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Roger Nichols buys ELEMENTAL AUDIO SYSTEMS!
Old 21st May 2006
  #1
Roger Nichols buys ELEMENTAL AUDIO SYSTEMS!

http://www.elementalaudio.com/

here we go.. price is 3times as much as the old pluggos.
no free inspector anymore..
ilok safety now:(

wooow.. **** happens
Old 21st May 2006
  #2
LEX
Gear Maniac
 

Blows.

There is no more Inspector as you said. Anyone have a copy they can email me?

What plugins are like the old one?

I liked Firuim.

LEX
Old 21st May 2006
  #3
these are the old ones.. only diffrent interface & ilok!

of course they will tell you: we made a lot of improvement and bugfixing.. but.. yeah.. why 3 times the price?

that's not cool.

tutt
Old 21st May 2006
  #4
Here for the gear
 

I was quite shocked as I read the announcement yesterday on EA´s homepage. I happily own all of their plugins except Finis (whose sound I didn´t like at all), but I want to know what will happen to old customers. Do we have to use Ilok for future upgrades? What about the promised free upgrade to the next plugins version? We will see, I think.
The new prices, however, are ridicoulously high for non-DSP plugins.



Michael
Old 21st May 2006
  #5
Lives for gear
 
Albert's Avatar
 

You'd hope that RND would offer some sweet deals to existing owners to keep them aboard further into the future.

However, you should read the notice on the EA page linked to above, as they do say this:

"Elemental Audio will continue to provide technical support to existing customers for the forseeable future and will produce one more product update for current customers. Customers will receive full details by e-mail in the coming days."

So let's maybe not jump to too many conclusions, as EA does seem to be keeping it's promises.

It's also worth noting that RND licensed the plugs from EA, and is now the distributor. That means that EA still owns them. I also wouldn't be surprised if EA continues to do the programming on them.
Old 21st May 2006
  #6
you are absolutely right, buts that's a Rip-Off and in my opinion just stupid. maybe he will change his mind.. who knows.

thanx for the input Albert
Old 21st May 2006
  #7
Lives for gear
 
Albert's Avatar
 

It might have been better from a PR point of view for him to take over distribution, lending his well known name to the product for higher visibility, but then not do the price gouging thing.

For example, I think another way to approach this would have been to keep the prices in the same approximate range (a reasonable bump up could have been expected), leave the copy protection alone or offer iLok *additionally* to those that would want it, and then offer his own presets to existing customers at a reasonable price. The presets are obviously just small files that get put in a folder, and could easily sold as downloads independent of the plugins. The lack of numerous high quality presets was one of the weaknesses in EA's approach, in my opinion.

Something like this would have gotten the product a lot more publicity thanks to Nichols' well known name, while at the same time not cutting out the original EA customers from his "RND" brand of the same plugins. The way it has worked out, probably most of the original EA customer base is upset by the change and how it happened, and basically alienated from the "RND" products right now.

He's a great engineer, but his approach to taking over the distribution of EA's plugins seems clumsy and not fully thought through. We'll just have to see how it develops I guess.
Old 21st May 2006
  #8
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GP_Hawk's Avatar
From the e-mail I got, they are saying 1 free upgrade for the old vers., then after that there will be an offer to upgrade to RN vers. with maybe a $20.xx fee for the the box vers./written manual costs. Of course you upgrade to I-Lock vers.


p.s oh, they did mention it was a coincidence that the recent deal on the plugs(almost half off on some) was in no way associated with the RN take over, just bad timing!
Old 22nd May 2006
  #9
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

That's a shame they increased the price so drastically...
Old 22nd May 2006
  #10
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T_R_S's Avatar
Thumbs down

RND = TURD
Old 22nd May 2006
  #11
Lou Judson
Guest
Nichols just lost a huge amount of respect from me. Now he's just a corporation...

<L>
Old 22nd May 2006
  #12
Gear Addict
 
cymatics's Avatar
 

Looks like he already cut the prices back to $249 a pop.

http://www.rogernicholsdigital.com/products/

If the torch & pitchfork mob keeps this up, we'll be back to the original Elemental prices in no time!
Old 22nd May 2006
  #13
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Paul Vnuk Jr.'s Avatar
Interresting how folks where just as angry on his web site's own forums as they are here on GS and ... wow they are magically offline for "administrative purposes".

