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Windows 10 is rolling out... share your experiences here
Old 31st August 2019
  #7171
Lives for gear
 

On some level it's good to know MS is still vibrant. We used to hear about how the early employees' stock options turned them into billionaires or close; not hearing those tales lately is probably why I formed the impression MS was just hanging on. Thanks for explaining that's not so.
Old 31st August 2019
  #7172
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponzi View Post
@ pete --I did try out the in windows linux--it was cool, but I personally did not have a use for it. One beef I have with Microsoft and maybe IBM back in the day--the command line utilities are differently named than in *nix. I just want to get on the windows command shall and type 'ls -l'.

I had the impression that there was already a linux kernel inside windows for when one got into the linux environment--maybe it was just a layer on the windows kernel. Are you saying that the windows kernel will be to some degree replaced with linux kernel code? I doubt that, but it would be interesting.

I remember how the first generations of NT were based on that DEC operating system--and tales of that hot-tempered former dec guy who ran the nt project.

Off topic, but I just made some sort of mistake getting bitlocker going on my C drive after a restore and it took several hours to recover from, but I did have an image to restore. For a while I was wondering how much work it would be to take a fresh windows install and install my files and restore my documents--getting careless in my old pc-age.
Windows Kernel will remain the Windows Kernel.

Right now, there's a layer above it that maps Linux syscalls to NT kernel calls. But that has issues with things that behave differently in Linux vs NT (example: deleting an in-use folder/directory).

So WSL2 is using the same very lightweight virtualization technology we created to spin up azure instances, and will have an actual Linux kernel in a VM/container. It's similar to running Linux in a full VM, but with much faster startup time and tighter integration.

NT has/had a POSIX-compliant layer in it. But that is not used here.

Command-line: No different from having to remember other operating systems. Speaking of DEC VMS, in college in Massachusetts, we used VMS on a DEC VAX. To change directory, you had to type:

SET DEFAULT directorypath

As students, we always created a bunch of aliases to take the pain from that, though. Other operating systems (CP/M, etc.) had other commands.

Later version of VMS, IIRC, had the mappings for ls/pwd etc. built in.

Anyway, if you really want ls in the Windows shell, you could use Cygwin (which I'm not a fan of, but works) or use PowerShell. It has an ls command, although it doesn't support the parameters because it's an alias of Get-ChildItem.

The other thing you can do is use WSL and navigate to a mounted Windows volume. That's a little extra for just a directory listing, but that will give you the full command.

On thing I do miss from VMS (and *nix) is the file version. VMS put a ;# with # being a number for each version of a file. You had to purge old versions manually. It's not git, but at the time, was super useful.

Pete
Old 31st August 2019
  #7173
Gear Head
 
snoskit's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ponzi View Post
@ pete

I remember how the first generations of NT were based on that DEC operating system--and tales of that hot-tempered former dec guy who ran the nt project.
MS OS/2 was the base OS

PROMPT=[$P]
Old 31st August 2019
  #7174
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoskit View Post
MS OS/2 was the base OS

PROMPT=[$P]
The story from that time has lots of different versions, especially the relationship between Microsoft/IBM OS/2 and NT.

But the NT architect and his team were all ex-DEC VMS OS developers.

Pete
Old 31st August 2019
  #7175
Gear Head
 
snoskit's Avatar
 

Mr Cutler remixed os/2

1st it job: installing + testing ms os/2 v1.x
2nd it job: installing + testing ibm os/2 v2.x

1st job outfit was a supplier of a 'branded' tweaked version os lan manager. Just before leaving that job the first released versions of NT code had turned up
Old 31st August 2019
  #7176
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Some actual windows 10 stuff to report:

1) I purchased an 'open box' ssd to use for my windows drive. I believe it had problems and I returned it. I was able to restore the windows partitions from a macrium reflect image file created by their free version. Not often I get in a pickle and need to do a disaster recovery scenario, but its good to see that this software was up to the task.

2) I was concerned that my ssd had data issues so I ran a couple of windows utilities that are new to me. I did sfc /scannow which compares installed files to saved windows image. It reported errors it could not fix. I then ran dism /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth. This reported it did do some updates. I then ran sfc again and it reported it was able to fix errors. I then ran sfc again and it reported no integrity issues found. Never heard of these before, but I was looking for something like the windows repair option where it verifies all the windows files are equal to what they should be.

3) Just for the fun of it I broke with my pattern of buying one terabyte ssds, and got a 512 gig samsung 970 pro. My windows partition on it is 200 gig and its currently using 100 gig including a large set of home photos in the my documents folder. So far working like a champ.

