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MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface Audio Interfaces
Old 27th April 2015
  #1501
Lives for gear
 

Hows the ultralite avb sound without the fx
Old 27th April 2015
  #1502
Quote:
Originally Posted by scratch17 View Post
Anyone know if three stereo busses in the mixer can be combined to make a 5.1 output?
There are no surround channels in the mixer (only stereo and mono) but you can of course treat the channels as whatever output configuration you want. Live mixing in surround would be tricky, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ballantine View Post
I have some little problem with my 1248. Sometimes it doesn't emits any sound and I noticed that in the upper right of the display it shows 192 KHz.
If I go on the control panel and I change manually the sample rate to 44.1 it works again normally.
Other times it says the regular 44.1K but it doesn't sound either. Actually, this happens every time I walk away from my mac for few minutes... I think it could be something related with the power saving because if I work for hours without leaving my position never happens.

I tried with different Macs (MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, iMac) with USB connection and I always have the same problem.
Is this something related with USB connection?
Do you also have the ethernet connected? If so, try disconnecting that. It could be acquiring the interface as an AVB device and setting the sample rate behind your back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ballantine View Post
I can't use audio via Ethernet, right?
You can if you're running OS X 10.10 or higher on a Mac with a Thunderbolt port. These Macs support AVB directly on their network cards (and the Apple Thunderbolt-to-Ethernet dongles and Thunderbolt displays). As well, Core Audio has an AVB driver built-in. See MOTU.com - Using AVB Ethernet to connect to a Mac for more info.

Quote:
Originally Posted by patpatpat View Post
I have just bought the new Motu 1248 and the quick setup works properly except for «Interface + Mixing» where I receive a 404 code error. The 1248 is not existing! It is pluged via Thunderbolt. I've got all the latest drivers and update for MAC. I've tried via USB and I got the same error code. Somebody can help me please ? Thank'S
Huh--that's strange! Thanks for the report. We'll look into it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kirky View Post
Is anyone using 2 Motu AVB interfaces which are connected with each other per AVB? How's your experience?

I run a 16A connected with thunderbolt to my mac and the 16A is connected to a 8M per AVB. For me it's not stable at all. Sometimes it happens that the 8M stops sending over AVB. It just randomly stops sending from the 8M to the 16A but still works in the opposite directions. 10 minutes later it works again without me doing anything. Just pure randomness... Sometimes the 8M can't be found over AVB and I can't control it (even after restarting my setup over and over). Then there's the "8-bit" mode happening from time to time which I mentioned already in 2 post (someone else in thread had the same problem). Really frustrating. Is it just me or have others had similar experiences?

I'm running the latest drivers btw. Please Motu fix these problems before thinking about new features and crazy stuff to implement. We want these Interfaces to run in big venues and setups and at the moment they're not doing the job they're advertised to do.

Here's a recording of the "8-bit" mode. I played music in itunes, then sent it through AVB from the 16A to the 8M and back, and recorded it in Ableton. Every 2 minutes or so this high pitched squeal set in and stayed for about a minute.

Playing: AVB high pitched squeal.mp3 - picosong
Oof--sorry to hear things aren't working quite right. I'm going to follow up with you via PM and see if we can figure out the issue. Thanks for your patience!
Old 27th April 2015
  #1503
Here for the gear
 

I have no complaints about the sound quality of the Ultralite AVB without FX, but my purpose for it is for a live mixer with effects, and the Reverb is the only effect that bothers me. I just can't get it to sound nearly as good as the MK3 version. The sound quality of the Ultralite AVB is supposed to be improved, which it probably is, but the Reverb quality is definitely not as good as Mk3.

Ultralite AVB is supposed to have better mic pres, better analog sound, better dynamic range, etc. I was excited for all that improvement. If you aren't really using the reverb then you will probably be happy. For my particular use as a live mixer with effects, the reverb has really been a disappointment. I will be sticking with the Ultralite MK3 hybrid and 828 MK3 hybrid I have for live use.
Old 27th April 2015
  #1504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guitarmuzic View Post
Still no further information here regarding answers to the questions I posed above about the limited DSP resources for reverb... In comparing my Ultralite MK3 Hybrid with my Ultralite AVB, my live vocal and acoustic guitar mix sounds better on the MK3 with the better quality reverb being obvious, so I am going to try to sell the Ultralite AVB to try to recoup my investment. Feel free to send me a private message on here if anyone is interested in purchasing.
Sorry for the delayed response, Guitarmuzic. I got hit by a nasty stomach bug last week and it's been a slow recovery.

