The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 Search This Thread  Search This Forum  Search Reviews  Search Gear Database  Search Gear for sale  Search Gearslutz Go Advanced
MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface Audio Interfaces
Old 11th December 2017
  #3301
Lives for gear
 
ModularOverkill's Avatar
 

Travis, while this is great to see new features, I'm still concerned about the lack of robustness of the Discovery app (on Windows) and just general system flakiness. Are you folks working on that?
Old 11th December 2017
  #3302
Gear Head
 
thecld's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ModularOverkill View Post
Travis, while this is great to see new features, I'm still concerned about the lack of robustness of the Discovery app (on Windows) and just general system flakiness. Are you folks working on that?
+1

Not only on Windows, on Mac there are problems too - for example with sample rate sync when using multiple applications at the same time. It's great to see new stuff added, but please don't forget about existing issues
Old 11th December 2017
  #3303
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thecld View Post
+1

Not only on Windows, on Mac there are problems too - for example with sample rate sync when using multiple applications at the same time. It's great to see new stuff added, but please don't forget about existing issues
Yep. I've complained about the sample rate/multiple app issues on a Mac too. I often have to reset my audio drivers in Ableton Live because another app has caused the sound to cut out. My Apogee and Dangerous music interfaces could handle this with no problem. Hopefully MOTU fix this issue soon?
Old 12th December 2017
  #3304
tft
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Travisvictor View Post
Hi everyone,

I just wanted to let you all know that we’re currently running a public beta cycle for some exciting new features we’ve been working on.This update installs the new Touch Console, featuring designed-for-touchscreen mixing for your MOTU Pro Audio Interface from your tablet or smartphone.
Please note that this firmware moves the "Computer Setup" and "AVB Stream Setup" settings from the Device Tab to the Routing Grid page.
Take a look at the page below for more information and download links.
MOTU.com - Pro Audio
I’d like to invite you all to share your feedback with us at: [email protected] or with me directly!
please give us some screenshots, so we know what to expect. or post a video.

aaaand this may be a good chance to implement a reverb that is usable ...
Old 12th December 2017
  #3305
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Couldn't get it to update with file or from motu.com. Some sort of message flashes by too fast to read. I do recall now that updating the firmware in my 1248 is a really big hassle. Can't remember how I got it to finally work last time.

Update: Travis kindly sent me a PM with instructions on the update process and I was able to install the update. The key to solve the problem I had, as I see it, was to disconnect the usb during the update process so the 1248 could concentrate on using the network connection to do it.

My 1248 with the beta software works as well as it did before. The touch screen looks cute, but I don't have a monitor to support it. One thing that seems odd: When I mute the phones output on the touch screen (using a mouse), the volume on the non-phones output gets softer.

Last edited by ponzi; 12th December 2017 at 05:11 PM..
Old 12th December 2017
  #3306
tft
Gear Nut
 

is there a dedicated "track-editor", that displays all effects of one track in better overview, than with the whole mixer?

EDIT: i mean with the new touch-mix option ..-
Old 18th December 2017
  #3307
Gear Nut
 
wilkinsi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponzi View Post
Couldn't get it to update with file or from motu.com. Some sort of message flashes by too fast to read. I do recall now that updating the firmware in my 1248 is a really big hassle. Can't remember how I got it to finally work last time.

Update: Travis kindly sent me a PM with instructions on the update process and I was able to install the update. The key to solve the problem I had, as I see it, was to disconnect the usb during the update process so the 1248 could concentrate on using the network connection to do it.

My 1248 with the beta software works as well as it did before. The touch screen looks cute, but I don't have a monitor to support it. One thing that seems odd: When I mute the phones output on the touch screen (using a mouse), the volume on the non-phones output gets softer.
Thanks for the heads up. I was just about to update my 8D and 112D. I think I will hang fire until this becomes a finalized update rather than Beta.
Old 18th December 2017
  #3308
Lives for gear
 
ModularOverkill's Avatar
 

Is the touchmix option something that helps it out with touch screen windows. I’m looking again at a 27” hp envy AIO PC with touch screen but terrified it simply won’t work with it.
Old 18th December 2017
  #3309
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
I know it sounds irrational, so I hesitate to say it, but I felt like this beta update made my 1248 playback sound better. I would describe it as sweeter, for lack of a better explanation. I wonder if any of the code changes reduced jitter or some other improvement.
Old 18th December 2017
  #3310
Lives for gear
 
ModularOverkill's Avatar
 

Here are the bugs I still run into on a daily basis in the Web based (chrome on windows) tool, in a 1248/16a/16a/24ai system (one AVB switch).

