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MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface Audio Interfaces
Old 18th February 2016
  #2371
Lives for gear
Hey folks,

I'm probably being really dense, but had my first real big dig into the Monitor 8 with all my inputs and so forth last night, and I couldn't figure out how to set the pan on Aux Sends

I updated to the latest v1.2.4+622 firmware, and so far as I understand it support for pan on Aux Sends was added in v1.2.2+559

However on my setup the Aux Mixing tab does not seem to show any pan control, and I couldn't see anything on the main mixing panel near the Aux Sends either. (my mixer UI looks just like the manual for these screens)

What am I missing?
Old 18th February 2016
  #2372
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gollumsluvslave View Post
Hey folks,

I'm probably being really dense, but had my first real big dig into the Monitor 8 with all my inputs and so forth last night, and I couldn't figure out how to set the pan on Aux Sends

I updated to the latest v1.2.4+622 firmware, and so far as I understand it support for pan on Aux Sends was added in v1.2.2+559

However on my setup the Aux Mixing tab does not seem to show any pan control, and I couldn't see anything on the main mixing panel near the Aux Sends either. (my mixer UI looks just like the manual for these screens)

What am I missing?
Quote:
Originally Posted by GGPS View Post
There is a pan button in the aux master to activate it..

hope it helps :-)
Old 18th February 2016
  #2373
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by GGPS View Post
hope it helps :-)
Ahh! I'll get a look at that tonight, cheers!
Old 18th February 2016
  #2374
tft
Gear Nut
 

some more info on the auxsend pan feature:

first you need to have two auxchannels combined as a stereo auxchannel (otherwise pan makes no sense). in the top of the aux channels click on the blue dot to switch between stereo and mono.
in the screenshot below i have aux 3 and 4 combined.
then you can switch the pan button for the send on the left of the mixer, right beside the send controls, to make the pancontrol visible. for the monoaux sends it is visible but not active.

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/atta...1&d=1455831479
Attached Thumbnails
MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface-image.jpg  
Old 18th February 2016
  #2375
tft
Gear Nut
 

some more info to avoid confusion:
under "controls", legend and auxsend have to be active. also the needed aux channels have to be switched active under "mixer outputs".
you can also use the blue dots like seen in my screenshot inside the red circle, to combine mono auxchannels to stereo and vice versa.
Old 19th February 2016
  #2376
Gear Nut
 
Rafter Man's Avatar
Speaking of panning...

Assuming that "From Computer 1" and "From Computer 2" are the main channels out from your Mac/PC, and that you then route this into your "Mix In" channels to have the output come out of the "Main", "Aux", or the "From Computer Post fx" outputs into your monitors/headphones, should you be panning those From Computer channels? For example, on my Mac, From Computer 1 and From Computer 2 are my main audio outputs. So in order to control them in the mixer, I pan From Computer 1 hard left and From Computer 2 hard right, and then send them to the "Main" channel, which is then routed to my studio monitor analog outputs. Or if wanted From Computer 1 and From Computer 2 to go into a Groups channel or Aux channel, I would instead of panning From Computer 1 and From Computer 2, just pan the Groups or Aux sends hard left and hard right.

Is there a reason to not always do this? Could anybody explain why or why not? Sorry, i'm a little slow. I've searched all through the manual, the MOTU site, and this thread, and haven't been able for the life of me to find any kind of explanation or recommendation for that matter. When I listen to the difference, I can't tell for sure. The volume sounds a little lower when panned, but I can't tell if it's better or worse and would greatly appreciate hearing what somebody else thinks of this.
Old 20th February 2016
  #2377
Gear Maniac
Man this network stuff kills my brain...

Is it really not possible to update my AVB devices, without connecting them directly to my router over Ethernet? My devices are screwed into a rack with many cables surrounding it and I have no access to a router at my studio. It's such a pain in the ass to take the unit out of the rack, unplug all connections, take the unit home, where I can finally make the firmware update. And I have to repeat the whole thing each time a new firmware gets released, because my units are still plaged with bugs and I have hope for each update, that at least one of them gets fixed. Such a hustle...

