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DFHS vs EZDrummer? Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 26th August 2007
  #1
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DFHS vs EZDrummer?

I've been using DFHS for a while now and I think it sounds good. Very flexible. My question is for EZDrummer users out there. It seems like Toontracks pays a lot more attention to EZDrummer and it seems to be the more popular than DFHS. There's a lot more expansion packs for EZDrummer. Am I missing something? Is EZDrummer easier to use than DFHS? Does it sound as good? Is good enough for Pro applications?
Old 26th August 2007
  #2
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Oldone's Avatar
EZ drummer is much easier and with the Vintage add on, I have pretty much replaced DFHS. Superior was good for its time but I was never happy with the kick sounds. The interface is more complicated than I want for creating music. The humanize control in EZ is just amazing. One knob, more or less random feel. Fast efficient and intuitive. Just a faster and more efficient writing environment to my experience.

I can get stunning results in less time and they are equal to anything I created in DFHS. There are a lot of tweaks in the older program that, at the end of the day, don't produce any usable results. Great ideas the programmers implemented that are by and large rarely necessary.

The real turn I had was the focus they placed on EZ, I mean 2 years worth of focus while DFHS sat by the wayside. It was obvious that they were not investing in the more expensive product, although, they keep claiming that a Superior update is coming and it will be "so much better"......

Add to this the cost of DFHS + Custom and Vintage =$500+

EZ with the Vintage add on was half the cost and sounds as good. Maybe not as many options but for meat and potatoes drums, it delivers. Love the products but their development focus has been hard for customers to follow.
Old 26th August 2007
  #3
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Animus's Avatar
 

I have used them both but they have all been pretty much replaced and trumped by Steven Slate Drums. THe new Elite Mixer version sounds incredible. All other drum libraries sound terrible and thin in comparison imo.
Old 26th August 2007
  #4
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Addictive Drums...better than either one...
Old 26th August 2007
  #5
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This is all very interesting. I guess I'm looking for the most 'musical' way to get 'real' sounding drum tracks and DFHS doesn't always inspire me. I write professionally for TV comms and do song writing on the side. It looks like the interface of EZ just gets you going with good quality too. I'll check out the other drum softs mentioned.
Old 26th August 2007
  #6
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EZD is great for writing/inspiration.
Old 26th August 2007
  #7
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Tone Laborer's Avatar
I have DKHS. What features of EZ will help you? The included midi?

I'm always looking for more and better human played midi grooves. Anyone know of any?
Old 26th August 2007
  #8
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I'm gonna check out the Addictive Drums demo because the demos on the website sound so good. I love the interface. Is EZDrummer's interface that intuitive and flexible? Also, will EZDrummer give me a 'final product' sound? I'm not so concerned whether or not EZ has one less layer of bleed control than DFHS. Do the drum samples sound as good?
Old 27th August 2007
  #9
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sorry about the steam of thought posts but...

I guess my question is...since I already have DFHS and know how to use it, would getting EZDrummer be redundant or would I be much pleased with the interface, midi grooves and humanize feel? Again, I don't have a lot of time to tweak (or knowledge) but would like a very good sounding final product...
Old 27th August 2007
  #10
jje
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsound View Post
I'm gonna check out the Addictive Drums demo because the demos on the website sound so good. I love the interface. Is EZDrummer's interface that intuitive and flexible? Also, will EZDrummer give me a 'final product' sound? I'm not so concerned whether or not EZ has one less layer of bleed control than DFHS. Do the drum samples sound as good?
I definitely prefer the sound of Addictive to EZ (as well as the fact that it takes about 30 seconds to load/change kits completely as opposed to EZ's 5 or more minutes depending on the size of the kit ) However, the problem with Addictive is the completely ridiculous way they mapped out the sounds on keyboard - instead of using GM with all the extra stuff at the end of the keyboard like EZ, they map out ALL the snares in a row so you have like twenty keys of different snare hits, same for toms, cymbals, etc. What I'm saying is that it's damn near impossible to just sit down to the keyboard and bang out a quick beat. Unless you use something like a Trigger Finger and map only basic sounds to the pads you have to stretch three or four octaves just to get your basic kick/snare/hat/crash. Also a weird thing is that with any groove that I do manually program in (or even just a cymbal crash at the beginning of the measure) the software spikes the cpu on those self programmed hits. If you use their grooves this rarely rarely happens.

That being said, they have a nice size library of grooves similar to EZ Drummer and Groovemonkee is converting his library of grooves over to Addictive one at a time - he now has jazz, country, and rock I believe.

So....when I want to use the EZ Grooves specifically or program my own grooves, I'll use EZ. When I want it to sound great and don't plan on programming anything at all, I'll load up Addictive (or if I need to go fast as it only takes about 30 seconds to load into memory).
Old 27th August 2007
  #11
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsound View Post
sorry about the steam of thought posts but...

I guess my question is...since I already have DFHS and know how to use it, would getting EZDrummer be redundant or would I be much pleased with the interface, midi grooves and humanize feel? Again, I don't have a lot of time to tweak (or knowledge) but would like a very good sounding final product...
If you're looking for real drum samples which can be played or programmed... check out our demos:

https://www.platinumsamples.com/JoeBarresi.html

DFH Superior and BFD use streaming data for the highest quality. EZ Drummer and Addictive Drums use lower resolution and RAM based samples so do use less resources but lack the same realism.

Rail
Old 27th August 2007
  #12
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Oroz's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Animus View Post
I have used them both but they have all been pretty much replaced and trumped by Steven Slate Drums. THe new Elite Mixer version sounds incredible. All other drum libraries sound terrible and thin in comparison imo.
I've been listening to Steven Slate Drums demos and they sound amazing but they seem to be great samples to enhance your drum recordings, on the other hand, with DFHS you can create fully dynamic and very realistic drums from scratch. I've programmed rock/pop ballads with a little jazzy feel in which there are a lot of ghost notes on snare and stuff like that and from what I've been reading you can't do that with Steven Slate Drums.

What I'm trying to say is DFHS and Steven Slate Drums are two different beasts, and besides, DHFS comes with Percussionist and Cocktail features which I use a lot for programming congas, bongos, shakers, tambourines, triangles, you name it...
Old 27th August 2007
  #13
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octatonic's Avatar
I have both- I prefer EZD for quickly coming up with ideas but it is too limiting for final tracks.
DFHS is more flexible but takes longer to get it up and running as a multi channel instrument in Logic.

I've been sample augmenting a track recently (beefing up the snare and replacing the weak kick and toms).
Neither DFHS or EZD were doing it for me.
I eventually went back to my Bob Clearmountain audio sample cd's and found some amazing sounding drums sounds and manually replaced them hit by hit.
Took me quite a few hours to do but I was much happier with the result.
Old 27th August 2007
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jje View Post
I definitely prefer the sound of Addictive to EZ (as well as the fact that it takes about 30 seconds to load/change kits completely as opposed to EZ's 5 or more minutes depending on the size of the kit )
What kit would that be? I have them all and they are all loaded in under a minute.

I really like EZ Drummer, quick and good to work with. The sounds are rather processed so you most likely won't have to tweak them as much, it's up to you to decide if that's your cup of tea or not. I also like the add-on thing they're doing. As for DFH - expect a new version to be announced soon.
Old 27th August 2007
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by octatonic View Post
I've been sample augmenting a track recently (beefing up the snare and replacing the weak kick and toms).
Neither DFHS or EZD were doing it for me.
I eventually went back to my Bob Clearmountain audio sample cd's and found some amazing sounding drums sounds and manually replaced them hit by hit.
Took me quite a few hours to do but I was much happier with the result.
I think you would enjoy Sound Replacer
Old 27th August 2007
  #16
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I think the difference between DFHS and EZD is that EZD is aimed for composers that want great sounds fast for working in TV/film or those that value an easy interface. DFHS is aimed for producers that have mixing skills to transform the raw sounds into a finished product. In my case I'm a producer but want quick, great sounds so I chose EZD. I haven't regretted the decision at all. The sounds, in my opinion, are great and the interface is far more logical than DFHS and the mixer in EZD is what I'm used to when recording and mixing a real drumset...faders and such.

Quote:
Also, will EZDrummer give me a 'final product' sound? I'm not so concerned whether or not EZ has one less layer of bleed control than DFHS. Do the drum samples sound as good?
Here are 3 songs that I did with EZD and the Nashville EZX. The drums are right out of the box except for a bit of eq on the kick and snare...and a bit of verb on the snare.

http://www.rainbowsounds.com/laymedown.mp3

http://www.rainbowsounds.com/countryclubsuperstar.mp3

http://www.rainbowsounds.com/whenimbreathing.mp3

There are a few things I'd like to see implemented in EZD like a tuning knob for the kick, snare, and toms but I'm very happy with the program so far.
Old 27th August 2007
  #17
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Animus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oroz View Post
I've been listening to Steven Slate Drums demos and they sound amazing but they seem to be great samples to enhance your drum recordings, on the other hand, with DFHS you can create fully dynamic and very realistic drums from scratch. I've programmed rock/pop ballads with a little jazzy feel in which there are a lot of ghost notes on snare and stuff like that and from what I've been reading you can't do that Steven Slate Drums.

What I'm trying to say is DFHS and Steven Slate Drums are two different beasts, and besides, DHFS come with Percussionist and Cocktail features which I use a lot for programming congas, bongos, shakers, tambourines, triangles, you name it...
Yup. I hear what you are saying.
Old 27th August 2007
  #18
Gear Addict
 

I like the sound of Addictive Drums, a lot! I just checked out the demo. The loops sound great. From a composers point of view, this is really happening. Does EZ do the same thing? Do the loops sound this good? Now there's rumors of a new DFHS. I wonder if they will make the UI and production more user friendly...
Old 27th August 2007
  #19
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ok..is it just me or does AD's midi files sound like someone played them and EZ's midi files sound like they were programmed? I also think I like the sound of the AD's better. My buddy has EZ so that's how I've been checking it out...
Old 27th August 2007
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oroz View Post
I've been listening to Steven Slate Drums demos and they sound amazing but they seem to be great samples to enhance your drum recordings, on the other hand, with DFHS you can create fully dynamic and very realistic drums from scratch. I've programmed rock/pop ballads with a little jazzy feel in which there are a lot of ghost notes on snare and stuff like that and from what I've been reading you can't do that Steven Slate Drums.

What I'm trying to say is DFHS and Steven Slate Drums are two different beasts, and besides, DHFS come with Percussionist and Cocktail features which I use a lot for programming congas, bongos, shakers, tambourines, triangles, you name it...

Actually check out this demo to hear how you CAN trigger our ghost notes:
www.stevenslatedrums.com/demo/elitemixer3.mp3

And you are right that Steven Slate Drums right now is for replacement/augment in its 1.5 version. However, the good news, is that in another month or so, we will have 2.0 out. 2.0 will be a fully packed drum software with cymbals and mappings for software samplers like Kontakt, Halion, EXS, and more. So I guess the final say is, stay tuned, and use our hits to augment and replace current drum softwares that have been mentioned in this thread.
Old 27th August 2007
  #21
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octatonic's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stiff View Post
I think you would enjoy Sound Replacer
I have it- don't like the interface.
Drumagog is better but it isn't a tdm plugin and I use Logic TDM.

Call me paranoid but when I take the time to do it manually I know it is done properly.
Old 27th August 2007
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jje View Post
However, the problem with Addictive is the completely ridiculous way they mapped out the sounds on keyboard - instead of using GM with all the extra stuff at the end of the keyboard like EZ, they map out ALL the snares in a row so you have like twenty keys of different snare hits, same for toms, cymbals, etc. What I'm saying is that it's damn near impossible to just sit down to the keyboard and bang out a quick beat. .
I have to be honest, I don't have this problem at all. In fact AD maps out perfectly on my keybord. It has 2 snare hits next to each other so I can give the rolls a live feel. I do not ever have 20 snare hits next to each to each other...if I did, I would agree with you...that would suck!

AD is the fastest for loading up and banging out a drum part for me.
Old 27th August 2007
  #23
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by PlatinumSamples View Post
If you're looking for real drum samples which can be played or programmed... check out our demos:

https://www.platinumsamples.com/JoeBarresi.html

DFH Superior and BFD use streaming data for the highest quality. EZ Drummer and Addictive Drums use lower resolution and RAM based samples so do use less resources but lack the same realism.

Rail
Unlike BFD, DFH Superior does not stream the samples from disk it loads the samples into RAM the same as ezdrummer. Superior uses 24bit samples and ezdrummer 16bit. Ezdrummer samples are pre-compressed when they are installed onto your hard drive, Superior samples are not.

Ezdrummer uses these lossless compressed samples by default for smaller RAM useage. You have the option whether to load compressed or uncompressed samples in Superior - there is a marginal CPU hit when you switch the compression on but the RAM savings are definitely worth it.

Ezdrummer pro's

- Premixed in great studios by top named producers
- Easy interface
- Ready to go grooves
- Cheap high quality ezx add-ons

Superior pro's

- Raw 24bit samples
- Much much more configurable
- E-drum compatibility
- Full microphone bleed options (you can set how much each drum bleeds into each mic)
- more articulations


Both products are sampled in great detail and have many velocity layers and round robin samples for loud and soft hits. They also have the best hihat implementation of any drum sampler.

The grooves with the initial ezdrummer are great but the grooves with the later ezx's are fantastic and certainly don't sound programmed. The midi is created by real drummers playing edrums.
Old 27th August 2007
  #24
Gear Nut
 

I've had EZ for a coupla weeks now, and here's my short time response...

EZ is very easy to work with and very quick to get running with, I myself don't find most of the midi grooves compelling so I'll throw one into a Logic track and then "fix" it till it actually moves right, then save it as another midi groove that can be accessed, (a tad pain in the assy to do but not terrible).

I too would REALLY like to be able to tune the drums, as well as have ALL sounds per instrument be accessible all the time, (Maybe they are and I haven't spent enough time with the manual.....that could happen).....

I don't believe at this point that I would try to do an artist release of my own music with it, but I could possibly see my way to it, the problem being that the sounds are sorta hardwired to how they were recorded, whereas I understand that BFD and maybe DFHS are both very raw samples that really NEED to be mixed. EZ they are already mostly there, good in one way and not in another, since you're married to what they did.

But you can get pretty good results very quickly, and for songwriting it's pretty hard to beat....maybe I'll put something up to show what I've been getting out of it.....
Old 27th August 2007
  #25
As far as I know, all the EZdrummer midi loops are played by a real drummer. Some may not be, if a less than real vibe is the aim, but most are designed to sound like a player playing and have been programmed using an e-drumkit.
EZdrummer was never designed to end up on major record releases, although I think it is creeping on to a few.

Other pluses for EZdrummer are:
Variety - lots of expansion packs, lots of different engineers, studios, drummers, instruments.
Price - it's much cheaper than some of the competition.
Ease of use - self explanatory.
Old 27th August 2007
  #26
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
As far as I know, all the EZdrummer midi loops are played by a real drummer. Some may not be, if a less than real vibe is the aim, but most are designed to sound like a player playing and have been programmed using an e-drumkit.
EZdrummer was never designed to end up on major record releases, although I think it is creeping on to a few.

Other pluses for EZdrummer are:
Variety - lots of expansion packs, lots of different engineers, studios, drummers, instruments.
Price - it's much cheaper than some of the competition.
Ease of use - self explanatory.
chrisso - not dogging them (you?) I think it's great for what it is.....but a coupla thoughts/responses to what you just mentioned....

If I was going to make a midi file from a drums performance, I would go for triggers on the drums so the guy could get a real solid groove going, and I wouldn't have him hearing the midi output while he's doing it.

For me, I've yet to hear an e-drum performance that didn't need a fair bit of tweaking, and I've never been around a drummer who wanted to work that way...just my experience.

That being said, EZ works fine as a songwriting tool, and like I said EZ is great for what it is, but maybe it's the kind of thing where it's an orange and someone shouldn't buy it if they really want an apple....

No hard feelings about this, I'm happy with my purchase, and I will continue to use it.....if I ever get something awesome from it, I'll bet that will be about the song it's on in any case, and it won't matter what buttons I push to get there....
Old 27th August 2007
  #27
Gear Addict
 

so I took DFHS and made a good Logic template in my Start Template. I gave each track comp and eq to my taste. I think I'll wait til DFHS 2 comes out. I just loved the midi grooves AD. I hope we can get some more of that stuff. BTW, I have EZPlayer but wasn't to psyched by the grooves. Maybe that will improve, as well...
Old 27th August 2007
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by STILL View Post
No hard feelings about this, I'm happy with my purchase
I don't think I was trying to come back at you.
I was merely trying to clear up a few things already put forward in the thread as a whole - one of which was to question whether EZdrummer grooves were played by a drummer.
FWIW, I think it's easier for some people to start with a pre-programmed midi groove and tweak it to taste, rather than a completely blank screen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dsound View Post
I have EZPlayer but wasn't to psyched by the grooves. Maybe that will improve, as well...
Are you commenting on EZdrummer?
EZplayer has no grooves, it's a simple midi translator allowing users to play sounds from many different drum sample products with midi-files from other products.
A version of EZplayer is free too.
Old 27th August 2007
  #29
Gear Nut
 

Chrisso, no sweat, didn't take it that way, we're cool!
Old 27th August 2007
  #30
Gear Addict
 

Are you commenting on EZdrummer?
EZplayer has no grooves, it's a simple midi translator allowing users to play sounds from many different drum sample products with midi-files from other products.
A version of EZplayer is free too.[/quote]

Oh yeah, I know it's just a midi player. Maybe the retail version will have better grooves...
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