The UltraLite AVB does have more DSP power but it's also doing more DSP work. We're still running into hardware limitations with what we can do because we're asking it to do much more than we were previously. One tradeoff we made in that process was to make the reverb less resource-intensive at the expense of its quality to free up resources for other effects. Engineering is full of such constraint-based decision making and this was just one of many similar choices. When we make these choices, we of course have the customer in mind. Sometimes, though, a choice can be good for one group of users and bad for another. I don't remember the exact decision process but it may have been something along the lines of: "Higher quality reverb or able to run just about every effect on every mixer channel at once?"

Regardless of how it came to be this way, we're always re-evaluating. Thank you for raising it to our attention! I know the reverb is a major concern for some of you and we're discussing possible solutions. Given the engineering constraints involved, this may be a difficult one to resolve but we're looking into it.
Old 27th April 2015
  #1505
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by emrr View Post
Do any of the other presets work? Can you see the 1248 from the AVB Discovery app on your computer, and manually assign connections? Or is it not found at all with the app?
Yes all the others work perfectly. Audio , mixer etc. But not the setiup «interface + mixer» neighter via Thunderbolt ou USB. I see the 1248 on my computer but on my iPAd I see just de the figure «1248» on a blue page, there is nothing else (no board, no nothing to control)

Thank you very much emrr
Old 28th April 2015
  #1506
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Sorry for the delayed response, Guitarmuzic. I got hit by a nasty stomach bug last week and it's been a slow recovery.

The UltraLite AVB does have more DSP power but it's also doing more DSP work. We're still running into hardware limitations with what we can do because we're asking it to do much more than we were previously. One tradeoff we made in that process was to make the reverb less resource-intensive at the expense of its quality to free up resources for other effects. Engineering is full of such constraint-based decision making and this was just one of many similar choices. When we make these choices, we of course have the customer in mind. Sometimes, though, a choice can be good for one group of users and bad for another. I don't remember the exact decision process but it may have been something along the lines of: "Higher quality reverb or able to run just about every effect on every mixer channel at once?"

Regardless of how it came to be this way, we're always re-evaluating. Thank you for raising it to our attention! I know the reverb is a major concern for some of you and we're discussing possible solutions. Given the engineering constraints involved, this may be a difficult one to resolve but we're looking into it.
MrMiller,

Thanks for your response and the direct answer to my questions. I hope you are feeling better!

I understand what you are saying and I do appreciate this information. I am probably amongst a smaller group of customers that holds the value of really high quality effects to be so important. A lot of users are probably using the effects for just creating a decent headphone monitoring mix while tracking in the studio so the ability to have effects on every channel is great for them, and a little compromise in the reverb doesn't really matter. Then they can use any plugin, or outboard gear for the best effects of their choice at mixdown.

For me, the ultralite is about using basically 2 or 3 inputs most of the time for a digital live performance mix, so I value super high quality effects on those 2 channels with a high quality reverb algorithm. It just came as a surprise and shock to me that the new AVB units would have stepped back in effects quality at all. Again, I understand why some sacrifices had to be made, and I really appreciated the honest information you have provided! I would be very, very, very, very, interested to learn if your engineering team were able to provide a way to use higher quality effects on a smaller number of channels. (at an equal or better quality than the MK3 interfaces.) Like a high quality mode for DSP where the Reverb is more complex and you can only use 2 or 4 channels with eq, compression, and limiting. Maybe this would be an optional firmware change not for everyone, but just if that is how you want your device configured...

