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Cheese Grater 5,1 Mac Pro Owners Next Move?
Old 1 week ago
  #1
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Cheese Grater 5,1 Mac Pro Owners Next Move?

Where are you guys with 5,1 Mac Pros at with your next Mac?

I've had either 4,1 or 5,1 Mac Pros for over 10 years and whilst the 5,1 12 Core machine I have had since 2014 is still going strong I am thinking about a new machine for the next 5+ years....

2018 i7 Mac Mini - love the form factor, but soldered SSD drive, weak GPU and less performance in real world terms than my current MP leave me thinking this is a step back and not for me.

2013 Mac Pro - I've always liked the form factor and silent running of this machine, and the 12 core is mighty powerful and can be had for great prices on Ebay. Best performance to price ratio - still, an older machine which may hit the end of the Mac OS road soon, and reliability would be a concern but very tempting

2019 i9 iMac - great machine, awesome screen and very powerful, beats out my MP in Logic and Pro Tools tests. Only concern is it or will it get noisey over time and being tied to the monitor - strong contender

2017 iMac Pro - same strengths as the 2019 regular iMac but on steroids. Even the base version has insane performance in the Logic and Pro Tools tests. Lots of extra less-known features like higher res camera, multi microphones, more TB ports, ECC RAM, better cooling. Concerns are upgradability isn't easy, onboard monitor and may be due an upgrade soon - still very sexy and I kinda wish I got one when they were first released.

2019 Mac Pro - same awesome form factor as the 5,1 MP and if it delivers the expected -Imac Pro beating- performance whilst running super quiet it seems the ideal option. I can imagine with the all the expandability options it will be very much future proof, and maybe even processor upgrades may be possible as with the 5,1 macs? Only smallish concern is that the price might get pretty high when specced out, that said it is likely to be the next machine for me.

This does leave me thinking there is a pretty big gap in the screen-less Mac desktop between the mac Mini and the Mac Pro. A cross between the mac Mini and 7,1 Mac Pro would be a killer machine, but then I guess that is why people are on the Hackintosh band wagon...
Old 1 week ago
  #2
Knowing me and the way my finances roll nowadays its gonna be the most maxed out Mini I can get. Its a tough choice, Im so used to the 'old way' of having a tower I can do whatever with, but apparently its time to move on from that. At this point, the only thing I even use the PCI slots for anymore is the graphics card and my 2010 MP has a USB 3.1 card in it, which I wont need on the Mini anyways (I bought it so my WD Time Machine drive can backup at the speed its supposed to). I have all 4 drive slots taken, but thats easy enough to fix with the Mini too. Ill just give in and finally get a bunch of cases from OWC for em with TB and USB so they can go either way. Its my audio interface thats the only hiccup. Its a MOTU 828MK2 so I just need a TB->FW adapter and hope everything goes smooth until I can magically replace it with a new 828ES or maybe an Ultralite. Im looking at stuff like the Soundcraft MTK series to maybe replace it with a USB mixer as well. At least MOTU has said already that they ARE updating the firewire drivers for Catalina/64 bit so my MOTU should keep on ticking for awhile longer (see folks THIS is why MOTU rocks).
Old 1 week ago
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monotremata View Post
Knowing me and the way my finances roll nowadays its gonna be the most maxed out Mini I can get. Its a tough choice, Im so used to the 'old way' of having a tower I can do whatever with, but apparently its time to move on from that. At this point, the only thing I even use the PCI slots for anymore is the graphics card and my 2010 MP has a USB 3.1 card in it, which I wont need on the Mini anyways (I bought it so my WD Time Machine drive can backup at the speed its supposed to). I have all 4 drive slots taken, but thats easy enough to fix with the Mini too. Ill just give in and finally get a bunch of cases from OWC for em with TB and USB so they can go either way. Its my audio interface thats the only hiccup. Its a MOTU 828MK2 so I just need a TB->FW adapter and hope everything goes smooth until I can magically replace it with a new 828ES or maybe an Ultralite. Im looking at stuff like the Soundcraft MTK series to maybe replace it with a USB mixer as well. At least MOTU has said already that they ARE updating the firewire drivers for Catalina/64 bit so my MOTU should keep on ticking for awhile longer (see folks THIS is why MOTU rocks).
The Mac Mini is still a great machine judging by the user comments, and I doubt I would be disappointed if I were to get one. Close to the performance of a top spec 5,1 Mac Pro, small enough to be portable and pretty inexpensive within the Mac world. What I can't justify though, is paying to replace my working machine with a machine that has less CPU power...

