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Blasts of white noise in logic 9 Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 25th August 2010
  #91
Gear Head
 

Is this bug still kicking around? I had it for a while but not for ages.
Old 25th August 2010
  #92
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api2500's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 6strings View Post
Um.... you're a funny guy... or maybe just a tool.

There's an official response (emailed to a user) over in the Apple thread acknowledging they've been attempting to track this for a while now...

For someone already dealing with tinnitus, the potential for a "sudden blast of deafening white noise" is indeed a major, show-stopping, class-action-suit-worthy bug.
I'm a tool for not having it happen to me. Oh sorry.
Old 26th August 2010
  #93
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by quincyg View Post
ok. this is a stretch but... is it possible that this is some sort of iphone interference? This just happened to me again while someone with an iphone was tracking. The phone kept creating audio interference in the monitors and then the bug occured. This time there was no disc too slow message, just a visibly maxed out sound wave and noise on playback. Could it be some sort of iphone/mac communication trying to occur?

I only throw this out there because, I believe the previous time it happened there was also annoying iphone noise. Feel free to call me crazy.
The phone/audio interference SHOULD be limited to just what you hear in the speakers. The RF transmitters of most GSM phones have this problem, the frequency of the interference is 217Hz, which corresponds to the pulse rate of the transmission, and it related to the GSM data transmission between the phone and the cell tower.

You hear it when you are about to get an incoming call, a data transmission is occuring or once an hour when the closest tower does a check to see if your phone is on the network. The further you are from a cell tower, the strong the phone pulse are.

In the US, this is only experienced with AT&T and T-mobile phones.
Old 26th August 2010
  #94
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"The phone/audio interference SHOULD be limited to just what you hear in the speakers. The RF transmitters of most GSM phones have this problem, the frequency of the interference is 217Hz, which corresponds to the pulse rate of the transmission, and it related to the GSM data transmission between the phone and the cell tower. "

I know, but there could possibly be a software communication of some sort between these two apple products. I know it's a far fetched idea...but the iphone seems to be a common variable the few times I have had this happen.
Old 26th August 2010
  #95
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by quincyg View Post
I know, but there could possibly be a software communication of some sort between these two apple products. I know it's a far fetched idea...but the iphone seems to be a common variable the few times I have had this happen.
Put the iPhone in flight mode... that should disabled all the radio functions (GSM/UMTS, WiFi and Bluetooth) and see if the problem still happens. Then slectively enable the different functions and repeat the test, disable that one and try one of the other radio functions.... If it's caused by the iPhone, you should be able to pin it down through testing. If you have a computer capable of sniffing bluetooth and/or Wifi, you would also be able to get a glimpse of specifically what is causing the issue.
Old 26th August 2010
  #96
Here for the gear
 

I had this issue with Live. I tracked it down to incompatible Ram.
Even though the Ram showed up OK in various test programs,
I went with my hunch. Replaced the Ram and never I have never had
a noise burst since.

Not sure this is totally related but maybe it can help someone on the way.
My ears took one hell of a beating that's for sure.
Old 27th August 2010
  #97
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I don't own an iphone, so I can't test. It's probably just a coincidence.
Old 27th August 2010
  #98
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valis's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by dig_dug View Post
I had this issue with Live. I tracked it down to incompatible Ram.
Even though the Ram showed up OK in various test programs,
I went with my hunch. Replaced the Ram and never I have never had
a noise burst since.

Not sure this is totally related but maybe it can help someone on the way.
My ears took one hell of a beating that's for sure.
Mac Pros should at least register single bit ram errors and correct for them, and may register a more complex error (depending on the type.) No? I've actually no idea how to look for the DMI event log under the Mac EFI though...
Old 1st September 2010
  #99
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jimmydeluxe's Avatar
I've had this problem several times, in Logic from 9 to 9.1.1--don't recall if it happened on 8.

It is definitely less frequent since doing a fresh install on a new WD 300gb HD of snow leopard, but it's still happening. I write data to a separate, internal 500gb WD drive. I backup this up on an external 750gb drive.

I have 7gb of Apple ram on a 3.0ghz quadcore macpro.

Perhaps the people who've never had it happen or eliminated it can say more--is the partitioning the key?
Old 1st September 2010
  #100
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api2500's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmydeluxe View Post
I've had this problem several times, in Logic from 9 to 9.1.1--don't recall if it happened on 8.

It is definitely less frequent since doing a fresh install on a new WD 300gb HD of snow leopard, but it's still happening. I write data to a separate, internal 500gb WD drive. I backup this up on an external 750gb drive.

I have 7gb of Apple ram on a 3.0ghz quadcore macpro.

