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Customised Mackie Control with DAW Sync and Full Plug-in Control
Old 10th November 2019
  #31
Gear Addict
Envy. Logic user.


Is the MCU in 2020 still the best Logic controller under 5 grand? After all that time...?
Damn.
Old 10th November 2019
  #32
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by r.staettler View Post
Envy. Logic user.


Is the MCU in 2020 still the best Logic controller under 5 grand? After all that time...?
Damn.
I think the OP is talking about the actually MCU protocol rather then the MCU hardware. I think the MCU hardware used a protocol derived from HUI. so MCU became a standard protocol which Mackie made for any vendor to use. Emagic then did something with Mackie and made the Logic Control ?. I think it might have had a modified MCU protocol but then, Emagic / Logic had a firmware update which could have the Logic Control also switch into MCU mode. something along those lines. but I think the OP is using the XTouch running in MCU mode in this case.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #33
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
[CENTER]Marginally within the time promised

Here's the first proper overview vid for QMap.
I'm going to add one per day, and this first one is on plugin control.

These are made from the perspective of seeing it from the ground up,
but also for people that might not be familiar with Studio One.

All the functionality and features will be covered so check back for the others

Once you've seen them all, you'll know exactly what it can do and if it will help your workflow.

(The website mentioned is actually still under construction It'll start going up tonight/tomorrow).


*** Updated Plug-in video is at the bottom of this page***
Old 4 weeks ago
  #34
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muser View Post
I think the OP is using the XTouch running in MCU mode in this case.
Remember that when you put a device into MCU mode, all this does is lock the midi addresses and cc/sysex data for the hardware controls to those pre-defined by the Mackie Control protocol standard.
The actual implementation of the mode is done via xml surface files and JavaScript.

QMap is a combination of workflow ideology, modified scripts, specific Studio One settings and 20 purpose-built macros integrated into the map.
These custom macros glue the whole thing together and overcome software obstacles that would otherwise make it impossible.

The base map will be free, and fully functional apart from the plugin mode, will come with the default skin/osd, no plugin map library, no extra custom macros, no physical graphic overlay.
All the workflow advantages will be there though which is still a massive boost over the normal Mackie Control functionality.

If you buy the package which includes all the above, then your installer will also have a unique id which will allow you to migrate your map to another computer/controller without conflicts/overwriting.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #35
Gear Guru
 
Muser's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quetz View Post
Remember that when you put a device into MCU mode, all this does is lock the midi addresses and cc/sysex data for the hardware controls to those pre-defined by the Mackie Control protocol standard.
The actual implementation of the mode is done via xml surface files and JavaScript.

QMap is a combination of workflow ideology, modified scripts, specific Studio One settings and 20 purpose-built macros integrated into the map.
These custom macros glue the whole thing together and overcome software obstacles that would otherwise make it impossible.

The base map will be free, and fully functional, but this will come with the default skin/osd, no plugin map library, no extra custom macros and no physical graphic overlay.

If you buy the package which includes all the above, then your installer will also have a unique id which will allow you to migrate your map to another computer/controller without conflicts/overwriting.
thanks for the explanation. I use a few MCU based signals with my setup but not many. just really for cursor based navigation. it's with a different DAW, though the protocol is universal. but in any case, I understand the work you must have put in, so I wish you the best of luck with it.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #36
Gear Maniac
 

@ Quetz
Looks like you might have a new beast to tame.
https://community.musictribe.com/t5/...al/td-p/279767
Old 3 weeks ago
  #37
Gear Nut
 
shmuelyosef's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by blayz2002 View Post
...you are COMPLETELY WRONG.
It is rare that anybody is more than partially WRONG
Old 3 weeks ago
  #38
Gear Guru
 
Jeezo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quetz View Post
Marginally within the time promised

Here's the first proper overview vid for QMap.
I'm going to add one per day, and this first one is on plugin control.

These are made from the perspective of seeing it from the ground up,
but also for people that might not be familiar with Studio One.

