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TBProAudio releases DSEQ, a dynamic spectral equalizer for Windows and Mac OS X
Old 6 days ago
  #481
Gear Addict
 

Full disclosure: I currently have no plugin budget so won't be buying this (or Soothe, or Smart Eq, or MSpectralDynamics) right now, but I thought I'd share a couple of little suggestions (which wouldn't alter the sound in a saved mix). Also full disclosure: This is a GREAT plugin.

Currently, when in bypass mode, the makeup gain is being added to the output. It would be better for a/b comparisons if it was not added, I think.

The mouse sensitivity for the makeup gain control is too high. The shift-mouse behaviour could be the default instead, or something closer to it, maybe?
Old 6 days ago
  #482
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TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by onerob View Post
Full disclosure: I currently have no plugin budget so won't be buying this (or Soothe, or Smart Eq, or MSpectralDynamics) right now, but I thought I'd share a couple of little suggestions (which wouldn't alter the sound in a saved mix). Also full disclosure: This is a GREAT plugin.

Currently, when in bypass mode, the makeup gain is being added to the output. It would be better for a/b comparisons if it was not added, I think.

The mouse sensitivity for the makeup gain control is too high. The shift-mouse behaviour could be the default instead, or something closer to it, maybe?
Thank you.
regarding main gain and bypass: we will consider this in one of the next releases
Old 5 days ago
  #483
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
We are very sorry to hear this.
We are doing our best to provide professional quality with our releases. We did a wrong step with 1.2 and we corrected it with 1.3. Not more, not less
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
Yes, will do, sorry for this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
We are very sorry about your concern.
We introduced a problem with V1.2 and fixed it with V1.3.
Will (hopefully) not happen again
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
Fixed with V1.3.0, sorry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
Update to V1.3.0:
- NEW: continuous spectrum slope calculation
- UPDATE: changed quality/OS calibration from DIRAC back to white noise (V1.1.0)
- UPDATE: response curve drawing optimized

Note: We screwed up V1.2.0 regarding the calibration of quality modes. So we are now back to 1.1.0. Sorry!
This kind of fast response to an honest mistake -- which the developer took care of very quickly (May 14 1.2.0 - May 18 1.3.0) -- then the totally honest and transparent accountability and personal apologies is AMAZING to me. Not to mention the generous and insanely fast responsiveness to requests. This developer is one of the best I've ever seen. Even when he makes a mistake, he fixes it and owns up to it, and apologizes with class. Long live TBProAudio! Bravo!

For the people who were affected by this change, just think for a minute about how many other developers have responded like this. In my decades of using DAWs, I can say it's very rare indeed.

And BTW, not to give anyone a hard time, but I've found that a general rule of thumb with any software, especially in the DAW world, is that if you are in the middle of a critical session, to make sure NOT to upgrade your DAW, plugins, OS or drivers until you're done with that session. I have blown up many sessions in the past and have learned the hard way. In this case, it's clear that the dev has been adding features at a furious pace, which is awesome, but anyone with critical sessions should make sure they take special care upgrading and can revert to a previous version just in case until the dust settles -- and that goes for any DAW or plugin. Fortunately, in this case, the dev has fixed the behavior in FOUR days while keeping all the new features, and hopefully, as the dev says, this kind of reversion won't be needed going forward as he has taken responsibility and apologized for the mistake.

Anyway, just my two bits. Thanks again to the dev and honestly this thread has been sort of amazing to watch. And DSEQ is a brilliant plugin, simple as that. :D
Old 5 days ago
  #484
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by uarte View Post
This kind of fast response to an honest mistake -- which the developer took care of very quickly (May 14 1.2.0 - May 18 1.3.0) -- then the totally honest and transparent accountability and personal apologies is AMAZING to me. Not to mention the generous and insanely fast responsiveness to requests. This developer is one of the best I've ever seen. Even when he makes a mistake, he fixes it and owns up to it, and apologizes with class. Long live TBProAudio! Bravo!

