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"Tape Booster +" Now Available!!! Mas­ter­ing Plugins
Old 9th October 2010
  #61
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Spent some time listening to the R2R audio examples and heard nothing that sounded like real tape, just slightly differently EQ'd versions.

The only way to get the perceptual improvement quality of tape is to use tape. Sorry if that burst a bubble.

Throw a sine wave at tape and then through the R2R and you can hear what is missing, though dont listen to hard, try to relax - you know every action has a reaction and all that!!
Old 10th October 2010
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackback Drop View Post
Spent some time listening to the R2R audio examples and heard nothing that sounded like real tape, just slightly differently EQ'd versions.

The only way to get the perceptual improvement quality of tape is to use tape. Sorry if that burst a bubble.

Throw a sine wave at tape and then through the R2R and you can hear what is missing, though dont listen to hard, try to relax - you know every action has a reaction and all that!!
I had experience with tape and tried a bunch of plug-ins that claims to emulate it over the years.

Well in theory, no plug-in can replicate it 100% but cdsoundmasters programs are the current best of whats available.

Also keep in mind, Nebula reacts to how hard you hit it more realistic than others (and others are mostly saturators) so in some cases audio demo's can't reveal all the aesthetical options you possibly have.

To my ears, it sounds good heh
Old 10th October 2010
  #63
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Last edited by mpod; 31st December 2010 at 10:21 PM.. Reason: wrong
Old 10th October 2010
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpod View Post
I don't get it? Is it 20ms of latency really that much? What kind of CPU you have? I mean UAD and Powercore has the same maybe few ms more or less.

In case you don't know how to setup Nebula to that latency drop me a PM and i'll help you..
I can go down to a 6ms with UAD2 no problem and also have the option ultra low latency. The problem with Nebula is that you can bring it down lower in latency but it will only use one core and you will run out of cpu fast, not mentioning it burns too much memory for each instance.
Old 10th October 2010
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackback Drop View Post
Spent some time listening to the R2R audio examples and heard nothing that sounded like real tape, just slightly differently EQ'd versions.

The only way to get the perceptual improvement quality of tape is to use tape. Sorry if that burst a bubble.

Throw a sine wave at tape and then through the R2R and you can hear what is missing, though dont listen to hard, try to relax - you know every action has a reaction and all that!!
Interesting.... A friend of mine just used R2R with Tape Booster on an album and fooled a well respected mastering engineer. I heard it a bit while he was mixing it, sounded pretty authentic. I think you actually need to play with these two libraries yourself. I've heard some folks with some golden ears give these two libraries high praise.

I might just have to get my hands dirty with Nebula.
Old 10th October 2010
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
I can go down to a 6ms with UAD2 no problem and also have the option ultra low latency. The problem with Nebula is that you can bring it down lower in latency but it will only use one core and you will run out of cpu fast, not mentioning it burns too much memory for each instance.
not true any more, we are betatesting a new solution for light library releases. A clone of a just released software console emulation is around 2 megabytes and pretty light on cpu, low latency (no reverb version required). Quality is lower, but still pretty good compared with original software model.
Old 10th October 2010
  #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B-sharp View Post
Is there really going to be a part three? ....what would it be?
Quoting Michael from the old forum:

'The final, 3rd stage heavy output gain+comp is going to be able to address the complexity of louder signals.'

I remember him saying it will be a standalone plugin..
Old 10th October 2010
  #68
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Ermz's Avatar
 