* every few days, when I select one unit that unit may not 'see' one of the other units in the left hand Devices panel
* AVB based labels sometimes go missing. So on one unit I'll see "1248:1-2" instead of the properly labeled "Prophet 6" or whatever. The source unit will be correct, and other units may see it correctly
* This may be user error, but it's incredibly frustrating/confusing -- I will go enable/disable some mixer channels on one device, and they will then be disabled/enabled on another device. I should be able to edit one device in isolation without having a weird side effect of it impacting another one.
* Trim knobs are still very twitchy. It's hard to go from 0 to 1 without jumping straight over to 3 or something
* Every now and then a device will lose another, where it will see "Unknown Device" in the AVB stream connections

All these little things make it extremely frustrating during day to day workflow.

If I could get a single monolithic device with 128x128 in/out and 24 auxes my life would be much simpler
Old 23rd December 2017
  #3311
Gear Head
 
thecld's Avatar
 

Guys / Gals I strongly recommend to try out the new Touch Control beta firmware - I'm already using it for a few days (MOTU 624) and the sample rate sync problem is gone (for now). Hopefully it'll stay this way

One thing I've noticed is that I can't lock the main volume / headphones volume screen on my motu anymore, but it's a small bug compared to the sample rate sync bug.

Happy Holidays, Cheers!
Old 27th December 2017
  #3312
Here for the gear
 

Anyone else experiencing some major recording latency with the latest Motu Pro Audio Drivers in Ableton or any other DAW? I went from negligible to quite severe after I updated teh drivers in my Motu 8A. Havent' test yet with my 1248 or 16A yet.

It's almost a quarter beat of latency before the recording gets laid down to my track which is basically unusable at this point. Before, at a resolution of 1/512 there was only a latency seen of 2 ticks, which is basically negligible.

With the latest drivers I'm ablet o reduce my buffer setting to as low as 32mb at 48Khz, whereas hte lowest i could go with teh old drivers was 128Mb. weird, but it made no differencet o the recording latency i'm now seeing.

see pics of Ableton track with old drivers and with new.
Attached Thumbnails
MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface-new.jpg   MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface-old.jpg  
Old 27th December 2017
  #3313
Gear Nut
 
tagpass's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by rean1mator View Post
Anyone else experiencing some major recording latency with the latest Motu Pro Audio Drivers in Ableton or any other DAW? I went from negligible to quite severe after I updated teh drivers in my Motu 8A. Havent' test yet with my 1248 or 16A yet.

It's almost a quarter beat of latency before the recording gets laid down to my track which is basically unusable at this point. Before, at a resolution of 1/512 there was only a latency seen of 2 ticks, which is basically negligible.

With the latest drivers I'm ablet o reduce my buffer setting to as low as 32mb at 48Khz, whereas hte lowest i could go with teh old drivers was 128Mb. weird, but it made no differencet o the recording latency i'm now seeing.

see pics of Ableton track with old drivers and with new.
I've noticed a lot of latency issues (and other problems) with my 8A and 16A lately, but I was also chalking it up to having recently installed OSX High Sierra. The latency issues are the same whether I'm using Ableton, Reason or Logic Pro X. Things start out fine, then there is a small crackle, and latency becomes very noticeable and requires me to reboot the 8A and/or restart the computer (Late 2013 iMac). Afterwards, it runs smooth for the remainder of my session(s).

HOWEVER, if the computer goes to sleep -- say overnight -- then the latency problem often returns, or I may lose connection to AVB devices altogether. MOTU Discovery app is either greyed out or when I open it, I get a "failed to find device" error. I can tell that the device is "lost" on my system if I am listening to music (as an example) because I can hear little defects in the music -- like the sampling rate is not locked in. Again, rebooting/resetting the device will fix the issue for the day.