For anyone who might suggest alternatives for better effects, I do have more gear and do bring a larger rack with separate reverbs and delays, and separate preamps for when I want to the best live sound, but the Ultralite MK3 has proven to be a very capable digital mixer with high quality effects that is smaller than any other mixer I have found. Then the interface capabilities are a total bonus on top of the live mixer function.
Old 28th April 2015
  #1507
tft
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Sorry for the delayed response, Guitarmuzic. I got hit by a nasty stomach bug last week and it's been a slow recovery.

The UltraLite AVB does have more DSP power but it's also doing more DSP work. We're still running into hardware limitations with what we can do because we're asking it to do much more than we were previously. One tradeoff we made in that process was to make the reverb less resource-intensive at the expense of its quality to free up resources for other effects. Engineering is full of such constraint-based decision making and this was just one of many similar choices. When we make these choices, we of course have the customer in mind. Sometimes, though, a choice can be good for one group of users and bad for another. I don't remember the exact decision process but it may have been something along the lines of: "Higher quality reverb or able to run just about every effect on every mixer channel at once?"

Regardless of how it came to be this way, we're always re-evaluating. Thank you for raising it to our attention! I know the reverb is a major concern for some of you and we're discussing possible solutions. Given the engineering constraints involved, this may be a difficult one to resolve but we're looking into it.
thanks a lot for giving some backgroundinfo on the matter. makes it at least easier to understand and accept, if things won't change to the better regarding reverb.
what i ask myself is, if it would be possible to incorporate some sort "interchangeable" reverb concept. so the user can decide, if he/she will go for quality or quantity. even if the unit can theoretically do a lot of channels, many users will not use that much at all.
so switching to a quality reverb for the expense of lower channel/effect count, would serve quite a lot of users very well i guess.
just thinking ...
Old 28th April 2015
  #1508
Here for the gear
 
ballantine's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Do you also have the ethernet connected? If so, try disconnecting that. It could be acquiring the interface as an AVB device and setting the sample rate behind your back.
No, I don't have any other connection, only USB.
The problem is easy to replicate... just connect the 1248 to a Mac and make it go to stop status. I tried with three different Mac and after the wake up the 1248 doesn't reproduce any sound. Do I have to open a support ticket or it's just a "normal" bug that will be fixed?

I'd like to know if the same problem happens with the thunderbolt connection. Unfortunatley the only mac I have with thunderbolt has no ethernet (I tried with the usb-ethernet adaptor but it doesn't support AVB) so I can't check if the audio over ethernet has the same behavior.

It's not a big problem, I know, but I'd like to know if I should buy a long thunderbolt cable or I can save the money because the problem is not in the connection but somewhere else.
Can someone please check?
Thank you.
Old 29th April 2015
  #1509
Quote:
Originally Posted by ballantine View Post
No, I don't have any other connection, only USB.
The problem is easy to replicate... just connect the 1248 to a Mac and make it go to stop status. I tried with three different Mac and after the wake up the 1248 doesn't reproduce any sound. Do I have to open a support ticket or it's just a "normal" bug that will be fixed?
We're not aware of this issue yet but we'll definitely look into it on our end, make sure we can reproduce it and then work on a fix. You're welcome to file a support ticket. I'm going to file the issue internally and get that process started tomorrow. If we have trouble reproducing it, I'll reach out to you over PM.
Old 29th April 2015
  #1510
Lives for gear
 
Monkey Man's Avatar
 

Hi everyone,

I've been following this thread for 9 months, 6 or 7 of which were spent stressin' over if or when I'd be able to add TB to my 2012 Mac Pro. I bought it specifically 'cause it was the final old-format desktop model, meaning I'd be able to avoid having to invest in Dearth's helmet and its requisite paraphernalia. My studio rack is designed around having all my goodies in this puppy where it resides happily as we speak. Having just upgraded the CPUs from the stock 2.4GHz to the Xeon 5680 3.33GHz "equivalents" (the plan all along), learned of MOTU's recent announcement regarding the 64 I/O USB2 alternative to TB and planned a "down-scaling" path to reduce my MOTU 24I/O-based 72 I/O system to fit the USB2 I/O-count limit, I reckon it's finally time to ask the obvious question I've been dreading for so long...