All the functionality and features will be covered so check back for the others

Once you've seen them all, you'll know exactly what it can do and if it will help your workflow.

(The website mentioned is actually still under construction It'll start going up tonight/tomorrow).


Overview 1 : Plugin Control:

Really interested , about the video , take your time , i wasn t able to read stuff more than once , give time to your stuff , it desreves it
Old 3 weeks ago
  #39
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Yep, you are right

I'm re-doing them, I'm adding one here which is for daw control and scene-sync which should have a better flow, and I'm redoing the plugin one now..
Too many hats to wear at once, never a good thing



Video Overview 2 ¦ Daw & Scene-Sync!


Old 3 weeks ago
  #40
Gear Nut
 
Mr. Green's Avatar
 

VERY COOL PROJECT.

And I am very interested.

I do have one question for you though. In attempting to use my Console 1 controller as an independent midi controller (and with any other controller for that matter, regardless of MCU or midi), I discovered a "broken feature" in Studio One and it's parameter linking system:

On certain plugins -or maybe all (I'm not sure) - but notably IK plugs and the Console 1 plugs in particular, there is a behavior that occurs when you load a preset into the plugin where the new parameters that have been loaded fail to initialize the controls in either external hardware or internal mapping panels. The result is that the controls on the hardware end up being all wrong compared to the settings in the software and when you go to move your improperly set control, the value suddenly jumps from the preset value to the now-recognized value on your controller - which makes fine-tuning anything quite frustrating.

I have submitted a bug report on this to Presonus and they have acknowledged it, but who knows if/when they will ever fix it. No one's voting for it.

Have you managed to find a workaround for this?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #41
Gear Nut
Videos are still WAY too fast... can't see what you are doing. Consider a split

screen with a clear view of the controller to show exactly what you are accessing

on the controller with the other screen showing how Studio One responds... and do

it slowly enough so the viewer can understand and appreciate what's happening.

I think it will make for a much more powerful presentation. The possibility of

a workflow where you can essentially ditch the mouse should interest a lot of

Studio One users... especially if your systems offers a more comprehensive

alternative for those of us using/considering Faderport/Softube scenarios.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #42
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Hi there, yes the plug-in video was the original hasty one, I'm posting a more relaxed version right here in this post.

Hopefully this will be a significant improvement..

Thanks for bearing with me though, the flow of the Daw Sync video makes sense to my brain, but I am probably not taking enough account of the fact that people are seeing this for the first time..
I've tried various ways of splitting the two video sources but finding a way that gives an equal view of what needs to be seen at any given time is tricky!


Video Overview 1 ¦ Controlling Plugins




NOTE:
The graphic overlay you see in the videos is a trial sample and doesn't reflect the one you will get.
You can see the final design and layout on the www.modernidiots.com site, it's the graphic linked to the two 'Design' parts.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #43
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mege View Post
@ Quetz
Looks like you might have a new beast to tame.
https://community.musictribe.com/t5/...al/td-p/279767
Oh my.

Damn it's a shame they haven't done a controller-only version without all the audio interface shenanigans.
But could use it as a 16 channel adat expander.

I like the look of that.
And yes it will run Qmap, with scope for extra bells and whistles.

Thanks for the heads up!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #44
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Green View Post
VERY COOL PROJECT.

And I am very interested.

I do have one question for you though. In attempting to use my Console 1 controller as an independent midi controller (and with any other controller for that matter, regardless of MCU or midi), I discovered a "broken feature" in Studio One and it's parameter linking system:

On certain plugins -or maybe all (I'm not sure) - but notably IK plugs and the Console 1 plugs in particular, there is a behavior that occurs when you load a preset into the plugin where the new parameters that have been loaded fail to initialize the controls in either external hardware or internal mapping panels. The result is that the controls on the hardware end up being all wrong compared to the settings in the software and when you go to move your improperly set control, the value suddenly jumps from the preset value to the now-recognized value on your controller - which makes fine-tuning anything quite frustrating.

