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AES 2019: Solid State Logic Preview ORIGIN – Next Generation Analogue Studio Console
Old 30th October 2019
  #301
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dlmorley's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by raal View Post

Yes and yes. Could someone please talk me out of considering this thing?
If I had $50k for a console, this would be high on my list.
Old 30th October 2019
  #302
Gear Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by raal View Post
It might be marketed as such and please correct me if i'm wrong, but don't most people who still mix on big SSLs and others break out from the box and automate ITB? If i had this console i would certainly use it for mixing. DAW out, get a basic balance and automate ITB and if you like, with the unity gain buttons you can bypass the faders altogether. If you need some automation OTB add a Sigma.



Yes and yes. Could someone please talk me out of considering this thing?
You obviously aren't married....! For my wife would be a high fastball right over the plate.....!
Old 31st October 2019
  #303
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ardis View Post
Actually that's probably polite southern for assh*le...... "antebellum and sweet tea" remarks aren't too nice either FWIW.... please keep race out of this new product announcement and move on.....

This is marketed as a tracking desk and is an SSL not a Daking or an API.

People seem to be awfully confused over something very simple. Seems to me to be a continuation of their entry level Six concept, a straightforward affordable mixing console without a bunch of things that would need future proofing....

Maybe I'm old school but having a single desk which handles everything is a wonderful thing, and speeds workflow.....
Thanks for the late response and pointless reiteration of beating a dead horse; welcome to the party.

No one with ears prefers the sound of SSL pres to comparably-priced boards. MCIs (debatable) and SSLs made using outboard pres a near-necessity. Who thought of such a thing before them?

The appeal of an SSL has to do with having many features in one space. Also, many like their EQs and compressors.

This board strips most of the features that made the SSL—compressors, gates, automation, etc—and leaves lackluster pres, no automation, no gates, no compressors, but the EQs remain intact.

One is left with just another mediocre, stripped down Chinese IC-based board. Give me a good, used live board for $1-3k, which sounds much better and has more features.

This is a $10-20k board with $30k of name recognition.
Old 31st October 2019
  #304
Lives for gear
 

Ouch !!!!

This is going to make the SSL boys butt hurt.

Cheers
Old 31st October 2019
  #305
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty James View Post
Actually an unloaded 24 channel API 2448 with automation is $78k MSRP at Vintage King. Which is less if you negotiate.

And it's actually 48 channels with the small fader. That's a lot of channels. But that's unloaded. Still gotta buy 500 series EQ's.. if you don't already have 24 laying around.. haha.

The API eq is very $$. But it has transformers and has a lovely color. I opted for different EQ to save money and add versatility.
Hey James ,which eq did you load into your 2448?,they are building mine.
Old 31st October 2019
  #306
Gear Guru
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakinrecords View Post
Thanks for the late response and pointless reiteration of beating a dead horse; welcome to the party.

No one with ears prefers the sound of SSL pres to comparably-priced boards. MCIs (debatable) and SSLs made using outboard pres a near-necessity. Who thought of such a thing before them?

The appeal of an SSL has to do with having many features in one space. Also, many like their EQs and compressors.

This board strips most of the features that made the SSL—compressors, gates, automation, etc—and leaves lackluster pres, no automation, no gates, no compressors, but the EQs remain intact.

One is left with just another mediocre, stripped down Chinese IC-based board. Give me a good, used live board for $1-3k, which sounds much better and has more features.

This is a $10-20k board with $30k of name recognition.
Thank you for your condescending attitude and pointless review of the sound of a board you've never heard.
If you don't like SSL why do you care?.....
Honestly I'd really hate to release a product and have to deal with people like you.......Ironic you're accusing me of beating a dead horse..... so I'll ignore your beating yours.....
Old 31st October 2019
  #307
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by breakinrecords View Post
Thanks for the late response and pointless reiteration of beating a dead horse; welcome to the party.

No one with ears prefers the sound of SSL pres to comparably-priced boards. MCIs (debatable) and SSLs made using outboard pres a near-necessity. Who thought of such a thing before them?

