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4, 6, 8 or 12 Core Apple with Digital Performer 7 and Logic 9 Effects Pedals, Units & Accessories
Old 30th December 2010
  #1
Here for the gear
 

Cool 4, 6, 8 or 12 Core Apple with Digital Performer 7 and Logic 9

Hello all,

I just can't figure out what I need to get. I currently have a G5 and am in need of an upgrade. I can't use any of my new software with the G5 - plus I need more horsepower!

So my question is... 4, 6, 8 or 12 cores? Clock speed vs. more cores? Which is better for music applications? I've been told a couple of things... one engineer at apple said to get the 6. Someone over at MOTU said the same thing.

I compose for film so I'm using a lot of software synths as well as live instruments. For this I need to use a lot of tracks. On my G5 I can get a good 60 tracks from both software and live. My machine slows down a bit but it works. I need a machine that can do more and at super fast speeds.

Before I spend all of this money I'd like to make sure I get the "right one."

HELP!

Thanks!
Old 30th December 2010
  #2
Gear Maniac
 
scitscat's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComposerKeyGreg View Post
Hello all,

I just can't figure out what I need to get. I currently have a G5 and am in need of an upgrade. I can't use any of my new software with the G5 - plus I need more horsepower!

So my question is... 4, 6, 8 or 12 cores? Clock speed vs. more cores? Which is better for music applications? I've been told a couple of things... one engineer at apple said to get the 6. Someone over at MOTU said the same thing.

I compose for film so I'm using a lot of software synths as well as live instruments. For this I need to use a lot of tracks. On my G5 I can get a good 60 tracks from both software and live. My machine slows down a bit but it works. I need a machine that can do more and at super fast speeds.

Before I spend all of this money I'd like to make sure I get the "right one."

HELP!

Thanks!

I have an 8 core and still run out of power, so not sure what to tell you. Think am going to have to bounce or freeze more instruments, which takes away from composition for me and makes it less fun and less intuitive. It is the 5400 model from 2009, ages ago, but... still believe it should be good enough to get serious work done, but bouncing seems to be the way, IMHO

One thing I would recommend, is to use Glyph Drives or comparable for the audio, I do and have for years, they seem to not give me as much problems, but I put the libraries, on different drives and that helps.
Old 30th December 2010
  #3
Gear Addict
 
captainate's Avatar
 

You may want someone more informed than I to tell you about how a program like Logic responds to multi-core processors. I believe there are limits to how the program can delegate tasks between cores.
Old 30th December 2010
  #4
Gear Maniac
 
scitscat's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainate View Post
You may want someone more informed than I to tell you about how a program like Logic responds to multi-core processors. I believe there are limits to how the program can delegate tasks between cores.

True, not my specialty either.

It would seem that the next step is, probably, SSD when they drop in price.
Old 30th December 2010
  #5
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComposerKeyGreg View Post
Hello all,

I just can't figure out what I need to get. I currently have a G5 and am in need of an upgrade. I can't use any of my new software with the G5 - plus I need more horsepower!

So my question is... 4, 6, 8 or 12 cores? Clock speed vs. more cores? Which is better for music applications? I've been told a couple of things... one engineer at apple said to get the 6. Someone over at MOTU said the same thing.

I compose for film so I'm using a lot of software synths as well as live instruments. For this I need to use a lot of tracks. On my G5 I can get a good 60 tracks from both software and live. My machine slows down a bit but it works. I need a machine that can do more and at super fast speeds.

Before I spend all of this money I'd like to make sure I get the "right one."

HELP!

Thanks!
On an early 2008 Mac Pro (8-Core) At 44.1 you can get between 50 to 60 tracks of VI's native to Logic Pro. Of course audio tracks in and of themselves typically use considerably less CPU than virtual instruments.

So, if you intend to work at 44.1, a 2009 2.93 8-Core Nehalem fitted with SSD's in RAID 0 and enough RAM to accommodate the amount of active sample data you will generally use in a given session should be just enough.