At point I did consider buying 2 Mac Minis and running one as a slave with VEP, but whilst my experience of running 2 studio machines is mostly positive I am more keen on one powerful machine that is expandable.

Does anyone know what the UK price of the base 2019 Mac Pro is likely to be?
Old 1 week ago
  #4
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There should still be a final update for Mojave(10.14.6) and security updates for the next few years yet. Hopefully these older Xeon CPUs will still be supported by third party developers for a while. Are you listening NI?

Catalina could be an option for the 5,1 via hacks and work-arounds and Apple could also update Catalina to block the 5,1 at the processor level if it wants to be nasty. If there is a stable way to run Catalina on a 5,1, I wouldn’t upgrade to it until it’s finished with all it’s updates and I would always have a Mojave or earlier backup boot drive.

There is always the chance, however slight that is, that Apple might release a higher end and some what upgradable Mac Mini in a few years or after fleecing the initial Mac Pro buyers and sales starting to slack off, they could release a more affordable Mac Pro but nothing close to the fabled xMac. That might require Apple killing off the iMac Pro and maybe offering a 5K display.
Old 1 week ago
  #5
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One big reason for wanting to update is that recently upgrading to High Sierra was a pain in the rear with my 5,1 MP. No big deal really just a little tedious..

Ironically, part of the reason the new for 2019 Mac Pro is so appealing is that these 5,1 Cheese Graters have had close to 10 years of service and are still rolling. If the Cheese Grater 2.0 is as solid and reliable, and you have to admit Apple have a good track record of this, it's going to be feasible you could still be rocking the 7,1 in 2029
Old 1 week ago
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by fastlanephil View Post
There should still be a final update for Mojave(10.14.6) and security updates for the next few years yet. Hopefully these older Xeon CPUs will still be supported by third party developers for a while. Are you listening NI?
That is why I finally got rid of my 2006 Mac Pro 3 years ago and got an old 2010 hah. NI left me behind first when Reaktor started getting point updates in the middle of 5.0 and I couldn't go beyond the first few running Lion. Whats funny is, it was MAME that broke the camel's back. It got to the point where the compilers were too out of date to build newer versions of things, so no Millipede or Mrs Pac-Man roms meant it was time for Lion to go. I guess it was a nice bonus I got to move up to Logic X and finally update my NI stuff haha.

Honestly in my situation, I don't do any "pro" work at all anymore. I just do stuff for me, occasionally friends and at the rate I work and finish things, the Mini will do just fine. I need a Logic track to run maybe 4 AUs, 6-8 audio tracks, maybe a couple MIDI tracks (unless Ive already printed my synth stuff). By the time a project is ready to be mixed, its maybe 20 audio tracks at most, and only audio tracks, once Ive bounced all the instruments to files. So far I can do my mixes and throw EQs and compressors and whatever where I want when I want and haven't made Logic crap out on this 6-core Pro yet. Not even close to it. The Mini can only be even better. My Mac is pretty much my regular computer Im using all the time as much as it is my DAW nowadays. I probably play Baldur's Gate and Battletech more than Ive opened Logic in the last year or so. Plus Im moving to an MPC. Right now Im still tied to the computer with the software version, but once I got $800 to blow Im swapping it with an MPC Live and Logic from then on out is gonna be for mixing pretty much. At that point, I wont even really need a Mac since I can just use the plugins I own on a PC too, but I like my MacOS ALOT (I even finally gave in and got a stupid iPhone X this weekend after all these years hating them). I was mad about the Mac Pro costing a few house payments but Im over it. I don't need it, the Mini will do just fine, and be a lot quieter, and give me some extra space under my desk to hide more rack gear from the misses haha. If my games start to suffer because of the Minis graphics, Ive still got the Pro with its 570 or at that point, just build a cheap gaming PC. Ill have my Mac and gaming machine for cheaper than the Pro would've cost me. Win win for me!
Old 1 week ago
  #7
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Chevron, I'm also aiming to replace my hot-rodded 2012 Cheese Grater with the 2019 MP.

