version' of a Fairchild Type Compressor, used in many Mastering Studio's worldwide. They also use 6BA6 Tubes instead of 6386.
Manley Website Quote...The 6BA6 T-Bar Mod is the preferred system to use in the Manley Variable Mu® for reasons of ability to perfectly match each phase-halve section and each stereo set, ability to select for lo-noise and lo-microphonic sets for a low cost, and because the action of the 6BA6's so closely resemble the smooth 6386 limiting curves.
Old 14th June 2019
  #674
Company Rep
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulthesparky View Post
Personally Joshua, I'm so stoked, for the sake of future maintenance costs, your not using those crap JJ 6386 preamp tubes, because

A) They usually retail around $120 each

B) JJ Preamp tube quality, in general these days, is hit and miss, mostly miss. My local Dealer/Tech in Western Australia who owns a Amplitrex AT-1000 tester, says your lucky to get 2/10 JJ preamp tubes like ECC83, that test within spec. Has refused to sell me or anyone, JJ preamp tubes since 2009. JJ factory matched Power tubes, on the other hand like EL34, test consistently good, and he still sells those only.

C) Totally agree with Joshua that JJ6386 sound nothing like or behave the same as NOS 6386. Check the audio forums. It's a known fact.

D) Heres a post from Manley who make the Vari-Mu, which is their loose 'version' of a Fairchild Type Compressor, used in many Mastering Studio's worldwide. They also use 6BA6 Tubes instead of 6386.
Manley Website Quote...The 6BA6 T-Bar Mod is the preferred system to use in the Manley Variable Mu® for reasons of ability to perfectly match each phase-halve section and each stereo set, ability to select for lo-noise and lo-microphonic sets for a low cost, and because the action of the 6BA6's so closely resemble the smooth 6386 limiting curves.
Hey Paul,

You know your stuff!

The compression characteristics of the 6BA6 are much smoother and beautiful to the ears than the new 6386.

In my preference order is:

1) NOS 6386
2) 6BA6 X 2
3) New 6386 or 5710


Unfortunately this NOS 6386 are incredibly expensive

I would not recommend upgrading to them as it doesn't seem to have any sonic benefits and pricing is outrageous.

Thanks for your input
Josh
Old 14th June 2019
  #675
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuanaconda View Post
Thanks for your input
Josh
Hey Josh,

What is the current status of the 670 build?

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC
Old 14th June 2019
  #676
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulthesparky View Post
D) Heres a post from Manley who make the Vari-Mu, which is their loose 'version' of a Fairchild Type Compressor, used in many Mastering Studio's worldwide. They also use 6BA6 Tubes instead of 6386.
Manley Website Quote...The 6BA6 T-Bar Mod is the preferred system to use in the Manley Variable Mu® for reasons of ability to perfectly match each phase-halve section and each stereo set, ability to select for lo-noise and lo-microphonic sets for a low cost, and because the action of the 6BA6's so closely resemble the smooth 6386 limiting curves.
I'm no fan of JJ either but there must be a good reason they pay to put them in the high end stereo Fairchild Clones and not 6BA6 tubes. Just sayin'.
Old 15th June 2019
  #677
Lives for gear
 
Piedpiper's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul_G View Post
I'm no fan of JJ either but there must be a good reason they pay to put them in the high end stereo Fairchild Clones and not 6BA6 tubes. Just sayin'.
Maybe because for those with deep enough pockets to get those pieces, they might also have the scratch to replace the JJs with NOS, and their priority is to be as original as possible rather than practical. Maybe...
Old 15th June 2019
  #678
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jsvalmont's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piedpiper View Post
Maybe because for those with deep enough pockets to get those pieces, they might also have the scratch to replace the JJs with NOS, and their priority is to be as original as possible rather than practical. Maybe...
Now that’s just silly
Old 15th June 2019
  #679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piedpiper View Post
Maybe because for those with deep enough pockets to get those pieces, they might also have the scratch to replace the JJs with NOS, and their priority is to be as original as possible rather than practical. Maybe...
Yeah the chance of finding enough matched originals must be almost as difficult as getting a full working set of JJ . Which actually don't sound bad at all if you get a good batch, it's their refusal to match or replace I find hard to swallow.

Anyway the Stam approach is a brave endeavour and I look forward to hearing samples with all these NOS tubes.
Old 15th June 2019
  #680
I've heard the only JJs to get are the 'platinum' matched premium-price sets. At least that's what my amp-tech tells me... :-l
Old 15th June 2019
  #681
Company Rep
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmin View Post
Are you serious? $500 for four switches? These cost like $20 each. Or even less actually

In fact, it'll cost you way less having someone mod it for you.
I wonder were you get these "facts" from

1) They are not 20 USD each

2) A Fairchild (StamChild) Engineer hourly rate in the US would cost you probably 100 USD an hour. It would take him 6-8 hours to do this job.