The appeal of an SSL has to do with having many features in one space. Also, many like their EQs and compressors.

This board strips most of the features that made the SSL—compressors, gates, automation, etc—and leaves lackluster pres, no automation, no gates, no compressors, but the EQs remain intact.

One is left with just another mediocre, stripped down Chinese IC-based board. Give me a good, used live board for $1-3k, which sounds much better and has more features.

This is a $10-20k board with $30k of name recognition.
Wow just wow!!!

Gearslutz is definitely now the 4Chan of audio forums - have to agree with Jindrich again on this. The forum has totally changed since I first started posting here.

Maybe one day the powers that be at Gearslutz will require all accounts to be verified and real names used along with links back to websites and social media accounts to prevent the ridiculous trolling and un-constructive posts that derail almost every thread on the forum.

Almost all of un-informed, low information, troll-ish type posts come from accounts with no identifiable information as to who is posting and what their role/profile in the industry is.

I'm sure the quality of discussions would skyrocket if there was no anonymous posting possible.

The current situation is DISGUSTING!
Old 31st October 2019
  #308
Lives for gear
 

I’d rather debate points than insult individuals.
Old 2nd November 2019
  #309
Here for the gear
 

i think i would still stick to Digital recalls so Wes audio and bettermaker stuff works better for me now,
in the past i would get this without thinking, but as of my workflow today, i would prefer to have instant recall in each project and track all the time
without the need of taking pictures and losing time, especially that i do work in multiple projects at the same time so every couple of hours i need to finish some parts in different projects.

but it looks nice, and a lot of people will now enjoy the ssl sound.
Old 3rd November 2019
  #310
Gear Maniac
 

Hi
Can someone post photographs of the internal insides of this desk
Thanks
Old 4th November 2019
  #311
Lives for gear
Would anyone know if the Origin's mix bus is AWS/Duality 'clean', or can it be a bit dirtier?

Last edited by raal; 5th November 2019 at 06:56 AM..
Old 5th November 2019
  #312
Lives for gear
 

Why'd ssl name this board after a Marshall amp?
Old 7th November 2019
  #313
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Space1999's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by breakinrecords View Post
I’d rather debate points than insult individuals.
In regard to your blanket statement about SSL pres...

Just for a reference, could you tell us how many SSL boards you have sat behind and tracked on?

Sounds like you are regurgitating “talking points” about the original 4000 G/G+ pres which led producers and engineers to begin using outboard preamps.

Now my poor country butt has never sat behind an SSL, but I have bought CDs and digital downloads of albums I know were tracked and mixed on current SSLs.

I do research a lot on consoles as a past time. I had a period of time where I was buying music tracked and mixed on Amek 9098i consoles.

I also listened to the sound bites of the SSL Duality pres, versus the harmonic overload pre. I thought it was a genius idea. Because of all the color you can use on your recorded tracks in your DAW or with the UAD setup I use, its the transparent pre that interests me the most.

I feel it would be harder to use what I already have if I am using a preamp that colors the sound on the way in. Audient also has fairly neutral preamps. So does the 9000 series SSL consoles and as far as outboard the Millenial HV-3 series outboard pres which I have used and loved.

Horses for courses, but if you are going to use talking points, it would be most helpful if you had real world experience with the equipment your are bashing. But I will gladly give you the benefit of a doubt that you have worked on 4 generations of SSL consoles and know the preamps on them intimately.

So it would be more helpful if you could put the SSL console’s make that you have worked on and how you felt about the pres on those consoles instead of using blanket statements that are confusing to the reader.

Bless your heart

Pat
Old 7th November 2019
  #314
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Space1999 View Post
In regard to your blanket statement about SSL pres...

Just for a reference, could you tell us how many SSL boards you have sat behind and tracked on?

Sounds like you are regurgitating “talking points” about the original 4000 G/G+ pres which led producers and engineers to begin using outboard preamps.

Now my poor country butt has never sat behind an SSL, but I have bought CDs and digital downloads of albums I know were tracked and mixed on current SSLs.

