The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
 All  This Thread  Reviews  Gear Database  Gear for sale     Latest  Trending
New Ilok 3 out
Old 1st November 2016
  #61
Gear Guru
 
UnderTow's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by sexyman View Post
Why 50k to pace.
E.g. Waves, plugin alliance and many more saw the light and cut middle man pace out.
Unfortunately their solutions don't seem to be as secure as iLock or elicenser.

Quote:
Even apple logic had cut middle man USB key out.
One could say that Apple have the biggest and most expensive dongle on the market.

Quote:
They are still having good sales. I know for sure business is booming for waves.
Do you have insider information or are you guessing that business is booming for Waves?

Alistair
Old 1st November 2016
  #62
Quote:
Originally Posted by sexyman View Post
Why 50k to pace.
E.g. Waves, plugin alliance and many more saw the light and cut middle man pace out. Even apple logic had cut middle man USB key out. They are still having good sales. I know for sure business is booming for waves. The Chinese moto works. Low price = quick many sales. Quick many sales = lots more money.

Is it really $50k though? Other people on the internet (the JUCE forum for example) have quoted $3k for an iLok product license, then a few bucks per end user iLok license issued. The $50k tag for all we know if the projected fee after thousands and thousands of plugin sales.

Telling plugin developers to adopt highly compromised attempts of copy protection is like telling a hardened and highly addicted gambler to hand over his wallet and assets to the casino "for his own good".
Old 1st November 2016
  #63
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by sexyman View Post
Even apple logic had cut middle man USB key out.
Aren't you forgetting something? If you want to run Logic, you will have to purchase Apple's "dongle":

Old 1st November 2016
  #64
Gear Maniac
 
sexyman's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderTow View Post
One could say that Apple have the biggest and most expensive dongle on the market.
That's a valid point right there.
Old 1st November 2016
  #65
Lives for gear
 
Squawk's Avatar
More iLok complaints?







Old 9th December 2016
  #66
I used to hate the concept of iLok but have warmed to it considering I have to use Waves Central to get my Waves licenses and sometimes that program forces me to download its own update and install it before I can get my licenses. Try doing that off a slow WiFi on the road.

And AVID has their own AVIDApplicationManager for Sibelius which runs all the time (talk about stealing CPU and Memory) in order to run their software (and jeez, it took me 5 days to register and activate, I was ready to kill little furry things waiting to use that software (in my defense, I had a quartet that just had to come out, so how many furry animals would you sacrifice for Mozart? I should be worth at least one! )

When Microsoft was selling license keys for Office and my hard drive died, Office refused to work on my image backup because it recognized the different drive and wanted me to purchase another license. Calls to Microsoft? Wait on the phone an hour to be told "No, go F yourself" I'm sure I don't have to convince anyone that 365 is a disaster.
It's the first time I've kept FreeOffice.

So imagine having to do a Waves or AVID license-manager-software for every friggin' plugin. I like iLok's dongle vs that.

The BEST solutions is like what Toontrack, SoundToys, etc, does: Offer a license for 2 systems. For my studio iMac and traveling Macbook, perfecto. And if that changes, unauthorized and re-autherize a new computer, easy peasy (unless it's for dozens, hundreds of licenses) So that isn't the perfect answer.

But if ANY of you don't like having to BUY a dongle, Slate often seems to offer a free iLok 2 with their software. That is classy. Although I don't understand why, like Waves, they can't let you use your own USB stick?!? Oh, right, money. Forget I asked.

As for me, hate it or not, I'm not going to prevent myself from using a plugin I really like just because the company is stupid, selfish, or wants to keep the money they are owed.

However, I reserve some deserved unhappiness for UA. Having to have a $1000+ dongle is bottom-raping BS in this day of powerful computing. Especially when the only way I can run one on a Laptop is to have a plug-point Wall Wart within 3 feet. Really?!? Bill has got to be turning in his grave over the stupidity of that one. But, does it prevent me from owning their plugins? No. Because that Lexicon 224 is The Bomb. Best Reverb Plugin, Ever (for me)

That said, if someone else can make a Lexicon 224 emulation that good, I'm putting on my sprinting shoes, selling my house (and those hi-class albatross dongles) and running wholesale into the arms of that plugin company.

