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UA Plugins , possibly native ? Reverb & Delay Plugins
Old 12th November 2009
  #31
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I would be very much interested if UAD went native.
Old 12th November 2009
  #32
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I think a native version of UAD plugs would be great. That way you get a choice to spread out your plug-ins to either the card or native, leaving more of the cpu intensive ones on the card (Fatso, EMT250 & Neve 33609 for example) and do a broad sweep of console EQs & compressors in native format (either full versions or SE).
Old 12th November 2009
  #33
Quote:
Originally Posted by ekwipt View Post
Why would they need to use Ilok? Couldn't they just release their own USB dongle?

Computers are now at the point where they can handle any audio project, give it another couple of years and I doubt anyone would actually need a DSP card.
You've not tried the new Wave Arts Tube Saturator, have you?
Old 12th November 2009
  #34
RiF
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It would be nice if they would leave us the choice to let UAD-plugins run on the card or native. I don't care if a UAD-card NEEDS to be in the system to let even the native plugins run (so the cards is only a dongle). But if the native plugins would be 0-latency, I would revive my abandoned UAD-cards. Line6 goes even one step further with their PODFarm which runs with (and through) a Toneport device attached to the system OR with a native plugin software version that is protected by an iLok. This leaves me the complete choice, although I don't use PODFarm at all but that's a different story.
OK, they might end up selling LESS UAD-2 Quad cards but MORE plugins. If these sales figure balance out or even get more revenue is a task that the UA marketing dudes have to figure out. My guess is, that UA could easily extend their customer base and make more money by going native even if they would charge $50-100 extra for a native plugin. Their current plugin's pricing leaves some room because some of them do not have competitors at all and the rest is still among the best money can buy.
Old 12th November 2009
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mobius.media View Post
Can't imagine they'd release native for at least 2 years, unless they're trying to piss off all the new UAD-2 owners.
I think they should keep the UAD card as a dongle. Second, I think they should do some sort of "power upgrade" for the different cards .

Perhaps provide 2x power, 4x power and 8x power upgrade packs for al cards.

The 2x power pack would make a uad duo card perform like a quad, while the 8x power pack would make a uad solo for example perfrom like 2 quads..

2x power pack: $149,=
4x power pack: $249,=
8x power pack: $399,=

Perhaps I'm totally crazy, but I think it would work. perhaps it's to expensive?? heh
Old 12th November 2009
  #36
Gear Addict
 

native as an option : yes but DSP card are really usefull even with a modern CPU

ilok for protection : no (as an option for who need this useless blue stick),

UA web site still manage licences way better than any ilok system (no need to pay insurance, no need to buy 2 ilok if you have more than 100 licences, no need another website, ...).




Old 12th November 2009
  #37
RTR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spasm_dtc View Post
i don't see the point, one of the big joys of UAD plugs is that they leave system resources free to use for other purposes. Whatever we do and how powerfull our computers may become, we'll always be searching for more DSP power. If they go native-only, i'll have to go see elsewhere if the grass is greener.

And for those who didn't buy the UAD because it's an expensive piece of hardware, i can assure you that the UAD card is the best investment you can make when it comes to pepping up your DAW, 99% of the native plugins don't even come close to the kind of sound quality and sheer musicality the UAD plugs show - just another world! (and i don't own UA shares )

Plus, there may be solutions that remain un-cracked on mac (ilok, Ableton etc....), but if you're on windows (what, 90% of the market?) you won't have to pay for them pretty soon anymore, which will probably be a big loss for UA...
I am a die hard PT user even though I don't agree with a lot of their decisions BUT..I would not ditch PT to use UAD..EVER....so IF native would fix the delay comp. I would buy them..Until then..I don't care how good they are, I am not learning a new daw to use plug ins!!!
Old 12th November 2009
  #38
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I think it might be good for guys like us who make it practice to pay for native but that might be a terrible thing for the company because the pirates will rape them.
Old 12th November 2009
  #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RTR View Post
I am a die hard PT user even though I don't agree with a lot of their decisions BUT..I would not ditch PT to use UAD..EVER....so IF native would fix the delay comp. I would buy them..Until then..I don't care how good they are, I am not learning a new daw to use plug ins!!!
I love PT.. but if it came down to a choice between PT and UAD, Pro Tools will lose lose lose
Old 12th November 2009
  #40
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ummm hell yeah