For the people who were affected by this change, just think for a minute about how many other developers have responded like this. In my decades of using DAWs, I can say it's very rare indeed.
I dont think anybody is upset with the dev. We are just informing him of the issue so he is aware. Great product and even if I had to readjust every parameter I'd still use this on every track. My most useful plugin of 2020.
Old 5 days ago
  #485
Gear Maniac
 

Oh wow, there’s been 3 more updates.

TBPro, please send an email notification when you release updates, I don’t want to have to find out by chance when on a forum.
Old 5 days ago
  #486
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ceejay's Avatar
Have to admit that Ultra2 mode introducing significant pre-ringing, especially noticeable at percussive material.
This pre-ringing less at Ultra1 and almost indistinguishable at High mode.
Pair of screenshots added to show it on hats U2 is Ultra2, U1 is Ultra.
Attached Thumbnails
TBProAudio releases DSEQ, a dynamic spectral equalizer for Windows and Mac OS X-u2.png   TBProAudio releases DSEQ, a dynamic spectral equalizer for Windows and Mac OS X-u1.png  
Old 5 days ago
  #487
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TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigSmo View Post
Oh wow, there’s been 3 more updates.

TBPro, please send an email notification when you release updates, I don’t want to have to find out by chance when on a forum.
Currently we offer a newsletter, updated every month.
We think of something similar for each of our products...
Old 5 days ago
  #488
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TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ceejay View Post
Have to admit that Ultra2 mode introducing significant pre-ringing, especially noticeable at percussive material.
This pre-ringing less at Ultra1 and almost indistinguishable at High mode.
Pair of screenshots added to show it on hats U2 is Ultra2, U1 is Ultra.
Thank you. Which settings are you using? Maybe you send it via PM (preset menu->save preset).

Have you tried to play with the parameter selectivity? Maybe you turn it a little bit down?
A well set pre-filter in the problematic frequency range could also control the pre-ringing. If you could provide your example as wav-file we could make a preset

In any case Ultra 2 is of course much more sensitive to pre-ringing. In this mode DSEQ uses 4096 linear phase dynamic equalizers, 5Hz resolution each!
Old 5 days ago
  #489
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceejay View Post
Have to admit that Ultra2 mode introducing significant pre-ringing, especially noticeable at percussive material.
This pre-ringing less at Ultra1 and almost indistinguishable at High mode.
Pair of screenshots added to show it on hats U2 is Ultra2, U1 is Ultra.
Because Ultra2 has longer IR, more quality, narrower bands (more precision of detection, suppression, more notching filters, more Q, better for lows) than Ultra1, and all modes are linear phase. So, it is obvious.
Old 5 days ago
  #490
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DirkB's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by citytape View Post
Yes, you are right. I noticed that also, DSEQ seems have more top. It gives me a plastic feel which I don’t like. (Maybe I didn’t use it in the right way?) I hope someone could let me realize that I am wrong, so that I can sell my Soothe 2 and buy this.

I like how Soothe 2 tames the resonance without makings much impacts on my original clips, it is subtle.
Interestingly. I do not own any of the two, but am testing both soothe 2 and DSEQ at the moment. I feel the exact opposite. After a couple of hours of comparing, DSEQ sounds more natural to me. The differences are of course subtle, but especially on vocals I seemed to favoure DSEQ.

On bass sources, I liked soothe a little more, but on harsh dirt guitars, cymbals, rooms and vocals, I felt it was easier to get a natural sound with DSEQ. Especially the tilt adjustment in DSEQ makes things easier to dial in for me. Also, I got better results in the high end when switching to ultra. In soothe I did not directly hear improvements.

Still, both are great tools.

Regards,
Dirk
Old 5 days ago
  #491
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ceejay's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
Have you tried to play with the parameter selectivity? Maybe you turn it a little bit down?
Thanks for the tip! Reducing "Selectivity" does helped minimize pre-ringing significantly. It also improved transients attacks.