Whomever designed the mounting process for m.2 drives deserves some sort of special punishment. Those microscopic screws use the smallest philips head I have and are a real hassle to work with. I lost the ones that came with my mobo, so I ordered a general set of these screws and mounts from amazon. Right now my m.2 c drive is on a pci-e card that I have used off an on. Since my z390 prime has a couple of m.2 slots on it, I will use them. I am using one now, and when the screw/standoff kit arrives, I will move it to the mobo.

I have a 4tb spinner I use for storing backups and archive files, and a 1tb ssd that I was using for a system drive, and now not sure what I will use it for. Its weird to think that it may not be long before all the 'disk' storage could be mounted on the mobo with no need for anything else in the case. As I have said many times, cpu improvements have been slow and incremental in the last 5 years, but storage has improved 100 fold in that time. Storage is where the action is if one wants to get a quick and inexpensive performance boost. And m.2 using pci-e is 6.6 times faster than sata 2 ssd, which is in turn at least 10 times faster than spinning platter....
Old 1st September 2019
  #7177
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoskit View Post
MS OS/2 was the base OS

PROMPT=[$P]
IBM OS/2 Lanserver 2.1 was the codebase for the NT core if I remember rightly.

Last edited by Scragend; 1st September 2019 at 01:06 AM.. Reason: (added IBM)
Old 1st September 2019
  #7178
Lives for gear
Holy flashback, Batman! I still have my OS/2 mousepad.

Carry on...
Attached Thumbnails
Windows 10 is rolling out... share your experiences here-os2-mousepad.jpg  
Old 1st September 2019
  #7179
Gear Head
 
snoskit's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scragend View Post
IBM OS/2 Lanserver 2.1 was the codebase for the NT core if I remember rightly.
IBM and MS had split by then (1993)
First version of NT I got see would have been 1990/1 - v3.0
Old 1st September 2019
  #7180
Lives for gear
from the Ask Woody forum:

"The second August patch for Win10 1903 shoots one core up to 100% utilization:
Is your machine red-lining after installing today’s KB 4512941, the second August cumulative update for Win10 version 1903?

Günter Born has a workaround. https://borncity.com/win/2019/08/30/...pu-load-issue/

The problem is caused by a corrupt cache in

c:\Windows\SystemApps\Microsoft.Windows.Cortana_cw5n1h2txyewy\cache\
The solution is to replace that folder with an old, correctly functioning version. Born has links"

https://www.askwoody.com/
Old 1st September 2019
  #7181
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoskit View Post
IBM and MS had split by then (1993)
First version of NT I got see would have been 1990/1 - v3.0
I remember at software etc store back in the 80s, I accidentally bought a microsoft os/2 disk rather than dos. I returned it, and had no idea what os/2 was. Even into the 90s, there was plenty of os/2 code in windows. Folks delightfully pointed out a windows error message that referred to os/2 in the message text. Microsoft reviewed their error messages and fixed that.

IBM was pretty energetic in avoiding the financial benefits that would have arisen by sticking with microsoft. I read that at one point, bill gates offered ibm a special deal on a block of microsoft stock. IBM said no. Had IBM taken the deal, the block of microsoft stock would have eventually been worth more than the entire rest of the IBM company.

Sybase also split from a joint development deal with microsoft on relational databases. Microsoft's part of this became sql server. Sybase is now a niche has-been and sql server is a significant player in relational database servers.

I remembered Dave Cutler's name. Amazing what I can and can't remember from prior decades. The stories were legendary--kicking a chair through a wall in a fit of rage. I recall reading that bill gates said that he was worried that if he fixed what was wrong about dave cutler, he might unintentionally fix what was right about him as well... Back in those days, writing an os was by no means a certain task, and at that time, it was not clear that microsoft would prevail over os/2. It was a real horse race for a few years, so a project leader that could deliver results was extremely important to ms.

Also, at ignite conference last year I saw a presentation from some windows 10 development team people. IIRC, they said there are 7,000 developers working on windows 10. Pete can correct me if I remembered that wrong.
Old 1st September 2019
  #7182
Lives for gear
 

... Resisting the temptation to ask how IBM makes money these days ...
Old 2nd September 2019
  #7183
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponzi View Post
...
Also, at ignite conference last year I saw a presentation from some windows 10 development team people. IIRC, they said there are 7,000 developers working on windows 10. Pete can correct me if I remembered that wrong.
Not sure of the number. It's more distributed now, so a bit more effort to nail down.

I'll be at Ignite this year.

Pete
Old 3rd September 2019
  #7184
Lives for gear
I'm sure no speakers attending will have a forced update interrupt their speech. You think? Oh...that's right. You're all probably on Enterprise... for free. Not like the rest of us schleps.