I do research a lot on consoles as a past time. I had a period of time where I was buying music tracked and mixed on Amek 9098i consoles.

I also listened to the sound bites of the SSL Duality pres, versus the harmonic overload pre. I thought it was a genius idea. Because of all the color you can use on your recorded tracks in your DAW or with the UAD setup I use, its the transparent pre that interests me the most.

I feel it would be harder to use what I already have if I am using a preamp that colors the sound on the way in. Audient also has fairly neutral preamps. So does the 9000 series SSL consoles and as far as outboard the Millenial HV-3 series outboard pres which I have used and loved.

Horses for courses, but if you are going to use talking points, it would be most helpful if you had real world experience with the equipment your are bashing. But I will gladly give you the benefit of a doubt that you have worked on 4 generations of SSL consoles and know the preamps on them intimately.

So it would be more helpful if you could put the SSL console’s make that you have worked on and how you felt about the pres on those consoles instead of using blanket statements that are confusing to the reader.

Bless your heart

Pat
You already presumed I was speaking from “talking points”. No, I’ve been behind enough (mostly) 4000s and (some) 9000s, and I’ve studied the sounds of the smaller/modular models to make an opinion. It’s difficult not to be familiar with the SSL sound(s).

The SSL family of sounds is pretty well known. Some like the sounds more than others, obviously.

Last edited by breakinrecords; 4 weeks ago at 02:03 AM..
Old 7th November 2019
  #315
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Space1999's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by breakinrecords View Post
You already presumed I was speaking from “talking points”. No, I’ve been behind enough (mostly) 4000s and (some) 9000s, and I’ve studied the sounds of the smaller/modular models, to make an opinion. It’s difficult not to be familiar with the SSL sound(s).

The SSL family of sounds is pretty well known. Some like the sounds more than others, obviously.
OK thanks! I appreciate you sharing your knowledge. I believe SSL was the first console to put serious punch into drum kits. I really do not know if SSL improved upon their earliest preamp or what. But I can tell if something from the 80s or 90s was mixed using one.

Pat
Old 4 weeks ago
  #316
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salty James View Post
Relax.
What you believe and reality are exactly in phase.
Like, nobody was using SSL consoles as tracking consoles i.e. the preamps.. if they could help it.

And that is exactly what SSL is saying this console is> A tracking console. Mixing on this in a professional environment would be basically impossible. I mean at a pro level. There is no auto, no recall, no DAW control, no comps. It's not a mixing console.
I agree in that very few people used to record with SSL pres by choice, but the pres on this desk, according to all descriptions i've read so far, are not to be found on any previous SSL product. I'd hesitate to issue opinions before actually hearing them.

Last edited by raal; 4 weeks ago at 06:38 PM..
Old 4 weeks ago
  #317
Quote:
Originally Posted by raal View Post
I'd hesitate to issue opinions before actually hearing them.
But raal, we're on Gearslutz! Where no one has used this console!! woohoo!
Old 4 weeks ago
  #318
MGA
Gear Addict
 
MGA's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by raal View Post
I agree in that very few people used to record with SSL pres by choice, but the pres on this desk, according to all descriptions i've read so far, are not to be found on any previous SSL product. I'd hesitate to issue opinions before actually hearing them.
I vaguely recall and interview on you tube with Kevin Shirley discussing the VHD pres in regards to a Joe Bonamassa album he was working on. He mention that he could get the SSL VHD pres to sound similar to the Neve 80 series console pres he was using to record with but YMMV.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #319
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by MGA View Post
I vaguely recall and interview on you tube with Kevin Shirley discussing the VHD pres in regards to a Joe Bonamassa album he was working on. He mention that he could get the SSL VHD pres to sound similar to the Neve 80 series console pres he was using to record with but YMMV.
I also remember people speaking highly of the VHD pres, but my impression is these are different from any previous SSL product, including VHD.

SSL website:

"ORIGIN features a completely new microphone pre-amplifier design that inherits the clarity and purity of previous SSL mic pre's, with the added flexibility of switching character to a warm, harmonically-rich and driven tone that varies with gain. The ideal solution to 'perfect' digital system and hybrid workflow.

