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Old 3 days ago
  #12031
Here for the gear
 

Thank you for the suggestions. Would I be better off with a gigabyte z490 vision G or Aorus motherboard?
The last time I built a PC was 10 years ago and I haven't heard about these m.2 SSD drives until now.

Thanks,
Rod
Old 3 days ago
  #12032
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMDX View Post
Thank you for the suggestions. The i9 10850 is more expensive than the 10900 on ebay for some reason. Would I be better off with a gigabyte z490 vision G or Aorus motherboard, and is the Crucial Ballistix RGB DDR4 UDIMM 3200MHz CL16 a good fit with these motherboards?
The last time I built a PC was 10 years ago and I haven't heard about these m.2 SSD drives until now.

Thanks,
Rod
All the motherboard manufacturers list memory they have tested and declared as compatible. Many others will work, but if I were you, I'd go from those lists.

Drive: be sure to go with NVMe M.2, not SATA M.2. Huge performance difference. NVMe drives are on the PCIe bus rather than the SATA controller.

Pete
Old 3 days ago
  #12033
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

So I have updated my system and everything seems fine with a couple of minor issues probably due to not doing a fresh install of my 5 year old Windows 10 Home (1909 build). Here is my system:

Intel Core i9-10900K Processor
Noctua NH-U12A CPU cooler
Gigabyte Z490 VISION D (bios version F5)
Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 3200MHz 32GB
Samsung 970 EVO Plus 1TB SSD
MSI GeForce GTX 1070 Ti Gaming 8GB
PreSonus Quantum audio interface
StarTech Thunderbolt cable 2M (TBOLTMM2MW)
StarTech Thunderbolt 3 TO Thunderbolt 2 adapter (TBT3TBTADAP)
Neumann TLM 102
Windows 10, Ableton 10, Cubase 10

My "issues":
1) Have to lower the XMP setting from 3200MHz to 3000MHz in bios. I also had to do this on my old system to make XMP stable. A fresh install will not "fix" this. This is purely due to how Corsair Vengeance produced this memory.

2) The Presonus Quantum disconnects on regular restarts. I have to hot plug the cable to make it work after a restart. When I shut down my system and start it again everything works fine. So it is just on restarts. Probably due to some conflict with my old thunderbolt software/firmware. Or also it could be a bios setting, but I suspect a fresh install of Windows will fix it.
Edit: FIXED
In the thunderbolt bios settings I enabled Boot Once and everything works as it should.

I will try to do a fresh install of Windows 10 Pro on a separate SSD and at the same time make music (and do other stuff) on my old install. As to the performance of the Intel Core i9-10900K Processor compared to my old Intel 6700K? I cannot notice a big difference on low latency RTL. It can handle a little bit more on ultra low RTL, but due to limitations in the technology there is no big difference on ultra low RTL. Clicks and pops pretty much happens on the same places and on the same settings on low RTL. I'm not surprised cause the 6700k is known for being an excellent CPU on ultra low RTL.

As to stability it is to early to tell. The Noctua NH-U12A CPU seems to cool fine, but it will go over 90 degrees when doing a Cinebench test. On regular use it is around 35 degrees.
Old 3 days ago
  #12034
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
1) Have to lower the XMP setting from 3200MHz to 3000MHz in bios. I also had to do this on my old system to make XMP stable. A fresh install will not "fix" this. This is purely due to how Corsair Vengeance produced this memory.
Running the RAM at fullspeed prevents the PC from booting up? Can you elaborate on what Corsair did to cause the RAM not to run at rated speeds?


Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
I will try to do a fresh install of Windows 10 Pro on a separate SSD and at the same time make music (and do other stuff) on my old install. As to the performance of the Intel Core i9-10900K Processor compared to my old Intel 6700K? I cannot notice a big difference on low latency RTL. It can handle a little bit more on ultra low RTL, but due to limitations in the technology there is no big difference on ultra low RTL. Clicks and pops pretty much happens on the same places and on the same settings on low RTL. I'm not surprised cause the 6700k is known for being an excellent CPU on ultra low RTL.
A little disappointing to learn that there is not much improvement at low latency - was this at 32/64? How are things at a more modest 128/256 buffer? I hope you are seeing some meaningful benefits with the new CPU?
Old 3 days ago
  #12035
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daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by lectrojape View Post
Running the RAM at fullspeed prevents the PC from booting up? Can you elaborate on what Corsair did to cause the RAM not to run at rated speeds?
Yes the boot becomes unstable, but like I said this also happened on my old system with same memory. So probably just a production thing with this memory. I can probably go up to around 3120Mhz or something like that. As long as I go a little bit under 3200MHz there is no problem. Gonna have it on 3000MHz for a while and see if that is stable before I push it further. This is how it looks like now in Cpu-Z:

I'm not gonna loose sleep over 3150MHz vs 3200MHz. The exact memory is CMK32GX4M2B3200C16:https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-2x16G.../dp/B016ORTNI2

Edit:
I did try to push the memory a little further but seem like 3000MHz is the limit or it gets unstable. I'm no expert in this but it could be because I use optimized default bios. So optimized default bios, slow down XMP to 3000MHz and enabling Boot Once in thunderbolt setting does the trick for my system. I also have silent mode on all my fans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lectrojape View Post
A little disappointing to learn that there is not much improvement at low latency - was this at 32/64? How are things at a more modest 128/256 buffer? I hope you are seeing some meaningful benefits with the new CPU?
You should not be disappointed cause my old system was already pushing the limits on what the technology of today can handle on ultra low latency. No CPU in the world can handle heavy stuff around 3ms RTL and lower.
As to higher buffers I take for granted that it can handle more stuff in general. I have not tested it enough yet. Most important thing for me is that it is as good as or even better on ultra low RTL as my old system.
Also I did not buy this CPU just to get benefits in music production also in video editing, gaming and general pc use. I use my PC as an media station not only for music production. To do this the safe way I take regular images and clones of my whole system. My clones are placed in a fire-proof safe.
Old 2 days ago
  #12036
Lives for gear
 
Kyle P. Gushue's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMDX View Post
Thank you for the suggestions. Would I be better off with a gigabyte z490 vision G or Aorus motherboard?
The last time I built a PC was 10 years ago and I haven't heard about these m.2 SSD drives until now.

Thanks,
Rod
I would add to Pete's point that there is pcie x2 and x4 versions of m.2 nvme drives, the x4 is the faster of the two options by a significant margin (3x faster).

The Samsung 970 evo+ is a good all around drive considering price, performance, and reliability.
Old 2 days ago
  #12037
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by RMDX View Post
Thank you for the suggestions. Would I be better off with a gigabyte z490 vision G or Aorus motherboard?
The last time I built a PC was 10 years ago and I haven't heard about these m.2 SSD drives until now.

Thanks,
Rod
Go with the vision D. It has native thunderbolt.
Old 2 days ago
  #12038
Lives for gear
 
Pictus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post

Edit:
I did try to push the memory a little further but seem like 3000MHz is the limit or it gets unstable. I'm no expert in this but it could be because I use optimized default bios. So optimized default bios, slow down XMP to 3000MHz and enabling Boot Once in thunderbolt setting does the trick for my system. I also have silent mode on all my fans.
Rise the memory voltage a bit
https://www.howtogeek.com/439140/how...computers-ram/

https://github.com/integralfx/MemTes...0OC%20Guide.md
Old 2 days ago
  #12039
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by redddog View Post
Go with the vision D. It has native thunderbolt.
I don't have a need for thunderbolt. I see the vision D has 2x thermal sensors, what is the advantage of having those? I would make use of the bluetooth and wifi maybe. Is there any other reason to get the vision D rather than G? There is a significant price difference.

After the suggestions my build looks like this:

Intel Core i9-10850K
Gigabyte S1200 ATX Z490 VISION D or G?
1 TB Samsung 970 Evo PLUS M.2 PCIe SSD
Crucial Ballistix RGB 32GB DDR4 UDIMM 3200MHz (2X16GB)
Noctua NH-D15
Corsair RM750X-2018
Fractal Design R5
Old 2 days ago
  #12040
Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
Yes the boot becomes unstable, but like I said this also happened on my old system with same memory. So probably just a production thing with this memory. I can probably go up to around 3120Mhz or something like that. As long as I go a little bit under 3200MHz there is no problem. Gonna have it on 3000MHz for a while and see if that is stable before I push it further. This is how it looks like now in Cpu-Z:

I'm not gonna loose sleep over 3150MHz vs 3200MHz. The exact memory is CMK32GX4M2B3200C16:https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-2x16G.../dp/B016ORTNI2

Edit:
I did try to push the memory a little further but seem like 3000MHz is the limit or it gets unstable. I'm no expert in this but it could be because I use optimized default bios. So optimized default bios, slow down XMP to 3000MHz and enabling Boot Once in thunderbolt setting does the trick for my system. I also have silent mode on all my fans.
...
Did you up the memory voltage when you increased the speed? Motherboards tend to default to 1.2v, but most XMP settings require 1.4v or 1.5v

Pete
Old 2 days ago
  #12041
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMDX View Post
I don't have a need for thunderbolt. I see the vision D has 2x thermal sensors, what is the advantage of having those? I would make use of the bluetooth and wifi maybe. Is there any other reason to get the vision D rather than G? There is a significant price difference.
If you can go with wired networking, that'll be one less thing on the list of common DPC latency causes.