Dealing with the incessant interruptions since 1803 refused to install. I did have a one year respite...but it's over. I hate to say it, but our most recent purchase was an Apple. Still learning, but I assume the OS won't kill my hard earned, and payed for, computer.
Old 3rd September 2019
  #7185
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norbury brook's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by onewire View Post
I'm sure no speakers attending will have a forced update interrupt their speech. You think? Oh...that's right. You're all probably on Enterprise... for free. Not like the rest of us schleps.

Dealing with the incessant interruptions since 1803 refused to install. I did have a one year respite...but it's over. I hate to say it, but our most recent purchase was an Apple. Still learning, but I assume the OS won't kill my hard earned, and payed for, computer.
Incessant interruptions, from what may I ask? I'm only asking as I'd be annoyed with any interruptions so I'm curious as to what and why.

I have all my updates set to install out of hours and have never had an issue and I run my machine everyday in the studio.

I'm running windows 10 pro by the way.


MC
Old 3rd September 2019
  #7186
Quote:
Originally Posted by onewire View Post
I'm sure no speakers attending will have a forced update interrupt their speech. You think? Oh...that's right. You're all probably on Enterprise... for free. Not like the rest of us schleps.

Dealing with the incessant interruptions since 1803 refused to install. I did have a one year respite...but it's over. I hate to say it, but our most recent purchase was an Apple. Still learning, but I assume the OS won't kill my hard earned, and payed for, computer.
We always defer updated before going on stage. The PCs are set to always warn before an install/reboot so it's more about not having the embarrassment of the prompt on stage. Most developers I know are on pro.

In the past, we've had other updates interrupt talks on MSIT-managed machines.

Sorry about your experience with the failed install.

Pete
Old 3rd September 2019
  #7187
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Psychlist1972 View Post
We always defer updated before going on stage...
I always turn off email. At one presentation a couple of years ago, a very big room of people and the presenter gets the little email received title message on the screen along the lines of "If this @ @@@ @ keeps pulling this sort of #####, we are going to have to hire a private investigator."

Embarrassing...
Old 3rd September 2019
  #7188
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponzi View Post
I always turn off email. At one presentation a couple of years ago, a very big room of people and the presenter gets the little email received title message on the screen along the lines of "If this @ @@@ @ keeps pulling this sort of #####, we are going to have to hire a private investigator."

Embarrassing...
Yeah. I've seen that happen a few times.

I just mute all notifications. Used to be called "Quiet hours" now it's "focus assist".

The toast notifications mute automatically now if you have this on (which is on by default, IIRC):

Settings->System->Notifications & Actions->Focus Assist->"When I'm duplicating my display". Doesn't work when you extend (like when using speaker notes in powerpoint)

Pete
Old 3rd September 2019
  #7189
Lives for gear
 
loopy's Avatar
 

I do a lot of presentations for work and always turn stuff off prior to my presentation.

What's worse is having "Instant Messenger" popping up with your best buddy asking if you are going to the nudie bar that night.. Yes I have seen this happen..

But not me of course
Old 6th September 2019
  #7190
I have to say, I've used Windows since 3.1, but since the Win 10 OS updated itself to the 1903 build on my laptop, I've had enough. Some of my old programs that were fine on 1803 have now stopped working. This isn't my DAW rig although I use it for some quick & dirty field recording occasionally. Every update just removes more control from the user... I've installed Linux Mint in a dual boot setup and will migrate to it gradually. My studio DAW is running an older build of 10 and I have the updates turned off on that machine, in addition it is not online most of the time.

If you're running Windows 10 you should look into the following tools which allow you to control your own computer, I can't recommend this stuff enough:

https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10

https://www.oo-software.com/en/ooappbuster

These guys also have tons of cool utilities, like these:

https://www.novirusthanks.org/products/win-update-stop/

https://www.novirusthanks.org/produc...-update-fixer/

You can thank me later...
Old 3 weeks ago
  #7191
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Saw some numbers on the interweb that might be interesting: Windows 10 market share 51% rising, windows 7 30% falling. Windows 7 official end of life Jan 2020 (I don't know what specifically that means in practical terms). Another study noted that 41% of people are using older windows 7, xp, and vista.
Old 1 week ago
  #7192
Gear Addict
 
juiseman's Avatar
 

I saw a few things there that may interest us for v1909

•A fix to allow OEMs to reduce the inking latency based on the hardware capabilities of their devices rather than being stuck with latency selected on typical hardware configuration by the OS.