I've got my AVB devices connected via USB and Ethernet, by the way. (The Thunderbolt ports on my iMac stopped functioning a while ago.) Don't know if that is also a contributing factor to the latency. Again, my assumption has been that it is an OS issue more than anything, because I've had other weirdness on my system (MIDI controllers disconnecting upon sleep, etc.)...
Old 27th December 2017
  #3314
Here for the gear
 

Update, I went back to the previous version of teh motu pro audio driver and voila, all fixed. see pic.


MOTU please fix this issue. I'm tired of dealing with ****ty, buggy driver for my Motu products.

I"ve got a 1248, 16A and 8A running through avb router, have been a DP user since the late 90's and about to jump ship.

last issue when i first bought my 8A where it was crashing my workstation when connecting over usb 3.0, MOTU kept blaming my hardware/usb controller. bought a new usb 3.0 contoller wiht the same issue, Motu not taking responsibility, a couple of weeks later they release a new driver and firmware and it fixed my usb 3.0 issues.

too many hours wasted when i could be working on music. freaking inspiration killer.
Attached Thumbnails
MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface-new_old.jpg  
Old 28th December 2017
  #3315
Here for the gear
 

My 828es did the same thing occasionally. Usually it ran fine with 16 sample ASIO buffer, but then after one audible glitch, the latency was suddenly 200-500 ms in Studio One. I updated the firmware to the touch-enabled beta and since then I have had no problems.
Old 28th December 2017
  #3316
Gear Nut
Thank you all for trying out the new Touch Console! Just a reminder that feedback can be sent directly to our development team at the below email address.

[email protected]

I am surprised to hear that people are seeing latency issues after the firmware update. The only change in this update was the addition of the Touch Console.

Rean1mator, were you seeing this problem after the Beta Firmware, or a recent driver update? If you're seeing this issue with latency, is it at all helpful to adjust the Host Safety Offset in the device page, in addition to the Host Buffer Size? Starting with a HSO of 48 is a good starting point.
Old 31st December 2017
  #3317
Here for the gear
 

TravisVictor

With respect to MOTU 1248 issues at low latency - I am using Win 10 (new install, new 8700K build), PT 12.8.3, Waves Gold bundle and NI Komplete....

Very occasionally (less than once a week with daily use) there will be a 'ping' sound and then all audio is delayed by about 1/2 second (the latest driver and the latest firmware, both before and after the new PC build, with earlier ProTools builds as well). Audio sounds like it has a spring reverb on it. A reboot fixes the problem. This only occurs when I am running at the lowest latency for recording - on the new 8700K build I can get away with 64/64 buffers in ProTools recording 16 audio, 16 midi and running 3 VIs @ 24/96 - which is awesome.

BTW, to achieve this low latency in ProTools I start the program with a FFE processor affinity to free up 1 core for system / MOTU driver operation. I am not sure if this is unique to the MOTU driver model, but without the FFE affinity I can not run at 64/64 latency without having processor spikes that halt recording.

Now my question....

Travis, with the current driver builds, what is the difference in latency between USB2 and Thunderbolt - how many extra samples are in the USB2 buffer ?

I ask because my new motherboard supports Thunderbolt (Asus Prime A) but with the add-in card, TB3->TB2 adapter and TB cable, it is about a 300$ investment. But, low latency recording is important to me. So what can I expect ?

What is the current difference in buffer size (samples) between USB and Thunderbolt for the MOTU 1248 ?

Happy New Year.

ejinbc
Old 4th January 2018
  #3318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Travisvictor View Post
The only change in this update was the addition of the Touch Console.
Thanks for this info... I was hesitant to update my 828es due to uncertainty which your post removed. Looking forward to trying out the Touch Console.
Old 4th January 2018
  #3319
Gear Head
 
thecld's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Travisvictor View Post
I am surprised to hear that people are seeing latency issues after the firmware update. The only change in this update was the addition of the Touch Console.
That's interesting, because this beta firmware definitely resolved sample rate sync problems on my 624
Old 4th January 2018
  #3320
Lives for gear
 
loopy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thecld View Post
That's interesting, because this beta firmware definitely resolved sample rate sync problems on my 624
I've been using the beta firmware on my Ultralite AVB with no issues at all. Runs fine.
Old 5th January 2018
  #3321
Here for the gear
 

Yesterday I was super excited to pick up the 1248. Today I returned it fairly disappointed.