I have submitted a bug report on this to Presonus and they have acknowledged it, but who knows if/when they will ever fix it. No one's voting for it.

Have you managed to find a workaround for this?
Hi there!

I missed this post somehow.
This may sound silly to some, but I haven't encountered it because I never use presets.
Let me investigate and see if this applies when using my system.

What I can confirm is that if I have say 4 plugs on one channel, and I switch between them, then the parameters always respond dynamically, ie there is no control value jumping, the controls always pick up at the point that the plugin parameter is set.
In other words, the hardware controls act incrementally, so if say encoder one was at 10 for one plugin, and I switch to another plugin, moving the encoder one notch left doesn't jump the new plugin parameter to 9, it will move it to 4 if the new plug was set to 5.
Hope that makes sense.
In the specific case where you load a new preset into the same plugin, it should still operate the same way, but let me confirm this and get back to you.
If it doesn't work, then as you say this is a bug on the Presonus end.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #45
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
@ Mr. Green , yes you are correct.
When you change presets within a plug, S1 doesn't update the parameter changes immediately.
This is pretty silly.
If you switch between plugs on the same channel, even the same plugin on the same channel (eg on different threads of a channel splitter), then everything updates fine.
See the pic below, which shows the settings for the previous preset still on the controller OSD and the settings for the new preset on the plug gui itself.
That's a big old bug...
Attached Thumbnails
Customised Mackie Control with DAW Sync and Full Plug-in Control-tape-test.jpg  
Old 1 week ago
  #46
Lives for gear
Looking great-

I've been debating on a control surface purchase and this made it easy...

Any word on what the pricing is for qmap and the overlay? Thanks!
Old 1 week ago
  #47
Lives for gear
Two other questions while I'm pestering you-

If I map all my plugins, I can save that setup (with extenders and all) to other workstations?

Also, you produced the music in the videos? If so, great work man...
Old 1 week ago
  #48
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC
Looking great-

I've been debating on a control surface purchase and this made it easy...
I know, for me it's a no-brainer, but then I am obviously quite biased!
And I haven't even touched on the other workflow features yet..
I'm so behind on the videos but I'll have two more up today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC
Any word on what the pricing is for qmap and the overlay? Thanks!
I want to keep it as low as possible, the main factor is the physical overlay, I can't afford to do a big run which makes them expensive because I'm having them produced professionally using a scratch resistant textured polyester, the one you see on my unit in the vids is a pre-production sample with an old design, the current design is the one in the graphic that you can see on the website.

The price will be £39.99, and I'm committing to it being no higher than that, which includes postage of the overlay to the UK; there will be a small surcharge (at cost) for sending to mainland Europe, the US and rest of world.

However, anyone that registers their interest by the end of the 6th December using the form on the website (as I think you have done?), will be offered the package at the discounted price of £29.99.
This gets you the full map, loads of pre-mapped plugs, the custom on-screen display, the physical overlay, an extra folder of custom macros that are very useful, and free updates.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC
Two other questions while I'm pestering you-

If I map all my plugins, I can save that setup (with extenders and all) to other workstations?
If you've done your own mappings for plugs (which pretty much everyone will in addition to the bundled maps), then all you need to do is run your installer on the target machine and then paste your updated map file (which you can just put on a USB stick with the installer) over the original one that's installed.
Simple as that.

If the target machine already has Qmap installed, then the host can just back up their mapfile, and you paste yours in and they can replace it with theirs again when you're gone.

This does beg the obvious question: what about transferring the overlay?
You can either choose not to remove the backing in the first place, it will fit snugly because of all the button apertures, but I've chosen an adhesive that does stand up to a few removals/replacements.
Of course, if the person that owns the workstation you migrate to is a regular collaborator, then please feel free to persuade them to buy one for themselves!
Once they see it in action it should sell itself though

Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanC
Also, you produced the music in the videos? If so, great work man...
I mixed it from the original multitracks yep, it's a great tune, the original mix is very different!
Unfortunately it gets encoded twice, once in obs and then again in prem pro so it's not as nice sounding as it is in Studio One.
Also, I used it as the trial project when developing Qmap and didn't save the fully mixed version when I started, so had to reset everything and start again in order to do these videos ha ha!

