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Famous Fun Thread: Analog v. Digital--Which is "The King" of great sound quality
Old 2nd October 2005
  #631
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

I can't help it if the Digital Math Scoundrels have done the big con job with their Silly Con **** chips...All the **** chips are full of errors and anomalies and they all still sound horrific when compared to analogue. The lyin' sack of **** ass bastards ought to be jailed for all the fraud they have perpetrated.

The only good Digital Math Scoundrel is one behind bars or one making full monetary restitution to the fraud victims.
Old 2nd October 2005
  #632
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De chromium cob's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny B
I can't help it if the Digital Math Scoundrels have done the big con job with their Silly Con **** chips...All the **** chips are full of errors and anomalies and they all still sound horrific when compared to analogue. The lyin' sack of **** ass bastards ought to be jailed for all the fraud they have perpetrated.

The only good Digital Math Scoundrel is one behind bars or one making full monetary resititution to the fraud victims.

You should be locked up and put away for aggravated redundancy.... They're all tools, and if you cant use them to your advantage, then thats your failing, not the gear.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #633
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bunnerabb's Avatar
The thread is a huge, puffed up dog and pony show, yeah.

But I'll take vinyl and valves over anything digital, any day. That being said, I'm part of the "problem" because I track and mix (often) ITB.

It's been driven into the mud, here, but.. most AE's I know prefer analogue, hands down. Now tell me how this got to be a sticky.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #634
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It got to be a sticky because the debate of Analogue vs. Digital still rages on....

So far, there is widespread agreement that Analogue still whips ass on Digital in the Sound Quality Race.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #635
Gear Nut
 

Personally, I can't decide whether "the folks who flip through stuck-together semen-encrusted pages of "Stereophile" drooling over a $15,000 turntable." or JohnnyB's description of everyone who works in the digital music industry as potential rapists is the high point of this thread.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #636
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

I don't know about the rape, could be true. What I do know is that the Silly Con **** is based to a large extent on people buying into the massive fraud and con job by the Digital Math Scoundrel insurgents at the chip companies.

Actually, it's a conspiracy, because the Bean Counters are up to their neck in the fraud.
You can try to lay all the blame on the marketing dept's, but they are nothing more than mouth-pieces who parrot the crap comming from the Bean Counters and the Digital Math Scoundrels.

Silly Con **** Chips....Emmm, Emmm, Emmm good!

Not!

Sue the bastards. Sue 'em all.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #637
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Imagine that?....over 10,000 hits on this thread!

The "Analogue vs. Digital Debate" rages on.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #638
Quote:
They're all tools, and if you cant use them to your advantage, then thats your failing, not the gear.
Word!!!


yeah, chromium.. this is kinda fun thread and maybe I move it to shoot the breeze but Johnny B is fun so who cares.

btw.. 400++ of your 649 messages are written in this thread Johnny B.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #639
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

I'm was born an entertainer...

Glad you think it's a fun thread.
Old 3rd October 2005
  #640
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themaidsroom's Avatar
 

what's amazing is how many other threads have so many presumptions......
and are informed by this thread's notion whether they are aware of it or not..........

the u47 + clones thread and the corresponding eq magazine mic article uses a
96k pro tools rig + apogee converters as the benchmark for hearing the 47 and its
clones.........insane to me and my ears..................

the difference between a soundelux e-47 and a real 47 is dwarfed by the difference
between 2" 16 track and pro-tools 96k..............an sm7 through a great pre onto
2" 16 track might make the mint 47 onto pro-tools seem irrelevant to my ears......

the difference between a huge live room and a smaller one is dwarfed by the difference
bewteen 2" 16 track and pro-tools 96k..............

i have clients coming from big fancy studios and freaking about my drum sounds, and
all i can attribute it to is tape.........

i don't understand some of these big places in nyc with thousands of dollars a month
in overheads and thousands of square feet and high ceilings
and many hundreds of thousands of dollars of equipment ,
and the immense $200 cost of a reel of tape
justifies them using
the same recording medium as someone in a bedroom ..............

it makes no sense and it doesn't sound good........

right on
johnny b !!


- jack
Old 4th October 2005
  #641
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Jack,

It's all because you know that Analogue is the King of Sound Quality.
Old 4th October 2005
  #642
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

I liked the old thread title better, it was more confrontational.

Analogue vs. Digital---Which is "The King" of great sound quality?

I would not be suprised if the old thread name helped account for more than 10,000 hits on this thread.
Old 4th October 2005
  #643
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StefanColson's Avatar
 

Digital sounds like ass? You deserve a swift kick in the nuts. Have you ever actually listened to a well recorded CD? I've worked for hifi companies, I've recorded projects to tape and to all manner of DAWs, I've compared $40,000 record players to $15,000 CD players. Does really good analog sound better than redbook CDs? Yes, and I don't think many people will disagree. But for you to say that all digital sounds like ****, or even that redbook sounds like **** is moronic.
Old 4th October 2005
  #644
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

You are entitled to your personal opinion, others disagree with your assessment.

Should we go back to revisit the appropriate punshment to be inflicted on the Digital Math Scoundrels? Blasting MPfreakin'3's at them night and day may not be enough.
Old 4th October 2005
  #645
The Distressor's "daddy"
 
Dave Derr's Avatar
 

Digital Discomfort, and Analog Ramblings

If you are looking for accuracy, no analog tape deck will give you the accuracy of any decent 16 bit digital recorder. This is not only measurable, but in most ABX tests, listeners could consistently pick out the analog tape from the digital recording and the LIVE source, whereas the listeners often had trouble telling the digital recording from the LIVE source. Digital recorders are very very accurate generally.

HOWEVER, when one says which sounds "better", you've entered into a whole new argument. Analog recorders have been refined for many decades, and tweaked so the non-linearities and innaccuracies were usually turned into "musical" and pleasing attributes. Digital is still young and people are still struggling to introduce some of these musical and pleasing attributes back into it... musical attributes that took many years to evolve in the analog world.

When it comes to processing and mixing, and not music "storage", a whole other set of issues crop up. I think its somehwat true what some people on here say about the mathematicians becoming the masters of your music. You essentially do your processing with intangible complex equations that no one on the outside can peer into, or adjust. You have to have this blind faith that your music isnt suffering irreperable harm! However, theres no reason that math cant be even more beautiful and musical than analog processing... it's all in the details and the ears of the DSP engineer who creates the processor.

Another part of the problem lies in the false promises we have heard for many years. Its the old CRY WOLF story. After hearing extravagant claims for decades, and yet still aching for a good ol knob to twist, or going to an old analog processor that is the same year after year, or hearing nasty steps on the last few db of a fadeout on your Slowtools system... any sane person would start to question just about anything digital. How many people don't start to cringe at the thought of doing a fade with a mouse, or adjusting a pan with a knob that obviously isnt doing what the equivilent analog knob would do... and on and on. When mixing in the box (within the computer), I often feel like Im trying to row a boat with one oar. And don't you roll your eyes when you want to send something Out of the Box to a patch bay, assigning busses, converters, worrying about latency etc, etc? I suppose what Im saying in this paragraph is that you just don't get the feel and comfort when working with the digital "simulated analog" interfaces. Certainly, much of it is a Look and Feel thing.

Another issue Id like to squeeze out is the "Stability" issue. When I plug in my LN1176 or NEVE1073, its going to be the same as it was 10 yrs ago (except the scratchy pots, intermittent switches, failing caps!). Its going to do the same thing with the same settings it always did. Why does software evolve "incompatably" with every rev or every other rev? I seriously doubt your Slowtools V3 mix will come up sounding the same in the new Slowtools V8. This is a problem... and another reason why stand alone analog or digital processors will always stay around... THEY WORK THE SAME WAY YEAR TO YEAR. Again, another digital discomfort.

Well I gotta run... brain surgery again. Just hope that analog gear keeps coming along to keep the DSP guys scrambling. Think what would have been if we didn't have many years of "tweaked" analog to emulate in the digital domain. What would the DSP guys be handing us if there wasn't our old, warm analog processors to constantly hold up for comparison. SO... don't be afraid to support and buy from your modern analog companies, and to go outside the box, because what you have IN THE BOX will most certainly evolve from it
Old 4th October 2005
  #646
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StefanColson's Avatar
 

It must be hard to exist in a world where the vast majority of what you hear on a daily basis sounds terrible. "Oh honey, turn off the TV, it's sounds like dog ****". "****, can't listen to the radio". "Damnit, the only way I can listen to music portably is with cassettes and 8 tracks".

Maybe you and I have different definitions of "terrible", and "dog****". If I say something sounds terrible, it means that I can't really listen to it. If you find digital that offensive then you either aren't hearing the same stuff I am, or you have LITERALLY THE BEST EARS IN THE WORLD. Either way, I'm sure glad I don't suffer from your predicament.

And if you really hate digital as much as you say, then for you to complete a project that passes through any digital medium must be so painful. If I hated such an integral aspect of my job as much as that, i wouldn't be doing that job anymore.

Exaggerating your preference for analog that much just makes you sound like a braindead zealot, and the reaction it causes is to disregard your opinion immediately. To have a preference is one thing, but your ranting is another. You might as well be one of those dumbasses who say things like "It's impossible to get any real work done on a mac/pc". If I read "I like PCs better", or "Macs have the edge over PCs" I keep reading to see how this person formed their opinion. If I read "All PCs are complete dog****" I immediately think that the author is either 12 years old, too stupid and uninformed to form an opinion that makes sense, or just so into following what others say (it's always the followers seeking acceptance who take things overboard to this degree) that they repeat cliches and make stupid claims.

Why be involved in music if you 99% of what's being produced sounds terrible to you. That sounds like a very masochistic practice...
Old 5th October 2005
  #647
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Glad, Dave Derr, the distressor's daddy, could find some time to join in on the fun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Derr
I think it's somewhat true what some people on here say about the mathematicians becoming the masters of your music. You essentially do your processing with intangible complex equations that no one on the outside can peer into, or adjust.
Emmm, perhaps some form of "peer review" might be helpful in this regard. Open Source Code would be even better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Derr
Another part of the problem lies in the false promises we have heard for many years. Its the old CRY WOLF story. After hearing extravagant claims for decades, and yet still aching for a good ol knob to twist, or going to an old analog processor that is the same year after year, or hearing nasty steps on the last few db of a fadeout on your Slowtools system... any sane person would start to question just about anything digital.
Yes, the sane people are questioning digital. They do not like the sound of "Slowtools" and their ilk...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Derr
AlSO... don't be afraid to support and buy from your modern analog companies, and to go outside the box, because what you have IN THE BOX will most certainly evolve from it
Some sound advice, indeed. Very sound.
Old 5th October 2005
  #648
Johnny.. if you would invest the half of your energy on mixing, you spend on this thread.. I think you could get on the top of the digitalmountain

whats your background btw.?
Old 5th October 2005
  #649
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

My background is "Blue." In the near-frame, there's a huge junk pile of Silly Con **** Chip-based crappola that I've tossed out.

On the wall behind me, I have some pictures of Digital Math Scoundrels. I throw darts at these bastards and cuss the Digital Math Scoundrels' bloody existance every damn day.

I do that for fun after having a pint. Piss on the Digital Math Scoundrels.
Old 6th October 2005
  #650
Gear Addict
 

"Which technology has the superior sound quality... "

heh what a question...

the best sound quality has live playing, preferably acoustic !!!!

.
Old 6th October 2005
  #651
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Live can be great when the performers are not "lip syncing" or faking it...like maybe certain model/dancers who claim to sing may being doing and lying about it by calling it "Live."

I like to look at great-lookin' girls as much as the next guy, but please, some of them are not live performers...I dunno if they can even sing at all...I can hear the freakin' Autotune chipmunk artifacts

Angelo, is right about a great real deal live performance...hard to top.

Since this thread now has over 10,000 hits....Maybe we should add the word "famous" right after "Johnny B" and before the word "fun".

It would then read:

Johnny B's Famous Fun Thread: Analogue vs. Digital---Which is the "The King" of great sound quality?
Old 6th October 2005
  #652
Gear Addict
 

Johnny, you're quite a case !!!
Old 6th October 2005
  #653
we have only certain amount of letters in titles here

impossible for digitial..

if this forum was written on a anlaogue typewriter it wouldnt be a problem to add fun to the title.

Old 6th October 2005
  #654
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Thanks.
Old 8th October 2005
  #655
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Derr


When mixing in the box (within the computer), I often feel like Im trying to row a boat with one oar...

Why does software evolve "incompatably" with every rev or every other rev? I seriously doubt your Slowtools V3 mix will come up sounding the same in the new Slowtools V8. This is a problem... and another reason why stand alone analog or digital processors will always stay around... THEY WORK THE SAME WAY YEAR TO YEAR. Again, another digital discomfort.

Dave Derr, the Daddy of the Distessor, is one intelligent fellow with some great observations.
Old 11th October 2005
  #656
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

Do we have any AES sightings of Digital Math Scoundrels being dumped into the East River?
Old 11th October 2005
  #657
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themaidsroom's Avatar
 

i saw about twenty of them, i was yelling to try to help, but someone had duct taped
their ear buds into their ears rather securely, some were floating on trash, some
on larger rats.......in any case......johnny b, it seems it would be appropriate to
go ahead and pay whoever it was you hired, johnny b...........well done




- jack
Old 12th October 2005
  #658
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Johnny B's Avatar
 

I did not pay anyone. However, the boys who used to hang out on Mulberry Street may have gotten angry after being tortured by the dorky Digiital Math Scoundrels digital **** chips ruining the sound of their favorite operas.

Wow, you actually saw 20 Digital Math Scoundrels floating down the river with the rest of the rats. This proves there must be a God.

And I think it also proves that God don't like those who make the music sound bad, and the very worst offenders? Why it's those Goddamned Digital Math Scoundrels.

God will send them all to hell, but first, the honest people in the world should send these bastards to jail for all the fraud they have perpetrated on innocent victims.

God damn, the Digital Math Scoundrel Man!
Old 12th October 2005
  #659
Gear Addict
 

Johnny,

it's time for you to think about, if you should institute your own religion, or church !!!

However, i won't be there, when the crowd nails you up !

.
Old 12th October 2005
  #660
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themaidsroom's Avatar
 

i just bought a cd from new zealand as it is not dometiscally realeased: some
great songs, great players..........hearing the pro tools right away kinda
broke my heart........everything was kind of small and thin......the tchad blake
15 ips masterpiece that turned me on to this artist sounded very, very different....
in truth the old one was a better record outside of its recording format.............but what a drag........
hearing that sound right away, so distracting...................
don't know what you've got til its gone.......

i hope they are floating in that river, johnny, they ruined something magical,
and they have an army of mouthy advocates, ready to die for convenient mediocrity.....
all of us with ears suffer as a result......
in my complete psychosis, i installed an accel card yesterday...........


trying to love music,



- jack
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