I doubt anybody would put their life at risk for less than 500 bucks parts not included. This machine can kill you if you touch the wrong part.
Old 16th June 2019
  #682
Lives for gear
 
Piedpiper's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsvalmont View Post
Now that’s just silly
What's not silly is noting exactly what has been exemplified in this thread where people mistrust practical progress in deference to authentic replication. The option of getting NOS 6386 tubes is the only way to do a strict authentic design justice in this case. So you can trust that updating the design is preferable or put up with the consequences.
Old 16th June 2019
  #683
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuanaconda View Post
I wonder were you get these "facts" from

1) They are not 20 USD each

2) A Fairchild (StamChild) Engineer hourly rate in the US would cost you probably 100 USD an hour. It would take him 6-8 hours to do this job.

I doubt anybody would put their life at risk for less than 500 bucks parts not included. This machine can kill you if you touch the wrong part.
1) A single switch is around $30. Buying in the quantities you do, it's much cheaper. I'm into DIYing and I've got some quotes from them in the past.

2) If someone needs 6-8 hours to solder a few switches (or a couple of hours per switch), then he's definately doing something wrong. Even someone with basic soldering skills can do that.

As far as other's people comments about other companies, the ones you mentioned use elma switches, which are twice as expensive, if not more.

Don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying that $500 is very expensive. All I'm saying is that it's not a bargain either.

Personally, I'd get the basic version and do it myself or having someone else to do it if I was feeling lazy. Also, by doing this you can really spend the extra time to hand-match the resistors as close as possible or even spend some more money to get 0.1% resistors. All that for less than $500 parts included.
Old 16th June 2019
  #684
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elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmin View Post
Personally, I'd get the basic version and do it myself or having someone else to do it if I was feeling lazy.
No doubt, when you don't have expenditures and salaries and rent and utilities and insurance, much less try to build in a little profit to keep the company afloat, it's an easier and cheaper venture.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmin View Post
Also, by doing this you can really spend the extra time to hand-match the resistors as close as possible or even spend some more money to get 0.1% resistors. All that for less than $500 parts included.
Might they be doing the same, hence the time/costs? I think you're making assumptions about their processes without knowing their processes.

The price is $500, which, as others have pointed out, and I'm sure you've noticed, is in line with the supplemental cost of other stepped hardware. If anyone is willing to get inside a 670 and make it happen themselves, the standard option would be the way to get started. Anyone who's likely to order a stepped 670 is also likely to understand what this add-on typically costs, and I'm guessing that, with that understanding, they'll have no issue with it.
Old 16th June 2019
  #685
Company Rep
Quote:
Originally Posted by tkmin View Post
1) A single switch is around $30. Buying in the quantities you do, it's much cheaper. I'm into DIYing and I've got some quotes from them in the past.

2) If someone needs 6-8 hours to solder a few switches (or a couple of hours per switch), then he's definately doing something wrong. Even someone with basic soldering skills can do that.

As far as other's people comments about other companies, the ones you mentioned use elma switches, which are twice as expensive, if not more.

Don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying that $500 is very expensive. All I'm saying is that it's not a bargain either.

Personally, I'd get the basic version and do it myself or having someone else to do it if I was feeling lazy. Also, by doing this you can really spend the extra time to hand-match the resistors as close as possible or even spend some more money to get 0.1% resistors. All that for less than $500 parts included.
My cost is about 400 USD to make this mod
The profit is about 100 USD, maybe 75 USD after taxes.
Old 16th June 2019
  #686
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuanaconda View Post
My cost is about 400 USD to make this mod
The profit is about 100 USD, maybe 75 USD after taxes.
When will you be making the folks who ordered these aware of the mod and giving them a chance to decide if they want to come up with the extra money or not? And what is the current status of the Stamchild?

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC
Old 4 weeks ago
  #687
Lives for gear
 
adamj31's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuanaconda View Post
My cost is about 400 USD to make this mod
The profit is about 100 USD, maybe 75 USD after taxes.
The price is fair, Josh. When is the latest date to let you know my decision about standard vs stepped? I’m going to run this on my 2-buss for mixing. Do you think stepped is a smart option for that?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #688
Company Rep
Quote:
Originally Posted by cgarges View Post
When will you be making the folks who ordered these aware of the mod and giving them a chance to decide if they want to come up with the extra money or not? And what is the current status of the Stamchild?

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC
I thought I had emailed everybody about this

Please reach me at [email protected] if you did not

I am working on 50 right now!
Old 4 weeks ago
  #689
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuanaconda View Post
I thought I had emailed everybody about this

Please reach me at [email protected] if you did not

I am working on 50 right now!
No, I have never gotten an unsolicited email from Stam with ANY details. In fact, I emailed you last week regarding this and have now asked twice in this thread in the last few days.

Chris Garges
Charlotte, NC
Old 4 weeks ago
  #690
Lives for gear
 
elambo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuanaconda View Post
I thought I had emailed everybody about this

Please reach me at [email protected] if you did not

I am working on 50 right now!
I'm sure emails sent to some of your clients are hitting their spam folders.
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