PV
Old 22nd May 2006
  #14
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

What a huge blunder.... What were they thinking?
Old 22nd May 2006
  #15
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copperx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cymatics
Looks like he already cut the prices back to $249 a pop.
WOW, this makes them look greedy. When they saw that nobody bit at those prices, they lowered them. EA had the supply-demand thing sorted out, why the arbitrary price increase? fuuck
Old 22nd May 2006
  #16
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copperx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cymatics
If the torch & pitchfork mob keeps this up, we'll be back to the original Elemental prices in no time!
And we'll hopefully (not!) see an RND Inspectorizer / RND Inspectorizer XtraLargery
Old 22nd May 2006
  #17
jow.. "down for maintenance"

Attached Thumbnails
Roger Nichols buys ELEMENTAL AUDIO SYSTEMS!-offline.jpg  
Old 22nd May 2006
  #18
Lou Judson
Guest
Cut 'em in half again, Rog ol boy. Then you'll sell some.

I think it is a bit deceptive to claim them and rename them especially with such ditzy names. Not that the original names were all that relevant either...

<L>
Old 23rd May 2006
  #19
Lives for gear
 
GP_Hawk's Avatar
Yeh, what's with the new names "****zerizer", "Dynoizolator", Craptasticpolarizer". Come on Roger.......
Old 23rd May 2006
  #20
Lives for gear
 
copperx's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by GPl
Come on Roger.......
Not everyone can be a Renaissance man.
Old 23rd May 2006
  #21
Lou Judson
Guest
Be a renaissancerizerer... err, maybe not.
Old 24th May 2006
  #22
update.. response written in the forum from Roger N. in person.

Quote:
Dear Forum users:

Thanks for stopping by. It is always good to have new comments.

I have not deleted any of these posts, and I am not going to. The only thing that upset me was the giant lime green font, which I have changed.

I am however dissappointed in the non-adult approach to the comments and sugggest that each of you delete your own posts.

1) Any existing Elemental customers can move over to the RND versions for less than $20. You will then own the expensive versions.

2) We are in the middle of adding features, improving those that exist, and creating TDM versions and versions for other hardware platforms.

3) RND purchased the rights to the Elemental plug-ins because I think they are the best available and will add to the future line-up to be offered by RND.

4) RND will be funding further developement of Elemental products as well as using Elemental to add their expertise in the developement of our plug-ins.

5) I am paid rather well for engineering and producing and do not need to rip off customers who buy plug-ins. We have invested substantial funds to build a succesful company and are not planning to leave anyone behind.

6) If you already have Elemental products, they will continue to work fine. We know that there are cracked versions of the ones you have. We cannot invest in new features with the possibility of kracks looming on the horizon, so we have implimented iLok protection.

7) I have spent 25 years developing software to make my records sound better. Some of the applications took an entire computer to run one instance. Now that computers are fast enough, those apps are being turned into plug-ins for others to use. There will be hundreds of presets available, tip sheets and videos available to add value to all of the plug-ins in the RND line.

8) I apologize for any surprises, but the e-mail from Elemental to its customers was late going out. The change-over was timed for the Paris AES show.

The RND web site is going to ramp up quickly with all of the content you are used to with the Elemental site, plus much more.

We are concentrating on the automated iLok authorizations for Demos and purchased products which has slowed the web site developement slightly, but this will speed up as soon as we return from AES.

Have a nice day.

RN
Old 24th May 2006
  #23
Lives for gear
 
Albert's Avatar
 

I for one find a "less than $20" crossgrade price to be quite reasonable. While I don't currently use iLok, I may reconsider if the new features on these plugins are compelling enough. I feel pretty lucky I got in at the old prices!
Old 24th May 2006
  #24
Lou Judson
Guest
My only response to RN's quoted response is, why are there no other products on the site than the newly bought ones? WHAT software development? Just looks in the plain light of day that he's cashing in commercially, like buying chinese mics and putting your name on it.