Please bear in mind though that I am a professional problem solver, not a professional mix engineer
Old 1 week ago
  #49
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
You can either choose not to remove the backing in the first place, it will fit snugly because of all the button apertures, but I've chosen an adhesive that does stand up to a few removals/replacements.
Why don't you use some sort of magnetic sheet instead of an adhesive one? This way, anyone can replace the overlay as many times as they like.
Personally, I'd rather it magnetic

Btw, well done with the QMap! Looks awesome!
Old 1 week ago
  #50
Gear Nut
Can you post a full photo of the Overlay?
Old 1 week ago
  #51
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorozen View Post
Why don't you use some sort of magnetic sheet instead of an adhesive one? This way, anyone can replace the overlay as many times as they like.
Personally, I'd rather it magnetic

Btw, well done with the QMap! Looks awesome!
I am with you, I would have preferred a magnetic one, but the issue here is cost.
The industry standard pricing for a run of 50 is over £750 just for normal adhesive backed ones.
There's no way on earth I have the financial resources to pay for a run of 500 which would be necessary to get a decent price.
The entire package will only be £39.99 remember, and if you register interest by the 12th Dec it's only £29.99.
Out of that will have to come Paypal fees, I will have to pay tax on it, postage to the UK is also included so that will come out of it, etc etc.

I could have decided to charge £99.99 for example, but I decided to price it a level that I myself could afford if someone else released it today.
I want as many people as possible to have access to it.

As soon as I get in a position when I can do a magnetic version then I will, trust me!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Daddy
Can you post a full photo of the Overlay?
I've got a new sample arriving tomorrow so I'll do it then.

I've delayed the new videos because I want the new overlay on the unit when I do them..
Old 1 week ago
  #52
Gear Nut
 
Mr. Green's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quetz View Post
@ Mr. Green , yes you are correct.
When you change presets within a plug, S1 doesn't update the parameter changes immediately.
This is pretty silly.
If you switch between plugs on the same channel, even the same plugin on the same channel (eg on different threads of a channel splitter), then everything updates fine.
See the pic below, which shows the settings for the previous preset still on the controller OSD and the settings for the new preset on the plug gui itself.
That's a big old bug...

Yup.

You think I could persuade you to send 'em a support request for that? Feels like I'm the only one so far (who knows). Maybe if more voices could be heard...
Old 1 week ago
  #53
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quetz
I am with you, I would have preferred a magnetic one, but the issue here is cost.
The industry standard pricing for a run of 50 is over £750 just for normal adhesive backed ones.
There's no way on earth I have the financial resources to pay for a run of 500 which would be necessary to get a decent price.
The entire package will only be £39.99 remember, and if you register interest by the 12th Dec it's only £29.99.
Out of that will have to come Paypal fees, I will have to pay tax on it, postage to the UK is also included so that will come out of it, etc etc.

I could have decided to charge £99.99 for example, but I decided to price it a level that I myself could afford if someone else released it today.
I want as many people as possible to have access to it.

As soon as I get in a position when I can do a magnetic version then I will, trust me!

Fair enough
Subscribed and registered, I will keep checking in..

Good luck!
Old 1 week ago
  #54
Gear Nut
I do not have a controller... is "Behringer X-Touch Universal Control Surface" the one to get?
Old 1 week ago
  #55
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Green View Post
Yup.