However, while competitor does better job cleaning up harsh artificial resonances at percussive material. BUT the DSEQ capable for much musical cleanup job for melodic/instrumental material, and most important - complex 2bus material (due to linear phase processing, i guess)

Attaching requested percussive audio examples: unprocessed hats, competitor processing, and DSEQ two versions - with 85 and 38 Selectivity settings.
Attached Thumbnails
TBProAudio releases DSEQ, a dynamic spectral equalizer for Windows and Mac OS X-settings.png  
Attached Files

av_hats_DSEQ_sel=38.wav (737.9 KB, 1771 views)

av_hats_DSEQ_sel=85.wav (737.9 KB, 1798 views)

av_hats_SUZ.wav (740.1 KB, 1791 views)

av_hats_unproc.wav (737.3 KB, 1798 views)

Old 5 days ago
  #492
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TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DirkB View Post
... Especially the tilt adjustment in DSEQ makes things easier to dial in for me. ...
I would like to take another look at the new feature that we introduced with 1.3.0.
Many users asked us how best to set the slope parameter. An experienced mix / master engineer can easily answer this question. But we aksed ourself if we could support this process.
As of V1.3.0, DSEQ now continuously calculates an estimate of the actual spectrum slope value. (Technical: DSEQ calculates the linear regression of the input signal based on the FFT analysis.)
The value below the Max GR value in the spectrum display now shows the current slope value. On this basis you could now easily set the slope parameter of DSEQ.

I would like to ask the audience if this is helpful during daily work?
Thank you
Old 5 days ago
  #493
Lives for gear
 
TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ceejay View Post
Attaching requested percussive audio examples: unprocessed hats, competitor processing, and DSEQ two versions - with 85 and 38 Selectivity settings.
Great, thank you. Will check asap :-)
Old 5 days ago
  #494
Lives for gear
 
Beatworld's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
The value below the Max GR value in the spectrum display now shows the current slope value. On this basis you could now easily set the slope parameter of DSEQ.
Are you saying we should set the Slope setting to roughly match the current slope value below the Max GR ??
Or do you mean set the Slope setting so the Slope current value read out is around 0 ??

I'm referring to the Slope settings in the Dynamic Equaliser section, not the Slope settings in the Pre-Filter parameters.

I don't really understand what you are saying.
Thanks.

Last edited by Beatworld; 5 days ago at 12:35 PM.. Reason: more detail
Old 5 days ago
  #495
Gear Head
 
citytape's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DirkB View Post
Interestingly. I do not own any of the two, but am testing both soothe 2 and DSEQ at the moment. I feel the exact opposite. After a couple of hours of comparing, DSEQ sounds more natural to me. The differences are of course subtle, but especially on vocals I seemed to favoure DSEQ.

On bass sources, I liked soothe a little more, but on harsh dirt guitars, cymbals, rooms and vocals, I felt it was easier to get a natural sound with DSEQ. Especially the tilt adjustment in DSEQ makes things easier to dial in for me. Also, I got better results in the high end when switching to ultra. In soothe I did not directly hear improvements.

Still, both are great tools.

Regards,
Dirk

Personally, I don't favor the "digital" transparent sound that I hear from the DSEQ on my materials. Maybe DSEQ sounds great with tube amp guitar or crunchy rock lead vocal but it does not treat rap vocal and digital synth well.

I usually put Soothe on some vst instruments to cure the digital harshness, which I don't think the DSEQ could help. And for some well-recorded stuff by my outboard chain, I don't feel the need for resonance suppression. This is why I don't like DSEQ.

I think the preference highly depends on personal taste and audio materials.
Old 5 days ago
  #496
Lives for gear
 
TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatworld View Post
Are you saying we should set the Slope setting to roughly match the current slope value below the Max GR ??
Or do you mean set the Slope setting so the Slope current value read out is around 0 ??

I'm referring to the Slope settings in the Dynamic Equaliser section, not the Slope settings in the Pre-Filter parameters.

I don't really understand what you are saying.
Thanks.
The slope value is always calculated from the pure input signal, so it does not change if the slope parameter is changed.
But yes, it gives you a starting point to what you could set it
Old 5 days ago
  #497
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Beatworld's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
The slope value is always calculated from the pure input signal, so it does not change if the slope parameter is changed.
But yes, it gives you a starting point to what you could set it
That is a very good suggestion.
I've ended up using slightly higher slope settings using this approach.
The results are pleasing.
It's revealing/useful information having the input signal slope value displayed.

