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MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface Audio Interfaces
Old 9th February 2016
  #2341
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by GGPS View Post
Hey guys, one question:

When you talk about a talkback solution for the avb devices, what do you think of ?

now, with the mixer you can already "build" a talkback, like the analog way: take 1 channel of the mixer with a talkback microphone, route it to the defined headphone outs, but not to the main mix. The mute button will act as talkback button - or am I wrong?

I liked the footswitch plug on the 828 but the 1248 does not have one.

How would a perfect talkback solution look like, as you wish it from motu?
What would be the difference to above suggested way?

As the digital way eat up one input, I've decided to do the talkback after the headphone signals go out of my 1248 as analog signal. it is better for me, so I don't have to "waste" 1 channel for talkback
Thanks.
My ideal solution would be a new box that sits on my desk with 2 mic/line/instr inputs and 2 or 3 pairs of outputs + a stereo headphone. Mono/Dim/Mute/Vol/talkback/monitor switching controls on the front or top. top quality DAC, mid grade ADC is fine. Basically I want a small control room box that can talk AVB to the live room/stage where you have the bigger rack mount gear. It could also serve double purpose as a small mobile rig. Right now I have a monitor8 next to my desk as it was closest to fitting the bill, but it doesn't have everything, and I'll never use all those headphone outputs - I'd rather get this new small device and repurpose the monitor8 to be closer to the talent.
Old 9th February 2016
  #2342
Here for the gear
 

Hey guys, just wondering about the midi i/o on the ultralite - will this work over the network? for example, i have an ultralite and my 1248 going into an AVB switch, with only the 1248 connected to my mac via thunderbolt. indication from the user guide (pages 22 and 40) is no but thought I'd ask anyway....is it even possible to do?
Old 9th February 2016
  #2343
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jiker View Post
My ideal solution would be a new box that sits on my desk with 2 mic/line/instr inputs and 2 or 3 pairs of outputs + a stereo headphone. Mono/Dim/Mute/Vol/talkback/monitor switching controls on the front or top. top quality DAC, mid grade ADC is fine. Basically I want a small control room box that can talk AVB to the live room/stage where you have the bigger rack mount gear. It could also serve double purpose as a small mobile rig. Right now I have a monitor8 next to my desk as it was closest to fitting the bill, but it doesn't have everything, and I'll never use all those headphone outputs - I'd rather get this new small device and repurpose the monitor8 to be closer to the talent.
maybe with all of this incorporated into a control surface?!
Old 9th February 2016
  #2344
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Cornvalley's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiker View Post
My ideal solution would be a new box that sits on my desk with 2 mic/line/instr inputs and 2 or 3 pairs of outputs + a stereo headphone. Mono/Dim/Mute/Vol/talkback/monitor switching controls on the front or top. top quality DAC, mid grade ADC is fine. Basically I want a small control room box that can talk AVB to the live room/stage where you have the bigger rack mount gear. It could also serve double purpose as a small mobile rig. Right now I have a monitor8 next to my desk as it was closest to fitting the bill, but it doesn't have everything, and I'll never use all those headphone outputs - I'd rather get this new small device and repurpose the monitor8 to be closer to the talent.
It's fun to dream but it would be more constructive to find a way to implement talkback with what already exists with current hardware.
Old 10th February 2016
  #2345
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Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnno View Post
maybe with all of this incorporated into a control surface?!
can we expect that MOTU will launch a controller or digital mixer for the AVB's ?
Of course including a monitor section
Old 10th February 2016
  #2346
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Cornvalley's Avatar
No we can't, unfortunately.
Old 10th February 2016
  #2347
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicsound-2 View Post
can we expect that MOTU will launch a controller or digital mixer for the AVB's ?
Of course including a monitor section
We can't expect, but if enough people ask then they at least have to consider it, right?!
Old 10th February 2016
  #2348
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Cornvalley's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnno View Post
We can't expect, but if enough people ask then they at least have to consider it, right?!
We that use Digital Performer have been clamoring for a midi control surface for years and years over at Motunation. Motu is not about to jump into a control room monitoring box or a control surface with bells and whistles. That is why I keep my request software based. We could have a talkback solution with existing hardware if they would write it up. Even that is hard to get an answer on
Old 10th February 2016
  #2349
Lives for gear
Finally picked up the Monitor 8 yesterday!! . Whilst my Edirol UA1000 setup has done me great, the Monitor 8 has a really compelling feature set for our band reherasals / iem setup and recording, plus with AVB I can expand as I go.