If he has devloped fancy software where is it?

I onlt know Nichols from his writing, not knowing if I have even heard his work (I don't listen to a lot of pop music), and this is just the way it appears. His defensive response does nothing to allay the feelings generated by the bare facts.

And still the silly names diminish the respect for the product...
Old 24th May 2006
  #25
LEX
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by GPl
Yeh, what's with the new names "****zerizer", "Dynoizolator", Craptasticpolarizer". Come on Roger.......
No kidding. Enough to stay away.

ILok is another.

LEX
Old 25th May 2006
  #26
Lives for gear
I dunno guys, seems kinda harsh? Companies buy each other out all the time, why the wrath for Rog? If ilok helps them make money and the price increase brings more features, isn't $349(todays price) reasonable?
Lots less than waves!
peace
daniel
Old 25th May 2006
  #27
Ilok doesnt help.. just tell the program "dont search the ilok dongle" and yeah.. things happen

the mainproblem is:
by just changing the layout of a plugin you must spend a lot of work on a design to raise the price 3 times

but its the market.. if we are not willing to pay it, he has to lower the prices or go another direction.. self regulation


cheers George
Old 25th May 2006
  #28
Lou Judson
Guest
I dunno, I only have Inspector, and would love to have these three, but not at this price. 250 each, if they were three for 550 or 600 maybe. But if I didn't buy them before, much less likely now.

Not harsh to me - just typical corporate gouging it seems. And such idiotic names!
Old 26th May 2006
  #29
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tengu's Avatar
Wasn't the max bundle a total of $350.

This has been a total scam, no ifs or buts. He would have known what the prices were at elemental audio and then to put that price rise on it without having developed them at all shows all the signs of capitalist greed.

Anyone who comes here to defend his position I suspect is somehow affiliated with Roger Nicolls because there has been ZERO integrity with what he has done.
Old 26th May 2006
  #30
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tengu
Wasn't the max bundle a total of $350.

This has been a total scam, no ifs or buts. He would have known what the prices were at elemental audio and then to put that price rise on it without having developed them at all shows all the signs of capitalist greed.
It shows that somebody sat down, ran the numbers, and came to the conclusion that the EAS plugs were underpriced relative to the market (we all knew and appreciated that) and perhaps underpriced relative to remaining a viable business (the EAS folks obviously had their motivations here as well), and that they'd also have to raise money to cover the cost of the exclusive licensing agreement, which I hope for the EAS guys' benefit wasn't cheap. I'd say it shows all the signs of capitalism; greed is in the eye of the beholder. I'm reminded of a saying (I think it was Mel Brooks): "Comedy is when *you* fall down a hole. Tragedy is when *I* fall down a hole."

Quote:
Originally Posted by tengu
Anyone who comes here to defend his position I suspect is somehow affiliated with Roger Nicolls because there has been ZERO integrity with what he has done.
Anyone who comes here and slams him I suspect didn't buy the EAS plugs when they were cheap, and now they're mad because they're not so cheap any more.

I always find it amusing that people get mad when prices go up (because they haven't bought, and somehow now feel cheated) or prices go down (because they did buy, and somehow now feel cheated.) One could just as easily come up with positive attitudes about both scenarios (I like the latter scenario better, thank you) but it's like playing the stock market; no matter what happens, most people feel lousy.

For the record, I have no affiliation, and yes, I did buy all of the EAS plugs previously.

Also for the record, they completely screwed up the announcement and apparently got bad advice on the pricing (given that it seems that they've dropped it by a good chunk.) That does not necessarily mean that they are without integrity, it probably means that somebody might get fired and a lot of people are feeling stupid.

Impugning integrity based purely on the contents of a web site is absurd, unless you happen to know the people involved or have an inside line to more information than the rest of us have. Now it may be that everyone involved is an Evil Greedy Bastard™ but that's unlikely, and if it turns out to be true, capitalist Darwinism will take over, the company will fail, and we can all take up a pool to buy the assets at auction for pennies on the dollar and sell 'em for $.25 per (this worked nicely for sat phones and transoceanic fiber.)

Meanwhile, folks should just get over it, IMHO.
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