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MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface Audio Interfaces
Old 12th February 2015
  #1141
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobywane View Post
Hard time here with the 24Ao. The AVB streams worked fine over usb few days ago but today I try to work over thunderbolt and it's like the 24Ao goes crazy ! It doesn't save my settings. If I set it right and I go back to the 16A screen, everything goes from scratch when I reopen the 24Ao setting page.

mrmiller, do you know what it could be ? I really feel like the internal memory failed all the time. Impossible to get the good setup like it was few days ago. I tried with usb and I can't have my setup running ok, the 24Ao is still "locked" to the factory setup.

EDIT : Can't even save my settings by creating a new preset. A pop-up opens : "Error message received from server: Service Unavailable (Code 503)". I think I have to ship it back to the shop...
Hmm... something seems wonky. I'd try power cycling the interfaces and see if that helps.
Old 12th February 2015
  #1142
Here for the gear
Sorry but what is power cycling please ? If it's simply switching off and on I already tried and nothing changed...
Old 12th February 2015
  #1143
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobywane View Post
Sorry but what is power cycling please ? If it's simply switching off and on I already tried and nothing changed...
Sorry, yes, I meant turning it off and on. We should probably continue this via PM. I'll follow up with you with some more questions.
Old 13th February 2015
  #1144
Lives for gear
 
once a roadie's Avatar
Really interesting product. A few questions...

Is the AVB audio interface now working with windows 7? Do I need the AVB hub or just plug directly into the PC? For example, if I connected a 1248 with Ethernet to my win 7 pc, am I up and running? What else would I need?

Has any one used these new interfaces with Studio One daw?

Is motu generally (historically) stable on windows, or is it really more a Mac affair?
Old 13th February 2015
  #1145
Quote:
Originally Posted by once a roadie View Post
Really interesting product. A few questions...

Is the AVB audio interface now working with windows 7? Do I need the AVB hub or just plug directly into the PC? For example, if I connected a 1248 with Ethernet to my win 7 pc, am I up and running? What else would I need?
Yup, these work on Windows 7+. You don't need an AVB-capable switch unless you're planning on creating a network of more than 2 interfaces. On Windows, you need USB to get audio into and out of the computer. With ethernet, you'd be able to configure the device and use it as converter box, remote mixer, etc. but not as an audio interface.

Quote:
Originally Posted by once a roadie View Post
Has any one used these new interfaces with Studio One daw?
I personally haven't but the USB driver includes an ASIO driver, so that should have you covered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by once a roadie View Post
Is motu generally (historically) stable on windows, or is it really more a Mac affair?
Back in the 90s we were Mac-only but ever since the 2000s we've supported Windows with all our hardware. Since this is a new product line, it took us a little bit of time to get stable drivers on both platforms. Definitely not a Mac-only affair.
Old 13th February 2015
  #1146
Lives for gear
 
once a roadie's Avatar
Thank you mrmiller!

A few other questions I have been struggling with:

On the 1248, there are 2 di inputs, 4 mic inputs and 8 trs inputs...does each path get its own a/d?

I mean if I plug in all 14 possible analog including DIs can I simultaneously record all the inputs to a separate track in the daw? Or is there some sharing of a/d s between those 14 inputs...?

Also, now that PCI thunderbolt cards are becoming available, will these interfaces work with thunderbolt on windows 7+?

Lastly, what kind of latency figures are we talking with win 7 and usb?

Thanks







Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
Yup, these work on Windows 7+. You don't need an AVB-capable switch unless you're planning on creating a network of more than 2 interfaces. On Windows, you need USB to get audio into and out of the computer. With ethernet, you'd be able to configure the device and use it as converter box, remote mixer, etc. but not as an audio interface.



I personally haven't but the USB driver includes an ASIO driver, so that should have you covered.



Back in the 90s we were Mac-only but ever since the 2000s we've supported Windows with all our hardware. Since this is a new product line, it took us a little bit of time to get stable drivers on both platforms. Definitely not a Mac-only affair.

Last edited by once a roadie; 13th February 2015 at 10:00 PM..
Old 14th February 2015
  #1147
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emrr's Avatar
Every time my system comes up, I watch 16a boot and load the browser app, then I open DP. Previously, DP always came back with the 16a as interface, last month or so, every time requires a manual switch off of built in audio back to 16a.
Old 15th February 2015
  #1148
Here for the gear
 

Routing problems with 2 1248s

Hey guys, A new member here and long time Motu user 828s before and now just bought 2 1248s. So the set-up I have is a basic control to live room, one in each with (right now) only one computer connected in the control room. The ethernet is running through a wall plug I installed from room to room with a cable hooked to each interface on each end from interface to wall.
So they seem to be reading each other and after some weird magic (took a few tries) I was able to get the computer audio to come out of the phones and monitors in the control room. However, no matter what I try, I cannot get it to [play at the same time through the live room, no meters moving and yes, I have tried clicking on everything in the routing tab for that 1248.