Only thing that's been giving me cause for concern is the HTTPServer stuff losing connectivity etc - how are people finding the mixer software these days?
Old 10th February 2016
  #2350
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gollumsluvslave View Post
Finally picked up the Monitor 8 yesterday!! . Whilst my Edirol UA1000 setup has done me great, the Monitor 8 has a really compelling feature set for our band reherasals / iem setup and recording, plus with AVB I can expand as I go.

Only thing that's been giving me cause for concern is the HTTPServer stuff losing connectivity etc - how are people finding the mixer software these days?
Connectivity over ethernet has been perfect for me, I only have the web interface fail over usb
Old 10th February 2016
  #2351
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnno View Post
Hey guys, just wondering about the midi i/o on the ultralite - will this work over the network? for example, i have an ultralite and my 1248 going into an AVB switch, with only the 1248 connected to my mac via thunderbolt. indication from the user guide (pages 22 and 40) is no but thought I'd ask anyway....is it even possible to do?
With the Ultrlite AVB and the 1248 you can connect them directly and run the 1248 off to the Mac via t-bolt.
Old 10th February 2016
  #2352
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by magoostus View Post
Connectivity over ethernet has been perfect for me, I only have the web interface fail over usb
Thanks for that, good to know.

I'm was gravitating to just making an ethernet connection for the web app in any case, just wanted to double check which was more stable - as I'm on Windows I have to use USB for the interface, I *think* you can have a hard ethernet connection just for the web app at the same time, but not sure which is the most stable!

Will just have to suck it and see I guess!
Old 11th February 2016
  #2353
Gear Nut
 
Rafter Man's Avatar
Monitors via Digital Outputs, Adding 2nd 16A vs Alternative

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicsound-2 View Post
Question:

Can I use the SPDIF in- and outputs of the 1248 to connect it with the AES/EBU in- and outputs of my lavry blue (assuming that they have still better converters ?!).
I kind of had a similar question about my 16A through thunderbolt. I'm just about out of analog outputs and was thinking about using the 16A's optical out to connect into my studio monitors (JBL LSR4328P) AES/EBU input so I could free up 2 more analog outs for my growing outboard gear collection, but the effectiveness of this from every bit of info I could readily find hasn't quite convinced me as to how effective or wise this may be. Would anybody who has had a similar experience or knows about this better than myself have a recommendation they could possibly share?

Also, regardless of whether I go that route or not, I'm readily looking into the possibility of expanding my analog in/out capabilities, but cannot easily figure out any alternative that's clearly head and shoulders above just adding another 16A connected via the ethernet cable. The limited options in gear strictly for monitoring could easily open up 6 much needed analog outputs that very well might be all i'd need, and i've looked into summing mixers as another possibility, but it doesn't appear to be as reliable a solution as just adding the 2nd 16A or another AVB interface, and be done with it.

I know there's quite a few posters here that work with a 2nd AVB interface and was wondering if they were driven to going that route for the same reasons i'm considering it. An extra 16A might be somewhat overkill, but if having that compatibility function is as good a reason as any to do that, then I guess there's worse things I can do than give that money to the Mark Of The Unicorn, who've at least suited my needs over this past year rather well. Just figured i'd ask after trying to find a good enough answer the past few days.
Old 11th February 2016
  #2354
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Hokut's Avatar
 

Did MOTU increase the price of the AVB units in the last couple of months? About £100 more?
Old 11th February 2016
  #2355
AVB guitar tuner?

I'm getting ready to transition from a PCI-424 setup to a 16A. I use CueMix's tuner all the time - it's a really great feature! I notice that there's now the "MOTU Audio Tools" application for use with the AVB interfaces, with an oscilloscope, FFT display, etc., but looking through the docs I didn't see a tuner. Is that correct, or have I missed it somehow? Is a tuner provided somewhere else (in the web app, for instance)? This isn't a deal-breaker for me - I have other tuners in various formats, hardware, software, iOS - but I'd miss the old CueMix tuner if it's gone.
Old 11th February 2016
  #2356
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rafter Man View Post
...
I know there's quite a few posters here that work with a 2nd AVB interface and was wondering if they were driven to going that route for the same reasons i'm considering it. An extra 16A might be somewhat overkill, but if having that compatibility function is as good a reason as any to do that, then I guess there's worse things I can do than give that money to the Mark Of The Unicorn, who've at least suited my needs over this past year rather well. Just figured i'd ask after trying to find a good enough answer the past few days.
Been running 2 16As for about a year. It's very slick. Any problems I've had have not had to do w/having two units or their connection. As I mentioned in an earlier post, having extra outs makes routing to outboard with the AVB system a breeze.
Old 11th February 2016
  #2357
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Hokut's Avatar
 

