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Yamaha n Series
Old 5th January 2008
  #331
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
Hi George,

Tried searching through the thread, but all I find is that the n-series doesn't have automation and motorized faders. No motors on the faders I guess I can deal with, but it would be nice to think we could write our pans and fades into Cubase as we mix. Is that not possible?

We aren't all Bob Clearmountain, mixing everything by memory in perfect motion. Most people need to do a few passes and unless those passes are written onto the file, were gonna have to go in and use the mouse. That kind of defeats having a digital mixer to work for you, no?
No Automation, The target for thr n is integration. It's the Old school analog approach with tools to help you use the computer and VSTs. The O series is about Automation
with automation you do not need 1 knob, 1 function. That's why we make both.
You have to decide which style is best for you. Usually those that want pristine audio and automation buy 2 devices. A good control surface and good analog front end and mixdown gear.

Euphonix may be a good friend to the n12 in the near future ;-)
Old 5th January 2008
  #332
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geosync View Post
I hated to raise a red flag and then not be able to answer questions right away.
We are very busy getting ready for NAMM.

We received a laptop directly from Dell to use at NAMM.
It was a recommended laptop for music. Didn't work.
We talked with customer support they said no issues w/ FW audio,
and then we were sent to engineering. They had not tested the laptop
with FW audio or at least not mLAN. They confirmed that the FW controller
on the motherboard was not compatible. It was a TI chip BTW.
We gave up on Dell laptops. Apple was kind enough to provide them to us for the show.
No problems. The new driver for Leopard will be released next week. It uses apx HALF the CPU as the Tiger driver. It ROCKS !!

For the PC guys, In the past we used HP laptops, They are really good.
Not sure of the costs.


Hope this helps
Thanks George, that most definitely helps. Too bad the Dell isn't compatable because I've had nothing but good experience with them so far. That said, I've also had good luck with HP so I'll check those out, last time I checked their pricing was reasonable. Also, If I could get a Mac with a 15" + screen for a decent price I would consider it.
Old 5th January 2008
  #333
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulitto View Post
Hi George,

will the new driver run also on OSX 10.4.11 ?

btw: i got my problems sorted....kind of, but i am still not
happy with the N12-driver behavior...

Regards,
Paul
Yes the driver works with both OS. We just tried it on Tiger and Leopard on the same machine. It improves tiger, but the CPU overhead drops about in half when Leopard was added. We thought that was amazing.
Old 5th January 2008
  #334
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Thread Starter
Over the next 3 weeks, I may not respond as often as I usually do.
We are ramping up into high gear getting ready for NAMM, training our sales managers and then showing our goodies at the show, so please be patient. I still love you guys. I'll just be very busy.
Old 5th January 2008
  #335
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
Hey Markmann,

I'm not even close to being an expert, but I can tell you I've been reading these types of boards for a couple years now and hear all kinds of problems people have with Dells when using them for recording. And honestly, most other big PC manufacturers get similar complaints. A lot of it has to do with certain components like FW, but even more so with how Windows is set up AND other software they've loaded that is running on the computer which can slow down your DAW software (esp. running with plugins). If you google a bit you can probably find the modifications to Windows that will help. It's not hard and does not effect your normal use of the PC. But the right manufacturer can do it for you.

I actually bought a PC from a company that targets recording studios as their clients. These companies are becoming more common now, but the one I bought from is ADK Pro Audio (Advanced Design of Kentucky). ADK Pro Audio Digital Audio workstations

I'm very happy with it and it cost me less than if I tried to get a loaded PC from Dell or HP. They can actually sell you the Yamaha n12 as well for standard price, set everything up in their workshop, test it all to be sure the software and hardware are working together. That way, when it arrives to your door you don't have to do a thing but plug it in. They sell their own designed laptops and desktops. And now they are selling Macs.

Personally, when I was shopping I wanted to buy a Mac but when comparing the better components involved to make a smoking PC, the ADK computer was way cheaper than buying a Mac. And they offered me lifetime support. Now, even with that considered, I think I'd go with a Mac before buying a Dell. Because you can run Windows on it, it just makes so much sense. Macs do have issues too, but they just work better for applications like audio recording. And really, you'll like the Mac environment too, once you spend a little time with it. I have an old e-Mac and love it.

Check out ADK. I highly recommend it.thumbsup
Getting a system all set up and optimized for recording for a reasonable price sounds too good to be true. I will definitely check out ADK.