Why can't I make an offline upgrade? Download the file on my mac, plug in the device with Thunderbolt or USB, select the file and then update? It says in the manual that this should be possible:

1. Download the firmware file.
2. Transfer the file to a computer with a network cable connection to your MOTU interface.
3. Launch the MOTU AVB Control web app on the computer, as usual.
4. Go to the Device tab.
5. Scroll down to the bottom and click "Update from File".
6. Locate the file on your hard drive and click OK to start the update.

But there is no "Update from File" button on the device tab! Why write that into the manual and then forget or remove the function? Please Motu give us an easier option to upgrade! Even allowing an ethernet connection between my macbook and the AVB-unit with which I could upgrade the firmware would be an improvement, because then at least I could make a mobile access point with my phone. But with the current system, I HAVE to move my unit each time I want to do an update...

If I'm missing something, please help me out, I would greatly appreciate it!
Old 20th February 2016
  #2378
Lives for gear
 
loujudson's Avatar
Do you have a laptop you can take to the studio? Should be really simple that way...
Old 21st February 2016
  #2379
Lives for gear
Spent a good day today getting properly to grips with the Mixer / Auxs etc setting up for band rehearsal next week; the proof will be in the pudding but so far the Monitor 8 sounds so good, and i've had no real issues as yet other than the learning curve.

Thanks to all who posted about the Aux Pans, mucho appreciated! 0

+ Headphone amps sound great, big step up from my Edirol and Behringers, and comparable with my Mytek Stereo 96 DAC on CD material which really makes me happy.

+ Mixer and DSP is great so far, EQ and compressor is usable, the leveler is pretty nice on drums. Even the reverb is not as bad as I was expecting for a bit of ambience, based on this thread

+ So far flawless in Cubase 8.5, but not really hammered it yet.

+ Aux mixing is great on my Galaxy Tab - my Galaxy s4 mini is a bit small but still works! Will be great the rest of the band can just bookmark their own aux mix and tweak their own mix! Before I had been doing that.

Minor annoyances - mostly UI / usability things (or user error possibly!!):-

- Pan controls - I don't like the dials - pan is most intuitive as a left to right slider IMO - maybe there is a touch related reason for the dial?

- The selections you make for what input channels etc you want to be visible do not seem to be retained on a new device - I sent up my main and aux monitors, disabled unused channels etc, saved presets on my main DAW PC browser; when I open my personal mixer page (Aux 1-2) on the PC it shows exactly how I would expect , but when I open the page from my Galaxy Tab, all the input and outputs are back to the default, and I needed to disable them all again - even re-applying presets did not seem to do anything here. A bit annoying but easy enough to work around - on subsequent opens of the personal page the settings seem to be retained.

On the whole so far I am very happy, it seems like it is going to do everything I wanted it to do; a nice bonus is I will be able to sell a fair bit of redundant studio kit that will more than offset the cost of the Monitor 8, which i think underlines it's bang for buck:- likely to sell

+ Mytek Stereo 96 DAC
+ Presonus Central Station and Remote
+ Behringer HA8000 Headphone Amp
+ TC M350 Reverb (this will depend, may keep it for delays... any chance of a simple echo on the mixer Mr Miller? )
Old 22nd February 2016
  #2380
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by loujudson View Post
Do you have a laptop you can take to the studio? Should be really simple that way...
Yes I have. But again, it's not possible to upgrade the firmware with the described offline method, since there is no "Update from file"-button. Or am I missing something?
Old 22nd February 2016
  #2381
tft
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kirky View Post
Yes I have. But again, it's not possible to upgrade the firmware with the described offline method, since there is no "Update from file"-button. Or am I missing something?
the update from file button is not visible when only connected via usb.
ethernet connection is reqired for this to work.