Just ordered a 1248 and a 16A
Hopefully the setup with my old MAC Pro will go well
Old 12th February 2016
  #2358
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Monkey Man's Avatar
 

Woohoo Hokut! Hopefully it goes well for you.

Now, for Mr. Miller...

Sorry to bother you, but two critical questions remain for me now, mate:

Firstly
I’ve asked this before, but not in the context of an ethernet hookup to the ‘puter:
Am I able to switch my synths (and therefore associated interfaces) on and off on an as-needed basis? I seem to recall your saying that I could when I was asking about the USB hookup, and that it’d take maybe 30 or 40 seconds to update or whatever, which would’ve been tolerable. Now that I’d like to run 4 of ‘em (interfaces), this capability is more important than ever to me both in terms of power consumption and the risk of over heating my room! Yes, I know… no aircon.

Secondly
I have two issues with the Streamware NIC-1 card by Echo Digital Audio that you mentioned twice to me, Mr Miller:

1) It appears to have a 64I/O channel limit. That’s 22 short of the minimum I’ll require and 64 short of the AVB-via-ethernet limit.
2) It costs $800 U$D. Hardly the $50 “experiment” you referred to.

I found a CM-1/CM-2-format card (don’t even know what it is, but it ain’t PCI), the Pivitec CMx64io-AVB Network Card, but it too has a limit of 64 channels.

The only cards I was able to “find” online, therefore, had 64-channel limits. Obviously I researched the Presto Gigabit Pro PCIe Revision B again, but I can find no mention of a channel limit anywhere on the Sonnet site.

So, after chasing my tail for way too long, it dawned on me that I should’ve just come straight to you, assuming that having stated that this route is an option, MOTU would surely know the score and be able to recommend a card that’s guaranteed to be able to stream the full spec of 128 channels. Yes, I remember well your pointing me to the user’s post where he shared his card stats and positive experience, but IIRC the channel count he ran was only a fraction of what I’ll require and it certainly wouldn’t have exposed a possible 64-channel constraint. For the record, my interfaces will require 86 channels, but I’d like to think I’ll be running 42 channels short of what the card is capable of. That’d, after all, feel a whole lot better than teetering on the edge with 64 chans over USB, at least for me.

Succinctly put, will the card you recommend allow for 128 channels at 44-192kHz and support ”random” on-and-off switching of my interfaces?

I didn’t want you to think I was blindly and lazily asking you questions, Mr. Miller; I tried to show some initiative, but alas, it was all for nought! LOL

Eagerly awaiting the score… please mate…

PS: Paid final instalment on the 64-chan system this week; all that’s required now is clarification from you on the aforementioned issues, and I’ll add another 24Ai to the order.
Old 13th February 2016
  #2359
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post

The only cards I was able to “find” online, therefore, had 64-channel limits. Obviously I researched the Presto Gigabit Pro PCIe Revision B again, but I can find no mention of a channel limit anywhere on the Sonnet site.

Succinctly put, will the card you recommend allow for 128 channels at 44-192kHz and support ”random” on-and-off switching of my interfaces?
The chipset of the Presto Gigabit Pro is identical to the chipset that Apple uses in systems that support 'onboard' AVB. It uses the same native OSX driver.

The maximum channel streaming capacity is determined by 2 major items:
1) Max available bandwidth, which boils down more or less to: doubling the sample-rate, halves the channel capacity. This not entirely true because of the overhead of the amount of channels packaged in a stream. (8 channels in a stream is more efficient than 8 individual 1 channel streams).
2) how efficient the driver is and how powerful the system is.

As a general rule you can use the table that Motu lists for their 1Gb device ports of a 16A/1248. You can find that in the manuals.

I am running 64-channels @ 192kHz successfully on a 5.1 Mac-Pro with the Presto-card. Higher channel counts at lower sample-rates should be no problem.
If you were planning to buy the Streamware card, you can now buy the Presto-card and still buy an airco...
Old 13th February 2016
  #2360
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post
Woohoo Hokut! Hopefully it goes well for you.