FYI, My plan is to always have a PC for dedicated home use... just internet, email, photo editing, office prog's and stuff like that. I want a laptop for recording for the portablitiy. I assume that the N8/12 is portable which means that when mated with a laptop = complete basic mobile recording system. For me that setup is way more useful than with a desktop.

I've heard guys say that desktop is the way to go but laptops now rival them is terms of power and performance, right? I know there are other issues but performance is really the bottom line isn't it?

One of the reasons that I like the idea of getting a commercial PC like a Dell (or HP, etc) is they come loaded with what I consider a lot of useful software. Even though a new laptop will be used mostly for recording it would be nice to have the option to use it for other stuff as well, especially like when the wife is hogging the desktop. I'm not sure that a system like ADK comes equipped like that but I will inquire.

Thanks for the help,

Mark
Old 5th January 2008
  #336
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geosync View Post
Over the next 3 weeks, I may not respond as often as I usually do.
We are ramping up into high gear getting ready for NAMM, training our sales managers and then showing our goodies at the show, so please be patient. I still love you guys. I'll just be very busy.
Good luck at the show George, we'll try to hold the fort down/
Old 5th January 2008
  #337
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Just Purchased!

Just picked up the N12 from American Musical. I am going to see if this fits the need of my Project Studio (3 room 600 square feet.) I will be testing the Pres against a SCA J99 and a few others and will post after I receive the board. Also, I am interested in the AD on this machine and cant wait to see how it fares against the Digi 002 and the apogee duet! I will track some drums and post the files also. Wish me luck!
Old 5th January 2008
  #338
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ricfoxx View Post
Just picked up the N12 from American Musical. I am going to see if this fits the need of my Project Studio (3 room 600 square feet.) I will be testing the Pres against a SCA J99 and a few others and will post after I receive the board. Also, I am interested in the AD on this machine and cant wait to see how it fares against the Digi 002 and the apogee duet! I will track some drums and post the files also. Wish me luck!
Good luck and we'll be waiting to hear back/
Old 5th January 2008
  #339
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricfoxx View Post
Just picked up the N12 from American Musical.<<SNIP>> Wish me luck!
Congratulations and Good Luck !!
Old 6th January 2008
  #340
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sirthought's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
Getting a system all set up and optimized for recording for a reasonable price sounds too good to be true. I will definitely check out ADK.

FYI, My plan is to always have a PC for dedicated home use... just internet, email, photo editing, office prog's and stuff like that. I want a laptop for recording for the portablitiy. I assume that the N8/12 is portable which means that when mated with a laptop = complete basic mobile recording system. For me that setup is way more useful than with a desktop.

I've heard guys say that desktop is the way to go but laptops now rival them is terms of power and performance, right? I know there are other issues but performance is really the bottom line isn't it?

One of the reasons that I like the idea of getting a commercial PC like a Dell (or HP, etc) is they come loaded with what I consider a lot of useful software. Even though a new laptop will be used mostly for recording it would be nice to have the option to use it for other stuff as well, especially like when the wife is hogging the desktop. I'm not sure that a system like ADK comes equipped like that but I will inquire.

Thanks for the help,

Mark
Hi Mark,

I hear you with thoughts about the convenience with the software. Not sure what extra software you need? ADK sells most everything , but in my opinion it's an advantage not to have most of the crap HP and (especially) Dell put on the computer. That just eats up space and often has stuff that wants to read your computer for selling you non-free versions of the software. My parents' Dell really had some buggy software that gave them issues. Lean toward HP. ADK does include some software I had not heard of used for system back up, restore, etc. All good for audio. Otherwise, my PC is like a normal PC with Windows XP Home, Games, my copy of Office 2000, my Adobe software, iTunes, etc. It came with IE and WiFi, but most pro audio guys tell you not to connect your recording rig to the Internet because WiFi can cause issues with your DAW. Just turn off the WiFi software when recording and mixing.

I have a desktop, but often wish I owned a laptop for the flexibility. Here in Cincinnati I took a recording workshop course at UltraSuede Studios and most everyone in the workshop was using a laptop, much to my surprise. It ranged from Gateway to Dell, but mostly Macbooks and the Macbook Pro laptops. I specifically asked -- no performance issues. You need to consider an external hard drive to store your recordings and possibly a FW card.

Here's a quick example on laptops:
An Apple Macbook Pro with 15" screen costs $2,499 w/ 2.4 Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, and 160 GB hard drive. It's great, but expensive.
The ADK 1Q SR laptop with same specs costs $1,997 and includes a 3 yr warranty. You could go up to 4GB RAM, add a separate 500 GB hard drive for audio and still be at $2,352 and know that they've set up everything for Pro Audio performance. The firewire is the Native Texas Instruments, so it is one that won't give you issues. You really need to call them or e-mail, tell them what you want to do and they will build a computer to meet your price and needs.
The HP dv9700t series will cost $1,619 (before the always available rebates). That is with a slightly slower processor @ 2.2 Ghz, a 240 GB hard drive, a 17" screen, Vista (another major issue of problems for pro audio folks) and MS Works, but the price is notably less. Call 'em and see if they'd put XP on there (you'll need it if you're running plugs). It's also good to know what motherboard they use. It might be worth the effort.
And to stay on thread topic... ADK sells the Yamaha n12 for $1499, plus Mackie, Tascam, and all the main mixers in this area. They are great for giving you advice and opinions since they work with audio guys everyday.

An iMac might also be a good option, since they are more portable than a desktop. You can beat those prices for what they are.
Old 6th January 2008
  #341
Lives for gear
 

The n series is changing the way I record.

I had not really thought about mixing outside the box but after using the N12 and "listening" to it's EQ, reverb and compressor I did a couple mixes and was very pleased with the results. I realize now (speaking for myself) that ITB mixing has given me some bad habits. Things like copy/paste...copy/paste where I could easily play the whole track through and keep track counts down. I've got what are really simple tunes with 60 tracks or more! Just insane stuff. Of course I understand all about bussing but the point I'm making is entire approach to recording is changing for me.

When I started thinking about using the N12 to mix i thought hmmm....not enough channels. So I started to break things down (like the mental mindset that we all need a million tracks) and realized..OK..I've got drums, bass, guitars and vocals on this song. All of a sudden I started thinking simple approach here, less is more. So I mix the song putting guitars on Chan 5,6. Solo guitar on Chan 4. Bass on Chan 9/10, the drums on Chan 11/12, the vocals on Chan 1 and some background Vox on Chan 2. Whoa! I've still got some channels left over and I haven't began to think about all the bussing capability!

I have always mixed in the box but last night mixing out of the box was an incredible experience! Using the N12 instead of a mouse was actually fun. The N series doesn't have all the automation and capturing scenes and all that a regular digital mixer has, but that's not it's approach. I filled out a track sheet for the mix. Using the N12 to mix really lets you realize this thing is an ANALOG mixer! LOL, but it's Digital. Hybrid I guess is a better word.

At this point thinking about ITB mixing gives me the creeps. My mind is taking a more simplistic approach to it and I like it. If for some reason I ever think I need more channels I'll buy another N12 before going back to mixing with a mouse. Another huge benefit for me in using the N12 to mix is not using plugins. I just like the feel of faders and EQ knobs. Plugins complicate things for me but I will still use them where I really need to.

Now I know why a lot of guys around here avoid ITB mixing like the plague.
Old 6th January 2008
  #342
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
Hi Mark,

I hear you with thoughts about the convenience with the software. Not sure what extra software you need? ADK sells most everything , but in my opinion it's an advantage not to have most of the crap HP and (especially) Dell put on the computer. That just eats up space and often has stuff that wants to read your computer for selling you non-free versions of the software. My parents' Dell really had some buggy software that gave them issues. Lean toward HP. ADK does include some software I had not heard of used for system back up, restore, etc. All good for audio. Otherwise, my PC is like a normal PC with Windows XP Home, Games, my copy of Office 2000, my Adobe software, iTunes, etc. It came with IE and WiFi, but most pro audio guys tell you not to connect your recording rig to the Internet because WiFi can cause issues with your DAW. Just turn off the WiFi software when recording and mixing.

I have a desktop, but often wish I owned a laptop for the flexibility. Here in Cincinnati I took a recording workshop course at UltraSuede Studios and most everyone in the workshop was using a laptop, much to my surprise. It ranged from Gateway to Dell, but mostly Macbooks and the Macbook Pro laptops. I specifically asked -- no performance issues. You need to consider an external hard drive to store your recordings and possibly a FW card.


Here's a quick example on laptops:
An Apple Macbook Pro with 15" screen costs $2,499 w/ 2.4 Core 2 Duo, 2GB RAM, and 160 GB hard drive. It's great, but expensive.
The ADK 1Q SR laptop with same specs costs $1,997 and includes a 3 yr warranty. You could go up to 4GB RAM, add a separate 500 GB hard drive for audio and still be at $2,352 and know that they've set up everything for Pro Audio performance. The firewire is the Native Texas Instruments, so it is one that won't give you issues. You really need to call them or e-mail, tell them what you want to do and they will build a computer to meet your price and needs.
The HP dv9700t series will cost $1,619 (before the always available rebates). That is with a slightly slower processor @ 2.2 Ghz, a 240 GB hard drive, a 17" screen, Vista (another major issue of problems for pro audio folks) and MS Works, but the price is notably less. Call 'em and see if they'd put XP on there (you'll need it if you're running plugs). It's also good to know what motherboard they use. It might be worth the effort.
And to stay on thread topic... ADK sells the Yamaha n12 for $1499, plus Mackie, Tascam, and all the main mixers in this area. They are great for giving you advice and opinions since they work with audio guys everyday.

An iMac might also be a good option, since they are more portable than a desktop. You can beat those prices for what they are.
Sirthought, that was an excellent breakdown. After reading it I went to the Apple and HP sites and configured a system from each. The final cost of the Mac was $3000 and the HP was $1700. They weren't exactly apples to apples since the HP only offers a 5400rpm HD but I'd more than likely buy a 7200 external anyway.

Question: can you record to an external HD or do most folks use them for storage? Since the mixer interface uses FW should the external be connected via USB to avoid a conflict?

Something I need to ask is what HP's return policy is. If I could test it and then return it if it didn't work it would be no big deal... it's a laptop afterall. I'll definitely ask if they could put XP on it, and I bet there is an option for that since I've heard so much oposition towards Vista, but I do have a fresh copy of XP at home if I need to switch it. If something like an HP works I'd go for it, if not it's on to something else.
Old 6th January 2008
  #343
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by soundrage View Post
The n series is changing the way I record.

I had not really thought about mixing outside the box but after using the N12 and "listening" to it's EQ, reverb and compressor I did a couple mixes and was very pleased with the results. I realize now (speaking for myself) that ITB mixing has given me some bad habits. Things like copy/paste...copy/paste where I could easily play the whole track through and keep track counts down. I've got what are really simple tunes with 60 tracks or more! Just insane stuff. Of course I understand all about bussing but the point I'm making is entire approach to recording is changing for me.

When I started thinking about using the N12 to mix i thought hmmm....not enough channels. So I started to break things down (like the mental mindset that we all need a million tracks) and realized..OK..I've got drums, bass, guitars and vocals on this song. All of a sudden I started thinking simple approach here, less is more. So I mix the song putting guitars on Chan 5,6. Solo guitar on Chan 4. Bass on Chan 9/10, the drums on Chan 11/12, the vocals on Chan 1 and some background Vox on Chan 2. Whoa! I've still got some channels left over and I haven't began to think about all the bussing capability!

I have always mixed in the box but last night mixing out of the box was an incredible experience! Using the N12 instead of a mouse was actually fun. The N series doesn't have all the automation and capturing scenes and all that a regular digital mixer has, but that's not it's approach. I filled out a track sheet for the mix. Using the N12 to mix really lets you realize this thing is an ANALOG mixer! LOL, but it's Digital. Hybrid I guess is a better word.

At this point thinking about ITB mixing gives me the creeps. My mind is taking a more simplistic approach to it and I like it. If for some reason I ever think I need more channels I'll buy another N12 before going back to mixing with a mouse. Another huge benefit for me in using the N12 to mix is not using plugins. I just like the feel of faders and EQ knobs. Plugins complicate things for me but I will still use them where I really need to.

Now I know why a lot of guys around here avoid ITB mixing like the plague.
I have never mixed ITB so I'd be right at home on the N series. Can you do partial mixing... some ITB and some on the mixer? Please exuse my lack of knowledge about digital recording but it seems like you could for instance mix backing tracks and then make a second or third pass and mix the remaining tracks. With my old Tascam 388 I used all 8 fingers on each channel... Haaaa!! I would practice mixing before the final take.

Mark
Old 6th January 2008
  #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
I have never mixed ITB so I'd be right at home on the N series. Can you do partial mixing... some ITB and some on the mixer? Please exuse my lack of knowledge about digital recording but it seems like you could for instance mix backing tracks and then make a second or third pass and mix the remaining tracks. With my old Tascam 388 I used all 8 fingers on each channel... Haaaa!! I would practice mixing before the final take.

Mark
Absolutely you could do some ITB mixing. That's part of the power of the N12...mixing ITB or OTB is seamless at least from my perspective. So yeah if you had a pretty big project you could sub-mix things ITB, run whatever plugs etc then for some tracks you could mix on the N12. My only limitation in this right now is that I don't have a complete grasp of Cubase and all the routing capabilities between it and the N12. George is really on top of it and is very helpful. I'm barely tapping the power of this setup and it will only become more awesome once I learn Cubase. I just have a habit of reaching for the mouse I need to break.heh
Old 7th January 2008
  #345
Gear Maniac
 
sirthought's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
Question: can you record to an external HD or do most folks use them for storage? Since the mixer interface uses FW should the external be connected via USB to avoid a conflict?
All good questions I can't really answer. I've never used an external drive outside of work, which wasn't recording.

My guess is you can record to it, but it'd be better to use it as storage just in case. You definitely want a 7200 hard drive, although I'm sure the 5400 would function. If you get the right laptop you could get more than one FW, maybe through a plugin card. USB probably would work fine. I've just never done that, so I don't know about performance.

Also, some of the ADK laptops can house more than one hard drive. (Maybe all of them. The 17" for sure.) You could have, for example, a 60 GB drive for your normal stuff and an audio drive with 500 GB. Sweet.

Laptops are expensive to me. I thought the laptops HP offered were good value comparatively. The thing that bothers me with all the big brands compared to these smaller guys is they don't tell you ALL of the components. It's hard to know about their screens and the make of the FW. Support is also a big issue, especially when most help desk people aren't familiar with pro audio needs. Remember - you pay for what you get.

ADK is selling Vista, but they try to steer folks towards XP, home over pro, and also 32 over 64 bit. The reason from ADK:
Quote:
Windows XP Pro offers no value for Pro Audio over XP Home, unless you intend to use remote access to control a computer. EG: using a laptop in your recording booth to control your DAW in the control room. Thats it!

Windows 64: There is still far too much software that will NOT take advantage or plain won't work.

Windows Vista of any flavor is no way ready for prime time. You would have to be using nearly no effects or samples as so few work and of those that do they are NOT large memory address aware and therefore would yield no benefit.

An exception to that is EWQL "play" and EWQL samples as they have released them in 64 bit.

While we are always on the bleeding edge of technology this is one area where we don't move quickly.
That's saving you money. They also gave me good advice on what recording hardware and software is more hype than help.

Regarding the ITB mixing versus on the n12. The n12, I believe, will help a lot of people mix the music in a more musical way... feeling it while you work with the board. I don't own one yet, but based on reading I believe you could, for example, work on 6-7 tracks for your drums, get the balanced levels right, then subgroup them to one track in Cubase and route that track to the n12 to mix while you work on, say, guitars, bass, and another subgroup for backing vocals.

My biggest fear is if I'm going to like the lack of automation in this thing. Everything else sounds great, but I've yet to hear an EQ, compression or reverb on a board that's under $2,000 that sounds better than Waves plugs. And you are not taking advantage of the mixing power of Cubase if you can't use pan changes, volume changes, etc. within a tune. That's a lot to manage by hand during a final mix. Then it's back to the mouse.

I want the promise of Yammy's new pres, control room features and nice board options WITH the automation. Plus, this price is more in my range than the Yamaha O1V96V2.

Good luck with the laptop shopping. Would love to hear what you decide on.
Old 7th January 2008
  #346
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Geosync's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
Sirthought, that was an excellent breakdown. After reading it I went to the Apple and HP sites and configured a system from each. The final cost of the Mac was $3000 and the HP was $1700. They weren't exactly apples to apples since the HP only offers a 5400rpm HD but I'd more than likely buy a 7200 external anyway.

Question: can you record to an external HD or do most folks use them for storage? Since the mixer interface uses FW should the external be connected via USB to avoid a conflict?

Something I need to ask is what HP's return policy is. If I could test it and then return it if it didn't work it would be no big deal... it's a laptop afterall. I'll definitely ask if they could put XP on it, and I bet there is an option for that since I've heard so much oposition towards Vista, but I do have a fresh copy of XP at home if I need to switch it. If something like an HP works I'd go for it, if not it's on to something else.


Markman just to be fair, There are hidden overheads in the macbook Pro that really aren't necessary. The Macbook @ 1,200.00 plus 100.00 for 4GB and 100.00 to upgrade to 160GB HD. The macbook actually has a better FW controller than the Macbook Pro. it should run you about 1,400 to 1,500.

Not pushing the Mac just wanting you to know the better Mac for the n12.
I found the iMAC24" best for me. iMac w/4 GB less than 1,800.00

HP is also a good computer.

Cheers
Old 7th January 2008
  #347
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by soundrage View Post
Absolutely you could do some ITB mixing. That's part of the power of the N12...mixing ITB or OTB is seamless at least from my perspective. So yeah if you had a pretty big project you could sub-mix things ITB, run whatever plugs etc then for some tracks you could mix on the N12. My only limitation in this right now is that I don't have a complete grasp of Cubase and all the routing capabilities between it and the N12. George is really on top of it and is very helpful. I'm barely tapping the power of this setup and it will only become more awesome once I learn Cubase. I just have a habit of reaching for the mouse I need to break.heh
Excellent. I'm liking the sound of this more and more. Thanks

Mark
Old 7th January 2008
  #348
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
All good questions I can't really answer. I've never used an external drive outside of work, which wasn't recording.

My guess is you can record to it, but it'd be better to use it as storage just in case. You definitely want a 7200 hard drive, although I'm sure the 5400 would function. If you get the right laptop you could get more than one FW, maybe through a plugin card. USB probably would work fine. I've just never done that, so I don't know about performance.

Regarding the ITB mixing versus on the n12. The n12, I believe, will help a lot of people mix the music in a more musical way... feeling it while you work with the board. I don't own one yet, but based on reading I believe you could, for example, work on 6-7 tracks for your drums, get the balanced levels right, then subgroup them to one track in Cubase and route that track to the n12 to mix while you work on, say, guitars, bass, and another subgroup for backing vocals.

Good luck with the laptop shopping. Would love to hear what you decide on.
I really need to find out about the recording to an external HD question because it seems like an important option. I'd probably prefer having an external over two internals because I could also use it with the desktop.

Your comments about mixing explain exactly how I would use the system.

Thanks for all the useful information.

Mark
Old 7th January 2008
  #349
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geosync View Post
Markman just to be fair, There are hidden overheads in the macbook Pro that really aren't necessary. The Macbook @ 1,200.00 plus 100.00 for 4GB and 100.00 to upgrade to 160GB HD. The macbook actually has a better FW controller than the Macbook Pro. it should run you about 1,400 to 1,500.

Not pushing the Mac just wanting you to know the better Mac for the n12.
I found the iMAC24" best for me. iMac w/4 GB less than 1,800.00

HP is also a good computer.

Cheers
Thanks George.

I'll have to recalculate because the cost of the configuration I chose with a 15" was considerably higher.

And to reiterate, this is a ground-up system so I can choose whatever I want but cost is a big consideration. Keep in mind that all of this digital stuff is new to me.

Here's my game plan:

#1-Purchase Yamaha N12
#2-Purchase laptop (must have return policy)
#3-Test sytem (load Cubase software and record many channels at one time to PC. Edit and Mix then master to CD. Anything else I should do?)
#4-If recording is inadiquate the laptop gets returned.
#5-Repeat steps 2-4.

Does this make sense? Is it reasonable to think that I could learn enough about the software to test the system within the return policy time frame?

Mark
Old 7th January 2008
  #350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
I really need to find out about the recording to an external HD question because it seems like an important option. I'd probably prefer having an external over two internals because I could also use it with the desktop.

Your comments about mixing explain exactly how I would use the system.

Thanks for all the useful information.

Mark
I've got an external but I use it for storage/backup.

The external just looks like another drive on the computer. I think it would work.

Lets ping George on that. He said he's gonna be busy but he might see this..
Old 7th January 2008
  #351
Gear interested
 
recordings's Avatar
 

External Hard Disc

I use external hard disc(s) for recording and editing as well as archiving. I've never had any problems
Old 7th January 2008
  #352
Lives for gear
 
Geosync's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
Thanks George.

I'll have to recalculate because the cost of the configuration I chose with a 15" was considerably higher.

And to reiterate, this is a ground-up system so I can choose whatever I want but cost is a big consideration. Keep in mind that all of this digital stuff is new to me.

Here's my game plan:

#1-Purchase Yamaha N12
#2-Purchase laptop (must have return policy)
#3-Test sytem (load Cubase software and record many channels at one time to PC. Edit and Mix then master to CD. Anything else I should do?)
#4-If recording is inadiquate the laptop gets returned.
#5-Repeat steps 2-4.

Does this make sense? Is it reasonable to think that I could learn enough about the software to test the system within the return policy time frame?

Mark
You have a great gameplan !!

There are many people that can help you get up to speed with Cubase AI
It's very easy to use. The most involved part is registering it ;-)
Old 7th January 2008
  #353
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by soundrage View Post
I've got an external but I use it for storage/backup.

The external just looks like another drive on the computer. I think it would work.

Lets ping George on that. He said he's gonna be busy but he might see this..


Works like a Champ.

I use GLYPH firewire drives. They are slightly more expensive and are worth every penny
for reasons too many to say here. They are a mLAN partner that test their drives for audio and Yamaha compatibility.

I have 3 of them connected to my iMAC. no problems..
Old 8th January 2008
  #354
Gear interested
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geosync View Post
Works like a Champ.

I use GLYPH firewire drives. They are slightly more expensive and are worth every penny
for reasons too many to say here. They are a mLAN partner that test their drives for audio and Yamaha compatibility.

I have 3 of them connected to my iMAC. no problems..
Awesome.
And that answers the question about whethr it's OK to use an external firewire drive with the Yamaha instead of USB.
Old 8th January 2008
  #355
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by markmann View Post
Awesome.
And that answers the question about whethr it's OK to use an external firewire drive with the Yamaha instead of USB.
If you get a GLYPH get a GT050Q it has 800 and 400 hubs
When Time aloows I'll give you a few tricks ;-)
Old 8th January 2008
  #356
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall View Post
Well the Tascam 2400 and the Maxio XD sold took in 2000 bucks.. not bad.. I have an N12 held for me at Musicians Buy.. as soon as the cash clears Paypal the N12 will be on it's way.. Hope there are no disappointments.. The 2400 and Maxio were a pretty lethal combination
Awesome!
Old 8th January 2008
  #357
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randall View Post
Has anybody plugged a turntable into one of these yet? are the rca inputs line level? or am I going to have to find a phono pre-amp?
Way to go Randall !!

I have not tried a turntable my iPOD rocks Hard through them. The RCA doesn't go through the channel strip but is routed to the Stereo Bus.
Befoe investing in a preamp try using RCA to 1/4" adapters if you need it. That way you will have preamps in abundance
Old 8th January 2008
  #358
Gear interested
 

Hi,

Connecting a turntable does not only involve amplification, there's a need for equalization as well. Phono preamps usually implement the so called RIAA EQ curve. If memory serves, there's 20 dB of amplification at 20 Hz (bass), 0 dB at 1kHz, and 20 dB of attenuation at 20 kHz (treble), so we're talking pretty heavy equalization here. Without EQ the turntable signal sounds very trebly.

Cheers,
-joachim
Old 8th January 2008
  #359
Summin it all up :)

I apologize if this has already been discussed but it appears that one could assign the entire Cubase Mix to channels 1-8 on the n12, send channels 1-8 out and back in via the inserts through an 8-channel analog hardware device then back into the n12 to Cubase for a final mix down into stereo/surround/etc.
Or you could send it to an 8-channel analog summing device, mix there and back into Cubase, stereo.
Or you could just go out to an 8-channel analog summing device, mix there and into whatever media you want to use to send for mastering.
Or.......

Does this sound correct?
Old 8th January 2008
  #360
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by homestudioguy View Post
I apologize if this has already been discussed but it appears that one could assign the entire Cubase Mix to channels 1-8 on the n12,

1) send channels 1-8 out and back in via the inserts through an 8-channel analog hardware device
2) back into the n12 to Cubase for a final mix down into stereo/surround/etc.
3) you could send it to an 8-channel analog summing device, mix there and back into Cubase, stereo.
4)you could just go out to an 8-channel analog summing device, mix there and into whatever media you want to use to send for mastering.
Or.......


Does this sound correct?

I'm a bit confused by your questions.

All are correct. Why would you need to go out of a really great low noise, Hi gain mixer into another that may not be as good?

You can do all of that totally inside the n12 with the exception of Surround MIXING.. It does monitor. Cubase 4 or Nuendo 4 do a great job of surround with multiple panners
separate surround effects panners, True surround audio path ..Blah, blah blah.

With Cubase4/ Nuedo 4 and the n12 you can do it all.
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