edit: just reread the description from the manual you posted.
it clearly says: 2. transfer the file to a computer with a networkconnection to your motu interface
this means a networkcable plugged in the networkport of the motu, connected to your computers networkport. you can leave the networkcable plugged in to the motu and stuff it in the rack. just take it out and connect to your computer when you need to update. or is your networkport already used for connection to another avb interface?
Old 23rd February 2016
  #2382
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by tft View Post
the update from file button is not visible when only connected via usb.
ethernet connection is reqired for this to work.

edit: just reread the description from the manual you posted.
it clearly says: 2. transfer the file to a computer with a networkconnection to your motu interface
this means a networkcable plugged in the networkport of the motu, connected to your computers networkport. you can leave the networkcable plugged in to the motu and stuff it in the rack. just take it out and connect to your computer when you need to update. or is your networkport already used for connection to another avb interface?
Unfortunately I can't even see the device in my Motu AVB Discovery app, when I connect it only with a network cable to my laptop. I guess that means my network connection isn't working properly...?
BTW: I'm on a macbook pro 2012 with osx 10.9.5 installed. I know that an ethernet connection that transfers audio from my macbook to the interface is only possible from 10.10 upwards. Could that be the problem? Or should a network connection that doesn't stream audio but only controls the web-app also be possible with osx 10.9?
Old 23rd February 2016
  #2383
tft
Gear Nut
 

it should absolutely be possible!
when you are connected via ethernetcable to your macbook, press the "id" button on the front of your motudevice and type that adress into safari.
this should bring up the web app directly in your browser.
wait a bit until you connected the devices, it needs a little time to handle out the network id.
Old 23rd February 2016
  #2384
Lives for gear
 

1248: Need some help

I would like to get a Cubase mix + direct monitoring with click to phones 2 (for the drummer) and without the click to phone 1.

In Cubase I made a cue mix with click and allocate it to output 3/4 and the main mix without the click to output 1/2.

How do I set the routing in the MOTU ? Somehow I need two different mixes (incl. "from Computer" + direct Monitoring) to phones one and two.
Old 23rd February 2016
  #2385
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicsound-2 View Post
1248: Need some help

I would like to get a Cubase mix + direct monitoring with click to phones 2 (for the drummer) and without the click to phone 1.

In Cubase I made a cue mix with click and allocate it to output 3/4 and the main mix without the click to output 1/2.

How do I set the routing in the MOTU ? Somehow I need two different mixes (incl. "from Computer" + direct Monitoring) to phones one and two.
It kind of depends on what preset / config you are using - e.g. I started of with 'Live Recording with Monitor Mixing'

This has
From Computer 1-2
From Computer 3-4
From Computer 5-6
From Computer 7-8

I've got the Monitor 8 so it might be a bit different, but in my Cubase project if I have stems going to different AVB outputs, then I just enable these in the aux mixing tab and raise the volume as I need. I also rename the inputs in the AVB Mixer - in your case I'd name the From Computer 1-2 to 'Cubase Mix', and From Computer 3-4 to 'Click Mix' or something.

Again this also assumes that the Aux Sends are routed to the Headphones (they are by default on Monitor 8)
Old 24th February 2016
  #2386
Lives for gear
 

thanks a lot. Really helpful.
I have totally overlooked the aux mixing tab
Old 25th February 2016
  #2387
Lives for gear
The band had our first rehearsal through the Monitor 8 last night, and I can say one word : WOW!

Our bassist said that it was 'unbelievably clear', and they were all blown away with being able tweak their own monitor mix on their phone; this in turn freed me up to concentrate on my own performance and mix as opposed to constantly tweaking levels.

Compared to my ALL my previous headphone setups when recording a dense mix (Edirol UA1000, behringer ha8000, Presonus Central Station, and most recently Mytek Stereo DAC 96), the Motu is ridiculously clear with an awesome sense of space, no sense of congestion, everything was clear and no congestion or masking at all.