Thanks
Old 5 days ago
  #498
Gear Maniac
 
RitchieBorg's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatworld View Post
That is a very good suggestion.
I've ended up using slightly higher slope settings using this approach.
The results are pleasing.
It's revealing/useful information having the input signal slope value displayed.

Thanks
Noticed the exact same thing! Seems like a really useful help to find a starting point!
Old 5 days ago
  #499
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by citytape View Post
Personally, I don't favor the "digital" transparent sound that I hear from the DSEQ on my materials. Maybe DSEQ sounds great with tube amp guitar or crunchy rock lead vocal but it does not treat rap vocal and digital synth well.

I usually put Soothe on some vst instruments to cure the digital harshness, which I don't think the DSEQ could help. And for some well-recorded stuff by my outboard chain, I don't feel the need for resonance suppression. This is why I don't like DSEQ.

I think the preference highly depends on personal taste and audio materials.
I mix 75% rap and hip hop vocals (have mixed some heavy hitters). Works perfect and makes everything smooth, clean, round and removed any harshness. I don't think nasty frequencies and this plugin know the difference between a rock vocal or a rap vocal. It fixes and removes what u feed it.
Old 5 days ago
  #500
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by citytape View Post
Personally, I don't favor the "digital" transparent sound that I hear from the DSEQ on my materials. Maybe DSEQ sounds great with tube amp guitar or crunchy rock lead vocal but it does not treat rap vocal and digital synth well.

I usually put Soothe on some vst instruments to cure the digital harshness, which I don't think the DSEQ could help. And for some well-recorded stuff by my outboard chain, I don't feel the need for resonance suppression. This is why I don't like DSEQ.

I think the preference highly depends on personal taste and audio materials.
Definitely! I agree it's all about personal taste!! Soothe 2 is dope... It's just not as useful as DSEQ; which in my opinion is amazing! DSEQ has me spending more time with soothe 2 in hopes of figuring what it can still be used for... DSEQ seems to be taking all of its jobs. That being said; if Soothe 2 is what you have it's a fine tool; but if you have both Soothe 2 might start collecting some digital dust.
Old 5 days ago
  #501
Lives for gear
 
TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ceejay View Post
Thanks for the tip! Reducing "Selectivity" does helped minimize pre-ringing significantly. It also improved transients attacks.

However, while competitor does better job cleaning up harsh artificial resonances at percussive material. BUT the DSEQ capable for much musical cleanup job for melodic/instrumental material, and most important - complex 2bus material (due to linear phase processing, i guess)

Attaching requested percussive audio examples: unprocessed hats, competitor processing, and DSEQ two versions - with 85 and 38 Selectivity settings.
Thank you for providing this example material :-)

OK, here are my findings:
Unfortunately "av_hats_SUZ.wav" is a little bit hard to compare to unprocessed, as the transients seem to be out of sync... I guess you used a similar processing focusing on the range from 1.8kHz to 6.7kHz. But still something happened with the lows...

Anyway, the processing with selectivity 38 sounds pretty good. But in order to reduce the pre-ringing even further I reduced selectivity to 25. Now it sounds right, at least for me:-)
25 smooths the filter curve even further and reduces the pre-ringing (in this case).

I have two more suggestions (just my personal taste):
I would change the filter slope to 12dB as steep filter (even pre-filter in this case) could turn the sound quickly to plastic when used on high transient sound material. Similar effect when you do it with an EQ.

Another trick is to lower the threshold by add 3dB (to -13db) and set GR strength to x0.5. So more threshold but reduction with ratio 2:1. This makes more frequencies jump over the threshold but dimmed only by half. This makes it sound even a tick more natural.