Mr. Miller, is the replacement of my 72 I/O PCI-based AudioWire system with the aforementioned 64 I/O AVB equivalent over USB2 a solid, reliable option yet? I've seen no mention thus far of anyone's having set up a 3 or 4-unit network connected via USB to a Mac, yet alone a rock-solid one.

The thought of ditching the completely glitch-free (for 15 years) PCI system for anything else, let alone a USB-connected one, leaves me feeing uneasy to say the least. I've learned to trust MOTU on the Mac, as I've had all my eggs in its basket since day 1 (all audio & MIDI interfacing, along with DP and Mach Five), so I'd like to believe that if anybody can make 64 I/O a stable reality over USB2, it's you guys.

Anyone who's running such a setup is strongly encouraged to chime in. Mr. Miller, I await your reply with much fear and trepidation...

Thank you very much,
Nicky

Last edited by Monkey Man; 29th April 2015 at 03:27 PM.. Reason: Deleted sob story - background context as to how important this is to me
Old 29th April 2015
  #1511
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post
Hi everyone,

I've been following this thread for 9 months, 6 or 7 of which were spent stressin' over if or when I'd be able to add TB to my 2012 Mac Pro. I bought it specifically 'cause it was the final old-format desktop model, meaning I'd be able to avoid having to invest in Dearth's helmet and its requisite paraphernalia. My studio rack is designed around having all my goodies in this puppy where it resides happily as we speak. Having just upgraded the CPUs from the stock 2.4GHz to the Xeon 5680 3.33GHz "equivalents" (the plan all along), learned of MOTU's recent announcement regarding the 64 I/O USB2 alternative to TB and planned a "down-scaling" path to reduce my MOTU 24I/O-based 72 I/O system to fit the USB2 I/O-count limit, I reckon it's finally time to ask the obvious question I've been dreading for so long...

Mr. Miller, is the replacement of my 72 I/O PCI-based AudioWire system with the aforementioned 64 I/O AVB equivalent over USB2 a solid, reliable option yet? I've seen no mention thus far of anyone's having set up a 3 or 4-unit network connected via USB to a Mac, yet alone a rock-solid one.

The thought of ditching the completely glitch-free (for 15 years) PCI system for anything else, let alone a USB-connected one, leaves me feeing uneasy to say the least. I've learned to trust MOTU on the Mac, as I've had all my eggs in its basket since day 1 (all audio & MIDI interfacing, along with DP and Mach Five), so I'd like to believe that if anybody can make 64 I/O a stable reality over USB2, it's you guys.
It's not quite fair to compare USB with the PCI system. With PCI, you're going to see lower latency. At 64/64, you're limited to 1x sample rates so only 44.1khz or 48khz. Not sure if that's an issue for you or not. Lastly, you should make sure the interface connected to the computer isn't sharing a USB bus with other devices that might use up bandwidth and interfere. Otherwise, if that all sounds fine, 64 In/64 Out USB is working great on our end. Of course, real world feedback is much more valuable here so I'm not the best person to answer that part.

None of these caveats really exist with Thunderbolt, but you're not going to be able to upgrade your Mac to support Thunderbolt. The only other option would be to get an AVB-capable network card and using that instead of USB. I think a couple of users have reported success with such a card in their previous generation Mac Pro towers. You'll also need to be running OS X 10.10.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1512
Here for the gear
 

USB lockup / error / wishlist

Hey guys, and especially MrMiller!

I have just made the switch from an Ultralite Mk3 to an Ultralite AVB. So far, it has been a mixed bag.

+ first of all, let me state, that overall I am really happy with the interface, everyone and their mothers should buy one
+ routing capabilities are simply marvelous, finally I can assign mono outs as mix destinations, so my band can use their in-ear systems hassle-free (before I had to put some of them on the L-R of a stereo mix..)
+ remote control is just sweet at this price point
+ preamps and overall build and sonic quality is MOTU-grade, well done

- On windows 7, USB webserver service is not stable at all, just as a few commenters before, I have run into the problem that the webgui over USB simply stops responding after a while ("could not communicate with driver" error), I might still be able to gain access via wifi/ethernet, but it happened to us during a rehearsal that even the wifi access went down at the same time ("could not communicate with server" error). Since have used the MK3 as a live mixer with recording option and that is the role the AVB should do, this is a major problem for me. I have set the USB webserver service in the "Services" window to be restarted automatically, but I fail to understand why it terminates on a powerhouse pc like mine (ssd, heaps of ram, corei7 quad).

