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The "today we build our studio pc" thread
Old 8th July 2019
  #8431
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
Don't try to offer logic and common sense to Intel fans. They just want the blue logo on their box and will convince themselves it's the best choice using confabulation and fact distortion. They think whatever is on their Mobo is magically better than what's on AMD Mobo. They live in a beautiful fairyland. Let them be. Most intelligent people already compared the facts/reviews and came to the same conclusions. You don't need to post these facts for them. Those who want to continue living in their blueland... Let them continue living in a Land of Confusion

Yes, then the option in September to sell the 3900X for little loss and buy a 16/32 thread 3950x beast

9900k dead end...nowhere to go

You can lead a horse to water etc...
Old 8th July 2019
  #8432
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9900k is still an excellent CPU saying anything else is a lie
Old 8th July 2019
  #8433
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
9900k is still an excellent CPU saying anything else is a lie
No one said it wasn’t...but for cheaper the 3900X offers so much more.
Old 8th July 2019
  #8434
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 5edf3fa View Post
Don't try to offer logic and common sense to Intel fans. They just want the blue logo on their box and will convince themselves it's the best choice using confabulation and fact distortion. They think whatever is on their Mobo is magically better than what's on AMD Mobo. They live in a beautiful fairyland. Let them be...
As invigorating as a good old religious debate can be, I don't think many people in this forum have enough passion about cpu manufacturers to generate a mac/pc level of flame war here--so I think your hyperbole here is based on wishful thinking.
Old 8th July 2019
  #8435
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
Don't try to offer logic and common sense to Intel fans. They just want the blue logo on their box and will convince themselves it's the best choice using confabulation and fact distortion. They think whatever is on their Mobo is magically better than what's on AMD Mobo. They live in a beautiful fairyland. Let them be. Most intelligent people already compared the facts/reviews and came to the same conclusions. You don't need to post these facts for them. Those who want to continue living in their blueland... Let them continue living in a Land of Confusion

I actually returned my unopened Intel purchase as soon as AMD announced their new chips
Old 9th July 2019
  #8436
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Everyone keeps saying the 9900k is cheaper—is that on a price-to-performance basis? Because here I can buy the 9900k for ¥3099 and the cheapest 3900x I could find was ¥3999. AM4 mobos are also more expensive, and dedicated GPU, though cheap and cheerful, still adds to cost.
Old 9th July 2019
  #8437
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 5edf3fa View Post
Don't try to offer logic and common sense to Intel fans....
Oh FFS !!

Much the same way the AMD fanbois for years accused me of manipulating the DAWbench sessions to favour Intel in some huge conspiracy involving compilers or session bit depths, then when the exact same sessions showed significant improvement with AMD's first gen Ryzen, they were miraculously not biased.

Quote:
They think whatever is on their Mobo is magically better than what's on AMD Mobo. They live in a beautiful fairyland.
More than a touch myopic !

To say that Intel and AMD chipset quality and consistency regards compatibility is on the same level is just B.S !!

Perfect example for me personally - I was party to a frustrating disrupted recording session when an AMD system recently updated to resolve an issue with one piece of audio hardware, only resulted in it completely breaking operation of another. In this instance a previously working audio ( USB ) interface. Absolute crapshoot !!

What Professional working in mission critical environments has time for that ****e ? Thats rhetorical btw !

What ever AMD has delivered in this latest CPU rollout, as I mentioned in a previous post, is only 1/2 the equation. The other 1/2 being the platform as a whole.

Once the DAWbench results are in, then we can have a better insight into what has actually been achieved re DAW usage , until then ...

Old 9th July 2019
  #8438
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
AM4 mobos are also more expensive, .
Depending on Chipset...