You think I could persuade you to send 'em a support request for that? Feels like I'm the only one so far (who knows). Maybe if more voices could be heard...
No can do.
I'm banned thanks to the over-zealous fanboi fanatics they still allow to control their user forum..
Worst part about the whole company, imo.
Old 1 week ago
  #56
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Daddy View Post
I do not have a controller... is "Behringer X-Touch Universal Control Surface" the one to get?
For someone buying now, I would recommend either that or the Icon Qcon Pro X.
Old 1 week ago
  #57
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
@ Rockin Daddy , and an update for everyone else as well:

The supplier of the graphic overlays had a fire

I kid you not.

So that's delayed things, but not for too long.

Re photos, there's a photo on page 1 of this thread showing the overlay, there have been a couple of changes though, such as the cutout for the time display will be an actual see through window rather than just an aperture, that's the updated sample I'm waiting on, if I don't like it then it'll be left as a normal aperture.

Also, instead of the thin strip running down the left side, the master fader aperture is now going to be just wide enough for the motorised fader clip, with dB markings on the overlay itself, this just guarantees extra strength there.

Here's a graphic showing the pretty much final design, the dB markings are to be added obvs:

Old 1 week ago
  #58
Here for the gear
 
Attamanu's Avatar
Did u think about adding something like this :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eV1p...ture=emb_title

Old 6 days ago
  #59
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Yes, and I did

However, the guy in the video (good job fella, btw) stated at the start that his setup is purely for tracking, which is why he has mapped controls to cue sends.

My map is primarily for mixing, therefore I chose to integrate send pans instead of cue sends (also something that hasn't been done before).

These are accessed nice and simply by going into send mode, which puts send levels on the faders and send pan on the encoders.
You can also hit flip while in send mode and this will then put channel pan on the encoders and send pan on the faders.
This allows for all kinds of fluid, simultaneous automation moves which would otherwise not be possible.

An important thing to note with the setup in that video is that his setup is static, ie you can't bank and have the cue sends follow the new channels that come into view.
In fact, there is no banking at all available, and he's not hiding this fact, he does say that for his setup for tracking, he only needs 17 or whatever channels for inputs, a few buses and a master section.
Beyond that you're stuck.

My system is dynamic in that you could have 200 channels and when paging left or right, you'll have send pan, channel pan etc available for every set of channels that appears, or it could have been cue sends, but as mentioned, that wouldn't make sense for the intended application (mixing).

The way he's implemented it means that it's set up just as a midi controller, with those controls assigned exclusively to the software parameters.
You can do that easily yourself by clicking on cue send 1 on channel one, and assigning it to fader 1.
Then click on cue send 1 for channel 2 and assign it to fader 2 etc.
When you choose a different layer on the 2400, this gives each control a different midi address, so then you can assign cue send 2 on channel 1 to fader 1 again etc.
Any midi controller that has layers can be used to do this, such as a Novation LaunchControl (using user templates).

The problem there is that when you run out of physical strips on your midi controller, the fun ends. There is a hard limit tied to how many faders/encoders you have on the midi device.

Another thing to note, is that he has mapped the PreSonus Pro Q to a row of encoders, but the plugin controls are still locked to just encoders, so all you can do is move that set of controls over to the faders.
With Qmap you can have the 8 encoders controlling high/low pass and eq band freqs for example, while simultaneously having control over input/output gain and eq band gains using the faders, and still have the encoder push-buttons free for other uses on that same plugin (ie band on/off).

The advantage of Qmap is that because it's a customised Mackie Control system, you are not limited to the number of physical 'strips', you can bank to your heart's content and still have all those dynamic controls available for every channel in the session.
Old 4 days ago
  #60
Lives for gear
 
Quetz's Avatar
Morning Slutz!

Quick update:

The new overlay is arriving tomorrow or Thursday, then I'm going to make a simple tutorial style vid that shows all the features working together that I can explain as I go along.
I've kept people waiting long enough!

I've realised it's important for people to see things happening in real time, not just for the speed aspect but also to see how fluidly you can work with the movements of just one hand, which is a big selling point in itself.

I didn't want to do this still using the old overlay, which is what's held things up.

Ok, that is all!
Have a good day
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