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UAD2 is a PCIE card Dynamics Plugins
Old 30th August 2008
  #1561
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peeder's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by peeder View Post
(They could have said "proportional to instance count" but they didn't...)
It will be trivially easy to see whether it's instance count or DSP load (which is what they said).

Simply look at the CPU hit difference between 20 Precision Multibands in Low-latency mode vs. 20 1176SE's.

Also look to see if low-latency mode frees up DSP on the cards.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1562
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DontLetMeDrown's Avatar
 

They should be selling these cards at cost to get people in the boat. The video game industry uses this strategy very effectively. For instance, I'd be a new UAD user, so once I buy the card, I'd still have to pay for extra plugs to really get the most out of the card. I'm looking at AT LEAST 1k in plugs if I were to choose everything I like.

Let me ask you this: Do you think people will be buying the solo and duo 5 years from now? It would have been much smarter to build only quad cards to lower the overall cost. I'm sorry, but the specs on the solo card are quite unimpressive. The quad should be somewhere between $500 and $1k. No matter how you slice it, this is not groundbreaking technology. I was really interested in buying UAD2, but I'd rather invest $1500 in a kickass DIY PC using the plugs I already own. Bummer.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1563
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hey Peeder- have you tested it @ 88.2? If so how is the stability/load/sound?
Old 30th August 2008
  #1564
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFTPH View Post
hey Peeder- have you tested it @ 88.2? If so how is the stability/load/sound?
I don't have one of these and until I hear the thing works for me I'm not going to.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1565
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peeder's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontletmedrown View Post
they should be selling these cards at cost to get people in the boat. The video game industry uses this strategy very effectively. For instance, i'd be a new uad user, so once i buy the card, i'd still have to pay for extra plugs to really get the most out of the card. I'm looking at at least 1k in plugs if i were to choose everything i like.

Let me ask you this: Do you think people will be buying the solo and duo 5 years from now? It would have been much smarter to build only quad cards to lower the overall cost. I'm sorry, but the specs on the solo card are quite unimpressive. The quad should be somewhere between $500 and $1k. No matter how you slice it, this is not groundbreaking technology. I was really interested in buying uad2, but i'd rather invest $1500 in a kickass diy pc using the plugs i already own. Bummer.
HeLLO!!!!
Old 30th August 2008
  #1566
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Old 30th August 2008
  #1567
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
I've been able to do this for the last 2 years with my MacPro. Why do I need a card to do that, let alone 2 of them?
um me too.. i have a dual quad 3.0 macpro...and my daw has more power than my old Hd6 accel ever did...
but what the post was pertaining to was the power of the uad-1 at 88.2 or 96k.
its WEAK bottom line.. but with a uad 2 i could run all my native plugs plus the uad plugs and still have extra horse power
if the uad2 aint for you.. its simple, but its crazy for anyone to say its not worth the price or talk about it..
Old 30th August 2008
  #1568
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Eric Dahlberg's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by peeder View Post
It will be trivially easy to see whether it's instance count or DSP load (which is what they said).

Simply look at the CPU hit difference between 20 Precision Multibands in Low-latency mode vs. 20 1176SE's.

Also look to see if low-latency mode frees up DSP on the cards.
You're right, it is easy and it's definitely worth looking into. I'll be using the card this weekend and reporting what I find out.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1569
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DontLetMeDrown View Post
Let me ask you this: Do you think people will be buying the solo and duo 5 years from now?
I don't care. I buy what I need today to do the work I do today.

Who's going to buy your homemade PC five years from now?

For me, resale value takes a big back seat to the value a piece of gear gives me at the present. Why? Because I can use the gear ASAP to make more money ASAP. I use the value ASAP.

When people around here start throwing around the "resale value" thing, I always think, "Why do you want to buy something you intend to resell?"

So, I'll use the UAD-2, make money to pay for it and then some, then pick up the next piece of gear when I need it.

If you don't want or need a UAD-2, cool. If you think it's too expensive or UA's cheated you somehow, that's cool too (although I can't quite empathize). Only the user can decide if an upgrade of any sort is useful or prudent. But if you don't: How relevant are your comments to this thread?
Old 30th August 2008
  #1570
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad McGowan View Post
What does everyone estimate the used price of the UAD1 will plummet to?
I don't know, but this would have been a damn good time to load up on plugs (plus a UAD-1). Seems like there were a lot of deals like Barry Johns' lately, as people didn't know for sure about the next card. You could buy a loaded down 1, get a Solo or something, do the free crossgrade and have a nice ass 3.5x or more rig stocked with expensive plugs.

I'm not selling mine either. I like the simplicity of working with 1 or 2 cards so I don't make too big of a mess. If I upgrade to one of the 2's, I can keep a nice UAD rig at home with the old ones.

George
Old 30th August 2008
  #1571
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price seems a little high, but well worth it. how much is the quad version?
Old 30th August 2008
  #1572
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Buncha' whiners.



I've got two UAD1's working everyday, and I've never once felt I didn't get good value for the money I spent on'em. Compared to the price of my native plugs from Waves, and Sony, the UAD1's still kick serious butt.

I'll order the UAD2-quad soon as I can get one. Can't wait.

As for this idea that the plugs don't cost UA anything, doesn't anyone consider that porting them over to a different processor must have cost more than a few man hours of software development? And you don't think there's any R & D cost at all to designing the hardware, or licensing new software emulations?

Fine. Whatever. You don't think it's worth it, don't buy it. Couldn't be simpler.

But I don't see anyone selling a better product at a better price. How much is the Waves Studio Collection? $1500 or more? With no added DSP, and a more limited range of plugins. And then you gotta pay your WUP too...

If you don't like the idea or expense of DSP-assisted plugins, don't buy'em. But don't call it overpriced unless you can point to a competing product that offers more quality and/or power for less.

Can't wait to hear the Fatso plug and the Moogs!!! hehhehheh
Old 30th August 2008
  #1573
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I've been told by a very reliable souce that : "If you use the older UAD1 along a UAD 2, the UAD performance goes "DOWN" the UAD1 performance Level...

For me, I've waited 7 years to jump on the UAD plugin bandwagon, due to the dongle factor to run the plugin(UAD1), and the fact that URS & Sonalkis filled the void perfectly..

Coming from a DSP DAW (Ensoniq Paris- 5 DSP card system), I'm more a DSP card guy.. These new UAD2 are in a different league than that UAD1 dongle.. That thing was a fake.. The UAD2 is some "Real" Juice..

I have 2 open slots on my Tyan Mobo.. Can we say 2 x Quad. . YES WE Can!!!

Now, I can have my Nuendo mixer Template with a mixture of .. 64 channles of neve 88rs channel strips..32 Harrsion Eqs...32..1073 eqs with 64 1176s..

Now, That's some kind of mixer..

Quote:
Originally Posted by KBOY View Post
Personally It's best they stated that pt LE/HD is not working.

They released at the right time. I think the crossover deal is more then fair. I think the new cards are are perfect, given the price point.

UA is a pretty cool company. I also dig business and the machine of making money, and This whole UAD-2 thing was done pretty well in my opinion. Even down to being able to still use our current UAD-1's along side of the new cards...

given that, I always thought I could get away with 3 cards (have two now) and not have to freeze tracks. But I only currently use the 1176/La2a on the cards....

Now I'm salivating for two Quads.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1574
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blackfinder's Avatar
 

my mind regards the price instead...

i think a basic average power of 2.5x, after so many years, looks like not a BIG STEP AHEAD for these days !!

and please consider that 1500$ for a quad card means they did the SOLO just to force customers to get at least a DUO.
and 1500$ for ONE CARD WITHOUT ANY SERIOUS PLUGIN BUNDLED isn't a good deal for me

the reality is that buying a really much more powerfull card than UAD-1 means to spend at least the price for a DUO and other 500 700 $ for a few truly good plugins.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1575
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peeder's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjdpro View Post
I've been told by a very reliable souce that : "If you use the older UAD1 along a UAD 2, the UAD performance goes "DOWN" the UAD1 performance Level...
Did they set the "Run on" menu selections correctly?

(you might be right, who knows yet)
Old 30th August 2008
  #1576
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jjdpro's Avatar
 

Cool

Not so fast..On my older DAW Ensoniq Paris, which is a DSP system..Ahh so we were told..?? It turns out that, the PAris DSP card does power the Mixer, EQs and a choice of 16 verbs comps, delays, chouring... But, Paris also, utlilises the host CPU for running native plugins, and recording, editing.. BUt, at an almost zero latency...

My point.. Running the UAD2 may involve using the Host cpu for the near zero latency monitoring. But, I think the Plugins are being powered by the card..

If this turns out to not be case, then then is just another big hype just like the UAD1..

Quote:
Originally Posted by peeder View Post
Starting to paw through the manual...

Unfortunately, you have to choose PER PLUGIN MODEL what gets run on UAD-1 vs. UAD-2. i.e. ALL 1081's will have to run on UAD-2s, or UAD-1's. They couldn't figure out how to do that automatically per instance! heh

Here's a goodie:



Makey no sensey. All the host CPU cares about is moving an audio stream around if it's not doing the processing. Any audio stream is the same as any other.

My conclusion is this is an outright lie, and the CPU is, indeed, doing the processing in low-latency mode, they just can't bring themselves to admit the plugins do run native because that would mean everyone would see the cards as just the dongles they are.

Someone with a low-level debugging skill please confirm this...
Old 30th August 2008
  #1577
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jjdpro's Avatar
 

Do not know.. This what I was told..And, this guy knows what he's talking about about when it comes to UAD or anything dealing with DAW manufactuers..


Quote:
Originally Posted by peeder View Post
Did they set the "Run on" menu selections correctly?

(you might be right, who knows yet)
Old 30th August 2008
  #1578
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
I sold these plugs because they do not work on my Protools HD rig and the fact that I have an HD2 with only 1 slot left and an expansion box was not an option. Couldn't really do anything with one card.

So it's either let the card and plugins sit there for the most part, never to be used, or sell them and cut my losses. Which were massive by the way.
I think the point other posters were making about PTHD is the fact that HD users justify the outrageous price of their hardware by saying it pays for itself in the environment of a working studio. Why couldn't the same argument be made for a UAD-2 card?

The fact that your original UAD card didn't work with your HD system seems to be a red herring. Did you buy the UAD before PTHD? If so, you made the choice to get PTHD, which made the UAD obsolete. That's not UAD's fault, that's your fault. Plus, we would assume that while you had the UAD, you were making money with it, right? So, presumably, the card paid for itself a long time ago, which means you could have given it away and still been in the black. We don't all recoup 100% when we resell gear. 50% - 70% is more like it.

It boils down to the hypocrisy of justifying a overpriced HD rig, but complaining about a overpriced UAD-2 card.

(Personally, I think it's great that the new UAD doesn't work with PTHD - just one more nail in PTHD's coffin.)
Old 30th August 2008
  #1579
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franco View Post
Yup, but keep in mind that you can still use your UAD-1 cards with the UAD-2s, so if you still want to use Nigel, you can use it on the UAD-1 cards.

It looks like they may be working with NI in the future too, I saw a soft synth with the NI logo in one of the videos, hm (scratches head).
Dropped Nigel, and partnered with NI...So we'll see a GuitarRig UAD-2 version?
Old 30th August 2008
  #1580
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peeder's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjdpro View Post
Not so fast..On my older DAW Ensoniq Paris, which is a DSP system..Ahh so we were told..?? It turns out that, the PAris DSP card does power the Mixer, EQs and a choice of 16 verbs comps, delays, chouring... But, Paris also, utlilises the host CPU for running native plugins, and recording, editing.. BUt, at an almost zero latency...

My point.. Running the UAD2 may involve using the Host cpu for the near zero latency monitoring. But, I think the Plugins are being powered by the card..

If this turns out to not be case, then then is just another big hype just like the UAD1..
I think Paris managed the i/o as well...no? if you handle the I/o interfacing yourself realtime is not that hard to get.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1581
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drumkideric's Avatar
 

I ordered a Duo today. Can't wait to try it out!
Old 30th August 2008
  #1582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
You could easily make the argument that the Duende is quickly outdated as well with the advent of 8 core Macs. To me, any card based DSP, including Protools HD is outdated and not justifiable at this point. For this very point, I do not use my HD cards for plugins, I use RTAS plugs.

So to me, it's not right to even compare to any other DSP base option, compare to how many Waves Neve plugs can I run on an 8 Core Mac, a lot more than on any of the UAD cards.

Now we can debate the quality of the plug and I will concede immediately that UAD's plugs blow everything else away, so even only able to run half the number of a Waves Neve compared to a UAD Neve natively would be acceptable if all done on the computers processor.

Think about this objectively for a minute.
You win! dont buy it.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrispick View Post
I don't care. I buy what I need today to do the work I do today.

For me, resale value takes a big back seat to the value a piece of gear gives me at the present. Why? Because I can use the gear ASAP to make more money ASAP. I use the value ASAP.

When people around here start throwing around the "resale value" thing, I always think, "Why do you want to buy something you intend to resell?"

So, I'll use the UAD-2, make money to pay for it and then some, then pick up the next piece of gear when I need it.
well said thumbsup
Old 30th August 2008
  #1584
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by barryjohns View Post
I just sent you a PM to give me a call at work next week.
HAHAHAHAHAHA!

"Hello, I'm just doing some background checks on behalf of Gearslutz."
Old 30th August 2008
  #1585
Gear Addict
 

Stupid simple comment, but maybe true:
If you are a hobbyist, this is big fun for short money (safe and sound, at home, making art). If you are a pro, it's tax decutable, made to make money with, and much less than the $1,000,000 you'd spend for equivalent hardware.
I thank god I'm alive today and will get this asap (I have uad-1's now and have been freezing tracks all week, and that's using SE versions). Duo will do me just fine. Quad if I'm a bit lit.

Last thought: will we all now sound the same, using Neve as if it's '73? It's a good thing I have waves SSL, Sonnox, PSP, and Soundtoys plugs too. API next.
Life is good.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1586
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majool's Avatar
 

partnered with Logic?

why was space designer shown?
strange...
Old 30th August 2008
  #1587
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BLueROom's Avatar
 

While I agree that charging for transfers is kind of an insult, the price of the actual cards is perfectly ok considering what you get. No problem here.
Sh*t, I'd pay that price just to get my current cards to play nice with my 8core MacPro.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1588
Here for the gear
 

in the chart where it says you can only run for example 6 instances of Plate 140 on the UAD Solo's does that mean youve run out of space to run other plug ins?
Old 30th August 2008
  #1589
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True North's Avatar
 

I have a Quad on order, should be here next week heh

Quote:
Originally Posted by peeder View Post
When LiveTrack is active, host CPU loading increases. The host load is directly
proportional to the DSP load of the UAD plug-in(s) in LiveTrack mode,
however host CPU is never used for Powered Plug-in processing.
Peeder - where did you find the above quote ?

One thing will be interesting in that we will finally be able to see how much native power these UAD plugs can eat up - there has been alot of speculation on this.

Reaper has a cool finction that allows you to see exactly how what CPU % each plug is using.
Old 30th August 2008
  #1590
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DontLetMeDrown's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrispick View Post
I don't care. I buy what I need today to do the work I do today.

Who's going to buy your homemade PC five years from now?

For me, resale value takes a big back seat to the value a piece of gear gives me at the present. Why? Because I can use the gear ASAP to make more money ASAP. I use the value ASAP.

When people around here start throwing around the "resale value" thing, I always think, "Why do you want to buy something you intend to resell?"

So, I'll use the UAD-2, make money to pay for it and then some, then pick up the next piece of gear when I need it.

If you don't want or need a UAD-2, cool. If you think it's too expensive or UA's cheated you somehow, that's cool too (although I can't quite empathize). Only the user can decide if an upgrade of any sort is useful or prudent. But if you don't: How relevant are your comments to this thread?
Hmm. I think you kinda missed my point. I certainly was not talking about resale value anywhere in my post. I'm just pointing out that there are cost savings to be had by mass producing 1 card instead of 3. As it is RIGHT NOW, quad core systems [arguably] already render these cards worthless. I think it is a poor business decision to even bother putting out the weak solo especially. They could have focused on one card (mass produce the s#it out of it) and gave bonuses for buying more than one.

I'm just kind of disappointed since it would not be very cost effective for me to purchase this when I can just upgrade my PC with that cash (even though my current DAW makes it through huge sessions just fine). Everyone raves about these plugs so I was kind of excited about trying them, but I think I'll just stick with the plugins I currently have.
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