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Old 4 weeks ago
  #7621
Lives for gear
 
zaphod's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by borlandsamuel.re View Post
Find the thread where 4 people who own both, say that Calrec better than Neve, while cheaper. The 10K sound like Bentley.
Sitting now listening to it and in some ways they are right, even in passthrough, Calrec sound very luxury what I perceived for intelligence)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ericbridenbaker View Post
It really is a top quality mixing eq with very tight, solid state console sound. The DL16FiFTY6 v2 limiter that goes with it is great too.
Agreed, they are very good

Quote:
Originally Posted by telluride View Post
Do you mean leaving the company or this forum?
I'm not planning to leave the company, it is my company. But yes, the idea is about delegating more. I'll focus on the things I like the most. I would prefer to improve the Aquarius platform, there is so much fun there

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mplay View Post
I dreamt Acustica did a softsynth with the Volterra kernel technology build right into the oscillators, maybe that's your next project Giancarlo? It sounded so awesome
It was suggested several times, yes. I'm not sure about it. Too many things, we would loose our focus

Quote:
Originally Posted by breakline View Post
I don't hear this supposed "closing gap". What I hear is that algos hype the sound more and more to circumvent the lack of depth and the soundstage is still crap, almost always. If you measure algos vs hardware you can see how algos have always more harmonics, more hype and more volume, but always lack the soundstage and the stereo field of hardware. You cannot algorhytmically create the effect of transformers or diodes for example really well. Always comes out that you have a finite world in digital with infinite in analog.

If I see a studio where they use plugins like Slate or Waves or whatever, for me that means that studio puts "workflow" and being lazy over the quality of the material. I haven't really heard convincing demos where the plugin is even on the same level as the hardware.

Does the consumer/listener care? No, probably does not. But I do, I mean if I get to work ITB at least I wanna have fun and not feeling like I'm fighting digital sounds. Sure no ecosystem is perfect or without bugs or whatever, but that could be said about anything computer. Everything has drawbacks too. Acustica is not perfect of course, and not even the sound is exactly the same: it's probably the closest I've heard though, and that little offset or difference is an acceptable compromise for me.
Quoted, every single word
This is our mission. For me it is not important that everyone understands the need to be so meticulous, I want to do it for myself.
However, I must confess that this is also a wonderful time for our business. I can't understand if it's because it's easier to buy a powerful computer, or simply because our message has reached more users, so this leads us to improve, because we have more resources.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7622
Quote:
Originally Posted by Will The Weirdo View Post
So..... when you got rid of all your Acustica stuff did you sonically upgrade to hardware or downgrade to algorithmic plugins?
I sonically upgraded to algorithmic plugins
I improved my workflow in every aspect

I get rid of all this "wobble" and "chirps"
I get rid of all hassle with CPU and latency

You know from the old age Acustica Audio was telling that "Nebula is the best! Nebula is the future!". Something like this I heard in 2010, in 2012, in 2015, in 2017 and in 2019. And all the pros still using Waves, UAD, Cytomic, and all other algorithmic plugins. Go figure out

When I need separate Nebula instance for preamp section and for compression section of Opto32 or RCA comp - it pisses me off.
When all the latency are stacking up and it's sound just as good as some zero-latency low-CPU plugins - I ask myself why bother
When harmonic distortion is so low (say hello to crips and stuff), I can't hear proper analog coloration - I ask myself why bother
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7623
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvgenyStudio View Post
You know from the old age Acustica Audio was telling that "Nebula is the best! Nebula is the future!". Something like this I heard in 2010, in 2012, in 2015, in 2017 and in 2019. And all the pros still using Waves, UAD, Cytomic, and all other algorithmic plugins. Go figure out
Most of those pros are getting mixes done through high end desks or through high quality rack pres and pre-mixes through hardware. The coloration is already there. A lot of pros are still using hybrid setups anyway, with outboard bus comps and things like that. Some of the stuff that isn't done in expensive studios (Billie Eilish, for example) is still sent to pro mixers who are likely using great gear and know their ****. A lot of those Billie Eilish mixes sound hyped and like they're full of artifacts to me anyway, but the audience who's listening doesn't care.