It's gonna take a lot of 2nd-hand-gear selling and likely some finance on the purchase, assuming I can get it, but I'm keen to get there even if it takes a year.

Like you, I hope to get 10+ years out of it...

EDIT:
I'll likely order it with an additional 2TB SSD and maybe an extra 32GB RAM. I'll add a 3rd-party spinner chassis so I can transfer my 4 backup drives across.

Processor upgrade (the first - I suspect there'll be a few over time as prices drop) will have to wait an additional year or two I guess.
Old 1 week ago
  #8
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Also on a 5,1 12 core here running mojave with RME PCIe cards.
It's still a very good audio machine.

As Logic was my main reason to switch from Atari to Mac a few years ago, I'll think about a new computer if some irresistible, 5,1-incompatible Logic version comes along or there's some U-he Repro-like plug-in coming out, which justifies investing in more processing power.

Then I'll buy the brandnew 6-core i9 or AMD threadripper mac mini or try building my first hackintosh.
Old 1 week ago
  #9
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  1. Many of us, myself included will not be able to move to Catlina for the mere reason that I still have numerous 32bit applications, utilities, installers, and even drivers that are not going to be able to run on Catalina until the developers release 64bit versions, which will not happen right away in some cases.
  2. I see no rush to jump on Catlina when Mojave is working so well.
  3. The 5,1 can already run Catalina. All that's needed is a small hack to the installer and people are working on it, it will be sorted out before Catalina is released IMHO. But see point #1 above.
  4. The 2019 MP is a joke for what we do. Totally overpriced and not even the most ideal CPU in my opinion.
  5. I plan to run my 5,1 for at least a few more years before I even think about what comes next. A lot can change between now and then and the 5,1 is still very viable. The only thing I can't run is MassiveX. There is no need to rush out and get rid of it just yet and for at least several more years.
  6. If Apple pulls their head out and presents a better mid tier tower alternative I will look at that. But it will have to be under $5000 (fully loaded!) and have all the advantages my 5,1 has in terms of PCI, easy expandability with standard components that are not purchased through Apple, etc.. A CPU with fast single core performance. I doubt that is going to happen, so most likely I will be building a hackintosh in a few years from now and I won't lose any sleep over it. But if Apple provides a reasonable alternative I will gladly pay a few thousand more than a similar hackintosh, but to instead buy from Apple. I just doubt they will.
Old 1 week ago
  #10
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Just recently purchased a used cheesegrater 5,1 for my personal workspace with 32 gigs of RAM, fastest 12-core 3.47 GHz processors for very cheap ($1,500.00 shipping included), pimped it out with a couple of large SSDs and I can see keeping this machine running for another 8~10 years even if it stays on an older OS. I need it for my UAD quad card, as well as when I want to use Pro Tools TDM with expansion chassis. (home studio, not commercial so who cares if it works for what I do?)

These are great and reasonably stable machines, they seem to have been designed to keep running forever as long as they're not abused. The worst that can happen is having to change mobo or graphics card, otherwise all the Mac Pro cheesegraters I've had have been extremely stable, I still use some of the older ones as file servers or one-task dedicated workstations like for D>A transfers or simple things and they perform admirably. No monitor needed even, just VNC into them.

I also have an ancient dual 1.25 GHz original cheesegrater (the last machine with a ROM capable of running OS-9) that can dual-boot with OS-X for legacy projects that may need to be recalled.

This is probably just for sentimental reasons, most of the work I plan on doing going forward is going to increasingly be under Windows.... but I digress.