Sounds like this will be an immensely hard solution to implement with any degree of practicality on mixes.
Old 10th October 2010
  #69
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You mean with cpu use? We shall see, but I think most Nebula users are used to getting their cpu abused by programs..From my understanding of Michael he won't be settling for efficiency over sound quality.
But then if I'm getting nice tape compression and drive, I am happy to commit the audio to it and export to free resources.
Old 10th October 2010
  #70
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Surbitone's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by farjedi View Post
You mean with cpu use? We shall see, but I think most Nebula users are used to getting their cpu abused by programs..From my understanding of Michael he won't be settling for efficiency over sound quality.
But then if I'm getting nice tape compression and drive, I am happy to commit the audio to it and export to free resources.
Yeah exactly. It's not like I can save a preset for my Revox, or adjust the gain going to tape after the fact I swear, when relying heavilly on Nebula, you do have to adjust your workflow, especially if you are used to just working ITB, but...it can be *really* liberating to box yourself in from the infinite options of plugins and be ruthless with the choices you make. Christ, running and maintaining an all analogue studio is far more of a pain in the arse than rendering down the odd track in a DAW.
Old 10th October 2010
  #71
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BlackBackDrop's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by B-sharp View Post
Interesting.... A friend of mine just used R2R with Tape Booster on an album and fooled a well respected mastering engineer. I heard it a bit while he was mixing it, sounded pretty authentic. I think you actually need to play with these two libraries yourself. I've heard some folks with some golden ears give these two libraries high praise.

I might just have to get my hands dirty with Nebula.
I believe there is a difference between the sound of tape and the percerption of the tape effect (if that makes sense?) The emulations nail the sound (of various types) but not the tape effect, which humans love. Its easy to be fooled, happens to the best of us.


Quote:
Originally Posted by mpod View Post
Yeah like we are stupid and don't know this..Sorry to bursting your bubble.

I guess you skipped that part where you know that there are people out there which:

- can't afford real tape
- don't have access to real tape
- will gladly pay for most precise emulation in any form
Yeah I understand that, and I dont think your stupid btw. Don't laugh, well laugh but try it. There are lots of old (back in there day) very very high spec, amazing quality cassette desks around going for less than the cost of most emulations. The one I use is exceptional. I use it as an external plugin in Cubase 5, throw it on an insert and do a realtime bounce, instant Fritz effect and no loss of sound quality.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cooker View Post
I had experience with tape and tried a bunch of plug-ins that claims to emulate it over the years.

Well in theory, no plug-in can replicate it 100% but cdsoundmasters programs are the current best of whats available.

Also keep in mind, Nebula reacts to how hard you hit it more realistic than others (and others are mostly saturators) so in some cases audio demo's can't reveal all the aesthetical options you possibly have.

To my ears, it sounds good heh
Me too, tape is neuro candy! Hey, if it sounds good then its good, thats all that matters. I just wave the banner that says, "this aint real tape"...
Old 10th October 2010
  #72
Gear Maniac
 

I have been searching for hours.........again.

New to the Nebula world on a Mac. Where does one find the Nebula "program folder" and "vectors folder"
Old 10th October 2010
  #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackback Drop View Post
Me too, tape is neuro candy! Hey, if it sounds good then its good, thats all that matters. I just wave the banner that says, "this aint real tape"...
Thats ok, just to make it clear; we get a bunch of attackers on Nebula threads and sometimes negative comments can be understood in the wrong way by Nebula users here in GS.
Old 10th October 2010
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HABBER View Post
I have been searching for hours.........again.

New to the Nebula world on a Mac. Where does one find the Nebula "program folder" and "vectors folder"
I'm not a mac user but if I remember right it works a little different on mac's. Make a search or contact the developer on official forum (giancarlo), he will guide you.
Old 10th October 2010
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HABBER View Post
I have been searching for hours.........again.

New to the Nebula world on a Mac. Where does one find the Nebula "program folder" and "vectors folder"
Mac HD > Libraries > Audio > Plugins > Presets > Acustica > Nebula
Old 11th October 2010
  #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
I can go down to a 6ms with UAD2 no problem and also have the option ultra low latency. The problem with Nebula is that you can bring it down lower in latency but it will only use one core and you will run out of cpu fast, not mentioning it burns too much memory for each instance.
Not true! Not true at all! Whoever told you that is either lacking in experience or lying.

I am not arguing about reaching lower latencies with comparable products and i know for UAD low latency (which will going to stress your ASIO buffers twice as much , increasing power on your native CPU and it isn't available for every plugin - i had UAD but sold it).