Sooooo, iLok is not the worst solution. Not even below median. But a new iLok 3 aught to be the latest port. This iLok 3 has, what, a 2 year shelf life before iLok 4.0?

Last Thought: Maybe we shouldn't get mad at these companies. Maybe we should form a posse and (reputation-ally) hang those crackers causing these let's-not-lose-more-money solutions? It's like blaming your runs on the antibiotic and not being cool with such a necessary side-effect due to that raging infection.
Old 9th December 2016
  #67
Gear Nut
 

Slate does not give you a free iLok - it cost $20.00 to get an iLok with a Slate plugin purchase.
Such as with "Repeater". The plugin itself is $99.00, if you want the iLok with it the price is $119.00
Old 9th December 2016
  #68
Quote:
Originally Posted by RuffRider View Post
Slate does not give you a free iLok - it cost $20.00 to get an iLok with a Slate plugin purchase.
Such as with "Repeater". The plugin itself is $99.00, if you want the iLok with it the price is $119.00
Ahh, got you. I guess I got one when it was a special offer for free. Maybe those are only certain times during the year. Or not anymore? Thanks for updating me!
Old 9th December 2016
  #69
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by db9091 View Post

So imagine having to do a Waves or AVID license-manager-software for every friggin' plugin. I like iLok's dongle vs that.
I agree, post upgrade, or post-crash, I find changing my tactics for re-installing each different copy-protection scheme to be the worst part about it.

Quote:
The BEST solutions is like what Toontrack, SoundToys, etc, does: Offer a license for 2 systems.
if you work in more than 2 studios, that may not the 'best' solution

Quote:
But if ANY of you don't like having to BUY a dongle, Slate often seems to offer a free iLok 2 with their software.
Kush Audio offers a free iLok (if you don't already have one) with their yearly sub. But griping about initial cost of one dongle is often a smokescreen for a different kind of resentment, IMO.

Quote:
As for me, hate it or not, I'm not going to prevent myself from using a plugin I really like just because the company is stupid, selfish, or wants to keep the money they are owed.
There is nothing 'selfish' about wanting to keep the money you are owed. I do it all the time - like when I insist a client pays up before they get their files, for example!

There is quite likely nothing 'stupid' about it either! The silly proposal you always read in these threads is that these companies would make "more money" (in volume!) if they would only unlock their software! It is wishful thinking. It's like proposing that Ferrari would make "more money" (in volume!) by dropping the price of their cars to be about even with a Honda Civic.

All these companies do is think about how much money they will make if they do A vs if they do B. That's what business is. They have ALL thought about it. They have it calculated down to the dollar, what the gains and losses will be. They are far more aware of the specific piracy numbers than any of the users who post here griping about how they are being "treated". They have already calculated how many people will 'boycott' them vs how many people will pirate them, and most have already arrived at their decision.

Quote:
However, I reserve some deserved unhappiness for UA. Having to have a $1000+ dongle...
you left out Logic - they too have a very expensive dongle...

Quote:
That said, if someone else can make a Lexicon 224 emulation that good...
there's is the rub, though, right? The people who make good stuff can insist on whatever copy protection. They are saying, if you don't like it you can go elsewhere, and you can - but quite often you won't. Just like my clients can go to someone else - someone who will let them "run a tab" for instance.

Quote:
Last Thought: Maybe we shouldn't get mad at these companies.
I agree - they are only responding to a situation that they did not want, created by the you-know-whos.
Old 10th December 2016
  #70
Lives for gear
 
ImNotDedyet's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by RuffRider View Post
Slate does not give you a free iLok - it cost $20.00 to get an iLok with a Slate plugin purchase.
Such as with "Repeater". The plugin itself is $99.00, if you want the iLok with it the price is $119.00
If you sign up for their subscription, you do get a free iLok. You have to pay for shipping if I recall.
Old 10th December 2016
  #71
Gear Addict
 
Dzilizi's Avatar
I like the iLok. It has made updating my hard drive/computer really easy over the years. And I can put the products on every computer I own.