- Gui performance - the mk3 was really like using a mixer, everything went flawlessly, never dropped connection, every fader, every mix appeared and reacted instantly. On the AVB, there is a 3-15 (!! yep, not an exaggeration) seconds delay when switching between the different tabs like routing or the mixing part. This is borderline unacceptable for my situation (live mixing). I know that MOTU is not really planning to release a pc-based control surface like CueMix was, but I am not certain that it is the right way. I mean, the gui is there, would it really be that time consuming to make it run on the computer and only send commands to the interface? A lot of people are buying your interfaces for live use, gui speed in that situation is crucial..

- aux mixing: ok, this is really nice from one side and not so nice from the other: it is great that you can route the mixes to mono outs and I can live with the big-mixer format as opposed to the separate mixes of CueMix (which I liked somewhat better, but maybe it just needs some getting used to). However, the fact that the aux mixes carry all effect setting with them that are on the channels are not ideal in some situations (my guitarist likes way different eq in his ears on his guitar that should go to the main mix). I know it is solvable via patching in the same signal into the mixer multiple times, but it is far from elegant. With CueMix's fully independent mixes this was soo much easier.

- analyzers, graphical eq, etc. these tools are sorely missed...

I can understand the need of playing with the resources, but would it be possible to make it so that WE can decide which service we want to fit in? Like OK, you want better reverb? Cool, but then you can't use this sampling rate or this many channels.. You want graphical eq with FFT? Cool, yet again, we will limit the channel count / effects you can use. I could really get used to such a limitation, I only need to plan right that way, but these options are not present now.

Thank you for reading my wall of text and I hope that MOTU fixes some of these shortfalls (especially the USB error, which is simply not worthy of MOTU).
Old 30th April 2015
  #1513
Quote:
Originally Posted by deuscreator View Post
- Gui performance - the mk3 was really like using a mixer, everything went flawlessly, never dropped connection, every fader, every mix appeared and reacted instantly. On the AVB, there is a 3-15 (!! yep, not an exaggeration) seconds delay when switching between the different tabs like routing or the mixing part. This is borderline unacceptable for my situation (live mixing).
While this is the first thing I noted, the workaround is to open the device tabs in different browser tabs. It would be great if MOTU did this automatically.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1514
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DAW PLUS View Post
While this is the first thing I noted, the workaround is to open the device tabs in different browser tabs. It would be great if MOTU did this automatically.
I do feel like a moron for not figuring this out..

It is still a problem with a mobile device though..

Thank you for your input!

I hope I receive a reply for my USB problem this fast as well.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1515
Here for the gear
 

Thanks for the great topic to participators, read through last 20 pages of it. Would still like to ask couple of questions about an upcoming MOTU setup.

Just sold an old 24i/o workhorse to move on to more portable dircetion. Now I'm planning to set up a new system with AVB gear that could be used in locations in addition to studio recordings.

24 inputs and outputs is required. Thought about replacing old converter with 16A AVB and connect an old 828mkII with adat. In studio, this packet would then be connected to Mac Mini with Thunderbolt. Monitoring would be done old-fashioned analog way. Simple as that.

This same setup should be detachable and movable to locations. I was thinking about positioning recording laptop to a "control room" with UltraLite AVB (for monitoring / talkback pre), then using a long CAT6 cable to connect 16A + 828mkII stack in the recording space. Couple of questions:

1) Audio routing should be quite clear in this "location" setup. How about controlling the setup (monitoring etc) over WiFi in recording space? As the network ports will be taken in both 16A and Ultralite, I can't connect MOTU devices to any router physically. Is it enough if both laptop and mobile device are in same wifi network?

2) Is this system reliable enough when all the 24ch io traffic going through Ultralite / USB2 bus? By "reliable" I mean as reliable as the old PCIe 24io setup, with zero problems in three years? This is somehow similar to the Monkeymans question above, but only with 24ch i/o.