I hope this helps
Old 5 days ago
  #502
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ceejay's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
I hope this helps
Thanks for your investigation and highly useful suggestions!
Hope this helps other users who chooses DSEQ to process transient rich material.
As i can see there is still so much to learn about this plugin controls, tips & tricks, as it so versatile and tweakable in-depth.
Old 5 days ago
  #503
Gear Head
 
citytape's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by trevon View Post
I mix 75% rap and hip hop vocals (have mixed some heavy hitters). Works perfect and makes everything smooth, clean, round and removed any harshness. I don't think nasty frequencies and this plugin know the difference between a rock vocal or a rap vocal. It fixes and removes what u feed it.
It depends on how you define “smooth and round”. I don’t consider DSEQ as “smooth and round” as Soothe 2. It is clean, it takes off the unwanted resonance. Maybe it is too transparent it doesn’t shape the top end as smooth as Soothe.

Also, you can use DSEQ on rap vocals or any vocals, it is your taste and your mix after all. I do curious about your mix though, is there anywhere I can have a listen to your mix?
Old 5 days ago
  #504
Gear Head
 
citytape's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saturatio View Post
Definitely! I agree it's all about personal taste!! Soothe 2 is dope... It's just not as useful as DSEQ; which in my opinion is amazing! DSEQ has me spending more time with soothe 2 in hopes of figuring what it can still be used for... DSEQ seems to be taking all of its jobs. That being said; if Soothe 2 is what you have it's a fine tool; but if you have both Soothe 2 might start collecting some digital dust.
Lol, digital dust. If you ever want to sell your Soothe 2, let me know. I have couple of musician friends are waiting for Thanksgiving Soothe 2 sale. They would love to buy it.
Old 4 days ago
  #505
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by citytape View Post
It depends on how you define “smooth and round”. I don’t consider DSEQ as “smooth and round” as Soothe 2. It is clean, it takes off the unwanted resonance. Maybe it is too transparent it doesn’t shape the top end as smooth as Soothe.

Also, you can use DSEQ on rap vocals or any vocals, it is your taste and your mix after all. I do curious about your mix though, is there anywhere I can have a listen to your mix?
i'll pm you when this mix i'm working on is finished, so you can see how it affects rap vocals.
Old 4 days ago
  #506
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duckoff's Avatar
 

This may be a dumb idea but would a freeze / hold function be useful?

I guess its straying into match eq territory but all the functionality is already there and might be useful to avoid overcompression whilst retaining some of the functionality.
Old 4 days ago
  #507
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TBProAudio's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by duckoff View Post
This may be a dumb idea but would a freeze / hold function be useful?

I guess its straying into match eq territory but all the functionality is already there and might be useful to avoid overcompression whilst retaining some of the functionality.
What do you mean with freeze/hold? Holding the GR spectrum view?
It just displays the input minus output spectrum.

You are looking for the input/output spectrum like in SPAN, right.

We are still struggling with the topic "reference spectrum matching".
We are already evaluating if it makes sense to turn an audio reference into a threshold curve. Currently the threshold is fixed for each dynamic EQ (beside the slope parameter and further pre-filtering).
Old 3 days ago
  #508
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ceejay View Post
Thanks for the tip! Reducing "Selectivity" does helped minimize pre-ringing significantly. It also improved transients attacks.

However, while competitor does better job cleaning up harsh artificial resonances at percussive material. BUT the DSEQ capable for much musical cleanup job for melodic/instrumental material, and most important - complex 2bus material (due to linear phase processing, i guess)

Attaching requested percussive audio examples: unprocessed hats, competitor processing, and DSEQ two versions - with 85 and 38 Selectivity settings.
Which plugin is the competitor?

Daniel.
Old 3 days ago
  #509
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ceejay's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danielbest1 View Post
Which plugin is the competitor?
Daniel.
soothe2
Old 2 days ago
  #510
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DirkB's Avatar
I do not get excited over gear too easily - but this DSEQ is fantastic. Been using it to complete two mixes the last two days and what this does to dirt guitars, overheads, vocals is amazing. Never was easier to get the backin vocals to smooth out and then brighten up for a big stereo in your face vocal sound.

This together wit Fabfilter Saturn 2 are two tools that I belief will stay with me quite some time.

Excellent stuff!

Gr.
Dirk
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