The best option is a mix of things to me. I still use some algo plugins because they do what they do in the best way (limiters, for example). I still use True Iron, Kazrog, Echoboy, TDR Limiter 6, etc.

I can't afford a Fearn VT-7 right now or Coil CA-70 pres, so I look for alternatives. In all honesty, though, I'm using AA plugs more than N4 now. TimP's comps are the only real Nebula libraries I'm still using. Part of this is where the business model is heading for AA and how Nebula has been left behind.

Just use what works for you and move on, anyway. We're getting into a golden age of recording quality, and both (select) algo plugs and AA products are sounding so good these days. It's easier than ever to get amazing quality.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7624
Lives for gear
 
Will The Weirdo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvgenyStudio View Post
I sonically upgraded to algorithmic plugins
I improved my workflow in every aspect
Pros are using top end hardware and algo's or top end hardware and Acqua's or both today, so don't fool yourself. I know this because I visit my pro friends (I'm an old pro myself) in Atlanta and LA and see their workflows. AA has slowly infiltrated major studios all over the world.

I myself went back hybrid and enjoy the best of both worlds..... but I've yet to meet an algo plugin that was superior sounding to Nebula, in fact my last mix every algo compressor I tried failed next to Opto 3A and Brighton, but to each their own. IMHO, only Liquidsonics can compete in verbs but they use convolution IR too, lol.

As to workflow it's easy to beat AA, and that's the only reason I even keep attempting to use algos in 2019.

For workflow
1. Algo
2. Acustica
3. Hardware

For Sound
1. Hardware
2. Acustica
3. Algo

Before anyone snaps back at me, that's my professional opinion in testing over the past 10 years and up to 2 days ago, and I sit in front of top end hardware daily.

As always to each their own.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7625
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vdosh View Post
Why N4 seems to be downgraded to 32 bit, where N3 is 64 bit ?
We must be informed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cali.bre View Post
The cynic in me thinks all these downgrades in functionality with things like skins and bit depth etc and keeping the cost of N4 far beyond the realms of reasonable pricing for most, is just to phase N4 out and in favour of the more lucrative Acquas. I've said this from the start.
And now with the heavily discounted Acqua pre-sales, even more users new and old will focus on Acquas.
I would not think so ; remember that the to come Modula has N4 for prerequisite.
...
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7626
Lives for gear
 
zaphod's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vdosh View Post
I would not think so ; remember that the to come Modula has N4 for prerequisite.
...
The engine is exactly the same
This is my final word on the matter
Quite in the opposite, nebula3 is buggy
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7627
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zabukowski View Post
N4 is being updated with newer JUCE framework, which also includes double precision interface (already featured in other wrappers). As Giancarlo already noted, this is only on the outside - internal processing is already 64 bit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by goshalev View Post
When we will see N4 with double precision interface(64-bit) in our Aquarius?
This is the question.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zabukowski View Post
When transition to the new framework is finished, it'll be available in Aquarius, as all other versions before.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zaphod View Post
The engine is exactly the same
This is my final word on the matter
Quite in the opposite, nebula3 is buggy
With all this said, we're eagerly waiting for N4 with double precision interface (64-bit) in our Aquarius very soon.
Hoping the persistant N4 current last version "recall bug" will be masterfully crushed in the same time.
.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7628
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vdosh View Post
N4 current last version "recall bug"
.
Which version?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7629
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjack2020 View Post
Which version?
R010

"recall bug" using BRIGHTON OPTO TUBE COMP from London Acoustics
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7630
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by goshalev View Post
R010

"recall bug" using BRIGHTON OPTO TUBE COMP from London Acoustics
...And also using VIRGO from DiBiQuadro Audio.