3) Are there any other cost-effective solutions, mainly as a replacement for Ultralite component as talkback/cr monitoring/AVB bridge?
Old 30th April 2015
  #1516
Gear Head
 

Is there any real video review of real time response of the gui? by "real review" i mean not motutv channel or sponsored video..
Old 30th April 2015
  #1517
Lives for gear
 
Monkey Man's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
It's not quite fair to compare USB with the PCI system. With PCI, you're going to see lower latency. At 64/64, you're limited to 1x sample rates so only 44.1khz or 48khz. Not sure if that's an issue for you or not.
Well, I've always used CueMix and / or an analog desk for monitoring, so I don't think latency will matter, Mr M. Only ever used 44.1khz, so that'll be just groovy too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Lastly, you should make sure the interface connected to the computer isn't sharing a USB bus with other devices that might use up bandwidth and interfere. Otherwise, if that all sounds fine, 64 In/64 Out USB is working great on our end.
I'll actually have 3 4-port PCI USB3 cards (2 now plus another to "replace" the 424 card). Don't know how many busses that is in the real world, but it sounds like a terminus to me.

It really means a heck of a lot to me that you're saying it's "working great" for you guys, mate. Seriously, Mr. M.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Of course, real world feedback is much more valuable here so I'm not the best person to answer that part.
Ah... but you were the first, mate!

Hopefully my question will prompt someone to report in; the timing was after all influenced by the fact that, as I said, I've not seen anyone volunteer info about such a system yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
None of these caveats really exist with Thunderbolt, but you're not going to be able to upgrade your Mac to support Thunderbolt. The only other option would be to get an AVB-capable network card and using that instead of USB. I think a couple of users have reported success with such a card in their previous generation Mac Pro towers. You'll also need to be running OS X 10.10.
Last I heard the latency was ridiculous using such a card. Normally I wouldn't care much about this, but the insanely high figures I heard just won't work for me once I start using VIs in a year or so.

Once again, thank you Mr. Miller for your prompt and encouraging response. This AVB system will be close to the last piece in a puzzle that's taken 30 years to put together. I should've been dead many times by now. Instead I'm sitting here shaking my head in disbelief that the "end" is once again in sight. Hope is, in my experience at least, the one ingredient guaranteed to sap the life out of you... in its absence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lauri View Post
2) Is this system reliable enough when all the 24ch io traffic going through Ultralite / USB2 bus? By "reliable" I mean as reliable as the old PCIe 24io setup, with zero problems in three years? This is somehow similar to the Monkeymans question above, but only with 24ch i/o.
I hear you, brother.

Following our glitch-free runs, any hiccup's surely gonna strike a deep nerve and send creepy shivers up our spines.

Mr. Miller seems pretty confident on this one 'though.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1518
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post
Following our glitch-free runs, any hiccup's surely gonna strike a deep nerve and send creepy shivers up our spines.

Mr. Miller seems pretty confident on this one 'though.
I can't guarantee that it will work flawlessly. Technology can be fickle like that. What I can guarantee, though, is that if it doesn't, we'll endeavor to fix the issue as soon as possible. We're committed to making the best possible product: it's why I'm here and why we're grateful to all of you for your feedback as we iterate and improve it!
Old 30th April 2015
  #1519
Gear Head
Hi Mr. Miller,

I have a 16A which I absolutely love in the studio. I bought an ultralite AVB as well, to replace my ultralite mk3. The thing is, i can't get AVB working.

- It's updated to the latest firmware.
- It's connected directly to my macbook pro retina via an apple thunderbolt to ethernet adapter.
- I enabled both input and output AVB streams.
- I cannot access the device via ethernet alone, must be connected to USB. (ethernet does work when connected to an airport)
- The display keeps saying: AVB: Disabled.
- The display keeps saying Mode: USB2 (even though it's not connected via USB)

What am i missing here?

