The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 All  This Thread  Reviews  Gear Database  Gear for sale     Latest  Trending
waves j37 vs kramer master tape
Old 19th October 2013
  #1
waves j37 vs kramer master tape

I like the j37 more even tho it costs $50 less. they are both amazing plugins
Old 25th October 2013
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Lorenzop's Avatar
 

why do you like it more ?

Can anybody please do a shootout betwen Kramer and J 37 ?
Old 25th October 2013
  #3
Lives for gear
 
bigbone's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorenzop View Post
why do you like it more ?

Can anybody please do a shootout betwen Kramer and J 37 ?


Old 10th November 2013
  #4
I had to respond to this question. I own both plugins, the J37 being the newest. Of course you can download both of these plugins to assess these for yourself, but, if you want an opinion from someone who has experienced both of these....

The J37 is LIGHT YEARS beyond the Eddie Kramer plugin. The J37 has a large boatload of GREAT and USABLE presets vs. the canoe full found in the Kramer for starters. Which you might not think a plus if you are a big do-it-yourselfer, but trust me, it is a big deal. The 16 preset effects found in the 'insert/return' tab in the Load tab are things that the Kramer cannot begin to duplicate, and probably things that you can actually use. Likewise the 16 presets found under the 'delay effects' tab in the Load tab. Then there's the 26 'normal' presets. That's 58 presets, unique and usable presets. The Kramer has 45 presets and, are you kidding me, very similar to each other such that IMO the total variety of presets found in the Kramer is maybe 16 - if that many, more like 5.

And I have not addressed the SOUNDs of the plugins. Let me just say that the J37 is something that actually DOES what you want a tape player to do to a track, while the Kramer is completely devoid of pixie dust.

If you are a DIY type guy and think you could bridge the gap between the two versions, Ha! You are kidding yourself. The plugins are EXTREMELY different.

I will also suggest/add that Waves has had 5 years to reconsider/think about getting a tape plugin to market - and Slate Digital has made a fuss with theirs in the meantime. They could have revamped the Kramer. Which would have saved their (me!) customers some money, right? But they didn't. Well, I think the reason for this is that the benchmark was raised so high by Slate Digital - and the Kramer technology was so dated - that rebuilding the Kramer would have been a waste of time and money. So they set their sights on another tape machine entirely. AND WHEN YOU HEAR THE RESULTS, you will appreciate what I am saying here. Again, LIGHT YEARS apart! [NOTE: It is also true that the J37 uses more CPU than the Kramer, something that confirms it's deeper process - and something you need to be mindful of if your DAW is dated.]

So, to those who are questioning purchasing the Kramer vs. the J37, there really is no contest. IMO the J37 is the ONLY tape plugin you should purchase from Waves today. If I could transfer my Kramer to you for FREE, I would do it because I will never use it again. Sorry Eddie.
Old 10th November 2013
  #5
Gear Head
 

I agree, the J37 kills the Kramer.

I have UAD ampex and studer plugins.

Now that I have J37, I use the studer less and less. Many things I used the ampex for has been moved to the J37 as well.

It's such a good plugin.

I find myself using the J37 on every individual track, and the ampex on busses and mix bus.

I've been using the J37 with the waves redd console emulation, then ampex, Fairchild, Plutec on mixbus, and it really helps nail an old school vibe.
Old 10th November 2013
  #6
Gear Guru
 
Jeezo's Avatar
Depends on the use ....the J37 is usable on buses and master ....the kramer not really ....but the kramer is pure fun as an effect on tracks
Old 11th November 2013
  #7
Lives for gear
 
barryfell's Avatar
+1 for J37 > Kramer. I feel I can dial in the response I want on the J37 far easier. The Kramer is pretty limited in comparison.
Old 11th November 2013
  #8
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeezo View Post
Depends on the use ....the J37 is usable on buses and master ....the kramer not really ....but the kramer is pure fun as an effect on tracks
I found it to enhance nicely a whole mix for mastering duties.

But it's not easy to find the sweet spot.

I found that feeding it with VU calibrated levels and dialing something like 300 on the flux control, can glue together things nicely.