What am I doing wrong? The book reads like this should be easy but, it isn't working that easily.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Billy

(Solved) Ok, it was a routing problem and I got it figured out after reading about how the AVB works with stems. Once I sent computer audio from the right channels to The AVB Stems, it worked. I have noticed one thing though, sometimes while making routing selection and then choosing mixer and then coming back to routing, some of my selections had moved. Has anyone else experienced this?

Last edited by mandobilly64; 15th February 2015 at 03:29 PM.. Reason: (solved)
Old 15th February 2015
  #1149
Gear Addict
 
rob61's Avatar
 

Can anyone discuss hooking up two units for extra channel count so it operates as one unit? I have a PC, using USB (which I know is limited to 24 channels at this time). I now have two 16a units. I thought by plugging USB into one, then using an ethernet cat6 between them, it would be recognized and allow me 24 channels. However, it seems I have to set up an "AVB stream"?

If this is the case, can someone take me through it using the routing grid so I have basically 24 channels available from one mixer (for monitoring live)? For each unit, I have the devices tab, which allows "AVB setup", "Mixer setup", and "Computer setup". I want to be able to have ONE mixer (with inputs coming from both 16a) to allow live monitoring. So the second 16a has to be feeding the aux 1-2 channel in the first 16a. Not sure how this AVB scheme works. Thanks for any direction you can offer.
Old 16th February 2015
  #1150
Lives for gear
 

The Sweetwater page for 112D says they can get it "in a few days". I assume this means it's shipping or about to ship. Can you confirm? Is there a Win7 driver yet?
Old 16th February 2015
  #1151
Gear Head
 

mrmiller
After the new AVB firmware upgrade, we notice a very large increase in CPU load from the coreaudiod process,when connected over AVB-Ethernet, compared to before the upgrade..
If we switch to Thunderbolt the CPU-load is gone.
The system is a 2012-MacMini quadcore/16GB (OSX-10.10.2), directly connected over ethernet to a 16A.
Attached Images
MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface-schermafbeelding-2015-02-16-om-12.05.16.jpg 
Old 16th February 2015
  #1152
Quote:
Originally Posted by once a roadie View Post
On the 1248, there are 2 di inputs, 4 mic inputs and 8 trs inputs...does each path get its own a/d?

I mean if I plug in all 14 possible analog including DIs can I simultaneously record all the inputs to a separate track in the daw? Or is there some sharing of a/d s between those 14 inputs...?
Yes, all 14 analog inputs are independent, as are all the outputs including the two headphones on the front.
Old 16th February 2015
  #1153
Quote:
Originally Posted by emrr View Post
Every time my system comes up, I watch 16a boot and load the browser app, then I open DP. Previously, DP always came back with the 16a as interface, last month or so, every time requires a manual switch off of built in audio back to 16a.
Hrm... that's strange. We'll look into it!
Old 16th February 2015
  #1154
Quote:
Originally Posted by balijon View Post
mrmiller
After the new AVB firmware upgrade, we notice a very large increase in CPU load from the coreaudiod process,when connected over AVB-Ethernet, compared to before the upgrade..
If we switch to Thunderbolt the CPU-load is gone.
The system is a 2012-MacMini quadcore/16GB (OSX-10.10.2), directly connected over ethernet to a 16A.
Thanks for the heads up. We'll see if we can reproduce it on our end and investigate.
Old 16th February 2015
  #1155
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdunn View Post
The Sweetwater page for 112D says they can get it "in a few days". I assume this means it's shipping or about to ship. Can you confirm? Is there a Win7 driver yet?
The 112D is shipping very shortly. The current Windows USB driver works with the 112D, so yes, the driver's ready.
Old 16th February 2015
  #1156
Quote:
Originally Posted by rob61 View Post
Can anyone discuss hooking up two units for extra channel count so it operates as one unit? I have a PC, using USB (which I know is limited to 24 channels at this time). I now have two 16a units. I thought by plugging USB into one, then using an ethernet cat6 between them, it would be recognized and allow me 24 channels. However, it seems I have to set up an "AVB stream"?

If this is the case, can someone take me through it using the routing grid so I have basically 24 channels available from one mixer (for monitoring live)? For each unit, I have the devices tab, which allows "AVB setup", "Mixer setup", and "Computer setup". I want to be able to have ONE mixer (with inputs coming from both 16a) to allow live monitoring. So the second 16a has to be feeding the aux 1-2 channel in the first 16a. Not sure how this AVB scheme works. Thanks for any direction you can offer.
Check out MOTU.com - AVB Routing Tab if you haven't already, particularly the bottom section "Sending signal to AVB audio streams".