I also have version of Nebula Reverb which is tweaked (anyone can do that) so my "fastest" nebula is taking less then 20ms and can do MULTITHREADING easily. I am taking full power of my quad core Intel processor.

There is forum there and people will going to help you. Just ask about it.

There is that thing i don't like in Nebula and that is - one has to know it inside out per parameter to utilize full power. Personally to me that is no problem but i see this is a problem for new users or people with lack of experience/time/putwhatever.

Giancarlo should address that imho..
Old 11th October 2010
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zaphod View Post
not true any more, we are betatesting a new solution for light library releases. A clone of a just released software console emulation is around 2 megabytes and pretty light on cpu, low latency (no reverb version required). Quality is lower, but still pretty good compared with original software model.
What about 0 latency under CUDA? That is what you really need to work on.
Old 11th October 2010
  #78
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Ermz's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by farjedi View Post
You mean with cpu use? We shall see, but I think most Nebula users are used to getting their cpu abused by programs..From my understanding of Michael he won't be settling for efficiency over sound quality.
But then if I'm getting nice tape compression and drive, I am happy to commit the audio to it and export to free resources.
No, no, more with gain staging and plug-in counts. Having to process 3 sets of saturation programs offline (4, counting the Alex B consoles), having to normalize near zero (never got his one), and then drop back down to -18 for Alex's programs.

The whole thing is a bit of a mess. Pretty impractical when working on records with a deadline.

All that aside, the programs as they are sound fantastic, i just wish someone would factor workflow into any of this.
Old 11th October 2010
  #79
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Animus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpod View Post
Not true! Not true at all! Whoever told you that is either lacking in experience or lying.

I am not arguing about reaching lower latencies with comparable products and i know for UAD low latency (which will going to stress your ASIO buffers twice as much , increasing power on your native CPU and it isn't available for every plugin - i had UAD but sold it).

I also have version of Nebula Reverb which is tweaked (anyone can do that) so my "fastest" nebula is taking less then 20ms and can do MULTITHREADING easily. I am taking full power of my quad core Intel processor.

There is forum there and people will going to help you. Just ask about it.

There is that thing i don't like in Nebula and that is - one has to know it inside out per parameter to utilize full power. Personally to me that is no problem but i see this is a problem for new users or people with lack of experience/time/putwhatever.

Giancarlo should address that imho..

yeah, I am totally lying and backing a global conspiracy mpod. Call Alex Jones.

Zaphod must be lying too because I asked him about the matter twice and this is what he confirmed to me. And if you think 20 ms is low latency...... The lowest i could get Nebula reverb to go is at a 1024 buffer.

I run full mixes (with lots of vstis) with two UAD2 Quads and a i7 at a buffer of 128k with no ill-effects.
Old 11th October 2010
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
yeah, I am totally lying and backing a global conspiracy mpod. Call Alex Jones.

Zaphod must be lying too because I asked him about the matter twice and this is what he confirmed to me. And if you think 20 ms is low latency...... The lowest i could get Nebula reverb to go is at a 1024 buffer.

I run full mixes (with lots of vstis) with two UAD2 Quads and a i7 at a buffer of 128k with no ill-effects.
you can reduce it as you want. From the graphic interface till 512, but you could edit xml manually and get even better values.
Anyway suggested value is 512 (so 1024), if you need lower values I think you should use the standard nebula. Ligher version of consoles are coming, so you should experience the same performances of other plugins. Which should not be good if your sequencer handles badly multithreading (I expect that all processors are used when you instantiante a new plug-in. If it doesn't happen in nebula but it happens using other products just report in our forum, we'll check differences).