Now as far as these new machines, not quite sure that the new MacPro offerings are going to be what I need at the price point they're slated to be. I would consider one if I was doing super-heavy processor-intensive rendering, 4K video editing, loading 2Terabytes of samples into RAM for orchestral scoring and that sort of stuff, because price would not be an obstacle. But for day-to-day music stuff Windows on a PC is totally fine.
Old 1 week ago
  #11
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Came from Cheese to the Cylinder and now have been using a 2017 iMac for 2+ years - been absolutely great.

The deals on the refurb 2019 iMacs got me to pickup an i9,580X,1TB SSD with AC for 3K. 32G of Ram(for a total of 40G like my current machine) is less than $200 when I am ready. Machine comes tomorrow and I will be very keen on fan noise issues. Will know in a week or two if its a keeper. I do audio recording/mixing of mostly acoustic groups with modest VI work and video editing for music videos. From a CPU/GPU performance POV - this should be all the machine I need for quite a time... 10 years - probably not - but 3-5, no doubt - then simply sell and upgrade again. But thats me :-)
Old 1 week ago
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProPower View Post
Came from Cheese to the Cylinder and now have been using a 2017 iMac for 2+ years - been absolutely great.

The deals on the refurb 2019 iMacs got me to pickup an i9,580X,1TB SSD with AC for 3K. 32G of Ram(for a total of 40G like my current machine) is less than $200 when I am ready. Machine comes tomorrow and I will be very keen on fan noise issues. Will know in a week or two if its a keeper. I do audio recording/mixing of mostly acoustic groups with modest VI work and video editing for music videos. From a CPU/GPU performance POV - this should be all the machine I need for quite a time... 10 years - probably not - but 3-5, no doubt - then simply sell and upgrade again. But thats me :-)
Please report back. I’m trying to decide between 2017 iMac pro, 2019 iMac i9, or a new Mac mini. So your experience with the i9 would be awesome to hear.
Old 1 week ago
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProPower View Post
The deals on the refurb 2019 iMacs got me to pickup an i9,580X,1TB SSD with AC for 3K. 32G of Ram(for a total of 40G like my current machine) is less than $200 when I am ready. Machine comes tomorrow and I will be very keen on fan noise issues. Will know in a week or two if its a keeper.
Fantastic computer for audio - I've always avoided the iMacs only because the machine is right in front of you and so are the fans. Please report any issues concerning the noise.
Old 1 week ago
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post
Chevron, I'm also aiming to replace my hot-rodded 2012 Cheese Grater with the 2019 MP.

It's gonna take a lot of 2nd-hand-gear selling and likely some finance on the purchase, assuming I can get it, but I'm keen to get there even if it takes a year.

Like you, I hope to get 10+ years out of it...

EDIT:
I'll likely order it with an additional 2TB SSD and maybe an extra 32GB RAM. I'll add a 3rd-party spinner chassis so I can transfer my 4 backup drives across.

Processor upgrade (the first - I suspect there'll be a few over time as prices drop) will have to wait an additional year or two I guess.
Right on Monkey man. Although I was thinking anything over 5 years would be a good run and make it financially worth it. I am also curious how easy it will be to upgrade the processor in the 2019 Mac Pro after a few years. I haven't looked in to this at all, but I wonder if you can swap the 8 or 12 core processor for a 16, 24 or massive 28 core later?

Only the 12 core and up supports the 2933Mhz memory, so I wonder if that will be factor. As in the 12 core being the least you can upgrade from, and not the 8 core? Pure speculation on my part and no hard facts about this, but I am curious.
Old 1 week ago
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProPower View Post
Came from Cheese to the Cylinder and now have been using a 2017 iMac for 2+ years - been absolutely great.

The deals on the refurb 2019 iMacs got me to pickup an i9,580X,1TB SSD with AC for 3K. 32G of Ram(for a total of 40G like my current machine) is less than $200 when I am ready. Machine comes tomorrow and I will be very keen on fan noise issues. Will know in a week or two if its a keeper. I do audio recording/mixing of mostly acoustic groups with modest VI work and video editing for music videos. From a CPU/GPU performance POV - this should be all the machine I need for quite a time... 10 years - probably not - but 3-5, no doubt - then simply sell and upgrade again. But thats me :-)
I'd also be interested to know how the i9 iMac works out too. Especially the noise side, keep us posted!
Old 1 week ago
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron View Post
Right on Monkey man. Although I was thinking anything over 5 years would be a good run and make it financially worth it. I am also curious how easy it will be to upgrade the processor in the 2019 Mac Pro after a few years. I haven't looked in to this at all, but I wonder if you can swap the 8 or 12 core processor for a 16, 24 or massive 28 core later?
Of course! That's what I'm planning to do, and what I've always done with Mac Pro's.

