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Goodbye CD drives?
Old 18th October 2019
  #1
Question Goodbye CD drives?

The new computers are now arriving without CD drives I notice. Does this mean the end of the CD?

What will this mean for the music industry - only downloads in the future?

Aren't we losing something?

A colossal amount of artwork disappeared with the decline of the vinyl long-player album, but CDs compensated with booklets, even if rather tiny by comparison.

But what now?

Where is the 'ownership' with a piece of virtual, electronic music? How can you store it? Most of my files last as long as the next pc upgrade.

Use the Cloud? Then who's actually in control of your record collection - you, or someone like the Microsoft Corporation?

Old 18th October 2019
  #2
Gear Nut
 
HexRanger's Avatar
 

Here in the States, I literally know no one who actively listens to CDs on a regular basis anymore, that I'm aware of.

It's all USB or streaming of some flavor.

This is not a scientific contribution, I admit

(EDIT: And yes, we'll all miss the nostalgia of cover art/packaging/new print smell, etc.)
(EDIT 2: I've recently met some folks below who listen to CDs regularly)
Old 18th October 2019
  #3
Gear Addict
 

Plenty of people like CDs still. not sure what cd rom drives on computers has to do with anything. People have dedicated cd players in cars, bedrooms, living rooms etc. many people still want to own physical even if they rip,or stream to actually listen to it.
Old 18th October 2019
  #4
Gear Maniac
 

Computers have been shipping without optical drives for quite a while now. iTunes and file sharing killed the physical music market and broadband internet made it unnecessary to ship software on physical disks, so PC builders eventually got the hint. Came in handy with the shift toward lighter and thinner machines.

I'm currently typing this on a mid 2012 MacBook Pro, which was (I believe) the last model to have an optical drive... of course, I immediately took it out and replaced it with an ssd.

Access had always trumped ownership for most people, so the shift toward streaming was inevitable, I guess. There will always be a small contingent who prefer to own physical media, but by and large - the majority of consumers (especially young consumers) are perfectly fine not owning anything if it means having access to everything.

Tis a shame though, as album artwork - especially in the days of the 12 inch - used to be a magical art form all its own.
Old 18th October 2019
  #5
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d.dot's Avatar
 

I don't listen to CDs anymore but I was having a discussion with a friend of mine about this topic. He was telling me that they are still in use like in the indie artist set. After a show it's a great opportunity for a performer to peel a few extra dollars by selling CDs. Often fans will want to leave the show with a piece of something that they feel was a part of the experience. Also different pockets of the country you'll see them in use more than others. Before I closed my studio in LA I only had one client in 9 years ask me for a CD. He was saying down south and in the mid-west they are more common.

I definitely miss the album art aspect of it. I can remember pouring over album artwork for days as a kid. CD liners were nice too.
Attached Thumbnails
Goodbye CD drives?-maxresdefault-2.jpg  
Old 18th October 2019
  #6
Lives for gear
 

Recently purchased two old CD players. Thus far, my favorite is a modded Sony CDP-X111ES (new op amps, added/upgraded bypass capacitors). It sounds better than my two audio interfaces. Not sure why, but there's something enjoyable about physically playing a CD, seeking through the tracks, etc....

Not sure, but a friend and I have a hunch that CDs may become a hipster fad in a few more years.... perhaps after the vinyl thing fades out. I like the larger album art that comes with LPs, but as soon as I hear pops and clicks, the magic of the musical experience is gone for me....
Old 18th October 2019
  #7
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And ownership... yes... this will become an issue in the future. Personally, I like having a physical copy of music, games, etc... as that means I have access as long as it remains in my possession. I have little confidence that streaming services will continue to provide access to music people have purchased even ten years from now. Same with games... the cloud is a pretty fleeting solution, IMO....
Old 18th October 2019
  #8
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by kr236rk View Post
The new computers are now arriving without CD drives I notice. Does this mean the end of the CD?

What will this mean for the music industry - only downloads in the future?

Aren't we losing something?

A colossal amount of artwork disappeared with the decline of the vinyl long-player album, but CDs compensated with booklets, even if rather tiny by comparison.

But what now?

Where is the 'ownership' with a piece of virtual, electronic music? How can you store it? Most of my files last as long as the next pc upgrade.

Use the Cloud? Then who's actually in control of your record collection - you, or someone like the Microsoft Corporation?

i just bought a cd a couple weeks ago. My computer i bought two years has a disc drive. No idea on newer ones.