Perhaps the people who've never had it happen or eliminated it can say more--is the partitioning the key?
No partitions here and running on internal and no noise blasts.
Old 6th September 2010
  #101
Gear Head
 

I've experienced this issue several times over the last 2 years on various workstations, software versions, operating systems and hardware setups. I've also just sent a very pissed off bit of feedback to Apple after it happened once again today during a long mixing session. Tonight, 5 hours after the incident, i am experiencing tinnitus as a direct result of what happened.
Old 7th September 2010
  #102
Gear Addict
I was planning on changing to mac from pc and buying a new mac pro just for Logic, but after reading this, how can I possibly invest so much into a system that has a potentially ear damaging bug like this? How could I be sure that my investment would not be wasted if I experienced this problem given that Apple seems so clueless. I can't believe a reputable company like Apple could allow something potentially deleterious like this to occur, especially since they control h/w and OS for their professional audio software. Given the ammount of pros using this with clients, they should issue a warning or something before something gets ugly and they get hit hard. You can't allow this to continue. Logic Amature edition 9.1.1 i say.

So, what do I do now? Build a new PC DAW for cubase?
Old 7th September 2010
  #103
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bakerman's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by aquablu8 View Post
So, what do I do now? Build a new PC DAW for cubase?
yep. or go mac and stay Cubase.
Old 7th September 2010
  #104
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Pepe Ortega's Avatar
I got the problem some times.
I used to use a DM3200 mixer with FW interfase option. Noise happens from time to time. So I alway use monitor thru my mixer, and I could see the balst waveform before I listen to it.
Two monts ago I bougth an SSL madixtreme ( PCIe)and alpha link madi and my problems have gone. even using 64 buffer size and lots of track playing at the same time. ( I never could use 64 Buffer size and so many tracks on DM3200)

Maybe I´m wrong, but most of people with this problem have Fw interfases or Fw drives in their chain. Luckly I´m out of problems now (knock on wood heh)
Old 7th September 2010
  #105
Gear Addict
For someone who needs to build or buy a new DAW and is considering Logic, would you abstain for now due to this issue? What % of users experience this issue? Is there something you could put in the signal chain to limit overly loud volumes from the speakers?
Old 7th September 2010
  #106
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phas3d's Avatar
 

It appears that this issue might have something to do with audio interface. I've used Logic since V4 and never experienced that. So the question here might be, what audio interfaces are being used by people with this issue?
Old 7th September 2010
  #107
Gear Addict
Excuse me, but isn't this a deal breaker for logic as a pro tool? Won't this dissuade potential mac + logic converts? Isn't it in their best interests to fix this ASAP to prevent their reputation from going down hill even if it takes a major re-write to fix?

If not, is it true that only a small minority of users experience this?

I don't see how any one would continue using logic, especially if they require headphone cue mixes while recording strangers given what is written here.

I can't imagine this problem is widespread given the lack of response from apple.. surely such a ear health issue would never be tolerated by pro users.

If i get logic, what are the chances this will occur?
Old 7th September 2010
  #108
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by phas3d View Post
It appears that this issue might have something to do with audio interface. I've used Logic since V4 and never experienced that. So the question here might be, what audio interfaces are being used by people with this issue?
if u read the thread, it occurs on many types of interface.
Old 7th September 2010
  #109
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phas3d's Avatar
 

I did. But I've used it for over 12 years and never experienced it. Used lots of computers from different owners too. Could be a chipset issue. It would really surprise me if it were random. I'm not that lucky, you know!
Old 7th September 2010
  #110
Gear Addict
So, is this happening with the 2010 MP?

How will this issue hurt Apple if it is not resolved soon?

Is this widespread and very common.

For a new system, would you hold off on mac/logic now and go PC? I'm not buying a MP for cubase unless it works fantastic on boot camp.
Old 7th September 2010
  #111
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api2500's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by aquablu8 View Post
So, is this happening with the 2010 MP?

How will this issue hurt Apple if it is not resolved soon?

Is this widespread and very common.

For a new system, would you hold off on mac/logic now and go PC? I'm not buying a MP for cubase unless it works fantastic on boot camp.
Macbook Pro i5 here.

No blasts of white noise from me.

Logic Pro 9 > Sapphire 6 USB > NS10s.

Haven't had it.
Old 7th September 2010
  #112
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phas3d's Avatar
 

Blasts of white noise in logic 9

8 core 2009 Mac Pro and 2007 MBP, both running RME Fireface 400. No issues. Used to run a Motu 2408MK3 on a Powermac G4. Again no issues. Used OS 10.4, 10.5 and 10.6. Also work in studios using Apogee and SSL converters.
Old 7th September 2010
  #113
Gear Addict
Very good, but could someone please chime in on whether a new mac pro hexacore purchase for logic is worth the risk at this time given that apple may not be able to stop this problem (ridiculous, though)? How can I be sure I can use Logic without being afraid to use headphones, etc?