These are the currently known ones suffering from the current N4 "recall bug".
Maybe there are others not yet discovered, or not yet mentionned.

DiBiQuadro Virgo - The Best Clean Guitar Amplifier - Official Acqua N4 Plugin
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7631
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
But aren’t those standalone Acquas that are used outside of N4? I know you can choose to install directly to N4 but also you can choose to set them up as their own thing (AU, etc) Maybe try that and the bug would go away?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7632
Gear Nut
 

These would not work without N4, they need N4, they are built for N4.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7633
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vdosh View Post
These would not work without N4, they need N4, they are built for N4.
I own Tokyo Tube EQ by London Acoustics and you can choose to install it as an AU. Pretty sure I use it in Logic without N4. I know for a fact I use that new free BAX eq without N4. It is standalone if you want it to be.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7634
Lives for gear
 
zaphod's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vdosh View Post
With all this said, we're eagerly waiting for N4 with double precision interface (64-bit) in our Aquarius very soon.
Hoping the persistant N4 current last version "recall bug" will be masterfully crushed in the same time.
.
The improvement at the interface level is one of the things we planned several months ago (a lot of months ago). I think things are ready - or almost ready - or just ready for the beta testing
I'm not sure about the time for fixing recall bugs, I guess they are caused by the adjustments we are doing for Catalina - and they are not completed.
Despite the fact I release silently in beta testing all possible engines in a testing folder, several issues were reported very late - months after the upload. Also several libraries were not tested against new engines, and it was because the process was not clear or explained enough. We'll try to increase the beta testing team size as soon as we have a bit of time - and to improve a bit testing procedures.

BUT:
I'll be straight on it, several releases are late because latest apple constraints. We froze a lot of developments and we are completing this for Catalina, and it will require not less than 2 months.
So you have an idea about the wait - we'll be back on nebula-related things around January, not before. At that point all catalina-related developments will be frozen and we'll have a solid base for tuning and fixing.

While the engine development team will compete the Catalina porting all other teams will stick to current engines. In January we'll change it again: Catalina aquarius releases will be enforced while we are at the engine level back again. Hope it gives to you a clear roadmap, I love to share these details

Last edited by zaphod; 4 weeks ago at 03:46 AM..
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7635
Lives for gear
 

Mmmm .... AlexB just sending out an UPDATE for the Mastering Console for beta-testing, tonite.

I'll start on that later this evening ....



edit ...

Also, a new Library will be arriving for testing ....
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7636
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjack2020 View Post
I own Tokyo Tube EQ by London Acoustics and you can choose to install it as an AU. Pretty sure I use it in Logic without N4. I know for a fact I use that new free BAX eq without N4. It is standalone if you want it to be.
From the Tokyo Tube EQ Product page, "How to install and use" (emphasis is mine):

"An Acqua library is similar to a Nebula library but it is built by merging several emulation presets into a single one, resulting in a more complex simulation with a custom user interface.
It’s exactly like a standalone Acqua plugin but it needs N4/N4 Player framework to run properly.
In this way you will have always the latest updated Acqua engine for all of your Third Party Plugins"



So, if you have it installed, you do have N4 (player or commercial) installed.


Bax EQ is NOT a N4 Acqua library. It is an Acqua plugin. There is a difference.



Hope this helps.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7637
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
cool, I’m no expert. I just thought there might be a way around that bug. Now I see it’s more complex than that...My bad.

What if you downgrade your N4 Player only? And leave N4 FULL up to date? No dice?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7638
Lives for gear
 
zaphod's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by cjack2020 View Post
cool, I’m no expert. I just thought there might be a way around that bug. Now I see it’s more complex than that...My bad.