Usually I jump onboard the least-expensive model and upgrade CPU's as prices drop, but of course this time it looks like there'll be no cheap model.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron View Post
Only the 12 core and up supports the 2933Mhz memory, so I wonder if that will be factor. As in the 12 core being the least you can upgrade from, and not the 8 core? Pure speculation on my part and no hard facts about this, but I am curious.
Gee, so am I now. Didn't know about the RAM thing.

Are you sure it's not just a case of higher-spec'd RAM's being installed in the baseline setup and the 8-core chip's simply not being able to take advantage of the full speed available? I've seen this before. IIRC some folks were surprised that when they added the 5680 / 5690 12-core Xeons into their Cheese Graters, their existing RAM suddenly ran at a higher rate.

At any rate(!), it seems you and I ought to get the lowdown on whether or not we'd need to order faster RAM from the get-go or if indeed it'll be installed anyway but not necessarily run at full-tilt 'til we upgrade our CPU's.

Otherwise, as you alluded to, we're gonna have to start out with 12-core+ CPU's and the faster RAM. Ouch. That's gonna add to the hip-pocket hurt.

EDIT:
Oh, and to answer your question about the 8-core's ability to be upgraded, I think it's safe to say that given the machine's intended purpose of being an "ultimate" expansion-friendly beast, we should be OK.
Old 1 week ago
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post
Of course! That's what I'm planning to do, and what I've always done with Mac Pro's.

Usually I jump onboard the least-expensive model and upgrade CPU's as prices drop, but of course this time it looks like there'll be no cheap model.


Gee, so am I now. Didn't know about the RAM thing.

Are you sure it's not just a case of higher-spec'd RAM's being installed in the baseline setup and the 8-core chip's simply not being able to take advantage of the full speed available? I've seen this before. IIRC some folks were surprised that when they added the 5680 / 5690 12-core Xeons into their Cheese Graters, their existing RAM suddenly ran at a higher rate.

At any rate(!), it seems you and I ought to get the lowdown on whether or not we'd need to order faster RAM from the get-go or if indeed it'll be installed anyway but not necessarily run at full-tilt 'til we upgrade our CPU's.

Otherwise, as you alluded to, we're gonna have to start out with 12-core+ CPU's and the faster RAM. Ouch. That's gonna add to the hip-pocket hurt.

EDIT:
Oh, and to answer your question about the 8-core's ability to be upgraded, I think it's safe to say that given the machine's intended purpose of being an "ultimate" expansion-friendly beast, we should be OK.
Yeh it's a question about the ramifications of processor upgrades (pun intended that needs to be answered before I decide which configuration to go with.

For the moment, I am assuming if you upgrade the 8 core processor you will also need different RAM? If it's even possible to make that processor upgrade... Please don't take my comments as any kind of fact, all just speculation on my part and I don't know anything concrete at all.

Lets keep the discussion rolling here, at least it will be easier than hanging out and that other car crash of a Mac Pro thread. Jeez those guys are in to bickering about useful ****
Old 1 week ago
  #18
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Agreed.

Hopefully someone will chime in with answers to our "noob" questions without telling us to "go build a Hackintosh".

I see you asked over there anyway for good measure. Wuddun, mate; appreciate it.
Old 1 week ago
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkey Man View Post
Agreed.

Hopefully someone will chime in with answers to our "noob" questions without telling us to "go build a Hackintosh".

I see you asked over there anyway for good measure. Wuddun, mate; appreciate it.
Haha yes hope so....

