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UAD2 is a PCIE card Dynamics Plugins
Old 31st August 2008
  #1681
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deuc647's Avatar
 

ok since some people seem to have already gotten their cards, can someone try live mode asn see if it works as advertised?
Old 31st August 2008
  #1682
Deleted bd1be4f
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SigmaDeltaAudio View Post
...

...

I'm hoping this was some sort of joke, but it seems too believable on gearslutz
Why would you hope it's a joke? You do understand that oftentimes the best sounding plugins are the ones that require massive amounts of DSP to run, right?

If you don't believe that, check out the Algorithmix EQ's sometime.

Now, if you're one of those people who is happy to sacrifice sonic quality for quantity, then THAT would seem too believable on Gearslutz. tutt
Old 31st August 2008
  #1683
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Jorg's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProducerBoy View Post
haha. Yeah, that and right back where we started.
Exactly. I hate freezing. Its the most annoying thing if u wanna make a tiny adjustment and then have to sit around and unfreeze and freeze again.

My whole point was that I'm hoping that 1 Quad will be sufficient for a while and not that all new plugs won't be insanely more dsp hungry that we all need a multicard setup again. That would bring me back to square one. Good for them so that they'll sell more cards lol

Anyway, was just thinking: Do these cards have a similar dsp distribution like the TC cards? What I mean is can one plug be spread across 2 dsps?
Is that maybe the reason that Nigel has been discontinued? Maybe changing the code made it so dsp hungry that 1 chip can't handle the entire plugin. Not that I'll miss the plug tho
Old 31st August 2008
  #1684
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Robert Randolph's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboy2854 View Post
Why would you hope it's a joke? You do understand that oftentimes the best sounding plugins are the ones that require massive amounts of DSP to run, right?

If you don't believe that, check out the Algorithmix EQ's sometime.

Now, if you're one of those people who is happy to sacrifice sonic quality for quantity, then THAT would seem too believable on Gearslutz. tutt
Correlation does not imply causation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You're making an inference on very bad logic. For all you know they could have crippled the plugin so they could sell more UAD cards, or they simply were lazy with the dsp optimization. Given UA's history with the UAD-1, and the dsp-card industry in general both seem plausible. Perhaps it is a fantastic sounding plugin, but you can not tell by DSP usage.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1685
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ProducerBoy's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboy2854 View Post
Why would you hope it's a joke? You do understand that oftentimes the best sounding plugins are the ones that require massive amounts of DSP to run, right?

If you don't believe that, check out the Algorithmix EQ's sometime.

Now, if you're one of those people who is happy to sacrifice sonic quality for quantity, then THAT would seem too believable on Gearslutz. tutt
UA stated that some plugs requiring more power has nothing to do with quality. The La2a requires a lot less DSP than the Neve 1073 on UAD-1 because of whatever blah blah blah it takes to make it all work. I can't remember the spill they gave, but it's on their website.
Anyway, my point is this: Massey Tapehead isn't DSP heavy, but it is a fantastic plug. Logic Platinum Verb sucks at being a verb plug while Tapehead rocks at what it does. Different emulations of different gear require different processes.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1686
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Kindred's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zboy2854 View Post
Why would you hope it's a joke? You do understand that oftentimes the best sounding plugins are the ones that require massive amounts of DSP to run, right?

If you don't believe that, check out the Algorithmix EQ's sometime.

Now, if you're one of those people who is happy to sacrifice sonic quality for quantity, then THAT would seem too believable on Gearslutz. tutt
I have to agree with you - I am always happy to give up DSP or native processing if it gives me nice results - eg - TC Powercore CL1B or MD3 or VSS3 for Reverb

However I also agree that this is a tendency only and sometimes you get nice plugs which are light on CPU/DSP
Old 31st August 2008
  #1687
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
Considering how far they were behind, I find it absolutely ridiculous that the UAD2 Quad is almost 1500.00 even if it is 10 times the old UAD Card. They were 20 times behind the current card. The UAD Quad should have come in at 599.00 and it should have been the only option.

I would not touch UAD ever again after this, it’s crazy. Most of you are going nuts over it, I just don’t get it.

If they ran it natively, we could get a 50 times the performance for free on our computers like we do with other Native options.

My perspective would be different if they did not have their head in their butt on this by grossly overcharging for and update to a grossly outdated piece of gear.

I am dumbfounded.
I'm shocked, SHOCKED, you feel this way.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1688
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peeder View Post
I have a Mac Pro. The problem is the thing doesn't work in Pro Tools and many of the plugins don't run on it anyway. This is a half-baked release...an early beta.

I charge for beta testing, rather than pay for it.
I'd like to know what is up you butt...besides a mac pro?
Old 31st August 2008
  #1689
Deleted bd1be4f
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by SigmaDeltaAudio View Post
Correlation does not imply causation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You're making an inference on very bad logic. For all you know they could have crippled the plugin so they could sell more UAD cards, or they simply were lazy with the dsp optimization. Given UA's history with the UAD-1, and the dsp-card industry in general both seem plausible. Perhaps it is a fantastic sounding plugin, but you can not tell by DSP usage.
Fair enough, but my point still stands that I will sacrifice quantity for quality every time if I have to choose between the two.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1690
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by BorrelNote View Post
yes we know where your priorities are...
I'm sorry if I live in 2008 and realize native computers are fast enough to support plenty of plugins. fuuck

It's a shame they didn't go native with this release.... there's no reason to be tied to anyone's DSP hardware units in this era of computer processing.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1691
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outcastrising's Avatar
 

@ Tony Belmont

I agree with you completely.
I wonder if there is a technical reason (piracy aside) that these plug-ins MUST run on the DSP card?
Old 31st August 2008
  #1692
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by outcastrising View Post
@ Tony Belmont

I agree with you completely.
I wonder if there is a technical reason (piracy aside) that these plug-ins MUST run on the DSP card?
The only reason I can see, is because UA is a hardware company and their business model is built around selling hardware... the same could be said about companies like Digidesign, SSL, TC Electronics and Focusrite. All of which require you to buy a hardware piece (or multiple pieces) to run their plugins.

Other than that there really is absolutely no technical reason for any company to be developing DSP based hardware units solely for running plugins in 2008.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1693
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
I'm sorry if I live in 2008 and realize native computers are fast enough to support plenty of plugins. fuuck

It's a shame they didn't go native with this release.... there's no reason to be tied to anyone's DSP hardware units in this era of computer processing.
This may be true if you only mix rock or pop songs. As a composer, however, I often need to have numerous virtual instruments, samplers, processed recorded tracks and aux busses online simultaneously. Tracking and mixdown often blur into a single creative endeavor rather than a separated, two-step process. So, I can use all the extra DSP processing I can afford in a system that's as uncomplicated as possible. For me, a MacPro with UAD cards is a good step in that direction. When I have a job where I need to have umpteen orchestral articulations, plus rock instruments, plus vocals, plus numerous submixes -- well, I can top out a system pretty quickly. My system procs need the help.

So, there's a customer need for DSP hardware. Given all the UADs, Powercores, Duendes, etc. that sell, there's likely a customer desire for it as well.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1694
AB3
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Why didn't they make card run on PCI-E 16X instead of 1X? Did I miss something here? Wouldn't PCI-E-16 allow a lot more plugins per card?

If you are going to do a massive upgrade after ten years, it should be something that makes sense several years from now, rather than just three years ago.

And having said that, three years from now, processors will be so fast (if not now), that no one will need to be tied to a card.

Doesn't mean I will not get one, but I am disappointed.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1695
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrispick View Post
This may be true if you only mix rock or pop songs. As a composer, however, I often need to have numerous virtual instruments, samplers, processed recorded tracks and aux busses online simultaneously. Tracking and mixdown often blur into a single creative endeavor rather than a separated, two-step process. So, I can use all the extra DSP processing I can afford in a system that's as uncomplicated as possible. For me, a MacPro with UAD cards is a good step in that direction. When I have a job where I need to have umpteen orchestral articulations, plus rock instruments, plus vocals, plus numerous submixes -- well, I can top out a system pretty quickly. My system procs need the help.

So, there's a customer need for DSP hardware. Given all the UADs, Powercores, Duendes, etc. that sell, there's likely a customer desire for it as well.
That's the typical response I hear from people.....

I would love to see a session that maxes out a current generation Mac Pro with a few gigs of RAM.

I mix with 140-150 tracks of audio... with a couple HUNDRED fairly CPU intensive plugins going (like Waves SSL channel as an example or URS Strip Pro)... no sweat.

I also run lots of virtual instruments and the real demand with those is your computer's RAM.

Basically.... You can easily run 400-450 Waves SSL Channels of URS Strip Pro's on a stock 8 core Mac Pro with the buffer set at 32 samples (at least with Logic/ Symphony).
Old 31st August 2008
  #1696
Gear Maniac
 

resale

not being an owner of these products, I have little to offer this conversation...

but I am wondering if anyone could comment on how the UAD-1 has performed in terms of its resale value over time and how the UAD-2 is expected to perform, and more importantly does it compare similarly to that of native systems?
Old 31st August 2008
  #1697
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chrispick's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
That's the typical response I hear from people.....

I would love to see a session that maxes out a current generation Mac Pro with a few gigs of RAM.

I mix with 140-150 tracks of audio... with a couple HUNDRED fairly CPU intensive plugins going (like Waves SSL channel as an example or URS Strip Pro)... no sweat.

I also run lots of virtual instruments and the real demand with those is your computer's RAM.

Basically.... You can easily run 400-450 Waves SSL Channels of URS Strip Pro's on a stock 8 core Mac Pro with the buffer set at 32 samples (at least with Logic/ Symphony).
Hmm. Well, I rarely exceed 100-120 tracks of audio at a 128 buffer and I run into problems. I'm running a dual-core for what that's worth. Tons of RAM, many separate, fast-spin hard drives. The usual.

I wonder why mine is the typical response you receive? Is yours atypical?

I do disagree with your statement regarding virtual instruments and RAM. It's the case for many, sure, especially those that depend on samples for a lot of their sound, but some VIs demand your procs work hard too. So, it depends.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1698
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ryst's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyBelmont View Post
I'm sorry if I live in 2008 and realize native computers are fast enough to support plenty of plugins. fuuck

It's a shame they didn't go native with this release.... there's no reason to be tied to anyone's DSP hardware units in this era of computer processing.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1699
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How about we diss Apple for making sure that their motherboards are not upgradable?
Old 31st August 2008
  #1700
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kasprouch View Post
How about we diss Apple for making sure that their motherboards are not upgradable?
Upgradeable to what? The CPUs, RAM, and video cards are upgradeable on Mac Pros.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1701
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrispick View Post
Hmm. Well, I rarely exceed 100-120 tracks of audio at a 128 buffer and I run into problems. I'm running a dual-core for what that's worth. Tons of RAM, many separate, fast-spin hard drives. The usual.
Hmmm... It could be something system specific with your setup.

What interface are you using and what DAW?

I run Symphony and Logic and have two additional hard drives for audio.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrispick View Post
I wonder why mine is the typical response you receive?
Because most people who feel they need external DSP hardware say "I need more power, because I am a composer and I run lots of virtual instruments, etc".

Quote:
I do disagree with your statement regarding virtual instruments and RAM. It's the case for many, sure, especially those that depend on samples for a lot of their sound, but some VIs demand your procs work hard too. So, it depends.
Sure... I was speaking about the sample based VI's which require additional RAM.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1702
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clonewar View Post
Upgradeable to what? The CPUs, RAM, and video cards are upgradeable on Mac Pros.
But not the motherboard!

Last time I checked Pci slots were on the motherboard
Old 31st August 2008
  #1703
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clonewar View Post
Upgradeable to what? The CPUs, RAM, and video cards are upgradeable on Mac Pros.
really? Please send me a link/info on upgradable CPU's on Mac Pros.

I have an 8 core and when the next mac pro comes out i would love to just be able to upgrade the CPUs instead of dropping another $3000
Old 31st August 2008
  #1704
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kasprouch View Post
But not the motherboard!

Last time I checked Pci slots were on the motherboard
Obviously Apple doesn't sell motherboards separately, but honestly whey would you want one? If you were trying to upgrade a G5, by the time you bought the motherboard, CPUs, RAM, video card, new power supply, etc.. you could just sell your G5 and buy a new Mac Pro for probably less $$.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1705
Moderator
 
TonyBelmont's Avatar
 

There are ways of upgrading a 4 core Mac Pro to an 8 core.

Hardmac.com : Le "Macbidouille" in English

AnandTech: Apple's Mac Pro - Upgrading CPUs, Memory & Running XP

It's harder than upgrading memory or adding a hard drive, but it can be done.

We'll see how things go with the next upgrade, though.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1706
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clonewar's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by computa View Post
really? Please send me a link/info on upgradable CPU's on Mac Pros.

I have an 8 core and when the next mac pro comes out i would love to just be able to upgrade the CPUs instead of dropping another $3000
Here you go: o0o.it :: Mac Pro Xeon Upgrade And Overclock Guide

But my last post applies here.. when Apple ships new Mac Pros with the Intel Nehalem chips they will undoubtedly require a new motherboard, and by the time you would buy a motherboard, the CPUs, and new RAM, you could sell your Mac Pro and buy a new one for less money.
Old 31st August 2008
  #1707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clonewar View Post
Obviously Apple doesn't sell motherboards separately, but honestly whey would you want one? If you were trying to upgrade a G5, by the time you bought the motherboard, CPUs, RAM, video card, new power supply, etc.. you could just sell your G5 and buy a new Mac Pro for probably less $$.
Bingo... So why is it UAD that f'ked G5 users over, and not Apple?
Old 31st August 2008
  #1708
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Guess all im trying to say is that all these companies do what they do because it makes financial sense... UAD-2 was ready for all platforms except protools, and its being called a beta, or a waste of time or too expensive or whatever..

Call me a UAD fanboy, but I didnt come on Gearslutz to diss Soundtoys when they didnt release a VST version of their plugs
Old 31st August 2008
  #1709
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kreeper_6's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kasprouch View Post
Guess all im trying to say is that all these companies do what they do because it makes financial sense... UAD-2 was ready for all platforms except protools, and its being called a beta, or a waste of time or too expensive or whatever..

Call me a UAD fanboy, but I didnt come on Gearslutz to diss Soundtoys when they didnt release a VST version of their plugs
Old 31st August 2008
  #1710
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Jorg's Avatar
The good thing about having a dsp card is that I use my cpu even less which then allows me to reduce my latency even more and keep it that way throughout an entire project.
I don't mind buying/having a dsp card as long as "1" card only will be sufficient to run a normal session. Once we're back in the "you need 4 cards" game I'll be dfegad off again cause that's just totally unreasonable.
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