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Epidemic Sound and Production Music Trends
Old 1st December 2017
  #31
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
But, again, Epidemic was the only company that figured out how to make serious money from it.
I disagree... Epidemic didn't figure out anything. It fell in their lap because the CEOs knew each other and the CEO of Spotify needed to come up with some way of increasing their cashflow... Epidemic just happened to be convenient since they were already friends. Epidemic fell into that, they didn't figure it out. And now that it has stopped... in a year or two you will see Epidemic not talking about how much money they are making from spotify... because they aren't being added to the top of the playlists anymore.
Old 1st December 2017
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Etch-A-Sketch View Post
I disagree... Epidemic didn't figure out anything. It fell in their lap because the CEOs knew each other and the CEO of Spotify needed to come up with some way of increasing their cashflow... Epidemic just happened to be convenient since they were already friends. Epidemic fell into that, they didn't figure it out. And now that it has stopped... in a year or two you will see Epidemic not talking about how much money they are making from spotify... because they aren't being added to the top of the playlists anymore.
So, because the CEO's were friends, the deal doesn't count? Whenever Elon Music and Larry Page get together to do something, they didn't figure anything out either. I didn't hear anyone say Jon Platt doesn't know what he's doing when he brought his friends Jay Z and Beyonce over to W/C. That's just silly to make such an assertion. If Megatrax, or WCPM, or any other library can't figure out how to exploit their connections for gain, including core talent... well, that's just their own damn fault.
Old 1st December 2017
  #33
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BTW, I know this is all coming off as pretty contentious. I apologize. Just in a certain mood, I guess. Must be all this freaking track bouncing!
Old 2nd December 2017
  #34
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
So, because the CEO's were friends, the deal doesn't count? Whenever Elon Music and Larry Page get together to do something, they didn't figure anything out either. I didn't hear anyone say Jon Platt doesn't know what he's doing when he brought his friends Jay Z and Beyonce over to W/C. That's just silly to make such an assertion. If Megatrax, or WCPM, or any other library can't figure out how to exploit their connections for gain, including core talent... well, that's just their own damn fault.
I'm not saying it didn't happen. I'm not saying they didn't make money. All I'm saying is that the guys at Epidemic aren't the "geniuses" you are making them out to be because they didn't come up with the idea and they didn't seek it out. It fell into their laps and they took advantage of the opportunity that was presented to them.
Old 2nd July 2019
  #35
Old 2nd July 2019
  #36
Mrx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
But profitability remains unknown. I've been wrong before and it's possible they really have come up with the holy grail of library music but experience tells me that often things may look great on the surface it isn't necessarily so once you look a little closer. Call me cynical.
Old 2nd July 2019
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrx View Post
But profitability remains unknown. I've been wrong before and it's possible they really have come up with the holy grail of library music but experience tells me that often things may look great on the surface it isn't necessarily so once you look a little closer. Call me cynical.
Kinda like Amazon?
Old 2nd July 2019
  #38
Mrx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
Kinda like Amazon?
Exactly, they never did anything did they?
Old 3rd July 2019
  #39
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
the irony here is they are worth $370mil but don't even have $20mil in capital.

If they are borrowing $20mil, they probably aren't making that much in revenue every year and their profits must be small...

Audio Network was bringing in $30mil a year but was $50mil in debt and they sold for $215mil.

The other funny thing about a valuation is it's all just monopoly money until you actually have to find a buyer and then the reality of the market comes in. Just because they are valued at $370mil doesn't mean anyone will actually buy them for $370mil.

who knows, if they sell maybe they will sell for higher than that! Maybe lower. The fact that they are worth that much but still can't even pull together $20mil of their own money to move the company forward is one of those red flags investment articles always talk about.
Old 3rd July 2019
  #40
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
oh and then there is this too...

https://techcrunch.com/2014/05/19/ep...ound-series-a/

five years ago they were trying to raise money too. 5 years later they need even more money (4x's the money!).

So it definitely seems like they are operating at a deficit... Sounds a lot like Music Dealers.
Old 3rd July 2019
  #41
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These companies are super talented at raising money and putting out press releases with buzzwords like "valuation" "series A funding" "disruption" "capital raise" etc..
Old 3rd July 2019
  #42
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I would just say that very few companies with really aggressive growth strategies have a bunch of extra money laying around. Reaching out for money through investors or IPO is common and much smarter than incurring loan debt with all that infers. Finding equity investors willing to chip in to the tune of $20m is not easy, and those investors don't invest without pouring over the books. They are becoming partners, after all. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this, that's all I'm saying.
Old 3rd July 2019
  #43
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaEtMusica View Post
I would just say that very few companies with really aggressive growth strategies have a bunch of extra money laying around. Reaching out for money through investors or IPO is common and much smarter than incurring loan debt with all that infers. Finding equity investors willing to chip in to the tune of $20m is not easy, and those investors don't invest without pouring over the books. They are becoming partners, after all. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this, that's all I'm saying.
I've been burned by enough dot coms to know to dismiss this.

Our industry is the new dot com boom. To a person that has $3bil dollars, what's $5mil or $10mil or even $20mil.

Sure they look over the books... but they are selling the dream of what they want to try and achieve moreso than their ability thus far to be able to do it.

I'm very skeptical of a company who is supposedly worth $370mil, yet makes so little they need to raise $5mil and then another 5 years later they need another $10mil. If they got $100mil or $200mil in funding then that would actually be more reassuring to me. But $20mil for a $370mil company means they are Waaaaaayyyy over valued.

Hey, more power to them! If they can convince someone they are worth $370mil and they can also convince someone to give them $20mil... great!

But the saying "when it seems too good to be true, it usually means it isn't true" is echoing in my mind when reading about this.
Old 3rd July 2019
  #44
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I dismiss your dismissal, sir!

Good day, sir!

Last edited by VitaEtMusica; 5th July 2019 at 06:54 PM..
Old 3rd July 2019
  #45
Hell, most tech companies are overvalued.

Most lose money year after year and still get people to invest. Many tech companies that go public are not profitable. But the tech industry is one that defies most common sense rules of the business world. That is why many new companies are pivoting into the tech space.

Why label your company as a traditional business when you can label it as a tech company and get funding for years? A bank will not even fund many small businesses, but VCs will throw millions at tech-based ventures like no tomorrow. So the regular rules don’t always apply.
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