If you intend to work at higher sample rates, then try and 'hit the ceiling' on your clock speed and cores but especially your clock speed. A 12-Core 3.33GHz might do very well, but two 6-Cores (one dedicated primarily for mix duties and one serving as your sequencing DAW and VI/Soft-Synth Machine) might give you the edge. Add to that a nice program called Vienna Ensemble Pro and you should be good up to about 96KHz. For extreme sample rates in that scenario, you'll need AudioPort Universal or a more detailed (and expensive) I/O setup.

Another approach at higher sample rates is to use a good SRC (Sample Rate Converter) to allow your DAW, VI, Soft Synth And/Or Mixing machines to remain at multiples of the output sample rate you desire (eg. 44.1 Session upsampled to 88.2, 132.3 or 176.4 KHz - - - 48.0 Session upsampled to 96, 144.0, or 192 KHz) This can be accomplished with a number of devices such as a Lynx AES16eSRC, RME ADI-192 DD, Prism ADA-8XR, Weiss, Mytek, etc. allowing you to have the benefit of monitoring and even folding back the monitored outputs in a session putting out audio at a higher sample resolution while offloading the SRC duties to the audio interface of your choice and allowing your computer to focus more on the quantity of functions available for use and leaving the quality of it all to the interfaces. Higher sample resolutions can be golden if you intend to track to tape as it is reminiscent of trying to gain the most accurate and desirable saturation depth and quality by means of a good set of narrowly focused tape heads.

The benefit of that setup is that you alleviate the stress on your DAW thus requiring a smaller CPU footprint on your computer while having the benefit of monitoring and printing tracks, stems or a mix at a higher sample rate simultaneously. Of course if you are primarily working ITB, much of what I just mentioned is hardly necessary but it should open up some perspective on just what options you may want to pursue regarding your choice of computer DAW/Workstations.

So, if you are going to operate at 44.1, the 8-Core 2.93 Nehalem should be plenty (Or a 6-Core 3.33GHz for that matter) at best, but if you intend to operate your sessions at 88.1KHz (Or higher) and you'd rather be safe and go for more CPU power over getting additional SRC conversion interfaces, then go for the highest clock speed you can get (Preferably 3.33 or higher) and and use as your starting benchmark 6-Cores (Or higher) and you should be a happy camper.

As far as software is concerned, if you like Logic and like its instruments, its 'sound' and functionality and are trying to save on getting a bunch of extra VI's & Soft-Synths by staying in Logic, then Logic is fine. However, if you have a hybrid set up of outboard synths, acoustic instruments, and the like and you intend on hand picking your own third-party VI's & Soft-Synths and want a clean sound (the differences in sound quality maybe negligible, but there are differences), then go for DP 7.2 (a personal fave). Of course, both are nice to have around. Logic is an idea driven and conceptual piece of software - Load it up and make beatz ! DP 7.2 is more creatively 'surgical' both from a composition point of view as well as an 'edit and mix' point of view. Both are very powerful and logic is incredibly deep, but its GUI is more 'plug and play' oriented whereas DP 7.2 is more like you're sitting down to begin operating on something and all of the tools are right there........

IMH(LONG)O - Done
Old 29th May 2011
  #6
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kstackm View Post
On an early 2008 Mac Pro (8-Core) At 44.1 you can get between 50 to 60 tracks of VI's native to Logic Pro. Of course audio tracks in and of themselves typically use considerably less CPU than virtual instruments.

So, if you intend to work at 44.1, a 2009 2.93 8-Core Nehalem fitted with SSD's in RAID 0 and enough RAM to accommodate the amount of active sample data you will generally use in a given session should be just enough.

If you intend to work at higher sample rates, then try and 'hit the ceiling' on your clock speed and cores but especially your clock speed. A 12-Core 3.33GHz might do very well, but two 6-Cores (one dedicated primarily for mix duties and one serving as your sequencing DAW and VI/Soft-Synth Machine) might give you the edge. Add to that a nice program called Vienna Ensemble Pro and you should be good up to about 96KHz. For extreme sample rates in that scenario, you'll need AudioPort Universal or a more detailed (and expensive) I/O setup.