What I don't like is having to have an ilok, an elicenser, a codemeter, and a waves USB stick. Especially when laptops are losing USB ports every new model.

But I have to put a plug in here for Cakewalk. They don't have any form of copy protection. Though I guess the new installation manager is now a form. I guess not being a popular DAW has its advantages.
Old 11th December 2016
  #72
Tui
Gear Guru
 
Tui's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post
But these companies are not stupid.
I don't know if they are "stupid", but I don't think they're particularly clever either.

NI are doing it right. You can download and authorise directly from their app, on several machines.

The idea that developers go bankrupt without Pace/iLok has been disproved. In fact, sales increase once the need for a physical dongle has been removed. This has been stated by vendors and discussed on GS.
Old 11th December 2016
  #73
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tui View Post
The idea that developers go bankrupt without Pace/iLok has been disproved.
Who suggested bankruptcy is the inevitable result?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tui View Post
In fact, sales increase once the need for a physical dongle has been removed. This has been stated by vendors and discussed on GS.
Interesting. Which vendors?
Old 11th December 2016
  #74
Gear Guru
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tui View Post
I don't know if they are "stupid", but I don't think they're particularly clever either.

NI are doing it right. You can download and authorise directly from their app, on several machines.
I can move my iLok to any number of machines. Anywhere. Instantly. Most of the plugs I own in one fell swoop. Not a different process for NI and a different process for Waves and on and on.

So it kind of depends on what your definition of "right" is.

Quote:
The idea that developers go bankrupt without Pace/iLok has been disproved.
But companies are not in business to "avoid bankruptcy". They are in business to make a profit. They are under no moral obligation to "hover" at the break-even point simply because we would like them to. That is what you might demand from a charity, or a public utility.

Quote:
In fact, sales increase once the need for a physical dongle has been removed.
Well then, if these increased sales hold up and truly offset the increased piracy, then it is a sure thing that Any Day Now we will see all the predictions for the demise of physical dongles come true.

You know, those predictions that we have been hearing for at least 10 years now.
Old 11th December 2016
  #75
Lives for gear
 

I just hope they fixed the converters. Way too much aliasing and digital harshness in the last version
Old 12th December 2016
  #76
Lives for gear
 
bgood's Avatar
[QUOTE=dcrhythm;12220833]And the logo, someone embossed it! OMG, I have a feeling it may be the 3D and depth I've been missing. Some may say it's a subtle difference, but I really think this is a game changer.[/QUOTE

The new one has tubes and is warner.
Old 12th December 2016
  #77
Lives for gear
 
Joe Porto's Avatar
 

Thanks for the heads up...just ordered one.
Old 13th December 2016
  #78
Tui
Gear Guru
 
Tui's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeq View Post


Well then, if these increased sales hold up and truly offset the increased piracy, then it is a sure thing that Any Day Now we will see all the predictions for the demise of physical dongles come true.

You know, those predictions that we have been hearing for at least 10 years now.
I'm not aware of any such predictions... Who made them?

Personally, I'd rather expect people to repeat the same follies, as they seem to, throughout history.
Old 13th December 2016
  #79
Lives for gear
The iLok 3 looks much better than the iLok 2 so a thumbs up from me.

The only downside is that I will have to wait until my ZDT is up for renewal before I can upgrade to the iLok 3.
Old 20th December 2016
  #80
Lives for gear
 

I like my ilok and UAD plugins because I can install my fav plugins on someone's machine and from there, just bring my ilok or twin to sessions and know that my client needs me to fully open my mixes i do for them or to use my tools. It gives my work a more personal touch because it doesnt work the same if im not there.

Also it gives me an excuse to not load a bunch of software for someone "sorry, it needs an ilok" *lazy*
Old 20th December 2016
  #81
For me it's simple, I don't need or want the dongle and so I don't buy plugins or software that require it. I respect that those who actually benefit from carrying their licences around on a usb stick derive a benefit from the whole scheme. That scenario does not apply to me, I'm not bouncing from system to system installing plugins on everyone else's systems ( I still find it hard to believe anyone is actually doing this rather than just using what's available...).