The base this gives us as a band can only mean we will improve massively - even just last night my backing vocals improved tenfold from being able to really hear and not just concentrate on breathing and pitch, but even being able to clearly hear nuance and inflections that I would only normally hear in a pure recording setup. Even then I think with a cheap Superlux dynamic mic, the vocal sound was really really good.

Seriously impressed and massively happy with my purchase. MrMiller you guys knocked it out the park!!!
Old 25th February 2016
  #2388
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by tft View Post
when you are connected via ethernetcable to your macbook, press the "id" button on the front of your motudevice and type that adress into safari.
this should bring up the web app directly in your browser.
That doesn't work for me... When I type in the adress and press enter, the page just goes into an infinitely long loading mode.
Old 25th February 2016
  #2389
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by tft View Post
it should absolutely be possible!
when you are connected via ethernetcable to your macbook, press the "id" button on the front of your motudevice and type that adress into safari.
this should bring up the web app directly in your browser.
wait a bit until you connected the devices, it needs a little time to handle out the network id.
Ok I got it working. I don't understand a lot of this networking stuff but I'll try to explain what the problem was for if somebody else can't get it to work:

So a long time ago I had a project for which I used a raspberry pi. I used my thunderbolt-to-ethernet connector (I have a retina macbook pro with no network port) for the connection to the raspberry pi and I changed something in the network tab in the system settings of osx. Basically I now had to delete the old Thunderbolt-Ethernet service, with the configurations I used for the raspberry pi and set up a new one, with the IP address of the AVB device and the setting "Configure IPv4" set to using DHCP with manual address. Again, it can't explain why it works now, but it does
If somebody has similar problems, just try to fiddle around in the network settings of osx...
Old 25th February 2016
  #2390
Lives for gear
 
loopy's Avatar
 

MOTU Ultralite AVB gets "No ASIO Driver Found" message with Reaper, Studio One. Works fine with Windows WASPI or Drivers and Foobar2000 as well as with system sounds.

This system (see my siggie) had an M-Audio Delta card installed in it. I uninstalled those drivers as well as removed the Delta directories and even the Delta.sys drivers from Windows/system32/drivers. Also physically removed the card as well as any hidden Delta entires in Device Manager.

Rebooted.

No sign of Delta anywhere. Onboard sound (Realtek) is disabled.

Install latest MOTU AVB software from the web site.
Plug in Ultralite AVB
It's recognized and shows up in the Web Mixer application.
Update AVB Ultraite with latest firmware.
Checked Control Panel--> Sound Devices and it's the default device and no other sound devices show up.

Start up Reaper or Studio One and I get the "No ASIO device/driver Found" message. Reaper will work if I select WASPI or Waveout or one of the other selections, I forget which one.
Point is I see the AVB but can't select an ASIO driver.

Studio One is even worse, it won't even use the device at all.

I can change Buffer settings via the MOTU Audio program however, and this might be a clue, when I start up that other MOTU audio program (name escapes me?) which allows you to run a spectogram, audio analysis etc it freezes the second I select anything.

I have scanned the registry and removed any entry with Maudio in it.
I've also removed any entry with MOTU in it, rebooted and re-installed with the same problems.

The MOTUDIscovery service is running and like I said the web mixer works fine.

As a test I installed the same unit on my laptop and it installed and worked perfectly so it's fine.

Something must be lingering around that is causing a conflict.

Any ideas?

Last edited by loopy; 25th February 2016 at 07:18 PM..
Old 25th February 2016
  #2391
Lives for gear
 

How does the monitor 8 sound
Old 25th February 2016
  #2392
Sorry I haven't been more involved recently. I've been deep in engineering land and there's a lot more dev work ahead still. As such, I need to focus on that for the time being. I've asked one of my colleagues, bmyr, to help out rather than leave you hanging. He's awesome and super knowledgeable and will be able to be much more responsive than I've been the past few months. I'll still be lurking and chime in when I get a chance! The new firmware we showed at NAMM is coming along beautifully and we can't wait to get it into your hands and boxes soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kirky View Post
Ok I got it working. I don't understand a lot of this networking stuff but I'll try to explain what the problem was for if somebody else can't get it to work:

So a long time ago I had a project for which I used a raspberry pi. I used my thunderbolt-to-ethernet connector (I have a retina macbook pro with no network port) for the connection to the raspberry pi and I changed something in the network tab in the system settings of osx. Basically I now had to delete the old Thunderbolt-Ethernet service, with the configurations I used for the raspberry pi and set up a new one, with the IP address of the AVB device and the setting "Configure IPv4" set to using DHCP with manual address. Again, it can't explain why it works now, but it does
If somebody has similar problems, just try to fiddle around in the network settings of osx...
Glad to hear you figured it out! Yeah, things can get complicated with networking if you've changed the configuration on your network card in such a way that the two devices ignore each other. DHCP without a manual address (the default) should be fine. That means it will wait for a DHCP server (typically your router) to assign it an IP address or assign itself one automatically if there's no DHCP server.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gollumsluvslave View Post
- The selections you make for what input channels etc you want to be visible do not seem to be retained on a new device - I sent up my main and aux monitors, disabled unused channels etc, saved presets on my main DAW PC browser; when I open my personal mixer page (Aux 1-2) on the PC it shows exactly how I would expect , but when I open the page from my Galaxy Tab, all the input and outputs are back to the default, and I needed to disable them all again - even re-applying presets did not seem to do anything here. A bit annoying but easy enough to work around - on subsequent opens of the personal page the settings seem to be retained.
This is intentional, actually. The web app saves its view settings in the browser, not on the interface itself. That means you can have multiple users viewing things independently. Or your tablet will recall its last view settings rather than your computer's, as you likely will use the two devices for different purposes. As of now, there's no way to have two devices "mirror" each other's views automatically.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gollumsluvslave View Post
Seriously impressed and massively happy with my purchase. MrMiller you guys knocked it out the park!!!
Awesome—happy music making!
Old 25th February 2016
  #2393
I appreciate MOTU's involvement with this forum.
I'm in the process of replacing a PCI-424 system with a 16A, on a Westmere Mac Pro (2x6 3.46GHz) using USB. I understand that it's currently per-spec that To/From Computer channel names are communicated to DAW software only when connected via Thunderbolt. As a feature request, it would be very useful if this worked via USB as well. If I understand correctly, previous MOTU interfaces (e.g. 896 Hybrid) did support channel names when connected via USB; at least, I found no caveats about this in those products' manuals. I'm using DP, and understand use of Bundles including the ability to load them into existing projects, but it would still be preferable to have the hardware channel names for reference when making (and checking) I/O Bundle assignments.
Old 25th February 2016
  #2394
Here for the gear
As mrmiller stated, I’m Brian, and I’ll be checking in on this thread, offering any advice or assistance you guys may need. Feel free to send any specific questions my way. Looking forward to hearing about all your cool plans for this gear!

Loopy: I’d definitely like to help you get this sorted out. I just sent you a PM with a few questions to get a little more info.

Give a shout if you need anything, everybody!
Old 28th February 2016
  #2395
Lives for gear
 
Cornvalley's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmyr View Post
As mrmiller stated, I’m Brian, and I’ll be checking in on this thread, offering any advice or assistance you guys may need. Feel free to send any specific questions my way. Looking forward to hearing about all your cool plans for this gear!

Loopy: I’d definitely like to help you get this sorted out. I just sent you a PM with a few questions to get a little more info.

Give a shout if you need anything, everybody!

Hi Brian,
Yes, I'd like to know something that I've brought a few times now and only Magic Dave at Motunation gave it a passing 'we'll look into it' comment.

What about a software update to give these AVB interfaces a Talkback functionality?
Using a keystroke as a DIM function and open up a Talkback channel doesn't seem like a big hurdle.

