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How is Electronic Music Film Scoring Possible?
Old 6 days ago
  #1
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How is Electronic Music Film Scoring Possible?

Alright, film scorers. Clear something up for me. Keep in mind I am a complete newbie to music production and film scoring in general.

What's the basic process of creating a film score of electronic music? Electronic music DAW's, like FL, ableton, and bitwig, don't have the film scoring features that DP, logic, pro tools, or cubase have. But DAW's like Pro Tools and DP aren't known for having electronic music features.

So how is this paradox reconciled? Get by with Ableton even though it doesn't have optimal film features? Be sad you have to somehow make electronic music in Digital Performer instead of Ableton because you are technically doing a 'film score'?

Or is there a secret way to get 100% of the electronic music DAW functionality and 100% of the film scoring DAW functionality?
Old 6 days ago
  #2
I think you have a lot of reading and video tutorial watching to do.
There is a lot of competition to get into film scoring, it's unlikely you'd get much work just making dance style music alone, unless you are a hit artist known for that style.
Lots of film composers make 'electronic' style cues for film and tv, but they do it inside whatever daw they own. They often use hardware synths and modular.
It's not really about looping repetitive sequences in an Ableton Live way, it's about taking some of those influences and applying them to a film score scenario.

Also, a film cue is never finished until the final mix, so you will find yourself editing, rewriting and changing many of your pieces before they are finished.




Old 6 days ago
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
I think you have a lot of reading and video tutorial watching to do.
There is a lot of competition to get into film scoring, it's unlikely you'd get much work just making dance style music alone, unless you are a hit artist known for that style.
Lots of film composers make 'electronic' style cues for film and tv, but they do it inside whatever daw they own. They often use hardware synths and modular.
It's not really about looping repetitive sequences in an Ableton Live way, it's about taking some of those influences and applying them to a film score scenario.

Also, a film cue is never finished until the final mix, so you will find yourself editing, rewriting and changing many of your pieces before they are finished.




Ooops! Sorry. I was unclear as to the purpose of what I was asking.

I wasn't trying to ask how I can be a film scorer as an ableton beatmaker. I just wanted to know how professional film scorers handle electronic music, out of curiosity. Ableton is easier than DP for making electronic music. DP is better at scoring features. What do?!

Anyways, your line of, "Lots of film composers make 'electronic' style cues for film and tv, but they do it inside whatever daw they own. They often use hardware synths and modular," seems to answer my question from your perspective. So it seems your answer is "They use the film scoring DAW for electronics even if another DAW might have a more natural workflow for electronics."
Old 6 days ago
  #4
That's why I posted the videos.
There really is no 'film making daw' or 'electronic music daw'.
It's more about your attitude.
There are daws that are popular with film composers and other daws that are popular with electronic music makers.
Maybe pick something that both camps quite like - Like Logic or Cubase.
Old 6 days ago
  #5
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vanGhost's Avatar
 

...every daw is fine to do so....

don't worry....start exploring....

...well fruity loops won't do it, though....
and pro tools is more used for bringing ALLl audible elements of a movie together, not "just" the music...... end of the day....

but as long u can compose......which is, well, nothing but an endless journey of learning.....

and have some way to link running pictures along ur grid, linked in timecode references....u'll be fine....
and pretty much all daws can do so...

while logic is biggest bang for the buck...
Old 6 days ago
  #6
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Awesome. Thanks for your help, chrisso! I'm going to check out those vids. (-:
Old 6 days ago
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanGhost View Post
...every daw is fine to do so....

don't worry....start exploring....

...well fruity loops won't do it, though....
and pro tools is more used for bringing ALLl audible elements of a movie together, not "just" the music...... end of the day....

but as long u can compose......which is, well, nothing but an endless journey of learning.....

and have some way to link running pictures along ur grid, linked in timecode references....u'll be fine....
and pretty much all daws can do so...

while logic is biggest bang for the buck...
Thanks for your insight!
Old 5 days ago
  #8
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drBill's Avatar
Pick a DAW. Pick a Soft or Hardware synth. Make music. Personally, I'm doing in Pro Tools HDX as it's the best thing I've found, and allows me to be completely standardized with most of the other post production chain.
Old 5 days ago
  #9
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charlieclouser's Avatar
 

Simple. Use a primary DAW like Logic, Cubase, Performer, or Pro Tools that has scoring-oriented features, and then use Ableton / Reason as a ReWire slave behind your main DAW, or on a separate computer slaved to the main rig.

I've done it this way for almost 20 years now.

