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Loudness of tracks of EDM producers like Hardwell,Showtek,David Guetta etc. Dynamics Processors (HW)
Old 31st July 2014
  #61
So why do you try then to achieve -2dBrms, when you can have an excellent result at -6dBrms or -8dBrms which is way more easy to achieve?

Even using all capslock shows only you're running for loudness
Old 31st July 2014
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deft_bonz View Post
So why do you try then to achieve -2dBrms, when you can have an excellent result at -6dBrms or -8dBrms which is way more easy to achieve?

Even using all capslock shows only you're running for loudness
LOUDNESS with CLARITY....STOP THIS PLZ
Old 31st July 2014
  #63
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Analogue Mastering's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsTHEONE View Post
NAIL IT WITH YOUR SKILLS BEFORE SOUNDCLOUD KILLS IT......sry for the delay
https://soundcloud.com/itstheone/premaster
Excuse me?!? Are you commander Keen now?
Old 31st July 2014
  #64
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kaboom75's Avatar
iTunes is clamping down on loudness wars so if you distribute on iTunes your over squashed mix will sound bad.
Old 31st July 2014
  #65
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsTHEONE View Post
LOUDNESS with CLARITY....STOP THIS PLZ
You're funny and you made my day.

BTW you already got my help, I mean HELP (you see, clear and loud hehhehheh)
Old 31st July 2014
  #66
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Analogue Mastering's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsTHEONE View Post
THIS IS NOT ABOUT LOUDNESS WAR AND I DON'T WANT TO ARGUE!!!
CHECK OUT THIS TRACK AND HELP ME MASTER
https://soundcloud.com/itstheone/premaster
http://we.tl/nE52onrqC1
6.7rms not much more in there without major distortion.
You need a different kick, thinner, tighter sidechained and you need to fix your percussion loops and cymbals some serious harshness in there. I've exagerated it a bit in the master, but it's near earpiercing and would hold the potential of your final track down if you wouldn't fix it in the mix.
also the timestretching thing going on in the build-up doesn't sound to clean either. what is that? Ableton?
overall not too bad, now compare this with what you call loud by just mixing it on a DJ deck, should not be too far off. You can probably get another dBFS RMS by fixing the mix further. go for a CLEAN sound, scrutinize every sound and sample and mix clean, the harshness edge you'll get when going to these levels anyway. so don't use any crushers or saturators or sausage fatners or what have you. The cleaner you go in, the louder they will come out.

Last tip, your mix is fine peaking near 0dBFS no need to send mixes at -10dBFS peak. It's all about headroom/dynamics/crest factor. not peak volume.
Old 31st July 2014
  #67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Analogue Mastering View Post
You're like this Dynam1ke guy.
i

Started with my questions about this subject December 2013 and now, let's say August 2014 I discovered most "secrets" heh July was by far the most interesting month in my learning process because I received some insights from artists (finally!). Absolutely not a bad word about the GS feedback in the months before though. Because, after all, that brought me in the right direction in the first place. Will update my thread when the time is right but I was done with some feedback and didn't want to go back to my older work each time (and yes, that work wasn't as good as I thought it was at that time).

To the TO:
There's a big difference between us. Your approach is totally wrong. Sorry to say so but you sound a bit ignorant and arrogant. I actually tried to learn something from all the feedback. And yes I went through all the 'hating' and I was definitely 'vulnerable' by uploading my work but I remained polite and tried to understand all replies. In one way or another. Example: one guy posted just 1 reply which I didn't like at all at that moment, but at the end, that reply was one of the most important ones. So my advice is: you need to respect all feedback and show others that you want to learn something from it. Then people will help you in the right direction like they did to me. And yes it takes a while because - I must agree to one of the comments - there isn't 1 solution. You need to go through the whole process. Over and over again. I'm still learning but I know now what I did wrong. And that's a big list I can tell you. So it takes time to repair everything and doing it right, from scratch, the next time.

To give you a start - and share my knowledge from the last months (why not) - here are some essential elements:
- clever arranging, writing, layering (also balancing sounds)
- DISTORTION, DISTORTION, DISTORTION (and saturation to warm up)
- sidechain compression, regular compression, parallel compression, grouping
- pay a lot attention to kick and bass behaviour and how they respond to eachother
- tame transients (with harmonic distortion for example) and filter the highs on synths
- remove muddyness in the 300-500 Hz area and harshness in the 3K area (Brainworx made a great tool with Refinement)
- concentrate on the mids instead but be aware of 'hollow/ringing' unwanted frequencies, notch them out with surgical eq
- less stereo (side information), more mono (mid) > mid / side processing, more mono is higher RMS
- panning and gentle widening (on single channels or groups), use the upside down Christmas tree image for spreading
- process your effects like reverb and delay with eq, (sidechain) compression and more if necessary
- use reference tracks all the time but bare in mind that they are already fully processed (in the production part, yours is still in progress)
- use a limiter on the output channel when producing and disable it (of course) when recording stems for mixing (repeat it in that stage, before the final mastering)
- use a frequency chart to find exact eq spots (combine ears with an analyzer as a 'studio room' compensation)
- gain staging (although some artists don't believe in this one because they don't bother that sounds go in red, as long as it isn't audible, well I disagree on that one, check the tuts from James Wiltshire)

Ending with this one > less is more, good luck!

Edit > listened to the track, Gold Skies remix participation?
Old 31st July 2014
  #68
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynamikemusic View Post
- gain staging (although some artists don't believe in this one because they don't bother that sounds go in red, as long as it isn't audible, well I disagree on that one, check the tuts from James Wiltshire)

This one is so much underrated. It helped me to gain better mixes, that got hotter (to clarify: I aim for -10 to -8 dBRMS) just with a little compression (1-2 dB GR), little tape saturation and limiting (2-3 dB GR) during the mastering process.
Old 31st July 2014
  #69
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Analogue Mastering's Avatar
Yes gainstaging really helps, if you are using plugins which are sensitive with their input volume and lack an input gain knob, if not using any gain sensitive plugins just ride a mix to conclude close to 0 dBFS on the mixbus
Old 31st July 2014
  #70
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Arksun's Avatar
When you're trying to push things super loud, the technical aspect literally dictates the musical aspect. ie, what sounds you use and the arrangement, thats a big part of it right there.

In many ways its a shame, not only does the loudness wars kill the sound quality, but also narrows the range of actual music you can make if you don't want it to be one giant distorted mess. We're living in the bombastic age, very stop-start, when the music is that loud, the sense of dynamics comes from literally stopping and starting the sounds, creating time-based dynamics rather than true continuous volume dynamics. I've always liked older style complex rich multi-layered mixes, which of course are the hardest to force loud.

I'd rather just turn up the volume knob on the playback device myself, its there for a reason.
Old 31st July 2014
  #71
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Analogue Mastering's Avatar
I fully agree Arksun, prefer the minimal, detroit and deephouse side myself, nu disco is a more musical genre too.
For me things went sour once the complextro hype started, but even before that there were genres like schranz and hardcore that where already OTT. The flavours change, but insane loudness has always been there ever since WAVES introduced the L1 but in parallel more loudness concious genres have developed too and i finished 2 beatport EP's that actually are -14rms dBFS yeahhhh so it's not all bad.
Old 31st July 2014
  #72
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Over and out!
Old 31st July 2014
  #73
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login's Avatar
The good part is that a generation wich loves this music will be deaf and no more will be produced
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