Now, for Mr. Miller...

Sorry to bother you, but two critical questions remain for me now, mate:

Firstly
I’ve asked this before, but not in the context of an ethernet hookup to the ‘puter:
Am I able to switch my synths (and therefore associated interfaces) on and off on an as-needed basis? I seem to recall your saying that I could when I was asking about the USB hookup, and that it’d take maybe 30 or 40 seconds to update or whatever, which would’ve been tolerable. Now that I’d like to run 4 of ‘em (interfaces), this capability is more important than ever to me both in terms of power consumption and the risk of over heating my room! Yes, I know… no aircon.

Secondly
I have two issues with the Streamware NIC-1 card by Echo Digital Audio that you mentioned twice to me, Mr Miller:

1) It appears to have a 64I/O channel limit. That’s 22 short of the minimum I’ll require and 64 short of the AVB-via-ethernet limit.
2) It costs $800 U$D. Hardly the $50 “experiment” you referred to.

I found a CM-1/CM-2-format card (don’t even know what it is, but it ain’t PCI), the Pivitec CMx64io-AVB Network Card, but it too has a limit of 64 channels.

The only cards I was able to “find” online, therefore, had 64-channel limits. Obviously I researched the Presto Gigabit Pro PCIe Revision B again, but I can find no mention of a channel limit anywhere on the Sonnet site.

So, after chasing my tail for way too long, it dawned on me that I should’ve just come straight to you, assuming that having stated that this route is an option, MOTU would surely know the score and be able to recommend a card that’s guaranteed to be able to stream the full spec of 128 channels. Yes, I remember well your pointing me to the user’s post where he shared his card stats and positive experience, but IIRC the channel count he ran was only a fraction of what I’ll require and it certainly wouldn’t have exposed a possible 64-channel constraint. For the record, my interfaces will require 86 channels, but I’d like to think I’ll be running 42 channels short of what the card is capable of. That’d, after all, feel a whole lot better than teetering on the edge with 64 chans over USB, at least for me.

Succinctly put, will the card you recommend allow for 128 channels at 44-192kHz and support ”random” on-and-off switching of my interfaces?

I didn’t want you to think I was blindly and lazily asking you questions, Mr. Miller; I tried to show some initiative, but alas, it was all for nought! LOL

Eagerly awaiting the score… please mate…

PS: Paid final instalment on the 64-chan system this week; all that’s required now is clarification from you on the aforementioned issues, and I’ll add another 24Ai to the order.
ha, ya the streamware NIC is $800 lol, sorry, ill just buy a MOTU Ultralite AVB, ha ha!
Old 13th February 2016
  #2361
Lives for gear
 
Monkey Man's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by balijon View Post
The chipset of the Presto Gigabit Pro is identical to the chipset that Apple uses in systems that support 'onboard' AVB. It uses the same native OSX driver.

The maximum channel streaming capacity is determined by 2 major items:
1) Max available bandwidth, which boils down more or less to: doubling the sample-rate, halves the channel capacity. This not entirely true because of the overhead of the amount of channels packaged in a stream. (8 channels in a stream is more efficient than 8 individual 1 channel streams).
2) how efficient the driver is and how powerful the system is.

As a general rule you can use the table that Motu lists for their 1Gb device ports of a 16A/1248. You can find that in the manuals.

I am running 64-channels @ 192kHz successfully on a 5.1 Mac-Pro with the Presto-card. Higher channel counts at lower sample-rates should be no problem.
If you were planning to buy the Streamware card, you can now buy the Presto-card and still buy an airco...
Dude, you are the man! Thank you so very, very much mate!

Translating your figures, you'd expect 128 channels at 96kHz to be no problem for a 12-core (upgraded CPUs) 2012 Mac. Not that I'd have a clue, but given your double-and-half approximation, it should all be good to go. Awesome!

Only need to confirm the "hot-switching" thing now.

Thank you again. I just can't thank you enough man!
Nicky

Quote:
Originally Posted by magoostus View Post
ha, ya the streamware NIC is $800 lol, sorry, ill just buy a MOTU Ultralite AVB, ha ha!
Ha! Too funny, magoostus!
Old 13th February 2016
  #2362
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loopy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by magoostus View Post
ha, ya the streamware NIC is $800 lol, sorry, ill just buy a MOTU Ultralite AVB, ha ha!
Funny stuff !
Old 13th February 2016
  #2363
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gradivus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by musicsound-2 View Post
can we expect that MOTU will launch a controller or digital mixer for the AVB's ?
Of course including a monitor section
I wouldn't, nor would I want it.