My girlfriend is younger than me and never owned a cd in her life. We fight about this. She says whats the point i told her lyrics, artwork, some people listen to whole albums start to finish, everything isnt about trendy pop songs...
Old 18th October 2019
  #9
Here for the gear
I bought a CD player this year for 600,- euro second hand. Leema Acoustics Elements CD player. But on some other aspects like games I gave up on physical and moved to Steam or other digital outlets. That said I do still keep a second digital collection on the NAS in .wav of all my CD's. When building new systems I still keep a CD/DVD reader/writer around for this purpose or if someone wants to show me something burned to a disc (although haven't had that happen in about a decade since USB sticks got quite big over the years) But having that said, personally I have never bought a CD with the idea of listening to it on my computer. Only for a dedicated CD player and I still do so.
Old 18th October 2019
  #11
Gear Head
 

USB External Floppy Disk Drive

Available on Ebay today.

Old technology never dies.
Old 18th October 2019
  #12
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by HexRanger View Post
Here in the States, I literally know no one who actively listens to CDs on a regular basis anymore, that I'm aware of.

It's all USB or streaming of some flavor.

This is not a scientific contribution, I admit

(EDIT: And yes, we'll all miss the nostalgia of cover art/packaging/new print smell, etc.)
I think it's nice to have your favorite albums at home, on CD or on LP. Streaming is convenient for the music you will listen to for a while, but that you don't love enough to buy the album.
Old 18th October 2019
  #13
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d.dot's Avatar
 

Do you all see this "home" vinyl cutter technology taking off? At $1200 probably not for every home, but perhaps project studios and whatnot could offer a one-off as an additional service.

https://phonocut.com
Attached Thumbnails
Goodbye CD drives?-homecut-frontview.jpg  
Old 18th October 2019
  #14
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shatz's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by d.dot View Post
Do you all see this "home" vinyl cutter technology taking off? At $1200 probably not for every home, but perhaps project studios and whatnot could offer a one-off as an additional service.

https://phonocut.com
Great idea, would like to see it evolve. However from the sound sample comparison they have it sounds completely awful. High frequencies attenuated like crazy, huge mid-range bump and everything becomes mono sounding in comparison to the real lathe and digital recording.
Old 18th October 2019
  #15
Gear Guru
 
Drumsound's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by HexRanger View Post
Here in the States, I literally know no one who actively listens to CDs on a regular basis anymore, that I'm aware of.

It's all USB or streaming of some flavor.

This is not a scientific contribution, I admit

(EDIT: And yes, we'll all miss the nostalgia of cover art/packaging/new print smell, etc.)
Those of use who have a lot of CDs still listen to them. Especially if (like me) you drive older used cars.
Old 18th October 2019
  #16
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dcwave's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by HexRanger View Post
Here in the States, I literally know no one who actively listens to CDs on a regular basis anymore, that I'm aware of.

It's all USB or streaming of some flavor.

This is not a scientific contribution, I admit

(EDIT: And yes, we'll all miss the nostalgia of cover art/packaging/new print smell, etc.)
Hi, I'm DCWAVE. I am in the USA. I listen to CDs quite regularly. I have a 6 CD player in the car. I drive about 2 hours every day. I listen to a lot of CDs.

My wife manages a radio station. We have stacks of CDs because she gets them delivered to her daily from aspiring musicians hoping they get played on the radio. They end up at my house.

At every gig I go to (which is most weekends, sometime 2-3 venues in a night) every band/artist performing has CDs for sale.

Some of the artists I work with regularly sell CDs online to their fans - they acount for about 20% of their revenue.

With that said, I listen to more music via youtube than I do on CD.
Old 18th October 2019
  #17
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by d.dot View Post
Do you all see this "home" vinyl cutter technology taking off? At $1200 probably not for every home, but perhaps project studios and whatnot could offer a one-off as an additional service.

https://phonocut.com
It should be possible - the analogue technology at least has been around for years.

https://youtu.be/FezBxUfWWXo
Old 18th October 2019
  #18
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blaugruen7's Avatar
My experience is that CD is already gone since two years or so.

Musicians sell few CDs during concerts. Outside of if concerts: zero

Some month ago I read news about a sing being in the first place on the charts selling 768 unis..... And million of streams...

There are animations coming in Spotify during song playback... Maybe more info in future? I would like to see it
Old 18th October 2019
  #19
Gear Addict
 
Vectorman's Avatar
 

I suppose the average consumer doesn't have as much use for an optical drive these days, but I don't foresee being without a DVD/Blu-ray writer anytime soon. I always archive finished songs/projects to optical media and keep copies off-site as well - no way I would trust the likes of cloud storage alone for archiving.