AVB is also enabled in my audio midi settings (i'm on 10.10.3 and use this mac with AVB with the 16A as well and that works fine)

Cheers,

Ruben
Old 30th April 2015
  #1520
Here for the gear
 

Mr. Miller, sorry to be so restless, but I have a gig tomorrow night with the Ultralite AVB. Any news you could give me on what causes the USB webserver service/process to come to a halt (could not communicate with driver error) and sometimes the web access dropout (could not find server)? During our rehearsal they happened at the same time... Hmmm... I just tested it at home, nothing else but some audio playing from my laptop, and the same errors came up together (I have opened the browser with multiple tabs, one via localhost access, one via lan). This is not at all the reliability I came to love about MOTU :(

I have done a clean install of the drivers and I have now set the usb webserver process to auto-relaunch, but this is still very annoying..
Old 30th April 2015
  #1521
Quote:
Originally Posted by synnys View Post
- I cannot access the device via ethernet alone, must be connected to USB. (ethernet does work when connected to an airport)
That seems worrisome to me. Let's see if we can figure that out first. Once you connect the UltraLite to your laptop via ethernet (no USB) and give it a second to self-assign an IP address, lookup the IP address on the front panel. What did it get assigned? And if you open a browser on your laptop, can you access that address?

Quote:
Originally Posted by deuscreator View Post
Mr. Miller, sorry to be so restless, but I have a gig tomorrow night with the Ultralite AVB. Any news you could give me on what causes the USB webserver service/process to come to a halt (could not communicate with driver error) and sometimes the web access dropout (could not find server)? During our rehearsal they happened at the same time... Hmmm... I just tested it at home, nothing else but some audio playing from my laptop, and the same errors came up together (I have opened the browser with multiple tabs, one via localhost access, one via lan). This is not at all the reliability I came to love about MOTU :(

I have done a clean install of the drivers and I have now set the usb webserver process to auto-relaunch, but this is still very annoying..
Does the tab that's accessing it via the IP address still work, even though the proxy over USB fails? We're tracking an issue some people are having with the USB proxy server but we haven't been able to get to the root cause yet. If accessing it via LAN works, I'd suggest relying on that for now.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1522
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
That seems worrisome to me. Let's see if we can figure that out first. Once you connect the UltraLite to your laptop via ethernet (no USB) and give it a second to self-assign an IP address, lookup the IP address on the front panel. What did it get assigned? And if you open a browser on your laptop, can you access that address?



Does the tab that's accessing it via the IP address still work, even though the proxy over USB fails? We're tracking an issue some people are having with the USB proxy server but we haven't been able to get to the root cause yet. If accessing it via LAN works, I'd suggest relying on that for now.
Sometimes.. the error is not consistent at all. It first happened when I was just trying the interface out, one mic in active, windows audio streaming to main outs. Then I did a clean install, deleted everything MOTU (even cleaned the registry) and reinstalled the Windows drivers. Then it came up simultaneously during rehearsal. That time around, I could not get it work again until a laptop reboot. I think the usb error is caused implicitly by the quoted USB webserver process halting (for no good reason). Digging around the event log of Windows, it just gives me the info that it stopped working abruptly. Also, there is another queer log saying that the "motuavbuac2 Failed to start notify pipe." but that happened much earlier and thus might not be related.

What really troubles me is that the web access too can become unresponsive and somehow this was fixed by a laptop reboot, which makes zero sense to me..

The usb connection seems to be intact though, as music keeps straming. I can also relaunch the usb server (and is now relaunched instantly), but if this error comes up just when I need to access the consol, and I mean right away during a live show, this is a real pain in my behind.. (and now it seems it is a periodically recurring error, meaning that if I leave the gui running for a while, there is a good chance it will happen).

I am truly nervous now, because I only have a very cumbersome backup solution for tomorrow's gig..
Old 30th April 2015
  #1523
Gear Head
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
That seems worrisome to me. Let's see if we can figure that out first. Once you connect the UltraLite to your laptop via ethernet (no USB) and give it a second to self-assign an IP address, lookup the IP address on the front panel. What did it get assigned? And if you open a browser on your laptop, can you access that address?
well thats the issue, it doesn't get an IP at all, just blank. And it's set to DHCP. It does when connected to my router, but not directly to my mac. i'm using the same cable (cat 6) and same tb-ethernet adapter as i used with the 16A.