I wish. Would be great!!! I use an Imac so its the only way people like me on a computer with no express or pci slots can use them. Kinda makes sense to go Native. all the people in the middle get left out otherwise. to use uad i would have to spent at least 1k on cards and2 k on a new computere.
Old 12th November 2009
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco View Post
I think if anything, what's going to happen is that UA will release native versions of effects, but not the same ones that run on the UAD-2; probably the ones that already run on the UAD-1 and are not supported in the UAD-2, like the Nigel.
oh yeah, a native version of Nigel, a dream coming true!







Old 12th November 2009
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carllock View Post
I think it might be good for guys like us who make it practice to pay for native but that might be a terrible thing for the company because the pirates will rape them.
To subvert piracy and keep our friends at UAD safe, perhaps a native option could be tied to the card itself as the best protection as its already proven over the years. I'm envisioning an included option on the UAD Meter & Control Panel so that you can either choose to run the plug-ins on the card's DSP resources or assign them to native. Max out the card with Fatsos, EMT250s, Bricasti M7* (okay I'm dreaming but hey I'm allowed) & 33609, and port the rest to the computer's own CPU resources.
Old 12th November 2009
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saovi View Post
To subvert piracy and keep our friends at UAD safe, perhaps a native option could be tied to the card itself as the best protection as its already proven over the years.
I'm envisioning an included option on the UAD Meter & Control Panel so that you can either choose to run the plug-ins on the card's DSP resources or assign them to native.
That's the way forward if they do go native, but the trouble is to run native, the code has to be native, with a piece of code tying the plug to the 'dongle', and that is exactly what other software companies have done - steinberg for example, and they're being cracked left, right and centre.

The questionnaire also asked if you wanted to be able to run third party plug-ins on the dsp card itself, which was interesting.

I really don't like the idea of having paid out for a dsp card in order to run the plugs, and then have someone downloading the pugs for free, I would be seriously pissed off if that was the case, so if they are considering it, they'll have to make damn sure it's as fail-safe as possible, even if that means you are obliged to buy a dsp card in order to run the native versions of the plugs (if, as mentioned, that's even going to be a guarantee that they won't be cracked).

I-lok as an alternative would be fine too I guess, so long as dsp card owners could still pay the current prices, with non-dsp card owners footing the bill for the i-lok fees.
Old 12th November 2009
  #44
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it's never gonna happen folks. They've got a working business model - as a business owner, you dont change your model to something more risky. What you guys "want" in no way is reflected in what suppliers will offer if the risk is high.
Old 12th November 2009
  #45
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They're probably watching Nebula. Maybe seeing the writing on the wall. I'm not a UAD or Nebula owner (considering Nebula, though). I'd suggest the following:

o Challenge-Response authorization.

o Draft and Final versions (or better yet, a global resolution slider) for the plugins - so you can run lots of plugins without freezing, and then in the final mixdown, hit ONE checkmark (or move one slider), and all your plugins switch to high resolution mode for a non-realtime mixdown.

o Optional OpenCL support. This pushes computation onto a video card, the power of which is getting crazy, like 2.7 Teraflops crazy. Nebula is already doing this, but only with CUDA, which is nVidia only (and only with cards past a certain generation). Giancarlo has mentioned that Nebula will go OpenCL eventually, which is not a GPU dependent programming interface. There should be an optional switch that applies to all plugins that can be run in OpenCL. The latency of running audio effects on video cards is an issue, apparently. I guess during mixdown, the default would be to run as much as possible through the OpenCL interface.

o Reasonable prices.

o Other cool stuff.

My 2 cents.
Old 12th November 2009
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rtownsend View Post
They're probably watching Nebula. Maybe seeing the writing on the wall. I'm not a UAD or Nebula owner (considering Nebula, though). I'd suggest the following:

o Challenge-Response authorization.

o Draft and Final versions (or better yet, a global resolution slider) for the plugins - so you can run lots of plugins without freezing, and then in the final mixdown, hit ONE checkmark (or move one slider), and all your plugins switch to high resolution mode for a non-realtime mixdown.

o Optional OpenCL support. This pushes computation onto a video card, the power of which is getting crazy, like 2.7 Teraflops crazy. Nebula is already doing this, but only with CUDA, which is nVidia only (and only with cards past a certain generation). Giancarlo has mentioned that Nebula will go OpenCL eventually, which is not a GPU dependent programming interface. There should be an optional switch that applies to all plugins that can be run in OpenCL. The latency of running audio effects on video cards is an issue, apparently. I guess during mixdown, the default would be to run as much as possible through the OpenCL interface.

o Reasonable prices.

o Other cool stuff.