The basic abstraction here is that your 24x24 I/O to the computer can be routed anywhere, whether it's in the box directly connected to your computer or over the network in another box. The two interfaces don't show up as one: your computer only sees the interface that's directly connected to it and its you're responsibility to choose which tracks get routed from the network to that interface and into your computer (or out).
Old 16th February 2015
  #1157
In the manual, the only way I've found to update the drivers is to plug an ethernet cord in. When you're using that port to connect another unit - it's a PITA to get into the back of the rack and connect the router to each unit. For future reference, isn't there some way to download the update and send it to the units via Thunderbolt - via each units I.P.?

After updating, several of my settings (sample rate/AVB stream routing) were lost. Be sure to save first.

I don't want to open a huge can of worms, but is there an optimal sample rate for these units? - I'm running @88.2k. When I lost my settings it went to 48k.

After updating, on a nMP, running DP8, I had several crashes within a simple project. It finally seemed to stabilize.

Totally unrelated to the interfaces, but maybe someone can help me w/a DP8 issue that's driving me nuts. I switched from a T.V. to a Apple Cinema Display for my main monitor. Every time I open a consolidated window it comes up too small and I have to resize it to fill the screen. Previously DP8 would remember what size I left it and they would reopen that size. Any way to fix this?


A semi slutty pic, these things get hot - give them room to breathe.



Last edited by Robby in WA; 17th February 2015 at 12:00 AM..
Old 17th February 2015
  #1158
Lives for gear
 
once a roadie's Avatar
Really great info up here...is thunderbolt for windows in the release pipeline?
Old 19th February 2015
  #1159
Gear Head
 

new windows drivers and firmware

Hello mrmiller,

I've seen the new windows drivers and firmware, so I really hoped to get more I/O channels via USB. It's a pitty, Motu hadn't increased the channel count for USB. When can we expect that?
Old 19th February 2015
  #1160
rlg
Gear Maniac
 
rlg's Avatar
 

This is new...

MOTU.com - Introducing the UltraLite AVB

I've just outfitted one of my projects with several 1248s, one for each musician. Everyone can do quality recording at home and connect in the studio and on stage via AVB. The workflow and flexibility are great, but 1248s are overkill for the input and output needs of individual musicians.

This UltraLite version looks more reasonable, but no Thunderbolt. Also, I presume the converters and preamps are not the same as the 1248s. Can anyone confirm this?
Old 20th February 2015
  #1161
Lives for gear
 
jlaws's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by once a roadie View Post
Really great info up here...is thunderbolt for windows in the release pipeline?
I'd like to know this as well.
Old 20th February 2015
  #1162
Here for the gear
 

Hello mrmiller. Are you going to add audio via ethernet on 8m-16a-1248 like on UltraLite AVB in the nearest future, and especially on Windows?
Old 20th February 2015
  #1163
Gear Addict
 
rob61's Avatar
 

Can audio via ethernet be implemented on a Windows 7 PC (since its now offered for MAC on the Ultralite). If so, this could break the 24 channel barrier on PCs without thunderbolt.
Old 20th February 2015
  #1164
Here for the gear
Connection to Mac changes 8M sample rate and thus the Mixer

Hi there.

MOTU 8M AVB FW1.1.4+923 over USB on a MacBook Pro 4.1 OSX 10.10 (MacPro on 10.9 yields same results)

Great product, great to have Mr Miller here, but:

- When connected to the Mac, the 8M switches sample rate from 44.1k to 192k and back by itself during powerup.
- When not connected this does not happen.
- When connecting the powered unit to the Mac, the sample rate switches from 44.1k to 192k and back.
- There is no setting in OSX's Audio-MIDI Setup to cause this.

Actually, I would not mind that, but: Switching to 192k drastically reduces hardware and software channels and this in turn disables all DSP FX that are set up on those higher numbered channels. So all what was set up (Filter/EQ/Gate/Comp/etc.) on those higher numbered channels is disabled and remains disabled, even back in 44.1k. This ruins any pre-set mixes and is quite annoying in a live setup.

MOTU Tech support says: 'This is normal'. I can hardly believe it is normal to wreck mixer settings on all channels above 8 as a default behaviour.

How do I fix this ?

Actually, how do I keep the unit from flipping through sample rates on powerup while connected to the Mac ?

If the unit stays at 44.1, then no FX get disabled > me happy

Any ideas ?

Thanks

Christian
Old 20th February 2015
  #1165
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuzzfilth View Post
MOTU Tech support says: 'This is normal'. I can hardly believe it is normal to wreck mixer settings on all channels above 8 as a default behaviour.

How do I fix this ?

Actually, how do I keep the unit from flipping through sample rates on powerup while connected to the Mac ?