I was upgrading from a Scarlett 2i2 so this was a fair chunk of money for me.

Running pro tools 10 on a 2012 MacBook pro with i7, 8gb ram, 500gb ssd, I couldn't even play a stereo track with no plugs at 1024 buffer without getting a pro tools CPU error -6101. I was using usb, as I use the thunderbolt connection to an external monitor. Latest firmware and driver's.

This was massively disappointing seeing as I run my scarlett with ~50 tracks of audio, midi, multiple plugs at 256 buffer with no issue at all.

I even tested pt12 on my other MacBook (same specs) with the same issue.

I was however able to run a 40 track logic session with multiple plugs at 32 buffer with a 3ms round trip latency with no issues.

The guys at store I got it from said I should reinstall my OS and start fresh, or buy a thunderbolt cable and try that, or upgrade pro tools, or just use logic. Any of these things may have fixed it, but it kind of defeats the purpose of spending $2200aud for me. I currently don't have the money to be spending more to get it to work, or changing my entire workflow to compensate for this not straight up working when it 'should'.

I got a full refund which was really nice and will now save more money to buy something different, maybe rme or focusrite.

All in all, the specs are amazing, the software was great. Annoying it didn't enjoy pro tools.
Old 5th January 2018
  #3322
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Majora_z View Post
Running pro tools 10 on a 2012 MacBook pro with i7, 8gb ram, 500gb ssd, I couldn't even play a stereo track with no plugs at 1024 buffer without getting a pro tools CPU error -6101.
I think this is caused by the 32 channel limit in Pro Tools' ASIO implementation; by default the 1248 presents 48 channels to and from the computer, if you simply reduce that to 32 you would have been good. That's why Logic worked fine as it doesn't have this artificial limit.
Old 6th January 2018
  #3323
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Budd View Post
I think this is caused by the 32 channel limit in Pro Tools' ASIO implementation; by default the 1248 presents 48 channels to and from the computer, if you simply reduce that to 32 you would have been good. That's why Logic worked fine as it doesn't have this artificial limit.
I tried turning off all digital I/Os on the Motu so was only running 14/14 seeable by pro tools and logic and still had this same issue unfortunately.
Old 6th January 2018
  #3324
Here for the gear
 

It's the number of channels in the Computer Setup section you would have needed to change - this is not affected by enabling or disabling inputs or outputs.
Old 6th January 2018
  #3325
Lives for gear
 
Agzilla's Avatar
 

Went for a Motu 16a arriving on Monday!!!!

What I wanna know is simple, i hope... I just wanna run 16 out's of the 16a into my Nicerizer Mk2 and use the ADAT I/O on the Motu 16a with either my old RME Multiface OR Behringer UltraGain Pro 8200 or whatever it's called for 8 more outputs...

Whatever I send out i intend to record back summed into Logic via Motu's analogue inputs...if you see what I mean... pretty basic..

I'll be having to use USB on my MacPro 2009 with El Capitan.. I'm looking forward to getting setup but having read way too many pages of this long thread I'm now overloaded with info...

Some kind audio jedi please tell me if I'm wrong in thinking it will be simple plain sailing?

btw: BIG UP @mrmiller and a few others that made it all an epic read....


One Love.

Zz.
Old 7th January 2018
  #3326
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Budd View Post
It's the number of channels in the Computer Setup section you would have needed to change - this is not affected by enabling or disabling inputs or outputs.
I unselected all the computer ins/outs aside from computer out to main outs. Would pro tools still have picked those up, and does pro tools have that limit via thunderbolt? If not, I guess I need to save up to get a newer machine that I can actually utilise the thunderbolt ports.
Old 7th January 2018
  #3327
Lives for gear
 
subspace's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Majora_z View Post
I unselected all the computer ins/outs aside from computer out to main outs. Would pro tools still have picked those up, and does pro tools have that limit via thunderbolt? If not, I guess I need to save up to get a newer machine that I can actually utilise the thunderbolt ports.
He means under 'Computer Setup' the 'From Device to Computer' and 'From Computer to Device' settings:
Attached Thumbnails
MOTU 1248, 8M, 16A Thunderbolt interface-skarmavbild-2015-06-11-kl.-22.31.13.jpg  
Old 7th January 2018
  #3328
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by subspace View Post
He means under 'Computer Setup' the 'From Device to Computer' and 'From Computer to Device' settings:
Yep, so I tested running 2 streams "from computer to device" straight to main L/R after reading this page: MOTU.com - Tech Tips | MOTU AVB | To / From Computer Audio Streams