My 2 cents.

LOL!
Old 12th November 2009
  #47
Moderator
 
matt thomas's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by cane creek View Post
2) if there was a native equivalent of a UA plugin would you buy the native instead ?

Obviously i answered YES to both questions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by junior View Post
I got the email too and took the survey last night. I answered a big YES to native versions too.
The question was:

"As an owner of a UAD card, would you purchase a UAD (DSP powered) version of a Universal Audio plug-in if a native (non-DSP powered) version of the same plug-in was available?"

So I think you meant to answer NO

I got the feeling they were talking about 3rd party plugins anyway, like for example if autotune was available for UAD which version would you buy native/UAD.. (there was a second version of the same question specifically about 3rd party plugins) hopefully I'm wrong here and they are considering making their plugs native (although I do like the copy protection the cards give)

matt
Old 12th November 2009
  #48
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by organik View Post
I wish. Would be great!!! I use an Imac so its the only way people like me on a computer with no express or pci slots can use them. .
Well, Logic can use nodes over networks, Waves had those network boxes and VSL streams orchestras over networks ... hmmmm ... each and every computer has Gigabit network these days ... Maybe they can come up with something else ...

best
Old 12th November 2009
  #49
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Personally I'd be interesting in seeing the performance difference between a i7 for example vs a Quad uad. Other than that it doesn't bother me if it's native or says the same
Old 12th November 2009
  #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by creeper_6

LOL!
What an informative post!

Web hosting for only $46 for THREE YEARS! How can I RESIST!



Quote:
__________________
Talk about dongles; I think the MAC PRO is the most expensive dongle ever! fuuck

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Old 12th November 2009
  #51
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If I remember correctly from a magazine, 1 instance of a 1176 requires a 1.8 GHz single CPU machine to be calculated so I guess the UAD card is not only a dongle but a real powerful board.
Old 12th November 2009
  #52
i actually like the idea of having the uad plug ins on a dsp card better than waves on an ilok, but it would be pretty cool if they gave you the option to run them native in case your card is running out of resources

and also imac users would be able to go uad
Old 13th November 2009
  #53
Moderator
 
narcoman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rtownsend View Post
They're probably watching Nebula. Maybe seeing the writing on the wall. I'm not a UAD or Nebula owner (considering Nebula, though). I'd suggest the following:

o Challenge-Response authorization.

o Draft and Final versions (or better yet, a global resolution slider) for the plugins - so you can run lots of plugins without freezing, and then in the final mixdown, hit ONE checkmark (or move one slider), and all your plugins switch to high resolution mode for a non-realtime mixdown.

o Optional OpenCL support. This pushes computation onto a video card, the power of which is getting crazy, like 2.7 Teraflops crazy. Nebula is already doing this, but only with CUDA, which is nVidia only (and only with cards past a certain generation). Giancarlo has mentioned that Nebula will go OpenCL eventually, which is not a GPU dependent programming interface. There should be an optional switch that applies to all plugins that can be run in OpenCL. The latency of running audio effects on video cards is an issue, apparently. I guess during mixdown, the default would be to run as much as possible through the OpenCL interface.

o Reasonable prices.

o Other cool stuff.

My 2 cents.
Nebula, very good stuff. Very popular - but no threat to UAD since the business model is entirely different.
Old 13th November 2009
  #54
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I think they might give us a more powerful card ... like UAD 3 ... who knows...
As Digidesign have done ...
Old 13th November 2009
  #55
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You can run up to 4 Quads in one system. How much processing do you actually need?

We're all ready reaching saturation point where there are more than enough tools to choose from, and more than enough computing power to run it all, we don't need more to get the job done, it's as simple as that.