The x570 is expesnive...But a B450 with a solid VRM like the MSI Pro Gaming Carbon AC will support a 3900x with ease
Old 9th July 2019
  #8439
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Presonus Quantum TB3 Confirmation

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaterNob View Post
Just wanted to mention that I built a PC using the spec Pictus posted a few pages back. Thunderbolt on the designare is working with a presonus quantum using the startech adaptor. I flashed the latest bios before I installed windows.
HaterNob posted in Jan 2019 of success with a "Designare" TB3 + Startech Adapter with a Presonus Quantum TB2 device. I'd love to confirm a few things, if Haternob is still around...
Still successful? Did it require a BIOS setting change or just the updated BIOS prior to the Windows 10 install? Is this the Z390 Designare or the X299 Designare? I'm building a box with the 9900K and was counting on buying the Z390 Designare... Hubs just bought a Presonus Quantum in anticipation, but then we read several concerning posts on various forums. Have not heard back from Gigabyte yet.

Hoping HaterNob can confirm success with this specs. If so, any additional specs will be very appreciated!

Anyone else have any MB advice for a TB2 device with the 9900K?
Old 9th July 2019
  #8440
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy_Rider View Post
Depending on Chipset...

The x570 is expesnive...But a B450 with a solid VRM like the MSI Pro Gaming Carbon AC will support a 3900x with ease
Yes but here it would only be fair to compare best with best—there are also cheaper z370 boards. BTW I'm only considering miniITX, which limits my options.
Old 9th July 2019
  #8441
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Quote:
Originally Posted by techpixie View Post
HaterNob posted in Jan 2019 of success with a "Designare" TB3 + Startech Adapter with a Presonus Quantum TB2 device. I'd love to confirm a few things, if Haternob is still around...
Still successful? Did it require a BIOS setting change or just the updated BIOS prior to the Windows 10 install? Is this the Z390 Designare or the X299 Designare? I'm building a box with the 9900K and was counting on buying the Z390 Designare... Hubs just bought a Presonus Quantum in anticipation, but then we read several concerning posts on various forums. Have not heard back from Gigabyte yet.

Hoping HaterNob can confirm success with this specs. If so, any additional specs will be very appreciated!

Anyone else have any MB advice for a TB2 device with the 9900K?
Quantum is confirmed working with Z390 Designare. Designare has issues with Thunderbolt 1, Quantum is Thunderbolt 2
Old 9th July 2019
  #8442
Deleted 5edf3fa
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKAT View Post
Oh FFS !!

Much the same way the AMD fanbois for years accused me of manipulating the DAWbench sessions to favour Intel in some huge conspiracy involving compilers or session bit depths, then when the exact same sessions showed significant improvement with AMD's first gen Ryzen, they were miraculously not biased.



More than a touch myopic !

To say that Intel and AMD chipset quality and consistency regards compatibility is on the same level is just B.S !!

Perfect example for me personally - I was party to a frustrating disrupted recording session when an AMD system recently updated to resolve an issue with one piece of audio hardware, only resulted in it completely breaking operation of another. In this instance a previously working audio ( USB ) interface. Absolute crapshoot !!

What Professional working in mission critical environments has time for that ****e ? Thats rhetorical btw !

What ever AMD has delivered in this latest CPU rollout, as I mentioned in a previous post, is only 1/2 the equation. The other 1/2 being the platform as a whole.

Once the DAWbench results are in, then we can have a better insight into what has actually been achieved re DAW usage , until then ...

Mobo either works or it doesn't. That's it. If you have glitches instability then it's defective and you can RMA it. But that's not normal. Any Mobo, literally any one of them should work stable under 100% load day and night with your cpu as long as it's supported. This is for drop in and forget installations, not for OC of course.

All my life I've been buying the cheapest mobos I could find, for all my music production, games in the past never had problems. Just my personal anecdotal experience. My current DAW is run by some cheap microatx office Dell or hp or something, it's like the cheapest junk PC made with lowest Q parts, no proper cooling or anything, and it's stable as a rock.

My personal opinion is that Mobo simply "works or doesn't" and all that VRM and "better quality" talk is utter BS and a placebo effect of "if I paid twice more for it it must be twice better". If you need more ports or ram slots sure, but "higher quality" - that's just funny.

But I'm not gonna tell anyone how to spend their money. You keep buying your $200 titanium reinforced mobos I'll keep buying my $37 clearance specials, everybody's happy.
Old 9th July 2019
  #8443
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
Yes but here it would only be fair to compare best with best—there are also cheaper z370 boards. BTW I'm only considering miniITX, which limits my options.
Well this is flawed logic...