If the unit stays at 44.1, then no FX get disabled > me happy

Any ideas ?
This is most definitely not normal. We were already aware of the issue, however, which perhaps led to our tech's misinformation. Sorry for the confusion!

It's looking like a bug related to Apple's Core Audio USB Class Compliant driver and we're talking to them about getting it fixed. The issue doesn't exist on Windows. Until that's fixed, there are only a couple of workarounds available. Easiest would be to use Thunderbolt (or AVB). Is that an option for you?

Alternatively, I would save a preset once you've got your FX just the way you want them so that you can quickly recall it once the Mac connects to the device. Not ideal, but at least should save some time instead of dialing everything in again.
Old 20th February 2015
  #1166
Quote:
Originally Posted by GGPS View Post
I've seen the new windows drivers and firmware, so I really hoped to get more I/O channels via USB. It's a pitty, Motu hadn't increased the channel count for USB. When can we expect that?
It's still in the pipeline but I don't have a concrete release date for you. We are working hard on it though!

Quote:
Originally Posted by siwang View Post
Hello mrmiller. Are you going to add audio via ethernet on 8m-16a-1248 like on UltraLite AVB in the nearest future, and especially on Windows?
All the other devices in the line (8M, 16A, 1248, 24Ao/24Ai, 112D) already support audio-over-AVB just like the UltraLite AVB. They can stream between any other AVB device, whether from us or another manufacturer (with the caveat that there may be compatibility issues to iron out). You can also stream directly to any Mac with a Thunderbolt port running 10.10+ (MOTU.com - Using AVB Ethernet to connect to a Mac).

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob61 View Post
Can audio via ethernet be implemented on a Windows 7 PC (since its now offered for MAC on the Ultralite). If so, this could break the 24 channel barrier on PCs without thunderbolt.
We are looking into our options here, whether that turns out to be Thunderbolt, AVB or something else. Unfortunately, there are downsides to both TB (lack of capable hardware and computers) and AVB (requires special AVB-capable NICs). By contrast, every modern Mac supports TB and an AVB capable NIC. We'll figure out something good, though! Our first priority, however, is to get higher channel counts over USB.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rlg View Post
This UltraLite version looks more reasonable, but no Thunderbolt. Also, I presume the converters and preamps are not the same as the 1248s. Can anyone confirm this?
The UltraLite's analog guts are an improved version of the previous generation UltraLite mk3 Hybrid, as evidenced by the relatively better dynamic range and THD numbers. It does not share the same converters or preamps with the rest of the AVB line.
Old 20th February 2015
  #1167
Gear Addict
 
rob61's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
We are looking into our options here, whether that turns out to be Thunderbolt, AVB or something else. Unfortunately, there are downsides to both TB (lack of capable hardware and computers) and AVB (requires special AVB-capable NICs). By contrast, every modern Mac supports TB and an AVB capable NIC. We'll figure out something good, though! Our first priority, however, is to get higher channel counts over USB.
More channels over USB would be nice as well. If I could utilize all 32 channels of my two 16a that would be sufficient for most uses here. I was thinking, if I could purchase your AVB network interface, and hook up my two 16a, it might allow a lot more channels if my computer has a 1 ghz ethernet port (which it does). I was wondering if this would be easier to accomplish than adding more channels via USB... but either way would be a welcome addition to using multiple units for more channels.
Old 20th February 2015
  #1168
Here for the gear
Hey Michael, thanks for getting back to me so quickly. Appreciated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
a bug related to Apple's Core Audio USB Class Compliant driver and we're talking to them about getting it fixed.
Them = Apple ? Oh my.

Since it is only the DSP objects' power buttons that get deactivated from the SR switch (the parameters themselves stay intact), the armchair programmer in me wonders if it is possible to have the unit automtically either
- re-activate the deactivated objects after a SR switch
or
- reload the last active preset after a SR switch

Both would solve the problem, although it would require a new Firmware rollout on your part. But then, MOTU has arguably more interest in getting this to work than Apple...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
couple of workarounds available. Easiest would be to use Thunderbolt (or AVB). Is that an option for you?
No, unfortunately not, my computer sports neither TB or AVB Ehternet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmiller View Post
I would save a preset
That's what I'm doing for the moment.

Thanks and keep up this close involvement with the user base. Great work. I wish Apple was like this...

Christian
Old 21st February 2015
  #1169
Here for the gear
 

The Web GUI allows for creating pre-sets in addition to the ones provided such as "Audio Interface, Stage I/O, etc." However, every attempt to save an existing pre-set or create a new one generates an error message:

"Error message received from server: argument must be json (Code 400)"

Any idea what this means?
Old 21st February 2015
  #1170
Here for the gear
 

Hi guys,

I really love my 16a but I have a problem,it's impossible for me to upgrade the firmware, the device tab doesn't see the 16 a when connected via ethernet port.

any users met the problem?
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