But it's always interesting to think about what direction things are headed in and what may or may not be possible in the future.
Maybe they achieve the perfect emulation of a vintage mixing desk etc, that's great, but where from there?
Old 13th November 2009
  #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matt thomas View Post
The question was:

"As an owner of a UAD card, would you purchase a UAD (DSP powered) version of a Universal Audio plug-in if a native (non-DSP powered) version of the same plug-in was available?"

So I think you meant to answer NO

I got the feeling they were talking about 3rd party plugins anyway, like for example if autotune was available for UAD which version would you buy native/UAD.. (there was a second version of the same question specifically about 3rd party plugins) hopefully I'm wrong here and they are considering making their plugs native (although I do like the copy protection the cards give)

matt
Also I think they meant would you buy the UAD4k even though waves has the SSL series. API here we come!

Quote:
Originally Posted by rtownsend View Post

Web hosting for only $46 for THREE YEARS! How can I RESIST!

DO IT! That's how much I used to pay quarterly.
Old 13th November 2009
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narcoman View Post
it's never gonna happen folks. They've got a working business model - as a business owner, you dont change your model to something more risky. What you guys "want" in no way is reflected in what suppliers will offer if the risk is high.
Actually, when you put it like that, I'm inclined to agree - but that doesn't mean I want to. I think UA is testing the water. If there is a cool way to offer this at little to no risk to themselves, great. Speaking of which...

Quote:
Get 3 years of web hosting for $46. Click the link and enter the coupon code "SAVENOW" to save $25 off your 3 year UNLIMITED package.
SPAM? ... at this rate, this guy might be out of business in two. Sorry, but good intentions doesn't always mean good follow through.
Old 13th November 2009
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saovi View Post
Max out the card with Fatsos, EMT250s, Bricasti M7* (okay I'm dreaming but hey I'm allowed)
A real Bricasti algo can't fit on a UAD-2 Quad...Casey doesn't want to do a native plug...you gotta pay if you want that particular piece.

In the meantime may I recommend signaltonoize.com for the True M7 impulses (kick Acousticas around the room IMO) running through LiquidSonics Reverberate. Will cost you $50, sorry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rtownsend View Post
o Optional OpenCL support. This pushes computation onto a video card, the power of which is getting crazy, like 2.7 Teraflops crazy. Nebula is already doing this, but only with CUDA, which is nVidia only (and only with cards past a certain generation). Giancarlo has mentioned that Nebula will go OpenCL eventually, which is not a GPU dependent programming interface. There should be an optional switch that applies to all plugins that can be run in OpenCL. The latency of running audio effects on video cards is an issue, apparently. I guess during mixdown, the default would be to run as much as possible through the OpenCL interface.
I think the latency of Open CL isn't any worse than for UAD-2's right? It's just the PCI bus, although maybe sharing bandwidth with video on the card means a bit more. I think that's just compared to e.g. the SSL MX4 or Mertic Halo 2D where the DSP is located alongside the i/o and can avoid the bus...UAD should have included i/o on the UAD-2 for that reason!
Old 13th November 2009
  #59
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UA ain´t stupid and will NOT go native. They might however do a Duende.

Yes, the cards are dongles, but without them they wouldn´t get paid for plugins, and when that happens they can´t afford to produce any new awesome emulations, and when they can´t do that, I´m out.

What they should´ve done is, release a card / box with the same power as four quads for the price of one to draw even more people in and baffle the competition. Then, if someone within the next 5 years would max out the card, offer a Duende deal so that processing could be done one the computers CPU´s as well.

But that´s just me. I´m ordering a quad now, yes it costs a lot, but it´s worth it. The emus are superb cause they´ve got the brains, the enthusiasm AND the cash that we are faithfully / unwillingy providing them with.

It´s a healthy circle of zeroes and ones. Personally I think most of the plugins out there is rubbish and I´m guessing that the reason for that is that very few are paying for something that you can just take.

Am I right or am I right?

I´m SLAMming a Massive Passive VoxBox into the Vari-MU over at the UA camp, who´s with me?
Old 13th November 2009
  #60
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If the Manley emus are really, really good they will print money over there...

I wonder if Eveanna will let them make them really good. I imagine she won't let them suck. But I wonder if she gets jealous!

If they are really, really good I wouldn't be shocked if the prices are ridiculous for a plugin either.
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