As far as music released on CD, I suppose the continued popularity/viability of that is somewhat genre-dependent. Fashionable pop music aimed at the under-30 crowd, probably not so much. I think a lot of people into progressive/conceptual rock, on the other hand, still like the artwork and packaging and a less "ephemeral" experience in general when buying a new album.
Old 18th October 2019
  #20
Gear Nut
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry Jones Sr View Post
I think the answer to this is vinyl. Especially the ones that come with a digital download code, you get best of all worlds, a digital copy often in 24bit for your mobile player/home jukebox, and the artwork in the best format, huge and tactile. I won't miss CDs to be honest. I like the 'alternative future' reality we seem to have landed in that has both ubiquitous streaming, terabyte hard drives full of music, and a revived vinyl industry. If you still want to access CDs, just buy one of these slim portable buss powered Bluray drives from samsung for your computer which are cheap enough, and there's plenty of existing great cd players on ebay like Marantz, Denon if you still have a collection.
Vinyl is nice but not very convenient.
Why not a higher quality digital disc ? Something like 192 khz / 24 bits. It should be able to compete with vinyl and offer a much better quality than streaming.
Old 18th October 2019
  #21
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dcwave's Avatar
 

Just an FYI:
BuzzAngle's 2018 report showed 60.7 million music CDs sold.
Pop music accounted for 27.5% and Rock was 24.5 percent.

But as far as computers needing them - probably not. If I am at a computer I am either playing music via phone, or watching videos. It's probably been a year since burning a CD for a band to listen too. They can grab their songs from dropbox. If I need to take files somewhere, I either drop them in g-drive or dbox or use a usb stick. It's been years since I've had software on DVD or CD; and passport usb hard drives are cheap enough that I backup to them and stick em in the safe.
Old 19th October 2019
  #22
Gear Nut
Quote:
Originally Posted by HexRanger View Post
Here in the States, I literally know no one who actively listens to CDs on a regular basis anymore, that I'm aware of.

It's all USB or streaming of some flavor.

This is not a scientific contribution, I admit

(EDIT: And yes, we'll all miss the nostalgia of cover art/packaging/new print smell, etc.)
I actually still listen to CDs, and actively buy them. Admittedly, I'm still in the minority. I actually rip all my CDs, but still listen to them actively.
Old 19th October 2019
  #23
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d.dot's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by shatz View Post
Great idea, would like to see it evolve. However from the sound sample comparison they have it sounds completely awful. High frequencies attenuated like crazy, huge mid-range bump and everything becomes mono sounding in comparison to the real lathe and digital recording.
I listend to the examples. I agree. The phonocut example sounded, i hate to say it, but yes terrible. Almost like a bad tape. Hopefully they are still perfecting the tech. I think they are using a prototype at the moment.

It's gong to be hard to compete with a hi-end precision engineered cutter. It'd be cool if they figure it out.
Old 19th October 2019
  #24
Gear Nut
 
HexRanger's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumsound View Post
Those of use who have a lot of CDs still listen to them. Especially if (like me) you drive older used cars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dcwave View Post
Hi, I'm DCWAVE. I am in the USA. I listen to CDs quite regularly. I have a 6 CD player in the car. I drive about 2 hours every day. I listen to a lot of CDs.

My wife manages a radio station. We have stacks of CDs because she gets them delivered to her daily from aspiring musicians hoping they get played on the radio. They end up at my house.

At every gig I go to (which is most weekends, sometime 2-3 venues in a night) every band/artist performing has CDs for sale.

Some of the artists I work with regularly sell CDs online to their fans - they acount for about 20% of their revenue.

With that said, I listen to more music via youtube than I do on CD.

Quote:
Originally Posted by husker View Post
I actually still listen to CDs, and actively buy them. Admittedly, I'm still in the minority. I actually rip all my CDs, but still listen to them actively.
Well, now I know some folks who still listen to CDs regularly I'll always miss the physical packaging, but not the giant flip book in the car and the scratches.

They do stack better than cassettes...
Old 19th October 2019
  #25
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Pindrive's Avatar
I keep my CD's because they are my collection & many memories attached to them. I really wouldn't buy a CD now, unless it had something I couldn't find elsewhere. Much of what you need is accessible digitally, online. Most people these days don't even own CD players. You couldn't even burn them a copy of something, anyway.
I will still buy records. Not because of the way they sound but, because they are a big piece of artwork & fun to play. Theres a satisfaction there you really can't get from any other medium. CD's just aren't worth the hassle, anymore. Not with the streaming music options we have, now
Old 19th October 2019
  #26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Barnaby View Post
Vinyl is nice but not very convenient.
Why not a higher quality digital disc ? Something like 192 khz / 24 bits. It should be able to compete with vinyl and offer a much better quality than streaming.
It's not happening - computers are now being manufactured without CD drives. Car manufacturers are producing new cars without CD players in them.
Old 19th October 2019
  #27
Quote:
Originally Posted by d.dot View Post
I listend to the examples. I agree. The phonocut example sounded, i hate to say it, but yes terrible. Almost like a bad tape. Hopefully they are still perfecting the tech. I think they are using a prototype at the moment.