PureDrive™ is a new discrete transistor mic-pre based around modern FET components. The result is an ultra-clean, ultra-low noise pre amp, that is fast and offers stunning resolution when in 'Pure' mode. Hit the switch and the 'Drive' circuit is engaged, adding gain dependent non-linear harmonic saturation."

Look forward to seeing/hearing what they're all about.

Last edited by raal; 3 weeks ago at 06:10 AM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #320
Gear Addict
 
Pyxis360's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by siddhu View Post
Wow just wow!!!

Gearslutz is definitely now the 4Chan of audio forums - have to agree with Jindrich again on this. The forum has totally changed since I first started posting here.

Maybe one day the powers that be at Gearslutz will require all accounts to be verified and real names used along with links back to websites and social media accounts to prevent the ridiculous trolling and un-constructive posts that derail almost every thread on the forum.

Almost all of un-informed, low information, troll-ish type posts come from accounts with no identifiable information as to who is posting and what their role/profile in the industry is.

I'm sure the quality of discussions would skyrocket if there was no anonymous posting possible.

The current situation is DISGUSTING!
Truer words have never been spoken
Old 3 weeks ago
  #321
Gear Nut
 
seedubs's Avatar
Lots of great records were made using only the mic pres on the e console. Those all had Jensen transformers in the mic amps . The later transformer less pres are not as cool but the E channel pres rock. I use them for over heads toms and the like . One day I’m gonna get 24 channels in a remote rack . Love em!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #322
Quote:
Originally Posted by breakinrecords View Post

No one with ears prefers the sound of SSL pres......

.......This is a $10-20k board with $30k of name recognition.



If you had even bothered to read for 30 seconds about this product you would see that it is a NEW, dual personality preamp design which should allow it to sound radically different from legacy SSL preamps like the 4K.

You also claimed there was no compressor, when the SSL bus compressor is included. Again, you can find this info immediately at a glance

Please read before you post rather than contributing to misinformation, the world already has enough.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #323
Moderator
 
Tim Farrant's Avatar
 

It is quite simple really. SSL have always used IC opamps. There is no Class A discrete heritage to hold on to. So, the sound of the original SSL 4000 is the Philips NE5534. Correct me if I am wrong back in the day but only 2 companies, Philips and Sygnetics made the NE5534 device.
Tim
Old 2 weeks ago
  #324
Lives for gear
 
crypticglobe's Avatar
No automation??

So... forgive me if it's already been covered in this thread... I just didn't have time to wade through all 11 pages.

But... am I the only one that see's the lack of an option for analog automation as the glaring oversight here? I mean... make a Duality/AWS style moving fader and digital scribble strip option for this and THEN it really becomes the perfect console.

Now... I know some people are gonna say... well, the " 0DB button" solves the automation problem. Just use that and automate in your DAW. To that I would say an emphatic no. This throws the basics of quality gain staging and leveling out the window, not to mention the reduced bit depth/dynamics you get from your D/A converter when you lower the output volume coming from your DAW.

This is why so many people are underwhelmed with analog summing boxes. You have to get high quality audio at the PROPER signal level with all the dynamic range your hardware can reproduce into your mixer and THEN sum in the analog realm to get the true sonic benefits of analog summing.

This desk is AWESOME in so many ways!! Don't leave us hanging. Sure... sure... a few sigmas would mostly solve this... but moving analog faders and digital scribble strips are a better solution. Seems like you could easily add that as an option and STILL come in less than a Duality.

Just saying..... it's currently the only analog console in its price range without an analog automation option?

Thanks for listening....
Old 2 weeks ago
  #325
Rea
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Rea's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by crypticglobe View Post
So... forgive me if it's already been covered in this thread... I just didn't have time to wade through all 11 pages.

But... am I the only one that see's the lack of an option for analog automation as the glaring oversight here? I mean... make a Duality/AWS style moving fader and digital scribble strip option for this and THEN it really becomes the perfect console.