I did ask over there, and quickly made an exit. Will check now for a reply..
Old 1 week ago
  #20
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The question for me always come down to real need and ROI. In 2017 I found the i7 iMac was CPU equivalent to my 2013 Hex cylinder. At that time I had many weigh in on threads that (like me) they rarely if ever exceeded the abilities of the 6-core nMP (or i7 iMac). I actually made the i5 iMac (no hyper threading) work this last cycle because fan noise on the 2017 i7 was too erratic for me. The modularMP at $6K for starters will be an amazing machine - no doubt. For a select bunch this will be the hands down weapon of choice and worth every penny. I imagine with a killer screen or 2 + important upgrades (CPU, ram, storage, video) - $10K will be an average price.

The upgrade cycle I am up to last bunch of years is ~$1K - $1.5K real cost every 2-3 years after selling the old one to stay close to the top of the "consumer" range. Since I went all SSD and TB at the nMP my system changes very little last couple of times. This time with 2X the real cores of my i5 + 2X more HT - and faster speed to boot - just give me no fan ramps at moderate loads and I will be very happy. I very purposefully chose 1TB SSD as well. I already have a huge sample library that would tax any internal SSD choice. Also - (again in my testing for what i do) there was no difference in running VIs from a SATA III SSD vs the internal NVME drive. A 4 bay TB SSD box has been working for me since 2014 (though today it is a TB3 one :-).

No answer is wrong! If you need PCI slots - its doable with iMacs but a bit painful and noisy (I ran HDX on the nMP and iMac for a few years). Will certainly post back as I get some time with the new i9 :-)
Old 1 week ago
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron View Post
One big reason for wanting to update is that recently upgrading to High Sierra was a pain in the rear with my 5,1 MP. No big deal really just a little tedious..
Yeah, I have 2009 and 2012 cheese graters myself and have been standing at 10.9.5, but was gonna make the jump to Sierra or High Sierra as NI and whatnot have finally forced my hand.....

What were the particular "gotcha's" with High Sierra? (and if it's a bunch of them, i don't mean to ask you to do any serious work on that! . )


thanks so much..
Old 1 week ago
  #22
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fingers are crossed that the power supply in my cMP lasts until an i9 mac mini is available. otherwise, it's likely a Hac for me.
Old 1 week ago
  #23
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As a multi-room facility, I've struggled with finding a perfect Mac for each room.

The 2009/2010 12-core 3.46GHz machines couldn't keep up with modern machines when it came to latency or VI's. Every hiccup is lost time and lost money for the client and studio...

Ultimately I've had to settle on Hackintoshes. It's been the only way to have HDX cards, UAD cards + multiple HDD's, and running multiple 4K displays in silence.

The release of the new Mac Pro is welcome in my studio as long as the CPU upgrade path is good. If Apple abandons Intel in the future, this could turn into a bad investment. That's exactly the risk we'll have to take without fully knowing Apple's roadmap...
Old 1 week ago
  #24
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I'd go for a MacPro 2013 D500 64GB RAM with two 30inch LG 32QK500 ($250 each). FYI the MacPro was suffering from random reboot issues that have been finally fixed in Mojave and it runs Mavericks without any issues as well. It's powerful enough, silent and an easy carry on. I have been using mine for four years and still love it. It's the perfect studio computer if you don't require expansion slots. The price will drop once the new MacPro is released.
Old 1 week ago
  #25
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.Good View Post
I'd go for a MacPro 2013 D500 64GB RAM with two 30inch LG 32QK500 ($250 each). FYI the MacPro was suffering from random reboot issues that have been finally fixed in Mojave and it runs Mavericks without any issues as well. It's powerful enough, silent and an easy carry on. I have been using mine for four years and still love it. It's the perfect studio computer if you don't require expansion slots. The price will drop once the new MacPro is released.
Yeah, Im pretty set on the Mini but Ill definitely have to see if those have come down at all when Im ready. Id like to stay with the Pro but times change and all that.. I doubt they'll drop as low as I paid for both my 2006 and 2010 when I finally bought them, but still worth a shot. At least with the Pro I wouldn't have to worry about graphics when I decide to play games on it.
Old 1 week ago
  #26
My 6 core MacBook Pro has serendipitously been prompted to studio use over my old 12 core 5,1 Mac Pro. It surprisingly handles everything I throw at it just as well. I’ve stopped jamming sessions into ram cache thanks to the drastically improved bandwidth of USB3 and TB3. I thought it might initially have been a couple of steps back, but it really blazes along. And it fits in a backpack, or on my lap in the back of a video edit suite, is a few centimetres thick and is 1/6th of the weight.