Started using ReWire to run Propellerheads ReBirth behind Logic and when Ableton came out I was all-in at version 1.0. I use Logic as a primary composing and mixing DAW, and run Ableton behind it as a ReWire slave. Then I can create complex tempo and time signature changes in Logic and Ableton follows right along, sample accurate. No sync settings, no clock settings - nothing. ReWire handles it all automatically. Tempo-matched loops in Ableton follow the complex tempo changes I create in Logic, and crazy stuff is possible when loops are set to "re-pitch" mode in Ableton while Logic is ramping up the tempo. It sounds mental, and all happens on one computer.

If your electro-music DAW can't be a ReWire slave then you'll have to run it on a separate computer (or possibly on the same computer) and slave it to the main rig via MIDI clock. However, this can be a pain, and you lose most of the amazing features of ReWire. I don't know if Bigwig or FL can be ReWire slaves - last time I used FL was decades ago and it was a train wreck but I'm sure it's better now.

I run three computers (ProTools, Logic+Ableton+Reason, VideoSlave) with an option to slave up a spare laptop and some iPads if needed, but that's overkill for most. Logic is the engine for composing and mixing in my world, and Ableton runs just fine behind it on most Macs. (I also have tons of hardware synths and other gear though.)
Old 5 days ago
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charlieclouser View Post
Simple. Use a primary DAW like Logic, Cubase, Performer, or Pro Tools that has scoring-oriented features, and then use Ableton / Reason as a ReWire slave behind your main DAW, or on a separate computer slaved to the main rig.

I've done it this way for almost 20 years now.

Started using ReWire to run Propellerheads ReBirth behind Logic and when Ableton came out I was all-in at version 1.0. I use Logic as a primary composing and mixing DAW, and run Ableton behind it as a ReWire slave. Then I can create complex tempo and time signature changes in Logic and Ableton follows right along, sample accurate. No sync settings, no clock settings - nothing. ReWire handles it all automatically. Tempo-matched loops in Ableton follow the complex tempo changes I create in Logic, and crazy stuff is possible when loops are set to "re-pitch" mode in Ableton while Logic is ramping up the tempo. It sounds mental, and all happens on one computer.

If your electro-music DAW can't be a ReWire slave then you'll have to run it on a separate computer (or possibly on the same computer) and slave it to the main rig via MIDI clock. However, this can be a pain, and you lose most of the amazing features of ReWire. I don't know if Bigwig or FL can be ReWire slaves - last time I used FL was decades ago and it was a train wreck but I'm sure it's better now.

I run three computers (ProTools, Logic+Ableton+Reason, VideoSlave) with an option to slave up a spare laptop and some iPads if needed, but that's overkill for most. Logic is the engine for composing and mixing in my world, and Ableton runs just fine behind it on most Macs. (I also have tons of hardware synths and other gear though.)
Thanks for the great info! The only problem is that Bitwig can't do ReWire, but I'm trying to figure out if I can do the same thing with JACK for bitwig and digital performer.
Old 5 days ago
  #11
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vanGhost's Avatar
 

...bitwig is doing great....but if u got ableton under ur hands already, there's no real need for it....
Old 4 days ago
  #12
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telecode's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErickCBass View Post
I wasn't trying to ask how I can be a film scorer as an ableton beatmaker. I just wanted to know how professional film scorers handle electronic music, out of curiosity. Ableton is easier than DP for making electronic music. DP is better at scoring features. What do?!
I think the DAW and technology doesn't matter as much as understanding how music works in film. I think those composers mentioned probably have a really good understanding of how to go about making music that fits a particular film narrative. for example, random character X is standing at a bus stop waiting for a bus and can't wait to visit character Y on the other side of town. Its a 30 sec scene and needs 30 secs of music that brings that charachters inner feelings across to the audience -- what kind of music can you come up with that brings that feeling across? People like Isham and Zimmer understand that intrinsically. I am not sure about Olafur. He's more of a new age type artist IMO. I would be very curious to hear what kind of music he would make for a Godzilla or Marvel comics blow-em-up type film.

I think Ableton and Max are more than capable of being used for film scoring. There are lots of really interesting things being done with them outside of the EDM beat step community. Check out some of the below.



Old 3 days ago
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by telecode View Post
I think the DAW and technology doesn't matter as much as understanding how music works in film. I think those composers mentioned probably have a really good understanding of how to go about making music that fits a particular film narrative. for example, random character X is standing at a bus stop waiting for a bus and can't wait to visit character Y on the other side of town. Its a 30 sec scene and needs 30 secs of music that brings that charachters inner feelings across to the audience -- what kind of music can you come up with that brings that feeling across? People like Isham and Zimmer understand that intrinsically. I am not sure about Olafur. He's more of a new age type artist IMO. I would be very curious to hear what kind of music he would make for a Godzilla or Marvel comics blow-em-up type film.

I think Ableton and Max are more than capable of being used for film scoring. There are lots of really interesting things being done with them outside of the EDM beat step community. Check out some of the below.



Wow! Thanks for all the great info and insight! I will check these videos out.
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