Is here some type of limiter or something that could prevent dangerously loud volumes?

I prefer Logic to Cubase, but If this problem is really serious on new mac pros and could happen at any time without warning, I'm not sure I could risk it.

My other option is to build a PC workstation with similar specs to the mac pro and run cubase, but I'd prefer to use Logic.
Old 7th September 2010
  #114
Gear Addict
Hey fellas, this is a really serious issue here... we are talking about a so-called pro music software that is unusable with headphones, and perhaps too risky to be used at all. A software that has people in fear of using it without keeping 1 hand on the main volume knob at all times ffs!!!! This is criminal for what they charge for this package.

I think more attention should be given to this thread.. it is important to keep contacting Apple and pestering them about how dangerous this could be and how if they don't fix it soon, they will lose serious revenue and perhaps risk serious legal action.. This thread needs to be up there at all times :!!!!! I don't think anybody should buy Logic until this is fixed for good... The silence is disgusting, Apple should be ashamed when the health of our precious ears are in the balance.
Old 7th September 2010
  #115
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api2500's Avatar
I have had no such experience. Believe me, there's no need to poop yourself in fear.

If your going to spend that kind of money on your specific iMac then go for it. I certainly did for my MBP.

Logic is not unusable, probably as stable as 7 was atm. Believe me. Take the plunge. If possible use clean power if your worried. I don't. And no problems here.
Old 7th September 2010
  #117
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Geert van den Berg's Avatar
 

I had the blast problem 2 times...

That's why I switched to another application. I like Logic, it's CPU efficient, but I don't want to blast someone's ears while tracking!

Offcourse there were some other reasons for the switch as well...

I think the problem has something to do with Logic not being able to write/read audio fast enough from the drive and then some bufferproblem happens and this is when it goes crazy... This was with an MBP 2.4 SantaRosa / Fireface 800 / Lacie D2. Offcourse it could also very well be firewire related.
Old 7th September 2010
  #118
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api2500's Avatar
Fearmongering is a thumbsup.

Poll anyone?

Actually this is the wrong thread for that.
Old 7th September 2010
  #119
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geert van den Berg View Post
I had the blast problem 2 times...

That's why I switched to another application. I like Logic, it's CPU efficient, but I don't want to blast someone's ears while tracking!

Offcourse there were some other reasons for the switch as well...

I think the problem has something to do with Logic not being able to write/read audio fast enough from the drive and then some bufferproblem happens and this is when it goes crazy... This was with an MBP 2.4 SantaRosa / Fireface 800 / Lacie D2. Offcourse it could also very well be firewire related.
You can't call it a pro app then. Ridiculous.
Old 8th September 2010
  #120
Posted when this thread first started. Thought I would add a bit. Switched to SL and Logic 9, a little over a month ago. Have not seen it yet (knock on wood), but did see it happen more then once in Logic 8. Not counting on the issue being solved with Logic 9, just bet it hasn't happened yet. The reason being the issue is very hard to chase down, it only happens 2-4 times a year, with everyday use. So odds are it just hasn't happened yet. I have had the issue on multiple computers all being mac pros. Fresh installs and builds.

On to the FW debate. The rig I am commenting on in this post uses no FW. All drives are internal, interface is an Apogee Symphony rig with a a DA 16x and a Rosetta 800. So if we are all discussing the same "bug" FW does not seem like the issue, at least in my situation. Who knows but the randomness of it all, to me seems like there might be a few issues floating around that have a similar bad result, ie the blast of noise.

If my memory serves me correct, the issue seems to happen more on audio intensive sessions. Lots of audio tracks, many takes and a lot of small punches. At least from my experience. Don't know if others have mentioned this, but if zoomed in enough the noise was actually printed to audio file. Had to zoom in a lot to see it, but if you hunted it down it was there.

API2500 -

Have you seen every bug that Logic has ever had, besides this one? I find it funny that since you have not seen it you continue to argue with people it is not possible. I maintain many Logic and PT rigs as my "day job." It's always crazy how some "bugs" show up on one rig but not another, have seen it more times then I would like. Maybe be productive and try to figure out with others on this thread, what is different with your rig. That makes it so you do not see the issue.

Don't know your work so only speculation. Do you do much audio tracking on your MBP? When I say much tracking I mean full band, ie way to many mics on drums, multiple gtr mics, bass, and vocs. Then go back sometimes and do overdubs? I usually find the issue pops up more often on sessions like this. Can't remember a time I have seen it happen with some VIs, a few voc tracks and some gtr parts. But could just be my memory.

This is just a start in trying to see what separates your work flow/rig.
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