Edit: I feel like I jumped into getting this interface too soon. I made a quick decision to take it back straight away seeing as I'm away for work for a few weeks and was concerned about the 30 day returns policy. I need to do some more research and maybe give it another go at a better time. There is obviously more settings and tweaks that can be made to get this working properly within PT.
Old 9th January 2018
  #3329
Gear Nut
 
tagpass's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ejinbc View Post
Very occasionally (less than once a week with daily use) there will be a 'ping' sound and then all audio is delayed by about 1/2 second (the latest driver and the latest firmware, both before and after the new PC build, with earlier ProTools builds as well). Audio sounds like it has a spring reverb on it. A reboot fixes the problem. This only occurs when I am running at the lowest latency for recording - on the new 8700K build I can get away with 64/64 buffers in ProTools recording 16 audio, 16 midi and running 3 VIs @ 24/96 - which is awesome.
Unfortunately, I am still having major problems with some kind of latency or clocking problem with my AVB setup, even with the new drivers and even after numerous resets and reboots. I'm about at wit's end at this point:

So I have an 8A (as the "master" audio device, connected via USB) with a 16A connected to it via Ethernet cable. On the 8A, I've got my OASYS on the ADAT input, and the digital output set as TOSlink, connected back to the OASYS for an effects loop.

On the 16A, I've got 8 channels of inputs on ADAT 1 via Audient ASP800 (slaved via Wordclock) and 8 channels of outputs going to an Expert Sleepers ES-3. ADAT 2 is connected (in and out) to an Alesis AI-3.

If I am tracking anything with the OASYS, the 8A clock is set to Optical. If I am not using the OASYS, it is set to Internal.

Up until a few weeks back this setup worked flawlessly regardless of buffer settings.

Now, I am experiencing some very strange behavior with hardware devices connected to either interface. The same problem exists in Logic, Reason, and Ableton:

If I am playing/monitoring a hardware connected device, after a few moments, the audio glitches out and then there is severe "latency". If I change clock settings on the 8A from Optical to Internal and back again, sometimes it will right itself. Closing and reopening the project file will always fix it (until it happens again), as will rebooting either the computer or the 8A.

As an example, today I was playing a drum kit on my MPCX with an effects send to my OTO Biscuit. After several minutes, the audio seems to stutter, and then there is about 1/2 second delay between hearing the drum hit and the Biscuit processed effect, like there is now a delay effect, just as ejinbc described above...

What's weird is that this "latency issue" doesn't affect softsynths -- only hardware stuff that is routed to inputs/outputs of the AVB devices (in the scenario described above, the sound from the MPCX is coming from the MPC software).

As an experiment, I created a fresh AVB Routing for both devices that bypassed the MOTU on-board mixer -- same behavior occurred.

I'm not sure what is up, but it is at the point where I cannot record anything without the issue happening. I am going to try to shoot a short video to see if I can capture what is going on which will hopefully send some light that I'm not able to currently see. Perhaps it has to do with the way these devices are all clocked together -- I don't know -- but as I said, it has been working fine for the past few years since I've had the AVB devices and has only cropped up somewhere between the release of the last couple sets of MOTU drivers and my upgrade to High Sierra.
Old 9th January 2018
  #3330
Lives for gear
 
Lady Gaia's Avatar
That sounds incredibly frustrating. I don’t (yet) have another AVB device in my setup, so I’m just learning about MotU’s implementation of the relevant protocols in anticipation of the day it becomes relevant to me. In other words: I can’t pretend to be an expert. That said, obvious questions include: are the two interfaces directly connected with an Ethernet cable? Or are they connected to a hub (sudder) or AVB-aware switch with other devices (if your Mac is on the same AVB switch that could introduce interesting opportunities for OS-related issues)? Are you sure the relevant Ethernet cabling is Cat 5e or better?

Also, you’ve talked about conventional clocking, but which device is acting as the AVB clock master? Ensuring that they’re the same device may simplify tracking down the source of your issue.
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump