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UAD2 is a PCIE card Dynamics Plugins
Old 19th January 2008
  #271
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PheelTheMusic's Avatar
 

I'm sending the following note to the Press & Reviews contact of Universal Audio "[email protected]". Maybe if we all copy and paste and send this letter to UA they will start to wake up. Monday morning open their e-mail to 1,000 emails expressing concern...



To Whom It May Concern:

As a loyal Universal Audio customer I would like to express my growing frustration with the increasingly antiquated processing power of the UAD1 PCI and PCI-Express cards. As you are certainly well aware, when UAD1 was released nearly a decade ago the UAD1’s processing was impressively powerful and highly innovative. Since then, Universal Audio customers like myself have watched other plug-in manufacturers continually update their products to accommodate technological advances while we sit here stuck in 2001.
This irresponsiveness is baffling. I believe that UA Powered Plug-Ins are sonically among the very best in the industry. A more powerful “UAD2” card would unquestionably lead to an influx of new costumers. Additionally, there would be a flurry of plug-in purchases by existing customers as the increased instance count of the UAD2 card would allow the use of more plug-ins in every session and warrant the purchase of more UA plug-ins.
While I certainly understand the need for secrecy throughout the R&D process, what I cannot understand is the fact that in 2008 we still are using processing technology from 2001. If Apple was still selling machines with 400Mhz single core CPUs today I’m not so sure they would be still be competitive in the personal computer market.
At the very least I hope UA is aware of the desire by the vast majority of its own customer base for an updated hardware solution that acknowledges progresses of the 21st century.
This GearSlutz thread, https://www.gearslutz.com/board/namm-...6727-uad2.html, is just once instance of many where an abundance of UAD1 users have expressed their concern and dissatisfaction. Also there is a poll on your own online forum, UAD Forums :: View topic - Poll: How important is a UAD-2 to you..., that poses the question “How Important is UAD2 to you?” and highlights the seriousness of the issue.
Universal Audio has always been a company of commendable customer service and extremely responsive management. It is a shame that UA is currently not in fact “listening loud and clear to its thousands of loyal users”.

- Hopeful UA Fan
Old 19th January 2008
  #272
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The whole UAD-2 speculation for NAMM 2008 started with that blurb (which has since been edited) in the NAMM press release, stating that the UAD EL Fatso plugin would be for UAD2. Now I thought the Fatso plug was going to be avail when NAMM hit, but it's not going to be available till later this year. One might infer that there will be a UAD2 release around the same time as the Fatso release.
Old 19th January 2008
  #273
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peeder's Avatar
 



Well what we know from that letter is that most likely AES is the launch date. They will try to have boxes in people's hands by the end of the year (tax writeoff season). There might be an announcement at Summer NAMM. The FATSO will be launched concurrently with the UAD-2 (thus the "typo") and may even be dangled as an upgrade sweetener for the long-suffering faithful.

In between, a Valley People processor or two, maybe a Neve 2254, and something else from SPL (perhaps announced at Messe) will roll out to try to retain interest. They won't do anything particularly elaborate until they get the new architecture rolling but once they do I'd expect a new reverb (note the swipe at Duende).

Sounds like they have encoutered technical difficulties. Sounds like something as major as a complete burn and rebuild along the way. This might have happened when Duende appeared, they felt a need to make a Duende killer and couldn't scale what was already in place. Or maybe there were false starts about how to serve the non-PCIe market (the ExpressCard thing being a trial balloon). The new unit will probably be a full studio-in-a-box with a full virtual Neve 88rs console, 33609, reverbs, outboard, etc all runnable simultaneously from within your DAW of choice.

But who knows, they could slip further, and the native guys could open a gap in quality and seize the market (with pirated versions destroying demand freely and making it very hard to justify investing in hardware acceleration). I wouldn't be "110% sure" of anything until the boxes/cards are installed in the field and work.
Old 19th January 2008
  #274
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I still have faith in UA. It's obvious something is in the works and probably has been for several years. I am hoping for at least an announcement at Musikmesse. I think they had planned to announce it but they had a setback. I think that's admirable they don't want too announce something and not have it ship for 3 months +. Look at the Spectrasonics Omnisphere's which was announced for a September release! That is just ridiculous.

Go UA!
Old 19th January 2008
  #275
AB3
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I also have faith in UA. They are probably making sure that there next product will also be awesome five years from now. So it is better to wait and have a huge success than release something with bugs, etc.
Old 19th January 2008
  #276
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could someone please stop this thread in the NAMM?

there are no news depending on uad2 and there won´t.
Old 19th January 2008
  #277
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Universal Audio has announced new plug-in partners and forthcoming additions to the DSP Platform for Mac and PC. Valley People (US), Sound Performance Lab (Germany) and Empirical Labs (US) join Roland (Japan) and Neve (UK) as the latest companies to sign licensing deals with UA to develop future plug-ins for the popular DSP platform which features the leading plug-in analog hardware emulations in the industry.
Matt Ward, President of Universal Audio, told us, "I think our users will be elated by the latest partner additions to our portfolio of premium quality plug-ins. The UAD DSP platform has successfully established itself not only as a secure platform to do plug-in business for our partners, but also the best-sounding platform for hardware emulations in the business at any price.”

Mike Barnes, VP Marketing for Universal Audio, had this to add, “UA has been listening loud and clear to our thousands of loyal users and we are committed to evolving the UAD product family, delivering the best value DSP platform and broadening our select plug-in suite so that the UAD continues to set the benchmark as the best in-the-box mixing and mastering solution available for AU/VST/RTAS DAW users."

UA also announced improved 2008 world-wide retail pricing on select UAD products. They say that the following UAD bundles now offer even greater per plug-in value:
  • UAD-1 Ultra PAK (PCI) moves from US$1199 to US$999 street price
  • UAD-1e Expert PAK (PCIe) moves from US$999 to US$749 street price
UAD Platform Partners/Plug-Ins:
  • Empirical Labs (US) - Forthcoming Fatso plug-in mid-late 2008
  • Neve(UK) : 1073, 1081, 33609, 88RS, future plug-ins TBA
  • Roland(Japan) - RE-201 Space Echo, Dimension D, CE-1, future plug-ins TBA
  • Sound Performance Lab (Germany) - Transient Designer, future plug-ins TBA
  • Valley People (US) - future plug-ins TBA
Old 19th January 2008
  #278
Here for the gear
 

Well, I'm bored with SM57's, I've sold mine because f**kin' Shure refuse to update them. COME ON SHURE, SOMETHING BETTER! (oh wait......) While I'm at it, I'm going to sell my U87's as well, now there's a company with arrogance....also my car isn't fast enough...piece of sh*t...the SSL in my studio needs replacing, the technology is sevral years old....



I think it says a lot with these new 'strategic partnerships', companies like Neve, Roland, etc. wouldn't be putting their names on these things if they didn't think that UA would come up trumps in the end. They would have happily gone to TC or whatever otherwise.

Anyways,
Love all you guys. Don't get me wrong, I love new toys as much as the next man.

Ed (who wishes he was in California right now. With a UAD2 card. But I'll wait.)
Old 19th January 2008
  #279
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e-are's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by audiomichael View Post
The whole UAD-2 speculation for NAMM 2008 started with that blurb (which has since been edited) in the NAMM press release, stating that the UAD EL Fatso plugin would be for UAD2. Now I thought the Fatso plug was going to be avail when NAMM hit, but it's not going to be available till later this year. One might infer that there will be a UAD2 release around the same time as the Fatso release.
I was told yeserday at NAMM , by a UA rep that it will be available in spring 2008.
Old 19th January 2008
  #280
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e-are's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AB3 View Post
I also have faith in UA. They are probably making sure that there next product will also be awesome five years from now. So it is better to wait and have a huge success than release something with bugs, etc.
+1
Old 19th January 2008
  #281
Lives for gear
well, in the computer-departement time goes a bit faster as with microfones.

(and you can use as many sm57 as you like and have inputs)
:-)
Old 19th January 2008
  #282
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slaves666's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by e-are View Post
I was told yeserday at NAMM , by a UA rep that it will be available in spring 2008.
I assume you mean the plugin, not UAD-2 right?
Old 20th January 2008
  #283
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I'm more excited by the partnership with Valley than I am the possibility of a Fatso. Would love to hear a Dynamite plug!!
Old 20th January 2008
  #284
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101

Look... NAMM is a trade show... it's about the relationship between manufacturer and retailer... MUSIC MERCHANT is the "MM"... so put yourself in the place of a Universal Audio...

If UAD announces the UAD2 a year before it ships, the head buyer for GC is going to be on the phone in five seconds asking the guys from UA why the hell he just bought X number of UAD1 cards that he now can't sell because everyone is going to wait for the UAD2. Then he's going to ask if Universal Audio is going to take them back... or give GC back some of the money back they just paid. Or if it's NAMM time he's going to be in Bill Putnam, Jr's face asking these questions.

So ask yourself... if you were Universal Audio, or Digidesign or MOTU or any one of 100 other companies in that situation, would you keep people who have already bought your product placated by informing them of your long term plans if it TORPEDOED current/near future sales? Would you? Really? I don't think so. If you answer "yes", don't open a business. And if the company you love announces products a year in advance, they won't be around very many years.

Apple is probably developing computers that would make you cum in your pants, but they're not going to tell you NOW! Not if it keeps you from buying their current product line! Software is a slight exception, because you can offer a free upgrade to version X for people who bought version Y after X was announced. Only costs a CD. Like I bet people who buy DP5 today get DP6 for free, because the cats out of the bag. (That's up to MOTU of course, but that's how it usually works).

Last edited by dannygold; 20th January 2008 at 06:09 AM.. Reason: spellin
Old 20th January 2008
  #285
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B-San's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dannygold View Post
Apple is probably developing computers that would make you cum in your pants, but they're not going to tell you NOW! Not if it keeps you from buying their current product line! Software is a slight exception, because you can offer a free upgrade to version X for people who bought version Y after X was announced. Only costs a CD. Like I bet people who buy DP5 today get DP6 for free, because the cats out of the bag. (That's up to MOTU of course, but that's how it usually works).
Well put... keep the faith brothers!
Old 20th January 2008
  #286
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brutze's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by e-are View Post
I was told yeserday at NAMM , by a UA rep that it will be available in spring 2008.
What? Please elaborate...
Old 20th January 2008
  #287
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Am I the only one thinking that the best way they could do it was to make the card itself just a hardware copy protection thing, and let the plugins get handled by the DAW cpu?

That way, processing power would not be locked to an outdated card, and they could just develop plugins for how long as they wish.

My dualcore DAW which is good, but not by any standard the best out there, easily runs 150+ tracks with 300-350 Waves R plugins at 2ms latency and 80% load, and I'm sure that if my UAD card DIDN'T process my UAD plugins, but instead let my CPU do it, I could run alot more instances of the UAD plugins than my card allows me to do.

And these days, we have quadcores and the train is not slowing down. Havin the plugins run on the card is yesterday, make them run on the CPU and use the old UAD-1 as a copy protection and the UAD plugins are future proof.

Wíth the speed of todays computers, a brand new UAD2 card would soon be a turtle too.
Old 20th January 2008
  #288
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I predict that, when the new card (or whatever) does come out, as many people will be griping about its cost as are now griping about its time to market.

In other words, y'all's griping about UA seems to be constant in level and continual over time.
Old 20th January 2008
  #289
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Eigenwert's Avatar
Yeah they even won´t stop griping about the nonexistance of the new card after they were told that it is already in development.

Same like before, when they didn´t stop griping about logic 8 being not developed while they were told it would be available soon because it already had been in the beta phase for a while.

People only asked "WHO told you that" and are never interested in the facts that they are being told. At least you guys should shift your cant from "there won´t be a new card, make it native" to "F*** you all, they´re not going native"
Old 21st January 2008
  #290
pro
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RIP
Old 21st January 2008
  #291
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crypticglobe's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strange Leaf View Post
Am I the only one thinking that the best way they could do it was to make the card itself just a hardware copy protection thing, and let the plugins get handled by the DAW cpu?

That way, processing power would not be locked to an outdated card, and they could just develop plugins for how long as they wish.

My dualcore DAW which is good, but not by any standard the best out there, easily runs 150+ tracks with 300-350 Waves R plugins at 2ms latency and 80% load, and I'm sure that if my UAD card DIDN'T process my UAD plugins, but instead let my CPU do it, I could run alot more instances of the UAD plugins than my card allows me to do.

And these days, we have quadcores and the train is not slowing down. Havin the plugins run on the card is yesterday, make them run on the CPU and use the old UAD-1 as a copy protection and the UAD plugins are future proof.

Wíth the speed of todays computers, a brand new UAD2 card would soon be a turtle too.

I posed this very question to the folks at UA a few years back. They told me (at that time) that a VERY fast computer like a dual XEON 3.0ghz system (which was VERY fast at the time) could run only 1, maybe 2 of their most CPU intensive plug-ins. They say the reason for this is that their emulations are specially coded to take advantage of the specific and dedicated DSP on the cards they use. They say that part of the reason their plugs sound so much better than anyone elses is because of the HUGE amount of DSP they actually require.

Thus.... even with todays mega fast computers, their plugs would still most likely require far more computing power than something like... say.... Waves.

I believe this because... well, listen to the depth, detail and realism of the UA 1073 compared to the Waves vintage version of this same EQ. Not even in the same ballpark.

jmtc... of course...
Old 21st January 2008
  #292
PDC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crypticglobe View Post
I posed this very question to the folks at UA a few years back. They told me (at that time) that a VERY fast computer like a dual XEON 3.0ghz system (which was VERY fast at the time) could run only 1, maybe 2 of their most CPU intensive plug-ins. They say the reason for this is that their emulations are specially coded to take advantage of the specific and dedicated DSP on the cards they use. They say that part of the reason their plugs sound so much better than anyone elses is because of the HUGE amount of DSP they actually require.

Thus.... even with todays mega fast computers, their plugs would still most likely require far more computing power than something like... say.... Waves.

I believe this because... well, listen to the depth, detail and realism of the UA 1073 compared to the Waves vintage version of this same EQ. Not even in the same ballpark.

jmtc... of course...
It's about the same thing as a video card for crying out loud. You're telling me that a video card is more powerful than a PC or Mac? They want to hardware. Once the software is on it's own, then everyone will have it on a torrent and the cat is out of the bag.
Old 21st January 2008
  #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antithesis View Post
Well, I'm bored with SM57's, I've sold mine because f**kin' Shure refuse to update them. COME ON SHURE, SOMETHING BETTER!
Hmmm... the difference being Shure doesn't release new incredible ad ons for the SM57 every year, that cause the mic to not perform very well because it doesn't draw enough current to run... Comparing computers and hardware, be it mics or cars, hardly makes sense...
Old 21st January 2008
  #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crypticglobe View Post

I believe this because... well, listen to the depth, detail and realism of the UA 1073 compared to the Waves vintage version of this same EQ. Not even in the same ballpark.

jmtc... of course...

Really? I briefly compared the UAD and Waves 1073, matching each by ear and I swear I had a hard time deciding which one I like best. In the end I forced myself into thinking the UAD sounded better. They were definitely in the same ballpark.

I think the whole thing about UAD plugs taking a whole dual Xenon with one or two plugs if ran natively is a bunch of bull**** marketing spin.
Old 21st January 2008
  #295
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peeder's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
I think the whole thing about UAD plugs taking a whole dual Xenon with one or two plugs if ran natively is a bunch of bull**** marketing spin.
There's another possibility: the programmers are lazy or afraid of becoming obsolete and invent all sorts of tales about how their video cards from the 90's are faster than a modern multicore CPU.

They might even demonstrate highly unoptimized C++ prototype performance against exceedingly optimized assembly on the card as "evidence" of their old ball & chain's superiority.

Programmers need to be managed by another programmer.
Old 21st January 2008
  #296
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Thumbs down native

Going native would be very stupid IMO. Besides the protection problem, all people (like myself) with no up-to-date computers would soon be ex-customers, because we're not able to run the numbers of plug ins we want to.

So my wishes for a UAD-2 are:
FW 400 / 800 (people with PCI slots only would also jump on it)
CHAINER plug in (go on and sign the thread in the UAD forum, it's very important)

But I can wait...and I'm sure whatever and whenever UA releases a new UAD Platform it will be something big
Old 21st January 2008
  #297
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Stefan Elmblad's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Klotzi View Post
Going native would be very stupid IMO. Besides the protection problem, all people (like myself) with no up-to-date computers would soon be ex-customers, because we're not able to run the numbers of plug ins we want to.
Doing a certain way just to please people with old computers would be like saying every website should be designed for 14" monitors and 600x480 pixel resolution.

What good could possibly come from that way of thinking?
Old 21st January 2008
  #298
Wow 10 pages on this topic. Yes we would like more power to run the newer UAD plug ins that demand more power. If they don't have an updated card, it leaves you with a clear choice. Start getting plug ins from other company's. Heck if you have the Waves SSL, V-Series, and API bundles, you are just about all set. Even better yet, invest in at least one high end hardware EQ, and just use your plugin eq's for touching up your tracks.

I have heard the UAD Neve and Waves V-Series and they do sound very different. Which one is closer to a Neve, I can't answer since I have not A/B them. One guy on the gearslutz forum did a test with the V-Seires and Neve and said while it did not sound exactly the same, the Waves was pretty close. I have done a comparrison with the Waves SSL and SSL channel strip and did come to the same conclusion as the guy on gearslutz with the V-Series. Many have praised the Waves API as well.

I think with the structure of how Waves program their software, newer computers appear to give you enough power. Cryptic Globe is a smart dude and I respect his opinions. The UAD structure may be based differently which is why they have their DSP card. But their LA2-A, 1176 and Cambridge take very little DSP, while their UAD Neve and newer plug ins require a lot more power. I don't think any plug in though can give you the clearer 3 dim sound of high end hardware EQ's or compressors but the general character of the EQ they get. They sound layered on top of the signal compare to being part of the original signal..but that is another topic.
Old 21st January 2008
  #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefan Elmblad View Post
Doing a certain way just to please people with old computers would be like saying every website should be designed for 14" monitors and 600x480 pixel resolution.

What good could possibly come from that way of thinking?
I got your point, but I'm still consider that going native would be the wrong way...and I'm sure that won't happen

It's more because of the copy protection and to rewrite the codes. The point, people with old computers, is more a personal thing But beside that I although think that FW would be the best solution.

So let's see what UA will announce this year...
Old 22nd January 2008
  #300
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wakestyle's Avatar
when are they going to announce ANYTHING?? isn't namm on right now?
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