If it is anything to go by, the newer 8 core model would absolutely destroy my 5,1 Mac Pro. For some reason the prices have gone up on 5,1 Mac Pros here in Australia. Mine sold on eBay last week, and I recouped about 40% of the purchase price of the MacBook Pro. It is something that I never really intended on doing, but I am pretty damn happy it panned out that way!

If you are happy with the performance of your old 5,1 Mac Pro, in all reality Apple probably have half a dozen machines on offer that will step up and take its place quite neatly. Those 9 year old machines have a lot of CPU grunt but they really show their age in other areas.
Old 6 days ago
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lestermagneto View Post
Yeah, I have 2009 and 2012 cheese graters myself and have been standing at 10.9.5, but was gonna make the jump to Sierra or High Sierra as NI and whatnot have finally forced my hand.....

What were the particular "gotcha's" with High Sierra? (and if it's a bunch of them, i don't mean to ask you to do any serious work on that! . )


thanks so much..
My machine is a 2009 up specc'ed to a 2010 so bear that in mind. I had to update the firmware, no issues there. But then in trying to install from a USB stick the Magic Mouse 2 wasn't picked up by Bluetooth, nor the wireless keyboard. So I had to pull out a wired keyboard (luckily I had one) and use that in accessibility mode to navigate the installer with the pointer. Sounds straight forward but was a pain, and took me while to work around all that. Of course, the whole time I was thinking if I had a more up to date machine this would probably be easier...

Perhaps just a minor issue with bluetooth, but then the High Sierra SSD wouldn't show up on the boot selector screen IF my El Capitan SSD was in the drive bay too. Of course I installed High Sierra and formatted the drive as APFS, which EL Capitan doesn't recognise for Start Up Disk so this may have something to do with it...

There were other niggles too which i can't or won't remember and I remember it just being a pain in the butt on top of installing software. All in all it might have not been because of having an older machine, but it wasn't straight forward
Old 6 days ago
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron View Post
...but then the High Sierra SSD wouldn't show up on the boot selector screen IF my El Capitan SSD was in the drive bay too. Of course I installed High Sierra and formatted the drive as APFS, which EL Capitan doesn't recognise for Start Up Disk so this may have something to do with it...
Just a note here: I have combination High Sierra and Win10 environment (separate native SSD's, not Bootcamp) in my 2010 Mac Pro. I use 'HFS+ for Windows' and 'NTFS for Mac' products.

After the native installation of High Sierra, I successfully used the utility from Paragon-Software to convert the APFS partition back to HFS+.
[https://www.paragon-software.com/us/...hfs-converter/ ]
Old 6 days ago
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MediaGary View Post
Just a note here: I have combination High Sierra and Win10 environment (separate native SSD's, not Bootcamp) in my 2010 Mac Pro. I use 'HFS+ for Windows' and 'NTFS for Mac' products.

After the native installation of High Sierra, I successfully used the utility from Paragon-Software to convert the APFS partition back to HFS+.
[https://www.paragon-software.com/us/...hfs-converter/ ]
Cool thanks, I may do the same. Apart form having a separate Windows SSD any reason you prefer HFS+?
Old 6 days ago
  #30
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevron View Post
Cool thanks, I may do the same. Apart form having a separate Windows SSD any reason you prefer HFS+?
My machine has an Nvidia GTX 1070 card which means I can't go to Mojave, and yet another investment in software for compatibility where I'm "stuck" didn't feel like the right move.

I didn't want to spend any money on buying their 'APFS for Windows' product, already have the 'HFS+ for Windows' product, and I don't see any advantages for me of APFS over HFS+.
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