While I use DP and have for a long time, I would not want to have MOTU make a controller. I would expect it to be too cheap, just like the other toy controllers being pushed at us these days. Expensive enough to look flashy, flimsy enough to be sub-par and lack the features we need in a piece of pro gear.

I may be 100% wrong, but I'm 99% confident this would be the case.

I'd rather see them come out with a top of the line interface with various I/O options that the current top interfaces offer, preferably some modular approach like a Prism ADA-8XA, or Burl Mothership, Lynx (at least has a card slot and dsub), and the rest, so I could choose what I wanted and forgo their preamps.

Short of that I'll just take DP and their solid MIDI interfaces which have served me well.
Old 13th February 2016
  #2364
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cornvalley View Post
Hi mrmiller, why can't we get a talkback solution for the AVB line? That would make this hardware a complete system.
And something like this perhaps?

https://uk.focusrite.com/ethernet-au...ces/rednet-am2

...and maybe a 1u AVB Switch with POE facilities to power them

Last edited by digital_io; 14th February 2016 at 12:24 AM..
Old 13th February 2016
  #2365
is it possible in an update we will see addition of the volume controls on mac being available on USB and not just thunderbolt?

cheers

Wiz
Old 14th February 2016
  #2366
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Monkey Man's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiz_Oz View Post
is it possible in an update we will see addition of the volume controls on mac being available on USB and not just thunderbolt?

cheers

Wiz
Yeah, and on ethernet-only connections too, Wiz.
Old 15th February 2016
  #2367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robby in WA View Post
My group just put an album recorded and mixed entirely on MOTU 16As and DP (except the song Super State done 2408 mkIIIs).


iTunes

Spotify

BandCamp

Congratulations !
Great Music and great sound. Which mics and mic preamps (not MOTU I guess) did you use ?
Old 15th February 2016
  #2368
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hokut View Post
Did MOTU increase the price of the AVB units in the last couple of months? About £100 more?
Yeah, i was looking at a Monitor 8 and in the last week or so it has gone up from £723 to £849 from one UK dealer :(
Old 15th February 2016
  #2369
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Hokut's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by digital_io View Post
Yeah, i was looking at a Monitor 8 and in the last week or so it has gone up from £723 to £849 from one UK dealer :(
Last week I had a quote from the same UK dealer I had a quote from maybe 6 or 8 months ago. Last week that same dealer was quoting me around £80+VAT more per unit compared to the quote he gave me 8 months ago. Still below the RRP of course but...

The dealer said MOTU increased the prices. (But who knows... )

I did some more looking around and another dealer gave me a better deal, still about £30 more than the best quote I had 8 months ago' but £30 more is better than £80 more per unit.

I bought something else as well, of course discounts you get depend on how much stuff/£-value you are ordering at the same time.
Old 15th February 2016
  #2370
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicsound-2 View Post
Congratulations !
Great Music and great sound. Which mics and mic preamps (not MOTU I guess) did you use ?

Thanks for checking it out - glad you like it

No pres on the 16As, so no MOTUs.

Tracked and mixed through a Toft ATB 24 v.3 (w/MOTU 16As)

Piano, Double Bass, and Drums were tracked live.

Kick - D112 -> WH FD312 (Wally Heider API 312)
Snare - 57 > WH FD312
Tom - EV N/D 468 -> Toft
F. Tom - ATM250 -> Toft
OHs - Coles 4038s -> UA 710
Room - Bock 195 -> UA 710
Bass DI - Avalon U5
Bass Mic - DPA 4099 -> Toft
Piano - 414s in M/S -> UA 710

Overdubs

Violin/Viola - 4038 -> UA 710
Vocals - Bock -> FD312
Vibes - 4038 -> UA 710
Mandolin - 4038 -> FD312
Cello - Bock -> UA710
Guitars - 57 & 4038 on amp. Bock 195 acoustic -> UA 710s
Rhodes - DI->U5 / Fender Twin -> 4038 -> 710

Attached a few pics of tracking and vid (shameless plug).

Sorry for the OT!





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