Now... I know some people are gonna say... well, the " 0DB button" solves the automation problem. Just use that and automate in your DAW. To that I would say an emphatic no. This throws the basics of quality gain staging and leveling out the window, not to mention the reduced bit depth/dynamics you get from your D/A converter when you lower the output volume coming from your DAW.

This is why so many people are underwhelmed with analog summing boxes. You have to get high quality audio at the PROPER signal level with all the dynamic range your hardware can reproduce into your mixer and THEN sum in the analog realm to get the true sonic benefits of analog summing.

This desk is AWESOME in so many ways!! Don't leave us hanging. Sure... sure... a few sigmas would mostly solve this... but moving analog faders and digital scribble strips are a better solution. Seems like you could easily add that as an option and STILL come in less than a Duality.

Just saying..... it's currently the only analog console in its price range without an analog automation option?

Thanks for listening....
Buy a used Sigma for 3k and you have automation... Are you ready with 50k now..? ;-)
Old 2 weeks ago
  #326
Here for the gear
 

Hi all. First post. Just purchased a 924 delta. Wouldn't a aws cover the previous posters needs? Sure and a sigma for more channels. Love the new ssl desk btw. But I'm a hybrid human. I had a 4k and I wished for it to be like a duality or aws w/ pt. I'm happy anyway. It's so fun to mix like this now.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #327
Rea
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Rea's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sslfetish View Post
Hi all. First post. Just purchased a 924 delta. Wouldn't a aws cover the previous posters needs? Sure and a sigma for more channels. Love the new ssl desk btw. But I'm a hybrid human. I had a 4k and I wished for it to be like a duality or aws w/ pt. I'm happy anyway. It's so fun to mix like this now.
I suggested sigma not for extra inputs, i suggested it as an automation device-- you strap it over the inserts, put the Origin(or any analog console) at unity and automate. use the console's faders for trims post automation moves.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #328
MGA
Gear Addict
 
MGA's Avatar
 

If the desk has insert points before the channel and or monitor faders, then you could hardware insert the 242EQ (and or dynamics etc..) into the DAW, insert the post DAW fader back into the desk at the insert point before the fader with unity setting and them you can automate without affecting the desk EQ and or dynamics but until we see a manual for the Origin, it remains to be seen if it can be done in this manor.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #329
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by raal View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MGA View Post
I vaguely recall and interview on you tube with Kevin Shirley discussing the VHD pres in regards to a Joe Bonamassa album he was working on. He mention that he could get the SSL VHD pres to sound similar to the Neve 80 series console pres he was using to record with but YMMV.
I also remember people speaking highly of the VHD pres, but my impression is these are different from any previous SSL product, including VHD.

SSL website:

"ORIGIN features a completely new microphone pre-amplifier design that inherits the clarity and purity of previous SSL mic pre's, with the added flexibility of switching character to a warm, harmonically-rich and driven tone that varies with gain. The ideal solution to 'perfect' digital system and hybrid workflow.

PureDrive™ is a new discrete transistor mic-pre based around modern FET components. The result is an ultra-clean, ultra-low noise pre amp, that is fast and offers stunning resolution when in 'Pure' mode. Hit the switch and the 'Drive' circuit is engaged, adding gain dependent non-linear harmonic saturation."

Look forward to seeing/hearing what they're all about.
Fifty thousand dollar fuzz pedal.

Just kidding. I'm looking forward to checking this out at Namm. I think I ticked Jim off last year by harping on no Nucleus being in the ssl booth.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #330
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by MGA View Post
If the desk has insert points before the channel and or monitor faders, then you could hardware insert the 242EQ (and or dynamics etc..) into the DAW, insert the post DAW fader back into the desk at the insert point before the fader with unity setting and them you can automate without affecting the desk EQ and or dynamics but until we see a manual for the Origin, it remains to be seen if it can be done in this manor.
It also has direct outs on every channel, so you can always go back to DAW via the DOs - but if i had that console i'd probably use Sigma for automation. Once leaving the DAW, i'd try to stay OTB til the final print, but what you say could certainly work!

Last edited by raal; 2 weeks ago at 06:35 PM..
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