What if you downgrade your N4 Player only? And leave N4 FULL up to date? No dice?
Sometimes we are faster. Let's keep it real, it could be a slow debug, it was catched very late so we have to go back quite a lot.
Also, it is not an issue, because Aquarius. You can have back and forward to the release which works in your system. Just stick to the release which works, simple like that
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7639
Gear Maniac
 
plexus's Avatar
 

It would be great if these things were fixed in N4:

on Logic Pro X,
1. If N4 is disabled it completely disables the plugin, like all other plugins

2. If no audio is flowing to N4 is stops consuming CPU, like all othe plugins

2. If a track is frozen with N4 on it, all instances of N4 stop consuming CPU, like all other plugins

3. The incredible amounts of latency that accummulate when using N4 instances is mitigated many orders of magnitude less to the degree the usability is not negatively impacted

Thanks.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7640
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
IMHO some of you guys are pretty hard on G when it comes to getting things to work the way you think they should work...I mean Barking orders and rude requests..I mean it is HIS company and it seems like he’s working around the clock to improve and to get things running smoothly.

It’s funny how when the whole Alex B thing wobble/chirp thing was going down, some people wanted to treat him like a saint, and any badmouthing of his work was frowned upon by some.....even though he had/has no intentions of fixing bugs or righting his wrongs, just Money out the window.

My opinion only.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7641
Gear Maniac
 
plexus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjack2020 View Post
IMHO some of you guys are pretty hard on G when it comes to getting things to work the way you think they should work.
Yes, because we pay money for this stuff and at the very least we expect it to work. N4 doesn't work, in terms of what is considered normal plugin behaviour, under Logic Pro X. It doesn't work so much that the use of N4 is severely crippled. If it was free, ok. But it's not free. They are a company, we are customers and we aren't fanbois. Our pespective is different than yours because of that. You don't have to agree but at least try and understand.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7642
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by plexus View Post
Yes, because we pay money for this stuff and at the very least we expect it to work. N4 doesn't work, in terms of what is considered normal plugin behaviour, under Logic Pro X. It doesn't work so much that the use of N4 is severely crippled. If it was free, ok. But it's not free. They are a company, we are customers and we aren't fanbois. Our pespective is different than yours because of that. You don't have to agree but at least try and understand.
It’s all good! Just a general observation. There’s a second half to my post that was a very important point...and really was the only reason I said anything.

As a LPX 10.4.4 user I’m not experiencing any problems with N4. Been using Nebs for almost a year and haven’t experienced any of the issues in your previous post. Then again, lately I don’t use a considerable amount of Nebula in one project. (Will gravitate to a Tim P Neb here/there for reasons in my previous post)

I just upgraded to the most recent N4 as of yesterday, and if I do have problems, I’ll downgrade and keep it moving until there’s a fix.

Just found a love for summing w/ Navy2 (which really takes away any bad feelings I had about still not having a console sim with no problems) so I respect the fact that there’s constant progress being made in the Acqua world.

I’ve spent just as much $ as Anyone else on this tech. So I just appreciate G’s transparency and the constant updates

Last edited by cjack2020; 4 weeks ago at 08:20 AM..
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7643
Gear Maniac
 
plexus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjack2020 View Post

As a LPX 10.4.4 user I’m not experiencing any problems with N4.
Try this: open Activity Monitor (unless you use some other CPU meter). while it's open, instantiate N4 in Logic a number of times with active programs like EQs etc. You can just option-drag to copy them, or put a bunch in one track and then duplicate the track. As the number of N4 instances increase, on my systems, the CPU load will increase even with no audio running through them. Do this until you have a lot of CPU load. Now, put some kind of audio on the tracks and freeze the tracks; on my system, even once they are frozen, N4 will still be consuming the same amount of CPU. Unfreeze them and disable all the N4's, again the CPU loan on my system will not go down.

The reason this is important is because it severely limits the ability to use N4 for serious audio work since no matter what I do I can not manage the CPU load... LIKE I CAN DO WITH EVERY OTHER PLUGIN.