I would have bought every Reverb from Exponential Audio if he didn't require the ilok dongle, and so instead I bought others. Same goes for Slate, I would have purchased at least a few of their plugs if not for the dongle requirement, and so you find alternatives.

I respect their choice, but in this market any extra level of hassle is going to prove fatal for consumers like me.
Old 20th December 2016
  #82
Lives for gear
 
Analogue Mastering's Avatar
Anybody has the new V3 ilok already? Any noticeable "performance gains" it being advertized as 2x as fast, (plugin load time? Less system stress polling licenses during production etc?)
Old 20th December 2016
  #83
Tui
Gear Guru
 
Tui's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverb View Post
... I'm not bouncing from system to system installing plugins on everyone else's systems ( I still find it hard to believe anyone is actually doing this rather than just using what's available...).
The number of people who do this must be tiny, compared with the majority of users. It is a valid requirement for travelling pro mixers/engineers, but how many are there? A few hundred, perhaps..?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverb View Post
I would have bought every Reverb from Exponential Audio if he didn't require the ilok dongle, and so instead I bought others.
Slightly OT, but did you get the free Eventide 2016 Stereo Room via Focusrite? I now prefer it over my Lex PCM - shock, horror!

https://www.eventideaudio.com/blog/n...om-reverb-free
Old 20th December 2016
  #84
Lives for gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tui View Post
The number of people who do this must be tiny, compared with the majority of users. It is a valid requirement for travelling pro mixers/engineers, but how many are there? A few hundred, perhaps..?
Probably more than that. I think the other side of this however is that many studios at least used to install cracked software, so the flipside of the argument is that 'no it's not needed because the studio already has X installed', but, that was a cracked version.

In other words from a larger perspective it in a sense becomes a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy when engineers bounce around and don't bring their legit protected software because the studios use cracked software. If the engineers brought iLoks with their own specific software then the studios wouldn't have to install five million plugins to make everyone happy, just a basic set.

I have for one gotten use out of my iLok when moving around. And I think Phoenixverb would be a good example for me because it's the by far best reverb I've heard and used to date for post production. Whatever the cost is for an iLok spread out over the lifetime of the device, even when averaged out onto that one plugin, makes it worth it. So if my iLok is $40 and breaks after four years then that's $10 per year for that one plugin, and if I use it at least 10 months of the year it's a buck a month extra. I mean, it's really nothing in terms of cost.
Old 20th December 2016
  #85
Gear Addict
 
pandar's Avatar
 

Blame copy protection on the suits not the devs plz.
Old 20th December 2016
  #86
Lives for gear
 

????
Old 20th December 2016
  #87
Lives for gear
 
Analogue Mastering's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by pandar View Post
Blame copy protection on the suits not the devs plz.
blame it on the warez users...
Old 20th December 2016
  #88
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tui View Post
The number of people who do this must be tiny, compared with the majority of users. It is a valid requirement for travelling pro mixers/engineers, but how many are there? A few hundred, perhaps..?



Slightly OT, but did you get the free Eventide 2016 Stereo Room via Focusrite? I now prefer it over my Lex PCM - shock, horror!

https://www.eventideaudio.com/blog/n...om-reverb-free
Thanks for sharing !!!!!!!! I had no idea!
Old 23rd December 2016
  #89
Gear Head
 

My current largest objection to ilok is having to search and dig out a dangling dongle when I want to work on an idea for a few minutes- in an airport, hotel etc. Well, and forgotting the thing which can impede work until one is back where it was left.

Does anyone have any thoughts about the possibility of just duct taping the newer stronger ilok 3 to the bottom of one's laptop and leaving it sonnected with a downangle usb extension?

(the reason to not fasten it to the top/lid is because that would require cable slack which might get caught and tugged on when putting the laptop in a computer case or backpack).

On another note:
Does anyone have any idea how ZDT/ loss/theft insurance would work if a plug-in manufacturer goes out of business?
Old 23rd December 2016
  #90
P99
Gear Maniac
 

Is there no software iLok emulator?
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearslutz Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…
Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Forum Jump
Forum Jump