It's gong to be hard to compete with a hi-end precision engineered cutter. It'd be cool if they figure it out.
Maybe it's a low-fi thing, like the new-wave cassette cult, competing with the fat-cat, hi-tec business-industry?
Old 19th October 2019
  #28
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I'm of the opinion that Spotify and streaming is basically a criminal organization.

You pay 10 bucks a month to get the legal right to steal any music you want. It's just Napster or Torrent with a tiny price tag on it so that it becomes legal.

You're not compensating the musicians. You're still ripping them off.

I think the government should shut those bastards down. 9 dollars goes to the mafia that is Spotify and 1 penny goes to the musicians that you're stealing from when you listen to their music there.

If you don't pay for the music you love, you're stealing from them. And I consider Spotify stealing.

That's why I've started buying CDs of the music that I really love. I've spent literally hundreds of dollars on CDs. They're not cheap. And I didn't have to. I could have just used Spotify. But I want to value the art. And Spotify, streaming, all this free ****ing bull**** is not valuing the art. It's actually actively devaluing it.

But nobody wants to listen to this because "MUH CONSUMER" and all kinds of stupid ****ing arguments. It makes me very angry.

"Like, dude, why would you spend 100 of your hard earned dollars on CDs when you can just listen to it for free on Youtube..."

Because I'm not a ****ing lowlife scumbag like you and I believe in the inherent value of music and I know that when we decide music should be free, the quality of the music will sink to meet that valuation. Why do you think there are no more Led Zeppelins, no more Radioheads, no more Beatles? It's because we've decided that music has no value and so we get what we mother****ing pay for: Imagine Dragons
Old 19th October 2019
  #29
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GeminIAm's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mxbf View Post
I'm of the opinion that Spotify and streaming is basically a criminal organization.

You pay 10 bucks a month to get the legal right to steal any music you want. It's just Napster or Torrent with a tiny price tag on it so that it becomes legal.

You're not compensating the musicians. You're still ripping them off.

I think the government should shut those bastards down. 9 dollars goes to the mafia that is Spotify and 1 penny goes to the musicians that you're stealing from when you listen to their music there.

If you don't pay for the music you love, you're stealing from them. And I consider Spotify stealing.

That's why I've started buying CDs of the music that I really love. I've spent literally hundreds of dollars on CDs. They're not cheap. And I didn't have to. I could have just used Spotify. But I want to value the art. And Spotify, streaming, all this free ****ing bull**** is not valuing the art. It's actually actively devaluing it.

But nobody wants to listen to this because "MUH CONSUMER" and all kinds of stupid ****ing arguments. It makes me very angry.

"Like, dude, why would you spend 100 of your hard earned dollars on CDs when you can just listen to it for free on Youtube..."

Because I'm not a ****ing lowlife scumbag like you and I believe in the inherent value of music and I know that when we decide music should be free, the quality of the music will sink to meet that valuation. Why do you think there are no more Led Zeppelins, no more Radioheads, no more Beatles? It's because we've decided that music has no value and so we get what we mother****ing pay for: Imagine Dragons
"Get off my lawn!"
Old 19th October 2019
  #30
Lives for gear
 
Pindrive's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mxbf View Post
I'm of the opinion that Spotify and streaming is basically a criminal organization.

You pay 10 bucks a month to get the legal right to steal any music you want. It's just Napster or Torrent with a tiny price tag on it so that it becomes legal.

You're not compensating the musicians. You're still ripping them off.

I think the government should shut those bastards down. 9 dollars goes to the mafia that is Spotify and 1 penny goes to the musicians that you're stealing from when you listen to their music there.

If you don't pay for the music you love, you're stealing from them. And I consider Spotify stealing.

That's why I've started buying CDs of the music that I really love. I've spent literally hundreds of dollars on CDs. They're not cheap. And I didn't have to. I could have just used Spotify. But I want to value the art. And Spotify, streaming, all this free ****ing bull**** is not valuing the art. It's actually actively devaluing it.

But nobody wants to listen to this because "MUH CONSUMER" and all kinds of stupid ****ing arguments. It makes me very angry.

"Like, dude, why would you spend 100 of your hard earned dollars on CDs when you can just listen to it for free on Youtube..."

Because I'm not a ****ing lowlife scumbag like you and I believe in the inherent value of music and I know that when we decide music should be free, the quality of the music will sink to meet that valuation. Why do you think there are no more Led Zeppelins, no more Radioheads, no more Beatles? It's because we've decided that music has no value and so we get what we mother****ing pay for: Imagine Dragons
Thats the reality of it. We no longer get paid for the art. We must try to get paid for the performance & peddling Merchandise. Commercial Music has become really dumb & true artists are becoming graphic designers & drug addicts.
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