Another approach at higher sample rates is to use a good SRC (Sample Rate Converter) to allow your DAW, VI, Soft Synth And/Or Mixing machines to remain at multiples of the output sample rate you desire (eg. 44.1 Session upsampled to 88.2, 132.3 or 176.4 KHz - - - 48.0 Session upsampled to 96, 144.0, or 192 KHz) This can be accomplished with a number of devices such as a Lynx AES16eSRC, RME ADI-192 DD, Prism ADA-8XR, Weiss, Mytek, etc. allowing you to have the benefit of monitoring and even folding back the monitored outputs in a session putting out audio at a higher sample resolution while offloading the SRC duties to the audio interface of your choice and allowing your computer to focus more on the quantity of functions available for use and leaving the quality of it all to the interfaces. Higher sample resolutions can be golden if you intend to track to tape as it is reminiscent of trying to gain the most accurate and desirable saturation depth and quality by means of a good set of narrowly focused tape heads.

The benefit of that setup is that you alleviate the stress on your DAW thus requiring a smaller CPU footprint on your computer while having the benefit of monitoring and printing tracks, stems or a mix at a higher sample rate simultaneously. Of course if you are primarily working ITB, much of what I just mentioned is hardly necessary but it should open up some perspective on just what options you may want to pursue regarding your choice of computer DAW/Workstations.

So, if you are going to operate at 44.1, the 8-Core 2.93 Nehalem should be plenty (Or a 6-Core 3.33GHz for that matter) at best, but if you intend to operate your sessions at 88.1KHz (Or higher) and you'd rather be safe and go for more CPU power over getting additional SRC conversion interfaces, then go for the highest clock speed you can get (Preferably 3.33 or higher) and and use as your starting benchmark 6-Cores (Or higher) and you should be a happy camper.

As far as software is concerned, if you like Logic and like its instruments, its 'sound' and functionality and are trying to save on getting a bunch of extra VI's & Soft-Synths by staying in Logic, then Logic is fine. However, if you have a hybrid set up of outboard synths, acoustic instruments, and the like and you intend on hand picking your own third-party VI's & Soft-Synths and want a clean sound (the differences in sound quality maybe negligible, but there are differences), then go for DP 7.2 (a personal fave). Of course, both are nice to have around. Logic is an idea driven and conceptual piece of software - Load it up and make beatz ! DP 7.2 is more creatively 'surgical' both from a composition point of view as well as an 'edit and mix' point of view. Both are very powerful and logic is incredibly deep, but its GUI is more 'plug and play' oriented whereas DP 7.2 is more like you're sitting down to begin operating on something and all of the tools are right there........

IMH(LONG)O - Done


Nice post and I heartily concur! Just about to upgrade my old computer myself....

Cheers
Old 8th June 2011
  #7
Here for the gear
 

Good response!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kstackm View Post
As far as software is concerned, if you like Logic and like its instruments, its 'sound' and functionality and are trying to save on getting a bunch of extra VI's & Soft-Synths by staying in Logic, then Logic is fine. However, if you have a hybrid set up of outboard synths, acoustic instruments, and the like and you intend on hand picking your own third-party VI's & Soft-Synths and want a clean sound (the differences in sound quality maybe negligible, but there are differences), then go for DP 7.2 (a personal fave). Of course, both are nice to have around. Logic is an idea driven and conceptual piece of software - Load it up and make beatz ! DP 7.2 is more creatively 'surgical' both from a composition point of view as well as an 'edit and mix' point of view. Both are very powerful and logic is incredibly deep, but its GUI is more 'plug and play' oriented whereas DP 7.2 is more like you're sitting down to begin operating on something and all of the tools are right there........

IMH(LONG)O - Done
So well said I couldn't have done better myself. Dead on comments. I use both DP 7.2 and Logic 9 for tracking and arranging, and then generally move to another studio to mix down in PT with another engineer. It's a bit of a pain to master so many DAWs, and to swap sessions and files between them (and then on to PT) but in the end it is worth it. I do exactly use DP and Logic just how you describe above. I stick with lower sample and bit depths because of the music I record and because of the audiences' ears, however your comments about "to tape" were right on. Good response about the computers too. I'm waiting on the next gen of MacPros to upgrade. I've been squeezing by on a G5 for five years now and I'm limping to the finish line!
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