Go back to 370? why?

X470 and B450 are pretty much the same, the latter not supporting dual GFX cards...

The Msi B450 pro Carbon is a solid board with a solid VRM

The asrock Z390 I tested with a 9900k was utter crap...

What do you mean best with best?
Old 9th July 2019
  #8444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
Mobo either works or it doesn't. That's it. If you have glitches instability then it's defective and you can RMA it. But that's not normal. Any Mobo, literally any one of them should work stable under 100% load day and night with your cpu as long as it's supported. This is for drop in and forget installations, not for OC of course.

All my life I've been buying the cheapest mobos I could find, for all my music production, games in the past never had problems. Just my personal anecdotal experience. My current DAW is run by some cheap microatx office Dell or hp or something, it's like the cheapest junk PC made with lowest Q parts, no proper cooling or anything, and it's stable as a rock.

My personal opinion is that Mobo simply "works or doesn't" and all that VRM and "better quality" talk is utter BS and a placebo effect of "if I paid twice more for it it must be twice better". If you need more ports or ram slots sure, but "higher quality" - that's just funny.

But I'm not gonna tell anyone how to spend their money. You keep buying your $200 titanium reinforced mobos I'll keep buying my $37 clearance specials, everybody's happy.
I didn't respond to that post as It wasn't worthy of a response :p


Fact: 9900k Tested at 5ghz by me on 3x z390 mobos....The asrock was crap...The asus was great but cost me £250 The gigabyte not much better...


Bought a £119 B450 MSI Pro Gaming Carbon wifi and clocked a 2600 to 4.2ghz....Ive flashed the bios ready for my incoming 3900 x and will destroy all benchies I have on record with my long gone 9900k.

The BS I am reading here in this thread makes me chuckle....Ive tested both 9900k and Ryzen 2

In a few days Ill be testing Ryzen 3900x...
Old 9th July 2019
  #8445
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy_Rider View Post
Well this is flawed logic...

Go back to 370? why?

X470 and B450 are pretty much the same, the latter not supporting dual GFX cards...

The Msi B450 pro Carbon is a solid board with a solid VRM

The asrock Z390 I tested with a 9900k was utter crap...

What do you mean best with best?
I meant "apples with apples", so to speak. The way I see it, Intel z390 chipset is on the same level as AMD x470.

Which AsRock Z390 board did you test? The reviews I read of the ASRock z390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac were all nothing short of stellar.
Old 9th July 2019
  #8446
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Sleazy_Rider's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
I meant "apples with apples", so to speak. The way I see it, Intel z390 chipset is on the same level as AMD x470.

Which AsRock Z390 board did you test? The reviews I read of the ASRock 390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac were all nothing short of stellar, maybe the board you tested was the cheaper ASRock Z390M-ITX/ac.
A "high end B450" will beat a low end X470

Z390 EXTREME4 INTEL Z390 (SOCKET 1151) DDR4 ATX MOTHERBOARD

Utter Garbage
Old 9th July 2019
  #8447
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TAFKAT's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
Mobo either works or it doesn't. That's it. If you have glitches instability then it's defective and you can RMA it... snip

.... My personal opinion is that Mobo simply "works or doesn't" and all that VRM and "better quality" talk is utter BS and a placebo effect of "if I paid twice more for it it must be twice better". If you need more ports or ram slots sure, but "higher quality" - that's just funny.
As is typical with those that operate in an echo chamber, you completely missed any points made !

Who said anything about a faulty motherboard ?

Where was there any mention of VRM's ?