Now a disclaimer.
Animus, every answer given privately can not the best answer FOREVER. For this reason we developing and improving continuously our products. A thing said yesterday is old tomorrow. When you ask the current situation I give the best answer for the current state of developments, but I can't forecast the future. For example you asked which is the latency of this or that and I answer in the correct way, but things change. I couldn't guess that a light version of a software console emulation COULD run with less than 1% CPU on a modern i7 processor. Maybe today I tell you that minimum latency is 256 samples, maybe tomorrow we are running zero latency algos, who knows?
While we are speaking a bunch of users are using successfully server versions of nebula. Other ones are betatesting light version of kernels and so on.
Old 11th October 2010
  #81
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Animus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zaphod View Post
you can reduce it as you want. From the graphic interface till 512, but you could edit xml manually and get even better values.
Anyway suggested value is 512 (so 1024), if you need lower values I think you should use the standard nebula. Ligher version of consoles are coming, so you should experience the same performances of other plugins. Which should not be good if your sequencer handles badly multithreading (I expect that all processors are used when you instantiante a new plug-in. If it doesn't happen in nebula but it happens using other products just report in our forum, we'll check differences).

Now a disclaimer.
Animus, every answer given privately can not the best answer FOREVER. For this reason we developing and improving continuously our products. A thing said yesterday is old tomorrow. When you ask the current situation I give the best answer for the current state of developments, but I can't forecast the future. For example you asked which is the latency of this or that and I answer in the correct way, but things change. I couldn't guess that a light version of a software console emulation COULD run with less than 1% CPU on a modern i7 processor. Maybe today I tell you that minimum latency is 256 samples, maybe tomorrow we are running zero latency algos, who knows?
While we are speaking a bunch of users are using successfully server versions of nebula. Other ones are betatesting light version of kernels and so on.

thanks zaphod. Pretty much confirms what I was saying. Look forward to a new and improved Nebula.
Old 11th October 2010
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
thanks zaphod. Pretty much confirms what I was saying. Look forward to a new and improved Nebula.
And he pretty much confirmed what i said

They "suggest" DSP buffer ranging from 512 to 1024 because it's the most acceptable for most users in therms of CPU performance . Or in other words - nebula will behave better in a way that you will most probably run many instances then at lower DSP buffer value (i did some betatesting for Acoustica at early development stage).


Btw i never said you are lying or anything about conspiracy theory. Sorry to misunderstood me. I said that person which told you that about latency is lacking in experience with nebula or lying. Sorry my english is pretty much bad. Take my honest apology if i made you feel wrong way
Old 12th October 2010
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooker View Post
Thats ok, just to make it clear; we get a bunch of attackers on Nebula threads and sometimes negative comments can be understood in the wrong way by Nebula users here in GS.
No I am not a Nebular knocker! I been meaning to try it.
Old 12th October 2010
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cooker View Post
Thats ok, just to make it clear; we get a bunch of attackers on Nebula threads and sometimes negative comments can be understood in the wrong way by Nebula users here in GS.
Yeah, thanks to guys like him:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/5875857-post280.html

he always behaves so good (this was a relatively "nice" post)
Old 12th October 2010
  #85
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Who cares if people knock it or not..they are all idiots anyway heh
Old 12th October 2010
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miro View Post
Yeah, thanks to guys like him:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/5875857-post280.html

he always behaves so good (this was a relatively "nice" post)
Ah, yeah. The village fool.
Old 12th October 2010
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miro View Post
Yeah, thanks to guys like him:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/5875857-post280.html

he always behaves so good (this was a relatively "nice" post)
LOL!! heh
Old 12th October 2010
  #88
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Surbitone's Avatar
Yeah, that guy's a bit of a bell-end.

More on topic, I used tape booster today on some drums & bass recorded to tape at fairly low gain. Really beefed em' up, did the job nicely and organically. thumbsup
Old 17th November 2010
  #89
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I just picked up both R2R & Tape Booster+. I haven't had a chance to even audition all of the variations and I can say that it was money well spent. I'm liking the sound a lot and will be using it a lot. Mixing ITB has never been so good.

oh, and even though this would never happen in a real world studio with a tape machine, I really like putting the snare through the Revox preset and the rest of the kit through the Studor.
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