Also, when you get into using console emulation libraries it requires the use of even more instances and with projects with a lot of tracks it becomes unusable.

Let me know if you system reacts differently. I am led to understand this is not isolated to my system.

On the other hand, Acquas work fine (so far).

Last edited by plexus; 4 weeks ago at 09:04 AM..
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7644
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by plexus View Post
Try this: open Activity Monitor (unless you use some other CPU meter). while it's open, instantiate N4 in Logic a number of times with active programs like EQs etc. You can just option-drag to copy them, or put a bunch in one track and then duplicate the track. As the number of N4 instances increase, on my systems, the CPU load will increase even with no audio running through them. Do this until you have a lot of CPU load. Now, put some kind of audio on the tracks and freeze the tracks; on my system, even once they are frozen, N4 will still be consuming the same amount of CPU. Unfreeze them and disable all the N4's, again the CPU loan on my system will not go down.

The reason this is important is because it severely limits the ability to use N4 for serious audio work since no matter what I do I can not manage the CPU load... LIKE I CAN DO WITH EVERY OTHER PLUGIN.

Also, when you get into using console emulation libraries it requires the use of even more instances and with projects with a lot of tracks it becomes unusable.

Let me know if you system reacts differently. I am led to understand this is not isolated to my system.
Tried a quick test with:

-10 empty tracks with Silk Eq (and also the separate harmonics instance on each track) at 96k.

-One apple audio loop on repeat cycle for four bars on one of the tracks

While loop plays, I now have 2.8 GB of free RAM on my machine which only has 8GB RAM. (Using CleanMyMac 3 to monitor my usage and also to free up RAM on command when possible)

Edit: after freezing and freeing up RAM I now have 4.55 GB of free RAM.

Are you able to try this test really quick?

Here I’m not experiencing anything abnormal..let me know..

Last edited by cjack2020; 4 weeks ago at 09:04 AM.. Reason: Forgot to freeze tracks
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7645
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by plexus View Post
Also, when you get into using console emulation libraries it requires the use of even more instances and with projects with a lot of tracks it becomes unusable.
With Navy2 I am only using it for group summing. So I have one instance on the master bus, synth bus, drums, vocal bus 1, vocal bus 2, etc. [8 groups max] sounds exceptionally good. Everything else is already processed by hardware, algo, and a Tim P here/there.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7646
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by plexus View Post
Try this: open Activity Monitor (unless you use some other CPU meter). while it's open, instantiate N4 in Logic a number of times with active programs like EQs etc. You can just option-drag to copy them, or put a bunch in one track and then duplicate the track. As the number of N4 instances increase, on my systems, the CPU load will increase even with no audio running through them. Do this until you have a lot of CPU load. Now, put some kind of audio on the tracks and freeze the tracks; on my system, even once they are frozen, N4 will still be consuming the same amount of CPU. Unfreeze them and disable all the N4's, again the CPU loan on my system will not go down.

The reason this is important is because it severely limits the ability to use N4 for serious audio work since no matter what I do I can not manage the CPU load... LIKE I CAN DO WITH EVERY OTHER PLUGIN.

Also, when you get into using console emulation libraries it requires the use of even more instances and with projects with a lot of tracks it becomes unusable.

Let me know if you system reacts differently. I am led to understand this is not isolated to my system.

On the other hand, Acquas work fine (so far).
This sounds like a DAW issue and nothing to do with N4. Also, "freeze and flatten" is a very good thing to get used to when working ITB in any case. Not just to easy CPU load but as a tool to move forward with things and commit to settings permanently. Once it's audio there is no going back (well you can keep your original audio if any), and that's the way analog works too.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7647
Gear Maniac
 
plexus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by breakline View Post
This sounds like a DAW issue and nothing to do with N4. Also, "freeze and flatten" is a very good thing to get used to when working ITB in any case. Not just to easy CPU load but as a tool to move forward with things and commit to settings permanently. Once it's audio there is no going back (well you can keep your original audio if any), and that's the way analog works too.
It's not a "DAW thing" - AA confirmed they over-ride these features to "prevent CPU spikes". However it severly limits the user's ability to manage CPU resources and hence limit to what degree N4 can be used. It also breaks a bunch of standard features and functions such as plugin bypass and freeze. I'd have to see the impact of these supposed "CPU spikes" to be convinced its worth giving up usability of the plugin to that degree.