http://i.imgur.com/XsCBJfL.png
Old 30th April 2015
  #1524
Gear Head
nevermind, i somehow got it to work, don't ask me how, but it now has a self assigned IP and AVB says: PTP M now...
Old 30th April 2015
  #1525
Quote:
Originally Posted by deuscreator View Post
Sometimes.. the error is not consistent at all. It first happened when I was just trying the interface out, one mic in active, windows audio streaming to main outs. Then I did a clean install, deleted everything MOTU (even cleaned the registry) and reinstalled the Windows drivers. Then it came up simultaneously during rehearsal. That time around, I could not get it work again until a laptop reboot. I think the usb error is caused implicitly by the quoted USB webserver process halting (for no good reason). Digging around the event log of Windows, it just gives me the info that it stopped working abruptly. Also, there is another queer log saying that the "motuavbuac2 Failed to start notify pipe." but that happened much earlier and thus might not be related.

What really troubles me is that the web access too can become unresponsive and somehow this was fixed by a laptop reboot, which makes zero sense to me..

The usb connection seems to be intact though, as music keeps straming. I can also relaunch the usb server (and is now relaunched instantly), but if this error comes up just when I need to access the consol, and I mean right away during a live show, this is a real pain in my behind.. (and now it seems it is a periodically recurring error, meaning that if I leave the gui running for a while, there is a good chance it will happen).

I am truly nervous now, because I only have a very cumbersome backup solution for tomorrow's gig..
I'd recommend explicitly disabling the USB proxy server for now in Services and only accessing it via ethernet. Hopefully that will bring more stability to your setup while we work on finding the cause and a solution.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1526
Quote:
Originally Posted by synnys View Post
nevermind, i somehow got it to work, don't ask me how, but it now has a self assigned IP and AVB says: PTP M now...
Glad to hear it's working now but that's strange. The interface won't self-assign an IP address until its DHCP request times out so it can take 30 seconds or so, but shouldn't be much longer than that.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1527
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
I'd recommend explicitly disabling the USB proxy server for now in Services and only accessing it via ethernet. Hopefully that will bring more stability to your setup while we work on finding the cause and a solution.
Well, ok.. I have a techlink open too that noone read from yesterday under the number 97097. I really hope there is a solution in store. I'll be monitoring the thread.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1528
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
I'd recommend explicitly disabling the USB proxy server for now in Services and only accessing it via ethernet. Hopefully that will bring more stability to your setup while we work on finding the cause and a solution.
Hey Mr. Miller. I might have something useful for the debugging. Digging around the Windows logs, Internet Connection Sharing might be a conflicting service, as it's error logs have coincided with the MOTU usb webserver error log. Also, for teh motuavbuac service (which does what exactly?), the Multimedia Class Scheduler Service might be a problematic thing, as the latter started up just at the same time on multiple occasions, when the motuavbuac crashed. It also seems to crash every time after the processor's power management processes come to life (Kernel-Processor-Power) management.

I hope this helps.. Could you relay this info to your colleauges...
Old 30th April 2015
  #1529
Quote:
Originally Posted by deuscreator View Post
Hey Mr. Miller. I might have something useful for the debugging. Digging around the Windows logs, Internet Connection Sharing might be a conflicting service, as it's error logs have coincided with the MOTU usb webserver error log. Also, for teh motuavbuac service (which does what exactly?), the Multimedia Class Scheduler Service might be a problematic thing, as the latter started up just at the same time on multiple occasions, when the motuavbuac crashed. It also seems to crash every time after the processor's power management processes come to life (Kernel-Processor-Power) management.

I hope this helps.. Could you relay this info to your colleauges...
Thanks for all that sleuthing! We've had trouble reproducing the issue so more detail like this is incredibly helpful.
Old 30th April 2015
  #1530
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Thanks for all that sleuthing! We've had trouble reproducing the issue so more detail like this is incredibly helpful.
Ok, this is almost certainly not a coincidence, that the USB HTTPserver always crashes when the Windows winhttp web proxy auto-discovery service is started. It just happened again, will let it run through the night (I'm in Europe) and see how it goes. Then if the crash still coincides with that, I'm disabling it and see what happens.
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