My comment re quality was in regards to chipsets and their consistency in regards compatibility. I also didn't mention anything about costings , you seem to be pulling stuff out of thin air and having a conversation with yourself !
Old 9th July 2019
  #8448
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy_Rider View Post
A "high end B450" will beat a low end X470

Z390 EXTREME4 INTEL Z390 (SOCKET 1151) DDR4 ATX MOTHERBOARD

Utter Garbage
Exactly, a crappy mobo can detract from the value of the CPU. I've looked at all the available x470 and b450 miniITX options and not one of them completely meets my requirements. which are:
  • miniITX
  • 4 x USB 3.1 gen 1 or more
  • 2 x USB 2.1 gen 2 ports, or more
  • 2 x M.2 sockets or more
  • Wifi connectors on the far left
  • 1 x Thunderbolt (ideally)
  • Passive chipset cooling
  • 2 x 4K display outputs (HDMI/DP/both)
  • I don't need exotic RGB nonsense
  • I prefer everything on one board, i.e. no piggy-back "M.2 Audio Combo Card" as seen on some Asus boards.

The AsRock Z390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac meets all these requirements, and it looks like this:



The 3900x is probably the better chip, but the current mobo offerings are not doing it justice. It's like one of those sports cars that have an amazing engine but very poor ergonomics.
Attached Thumbnails
The "today we build our studio pc" thread-rear-panel.png  

Last edited by Scoox; 9th July 2019 at 07:37 AM..
Old 9th July 2019
  #8449
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
Don't try to offer logic and common sense to Intel fans. They just want the blue logo on their box and will convince themselves it's the best choice using confabulation and fact distortion. They think whatever is on their Mobo is magically better than what's on AMD Mobo. They live in a beautiful fairyland. Let them be. Most intelligent people already compared the facts/reviews and came to the same conclusions. You don't need to post these facts for them. Those who want to continue living in their blueland... Let them continue living in a Land of Confusion
Interesting how you challenge "fanbois" but boldly claim AMD is better based on non-audio benchmarks, which have no value in this community.
While I use a Ryzen system myself which works fine for me, I do know an Intel for the same price would give me more performance at small buffers, which is what I work with. There are Dawbench results posted here which show exactly that.

And this is not about mainboards, this is about CPU's.

Now what?
Old 9th July 2019
  #8450
sbs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
The AsRock Z390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac meets all these requirements
Do you plan on overclocking the i9-9900k?

Which cooler and case are you looking at?

Last edited by sbs; 9th July 2019 at 06:59 PM.. Reason: Grammar
Old 9th July 2019
  #8451
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If I was to do a new build I would consider a mini ITX in a HDPLEX fanless.
HDPLEX lists i7 8700K as compatible and I would obviously want TB so my
only MOBO choice would be the AsRock Z390 Phantom Gaming-ITX/ac.
No need for high track counts so no need for an i9
Old 9th July 2019
  #8452
Deleted 5edf3fa
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleazy_Rider View Post
I didn't respond to that post as It wasn't worthy of a response :p


Fact: 9900k Tested at 5ghz by me on 3x z390 mobos....The asrock was crap...The asus was great but cost me £250 The gigabyte not much better...


Bought a £119 B450 MSI Pro Gaming Carbon wifi and clocked a 2600 to 4.2ghz....Ive flashed the bios ready for my incoming 3900 x and will destroy all benchies I have on record with my long gone 9900k.

The BS I am reading here in this thread makes me chuckle....Ive tested both 9900k and Ryzen 2

In a few days Ill be testing Ryzen 3900x...
You overclocked? I was talking about non-overclocked systems.
Old 9th July 2019
  #8453
Deleted 5edf3fa
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAW PLUS View Post
Interesting how you challenge "fanbois" but boldly claim AMD is better based on non-audio benchmarks, which have no value in this community.
While I use a Ryzen system myself which works fine for me, I do know an Intel for the same price would give me more performance at small buffers, which is what I work with. There are Dawbench results posted here which show exactly that.

And this is not about mainboards, this is about CPU's.

Now what?
Which specific part of CPU computing process is DAWbench using that has not been tested by other benchmarks?

Sounds like audio works utilities a special separate part of CPU that is not used by other software/tests. What part of CPU architecture is responsible for providing low latency small buffer recordings?

Please explain. We know with Threadripper inter-core latency was slowing it down. What else?
Old 9th July 2019
  #8454
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuieve View Post
Which specific part of CPU computing process is DAWbench using that has not been tested by other benchmarks?