Especially Hip-Hop beats !
Old 20th November 2013
  #9
Gear Maniac
 
autobot's Avatar
 

Put the J on a nice sampled 808 drumkit and you'll see what i mean......preset: mastering hi freq smoothing round bottom ;-)
Old 20th November 2013
  #10
Actually, I disagree.
I've done some extensive testing back and forth, especially with live drums, and the Kramer sounds a lot less like a clipper. I found that I could get away with higher overall volume and smoother kicks and snares whereas using the J37 it distorts a lot earlier in a nastier kind of way (either by raising the input or increasing the SAT knob).
Old 21st November 2013
  #11
Gear Maniac
 
autobot's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by manasseh View Post
Actually, I disagree.
I've done some extensive testing back and forth, especially with live drums, and the Kramer sounds a lot less like a clipper. I found that I could get away with higher overall volume and smoother kicks and snares whereas using the J37 it distorts a lot earlier in a nastier kind of way (either by raising the input or increasing the SAT knob).
I agree on the Kramer, but the thing is what you want your sound to be like.I think that J has a more controlled/rounded low end in contrast with the Kramer which blends ,a carpet like, low end in the signal.
Old 26th January 2014
  #12
Gear Nut
 

For tape saturation "effects", kramer with it´s flux range is still the one to beat
You have much less options to dirt the sound and a narrower sweetspot for -this- in other tape emus
I.m not talking subtle tape coloration here
Old 28th May 2017
  #13
Gear Head
 

I know I'm necro-raising this thread, but I know people still come across these "old" threads via Google searches and such.
I was using the J37 today and have used the Kramer a lot as well and got curious, "I wonder what others hear in terms of differences between these," so off a searching I went and came to this thread.

Chiming in, I think they both are great plugins, but are different animals.

Kramer:
To me, the Kramer imparts a sort of Sepia/Golden brown tone to a track/mix. It rounds off the transients a bit, while still allowing them to come through. On the low end, it fills it in and overall is a nice piece of "glue" if you are intentionally intending to get a "tape" sound. Not punchy, but not messy or murky either.

I used the Kramer on a national radio release (country) by Tigirlily, and it was just what that particular song needed. The Mastering was done in a couple hours and consisted primarily of the master bus comp on my 4000E and the Kramer to add a little "film grain" (borrowing a term from the film/photography business) to reduce some of the digital sheen. Incidentally, the song was written/recorded/produced/mixed by a guy named ISLAND who is a phenomenal artist and producer in his own right. Anyway, here's the track:

Tigirlily - "North Dakota"

(I wish he or I would've de-essed/hyped Kendra's vocals a bit more now that I listen back, but "brighter was better" in 2013. )


J37
The J37 is superior to the Kramer in the sense of true high-end tape emulation, though again, both are useful depending on the application.
Color-wise, the J37 is much more transparent, imparting bluish-greens to the sound. In comparison, the Kramer is the go-to if you intentionally want to sound like you recorded to tape. The J37 is the one you want to use if you don't necessarily want people to "hear" that you recorded to tape, but desire the listener to feel that tape saturation and sparkle more subconsciously.

In summary, the Kramer says, "hey look, y'all, I recorded to tape... hear my saturation roar!"
The J37 says, "I went to a world class studio and used one of the most well-maintained and expensive tape machines I could find because I wanted you to feel the sound that high-end tape imparts to a mix, but not expressly hear it."

Hope this helps some.
- Skylyter -

Last edited by Skylyter; 28th May 2017 at 06:31 AM.. Reason: Simple edit.
Old 21st July 2017
  #14
Lives for gear
 
andy3's Avatar
 

Is there a way to totally kill the noise on the waves J37?
Old 21st July 2017
  #15
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
As long as we are on the subject, j37 is $70 and Kramer is $50 today.
Old 21st July 2017
  #16
i demoed the J37, kramer, all the UAD tape(Ampex,Studer,Oxide) and the new Softube one for master mixbuss duties, just to kinda glue the whole thing together, and I chose the J37(the Abbey Road default setting) it just did what I wanted it do do the best, in that situation anyway.
Old 22nd July 2017
  #17
Gear Nut
 

They are so diferent machines from diferent musical contexts. Ampex is from USA 50s and J37 is Europe 60s. The sound of the 50s is not the sound of the 60s. Anyway people tend to believe Ampex 350 or 50s technology did not produce a sound as detailed as later on 60s but I disagree 100%, you just listen to a good record of "Only the lonely" by Roy Orbison and think about it.
The best way to take the best of these machines emus is to know a lot about the machines and how the people used them so you can get most benefits.
The matter is 90% users are not going to use these machines emus like the original way so they will use them for FX or coloring or saturation purposes and not like if they were recording a band on that machine. So the goals are not the same goals the engineers from then had, and this is ok(anybody is free to do ehat they want) but it leads us to a situation where these recording machines are analysed or valued just as boxes of separated effects. I would like a thread where a conversation about using these plugins as recording machines was possible.

PD: there is a J37 for Nebula made by TimP and it is light years ahead from waves one, and this is exactly comparing apples to apples
Old 25th July 2017
  #18
Lives for gear
J37: $29 today. I think I'll pick it up.
Old 26th July 2017
  #19
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squeegee 303 View Post
J37: $29 today. I think I'll pick it up.
Got it today with CLA Mixdown, $35.75 (CLA bundle owners discount + 25% off J37 as second plug in))
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump