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Latency problem while using a hardware reverb
Old 2 weeks ago
  #1
Gear Nut
 
mnawara's Avatar
Latency problem while using a hardware reverb

Hi,
I am connecting i/o 7-8 of my UA Apollo to a Lexicon MX300 reverb hardware. When setting up an AUX track in my DAW with the Lexicon reverb inserted on it and send signals from different tracks to this reverb AUX, i find a big latency.
Although i read and watched many tutorials about how to overcome latency issues with hardware inserts, for some reason i cannot solve this issue the same way i do with outboard gear connected to my Burl ADC.. The Lexicon in this case is connected directly to the Apollo using its internal converters.
Does anyone has a clue how to solve this issue? i am using Logic and Pro Tools
Old 2 weeks ago
  #2
Can you post screen grabs of your mixer page showing delay comp and also arrange page? in PT (I'm no help with Logic!)
Old 2 weeks ago
  #3
Quote:
When setting up an AUX track in my DAW with the Lexicon reverb inserted on it and send signals from different tracks to this reverb AUX, i find a big latency.
with my DAW, I use a dedicated hardware in and out insert and it measures the time the signal takes to go in and out and then it compensates for it. Does your DAW have that and did you enable that option?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #4
Gear Nut
 
mnawara's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJ Mastering View Post
with my DAW, I use a dedicated hardware in and out insert and it measures the time the signal takes to go in and out and then it compensates for it. Does your DAW have that and did you enable that option?
Logic have that, but not sure about pro tools.
its just very complicated to solve this latency problem in pro tools when i am using a reverb insert.
Any one has a simplified step by step way?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #5
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnawara View Post
Logic have that, but not sure about pro tools.
its just very complicated to solve this latency problem in pro tools when i am using a reverb insert.
Any one has a simplified step by step way?
Pro Tools should just deal with it.

Like I said - can you post a pic of your whole mixer page showing delay comp, and of your arrange page too?
Old 2 weeks ago
  #6
Gear Nut
 
mnawara's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Pro Tools should just deal with it.

Like I said - can you post a pic of your whole mixer page showing delay comp, and of your arrange page too?
I am attaching a screenshot, but let me first clarify my setup exactly and where i am confused..
My interface is Apollo and i am connecting the lexicon directly to its i/o 7-8 so in this case i am using the Apollos converters for the roundtrip to and from the Lexicon reverb.
At the same time i am connecting the Apollo digitally to another converter which is the dangerous convert 8 DAC which is connected to a summing mixer then some outboard gear then back to the DAW through Burl B2 ADC for print.

So as far i understand, i have the latency from the Apollo converters when i am using the Lexicon connected directly to it, and there is another latency from the Dangerous DAC/Burl ADC roundtrip.

In the screenshot i have tried to record the click 4 different ways:

- Pink Track: Sending the click to a Bus and recording this bus (no latency)
- Yellow Track: Sending the click to a bus and recording this bus in a new audio track with the Lexicon as an i/o send in the click track (no latency or automatically compensated)
- Blue Track: Sending the click to an ADAT output pair connected to my Dangerous DAC and recording a new audio track from my Burl ADC (Latency of around 148 samples)
- Green Track: Sending the click track to outputs 7-8 in the Apollo (where the Lexicon is physically connected) and then recording a new audio track from inputs 7-8 (opposite of latency!! the track actually begins before the original signal)


So my questions here are:
- Any clarifications for the above scenarios?
- what is the difference between the automatic delay compensation in pro tools and the manual compensation we put in the i/o settings? and should i do it manually or automatic or both?
- what should i do if i am mixing and using the outboard gear connected to my Dangerous/Burl converters and at the same time i want to use the Lexicon reverb in the same mix which is connected to another converters which are the Apollo internal converters? now i have 2 types of latencies, how can i calculate and compensate both?
Attached Thumbnails
Latency problem while using a hardware reverb-screen-shot-2019-11-25-8.08.36-am-2-.jpg   Latency problem while using a hardware reverb-screen-shot-2019-11-25-8.08.36-am.jpg  
Old 2 weeks ago
  #7
Ok. Nothing above looks out of order to me.

The reason for the “pre” latency is that the Apollo itself may not be reporting its converter latency correctly. So pro tools is over compensating.

The correct way to do this is to bus internally to an aux track then insert the reverb as a hardware io on the aux. have you tried it that way?

Re mixing - you don’t (and can’t) compensate for latency here. What you do is mix monitoring the output of your summing mixer. When it’s time to print the mix, you essentially monitor “off the repro head” ie the record track in pro tools - through a spare output, direct to the 2 track return of whatever monitor controller you’re using. You’ll only be able to set the final “sound” of the mix (is how hard you’re hitting the burl) this way - much like hitting a 1/2”.

You can never compensate for the hardware io loop of your summing mixer in input of course - because that is defeating the laws of physics . You’ll always print your masters “late”...but it doesn’t really matter at that point.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #8
Gear Nut
 
mnawara's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post

The correct way to do this is to bus internally to an aux track then insert the reverb as a hardware io on the aux. have you tried it that way?
ok i will use this way. But should i just tick the automatic delay compensation only or i need to manually calculate the latency and then write it in the i/o setting under the delay compensation tab?

Last edited by psycho_monkey; 2 weeks ago at 12:30 PM..
Old 2 weeks ago
  #9
Quote:
Originally Posted by mnawara View Post
ok i will use this way. But should i just tick the automatic delay compensation only or i need to manually calculate the latency and then write it in the i/o setting under the delay compensation tab?
Yes - automatic. As I said, you shouldn’t really ever need to fiddle with that!
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