Any interest going in that area?
Thanks
Old 2nd March 2016
  #2396
Here for the gear
Re: Talkback

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cornvalley View Post
What about a software update to give these AVB interfaces a Talkback functionality?
Using a keystroke as a DIM function and open up a Talkback channel doesn't seem like a big hurdle.
Talkback is definitely something we’re looking into adding in an upcoming update. I'm sorry if we came across as dodgy on the subject for any reason. mrmiller submitted a feature request on your behalf a while back and it's been on our to-do list. For now, here’s a potential workaround that was mentioned earlier in this thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
To get something like a talkback setup, you could create an aux mix for the performer and route your analog mic signal to that but keep it muted unless you were talking back. You could make this more streamlined by sending an OSC message to the interface. Create a small TouchOSC or Osculator patch with a single button that you hold for talkback. Or create an Osculator patch that takes MIDI or your footswitch and sends an OSC message to the box.
Thanks for your patience. We really appreciate the feedback!
Old 2nd March 2016
  #2397
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Awesome—happy music making!
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmyr View Post
Thanks for your patience. We really appreciate the feedback!
And thanks for the great work guys!

Any headway on lowering latency? We just did a thread here where Motu AVB interface owners posted RTL times, with USB and Thunderbolt very close to each other (maybe t-bolt edging out a msec or so) but the real point is they really pale by comparison to other manufacturers, say for instance RME and Lynx. There is an endless thread here with RTL's posted and our interfaces would wind up somewhere close to the bottom of that list in terms of RTL.

I remember you saying [mrmiller] that you guys were really trying hard to up the channel count over USB a while ago. I think I speak for many others that use VSTi's, monitoring plugins, amp sims, etc that a lowering of latency would be a much more welcomed addition.
Old 2nd March 2016
  #2398
Lives for gear
 
Cornvalley's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmyr View Post
Talkback is definitely something we’re looking into adding in an upcoming update.
Thanks for your patience. We really appreciate the feedback!
Very good! Thanks. Looking forward to it.
Old 2nd March 2016
  #2399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Mulcahy View Post
And thanks for the great work guys!

Any headway on lowering latency? We just did a thread here where Motu AVB interface owners posted RTL times, with USB and Thunderbolt very close to each other (maybe t-bolt edging out a msec or so) but the real point is they really pale by comparison to other manufacturers, say for instance RME and Lynx. There is an endless thread here with RTL's posted and our interfaces would wind up somewhere close to the bottom of that list in terms of RTL.

I remember you saying [mrmiller] that you guys were really trying hard to up the channel count over USB a while ago. I think I speak for many others that use VSTi's, monitoring plugins, amp sims, etc that a lowering of latency would be a much more welcomed addition.
As someone who uses a 16A on a Mac Pro via USB, I will speak for those who would indeed continue to value higher channel counts. As well as channel names. :-)

I'm guessing that you're referring to this thread: New Motu AVB Series Users (1248, 16a, 8m etc) What's Your Latency?
Old 2nd March 2016
  #2400
Lives for gear
 
loopy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Mulcahy View Post
And thanks for the great work guys!

Any headway on lowering latency? We just did a thread here where Motu AVB interface owners posted RTL times, with USB and Thunderbolt very close to each other (maybe t-bolt edging out a msec or so) but the real point is they really pale by comparison to other manufacturers, say for instance RME and Lynx. There is an endless thread here with RTL's posted and our interfaces would wind up somewhere close to the bottom of that list in terms of RTL.

I remember you saying [mrmiller] that you guys were really trying hard to up the channel count over USB a while ago. I think I speak for many others that use VSTi's, monitoring plugins, amp sims, etc that a lowering of latency would be a much more welcomed addition.
I'm getting great latency with my MOTU Ultralite AVB over USB. I just posted some screen shots from Oblique over in the MOTU What's Your Latency Thread here:

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/11743822-post20.html

With Studio One v3.2 and Reaper at 44.1k 64 Samples I'm at 4.9msec total RTL.
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