Anyway, it's been argued about ad noseum on KVR. I don't use N4 anymore and want to sell it and my vast 3rd party library. I didn't bump into this issue until I started to really use N4 and then I discovered I could only get so far with it and since no CPU management was supported by AA breaking these DAW features. By then I amassed quite a (expensive) library and now it's all pretty useless to me.

I am starting to migrate to Reaper. I have yet to test N4 out on that platform. I am hoping it's a better experience than with Logic. Then, maybe I can get back to work with it.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7648
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by plexus View Post
It's not a "DAW thing" - AA confirmed they over-ride these features to "prevent CPU spikes". However it severly limits the user's ability to manage CPU resources and hence limit to what degree N4 can be used. It also breaks a bunch of standard features and functions such as plugin bypass and freeze. I'd have to see the impact of these supposed "CPU spikes" to be convinced its worth giving up usability of the plugin to that degree.

Anyway, it's been argued about ad noseum on KVR. I don't use N4 anymore and want to sell it and my vast 3rd party library. I didn't bump into this issue until I started to really use N4 and then I discovered I could only get so far with it and since no CPU management was supported by AA breaking these DAW features. By then I amassed quite a (expensive) library and now it's all pretty useless to me.

I am starting to migrate to Reaper. I have yet to test N4 out on that platform. I am hoping it's a better experience than with Logic. Then, maybe I can get back to work with it.
You asked me to go out of my way to do something for you...Did you try the test or..?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7649
Gear Maniac
 
plexus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cjack2020 View Post
You asked me to go out of my way to do something for you...Did you try the test or..?
Yes I tried it with Silk HL, Mid, Harmonics on 10 tracks is not enough to get my CPU load up to the point I mentioned. I was working on a mock project that would but I had to attend to some other things. Its not for my edification however as I have thoroughly tested this and validated the issue with AA. In other words I dont need further validation of the problems. In order to see what I am talking about you have to be in a high CPU load situation which I generally find occurs when using console libraries across the project.

Last edited by plexus; 4 weeks ago at 06:09 PM..
Old 4 weeks ago
  #7650
Gear Maniac
 
cjack2020's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by plexus View Post
10 tracks of silk is not enough to get my CPU load up to the point I mentioned. I was working on a mock project that would but I had to attend to some other things. Its not for my edification however as I have thoroughly tested this and validated the issue with AA. In other words I dont need further validation of the problems. In order to see what I am talking about you have to be in a high CPU load situation which I generally find occurs when using console libraries across the project.
Regardless of what Nebula I used, freezing reduced some CPU load and that was the point of my test.. It sounds like you need to manage your CPU load properly.

Why would you even need console libraries across the project when you could just commit to the audio on the tracks (and use the console libraries only on groups and 2 bus?) organize yourself. It’s no secret Nebula is taxing on computers.....

Even when I was using still using 30+ Nebulas on tracks and console on buses I still got by and my machine is old and not even that good.

Lol you’re hating on LPX and N4 and there’s others with your exact same setup making sh*t work.

I rock Logic Pro and N4 daily lol. So really your anger is misdirected and u spreading misinformation...lol you’re out of line saying I’m a “fanboi”..really I’m a fanboi of my own music lol. Plugins don’t make me who I am. I gravitate to what plugins sound good regardless of who designs them.

P.S. maybe you should try something like CleanMyMacX to help monitor your CPU and ‘force’
it to free up on command.

Last edited by cjack2020; 4 weeks ago at 06:33 PM..
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