Thermal sensors: to alert you or shut down if stuff on the motherboard or in the case gets too hot. Typically not necessary.

Pete
Old 2 days ago
  #12042
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
If you can go with wired networking, that'll be one less thing on the list of common DPC latency causes.

Thermal sensors: to alert you or shut down if stuff on the motherboard or in the case gets too hot. Typically not necessary.

Pete
Thanks for the tip about the wifi.
Old 1 day ago
  #12043
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
Did you up the memory voltage when you increased the speed? Motherboards tend to default to 1.2v, but most XMP settings require 1.4v or 1.5v

Pete
On XMP profile 1 the voltage is set to 1.35v. I will try and experiment with that when I see that 3000MHz is stable. That being said I think I upped the voltage on my old motherboard without any luck.
Old 1 day ago
  #12044
Lives for gear
 
juiseman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
On XMP profile 1 the voltage is set to 1.35v. I will try and experiment with that when I see that 3000MHz is stable. That being said I think I upped the voltage on my old motherboard without any luck.
do you have 4x8GB or 2x16GB sticks? try only 1 or 2 sticks at XMP (if you haven't already)
Old 1 day ago
  #12045
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by juiseman View Post
do you have 4x8GB or 2x16GB sticks? try only 1 or 2 sticks at XMP (if you haven't already)
I have 2x16, and if it works on XMP with one what then?
Old 22 hours ago
  #12046
Lives for gear
 
juiseman's Avatar
Well, one of the sticks could be defective.

Do you have the mem in A2 and B2 slots?

Usually it doesn't matter; but you never know.
the memory controller is on the CPU; sometimes they are flaky
as well as the ram itself. You may be able to isolate it down to a lower performing channel which is why XMP is not overclocking the RAM.

Recommended Dual Channel Memory Configuration:

DDR4_A1 DDR4_A2 DDR4_B1 DDR4_B2

2 Modules - - DS/SS - - DS/SS

4 Modules DS/SS DS/SS DS/SS DS/SS

RAM table from:
https://download.gigabyte.com/FileLi...n-g_1001_e.pdf
Old 22 hours ago
  #12047
Lives for gear
 
juiseman's Avatar
Also, I'm not trying to insult your intelligence here; but sometimes while troubleshooting its good to check the basics first (like proper Channel installation) then move to more complicated stuff. Like manually setting the ram timings and voltages.
Old 22 hours ago
  #12048
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by juiseman View Post
Well, one of the sticks could be defective.

Do you have the mem in A2 and B2 slots?

Usually it doesn't matter; but you never know.
the memory controller is on the CPU; sometimes they are flaky
as well as the ram itself. You may be able to isolate it down to a lower performing channel which is why XMP is not overclocking the RAM.

Recommended Dual Channel Memory Configuration:

DDR4_A1 DDR4_A2 DDR4_B1 DDR4_B2

2 Modules - - DS/SS - - DS/SS

4 Modules DS/SS DS/SS DS/SS DS/SS

RAM table from:
https://download.gigabyte.com/FileLi...n-g_1001_e.pdf
Yepp I have them in A2 and B2. I will try one memory at the time when I have confirmed the settings I have now is stable. I will also try to increase voltage a little bit. But like I said I will not lose sleep over 3000MHz vs 3200MHz
Old 22 hours ago
  #12049
Lives for gear
 
juiseman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
Yepp I have them in A2 and B2. I will try one memory at the time when I have confirmed the settings I have now is stable. I will also try to increase voltage a little bit.
I figured you had that covered..just had to check.
Old 22 hours ago
  #12050
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daskeladden's Avatar
 

Here are both my memory settings CPU-Z:
Old 22 hours ago
  #12051
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Pictus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
Here are both my memory settings CPU-Z:
Use Thaiphoon Burner.

Have you tried XMP profile #2 ?
Old 21 hours ago
  #12052
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pictus View Post
Use Thaiphoon Burner.

Have you tried XMP profile #2 ?
No profile 2 in bios
Old 21 hours ago
  #12053
Lives for gear
 
Pictus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
No profile 2 in bios
Check manual page 48
https://download.gigabyte.com/FileLi...n-d_1001_e.pdf
Old 18 hours ago
  #12054
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pictus View Post
Quote:
(Note) This item is present only when you install a CPU and a memory module that support this feature
Probably not supported by memory
Old 17 hours ago
  #12055
Lives for gear
 
Pictus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
Probably not supported by memory
If your memory is Samsung B-die, check with Thaiphoon, they love more
voltage, I would set the voltage to 1.4 without any worry...
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