Sounds like audio works utilities a special separate part of CPU that is not used by other software/tests. What part of CPU architecture is responsible for providing low latency small buffer recordings?

Please explain. We know with Threadripper inter-core latency was slowing it down. What else?
Hey, if it’s so important to you, why don’t you just read up on what DAWBench does? It’s well documented. And then go out and look at some actual benchmarks. Preferably also do some standardized testing on multiple systems like others here do.

Then you might know enough to actually make valid points and be listened to.
Old 9th July 2019
  #8455
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thedberg View Post
Hey, if it’s so important to you, why don’t you just read up on what DAWBench does? It’s well documented. And then go out and look at some actual benchmarks. Preferably also do some standardized testing on multiple systems like others here do.

Then you might know enough to actually make valid points and be listened to.
The journey of advocacy and the journey of discovery do not follow the same path...
Old 9th July 2019
  #8456
Here for the gear
 

Looking for suggestions on a new build. I run drums, samples and effects from Ableton and ReWire Reason for synths and utilities. I control with a Push 2, Nektar P1 and nanokey 2. Might get a different keyboard controller later. Don’t need any peripherals. I already have a usb interface as well. I really don’t know much about how these programs run, I just know how to use them in a way that is comfortable for me. I lay down drum tracks in Ableton, use Simpler for samples and make separate effects tracks. Then I hop on Reason for the synth work. I have no idea about core’s, multithreading, heat, etc. I have used store bought laptops in the past but know I need to finally build my own pc. Looking at a $1500 budget. Any help, recommendations are greatly appreciated.
Old 10th July 2019
  #8457
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted 5edf3fa View Post
You overclocked? I was talking about non-overclocked systems.
Both...

I ran the 9900k at 5ghz all cores and run this stopgap Ryzen 2600 at 4.2ghz all cores
Old 10th July 2019
  #8458
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbs View Post
Do you plan on overclocking the i9-9900k?

Which cooler and case are you looking at?
I haven't decide yet on the CPU, as I'm waiting for daw benchmarks. I don't even have the CPU or mobo yet, but whatever I get I usually overclock a small amount, nothing crazy. The cooler I bought is the Noctua NH-U12A.
Old 10th July 2019
  #8459
sbs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scoox View Post
I haven't decide yet on the CPU, as I'm waiting for daw benchmarks. I don't even have the CPU or mobo yet, but whatever I get I usually overclock a small amount, nothing crazy. The cooler I bought is the Noctua NH-U12A.
3 or so weeks ago I took delivery of a new PC from Scan.

@ Pete Kaine was excellent to deal with and, as part of the buying process, built up an i9-9900k on the AsRock ITX board and the NH-U12A in a Fractal Design's Node 304. The idea was to overclock it and run it hard to see how the new Noctua would perform. Pete clocked the i9 all cores at 4.9GHz and let it do it's thing. The results were marginal, it ran a little warmer than would work for me - summer here in Colorado runs between 30 and 38 degrees C and my aircon is louder than a 747 and so I erred on the side of caution and went with the i9 clocked all cores at 4.9GHz in a Define R6, cooled by a Dark Rock Pro 4 all on the Asus Prime Z390 motherboard.

The other option was to run an i7-8700k in the Node with the NH-U12A. The cost difference between the two spec's was just over £100 and so I let GAS get the better of me and went with the i9.

I'm running Pro Tools 2019.5 with an MBox Pro 3. I've had the buffer sat at 64 samples since the get go and it's been solid. No PT errors, no crashes, no weird stuff. Runs super quiet, I cannot hear the machine and it's sat by my knees at the desk.

Haven't had time to post my experiences to date. I'll write more along with a complete spec sometime soon.
Old 10th July 2019
  #8460
Deleted 5edf3fa
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by thedberg View Post
Hey, if it’s so important to you, why don’t you just read up on what DAWBench does? It’s well documented. And then go out and look at some actual benchmarks. Preferably also do some standardized testing on multiple systems like others here do.

Then you might know enough to actually make valid points and be listened to.
It has about zero importance to me.
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