•A CPU may have multiple “favored” cores (logical processors of the highest available scheduling class). To provide better performance and reliability, we have implemented a rotation policy that distributes work more fairly among these favored cores.

•We have made general battery life and power efficiency improvements for PCs with certain processors.

Main link:
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/win...p-at-home-1909
Old 19 hours ago
  #7193
Quote:
Originally Posted by playon View Post
I have to say, I've used Windows since 3.1, but since the Win 10 OS updated itself to the 1903 build on my laptop, I've had enough. Some of my old programs that were fine on 1803 have now stopped working. This isn't my DAW rig although I use it for some quick & dirty field recording occasionally. Every update just removes more control from the user... I've installed Linux Mint in a dual boot setup and will migrate to it gradually. My studio DAW is running an older build of 10 and I have the updates turned off on that machine, in addition it is not online most of the time.

If you're running Windows 10 you should look into the following tools which allow you to control your own computer, I can't recommend this stuff enough:

https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10

https://www.oo-software.com/en/ooappbuster

These guys also have tons of cool utilities, like these:

https://www.novirusthanks.org/products/win-update-stop/

https://www.novirusthanks.org/produc...-update-fixer/

You can thank me later...
Thanks! I've been late to (or even 50% missed) quite a few business meetings at work because of an automatic update when I power up the laptop and never plan on ever installing or buying Windows 10. However, I bookmarked them just in case I am in the unfortunate position of installing that horrid OS. Even with the memory maxed out on my Dell Laptop, the performance is "not slow". I understand OS's only get bigger and more bloated over time but I'll probably have to migrate over to Mac or Linux at some point because the OS reminds me on a weekly basis why Win7 was better. I wish my company IT department disabled the automatic updates because I've even lost my unsaved files because the laptop automatically rebooted without my permission to perform an automatic update. I look at that, shake my head and say never win10.
Old 18 hours ago
  #7194
I can update my experience with Linux Mint after using it on my laptop for over a month. In a word -- great! I still have a dual boot setup with Win10 but the only time I use it is for loading music into my iphone. At some point I will install Reaper on the Linux partition and learn to use it.
Old 11 hours ago
  #7195
Lives for gear
 
ponzi's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by juiseman View Post
...
•A CPU may have multiple “favored” cores (logical processors of the highest available scheduling class). To provide better performance and reliability, we have implemented a rotation policy that distributes work more fairly among these favored cores...
Good to end that favoritism... It does remind me that now that I have 8 cores, that's a lot of cpu and it does require a sophisticated process scheduler to manage. Same with gigabytes of ram. I could have probably gotten by with 4 cores, but its like $100 more for 8, so...

I believe they are working to improve the windows kernel with every release, and since this is the year of core count multiplication, its good to do so.

PS. Where I work, over 5,000 employees, all using windows 10. Very few problems. At home, no problems. Linux does not have drivers for the better audio interfaces like my motu 828es, and osx is not a greener pasture if one reads all the hand-wringing over on mac threads over catalina...
Old 7 hours ago
  #7196
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by playon View Post
I can update my experience with Linux Mint after using it on my laptop for over a month. In a word -- great! I still have a dual boot setup with Win10 but the only time I use it is for loading music into my iphone. At some point I will install Reaper on the Linux partition and learn to use it.
Linux is still unusable for "ALL" music makers. Just to be clear Linux is not yet good enough and worth the hassle for music makers. Saying otherwise is simply not true. This is not a critique of you (that wants to experiment with it), just a warning to people thinking about switching.
Old 5 hours ago
  #7197
Gear Head
 
snoskit's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by daskeladden View Post
Linux is still unusable for "ALL" music makers. Just to be clear Linux is not yet good enough and worth the hassle for music makers. Saying otherwise is simply not true. This is not a critique of you (that wants to experiment with it), just a warning to people thinking about switching.
Do you mean by this that (a) there's a fundamental issue with linux or (b) that the software/hardware vendors don't offer any significant support yet ?
Old 3 hours ago
  #7198
Lives for gear
 
daskeladden's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by snoskit View Post
Do you mean by this that (a) there's a fundamental issue with linux or (b) that the software/hardware vendors don't offer any significant support yet ?
yes; drivers, plugin, stability, software, hardware and so on is not good enough on Linux. You have to do a lot of tweaking just to get it working. Here is one guy testing it out.
Old 2 hours ago
  #7199
Gear Addict
 
juiseman's Avatar
 

Linux for music has come along way; but I do agree if you're not familiar with
it....its going to be a big learning curve. It also depends on what hardware you are using and how well it works with JACK audio. There are cases that it may
work out of the box with you're distro flavor of Linux. Guys who are using
the DAW just to record audio & maybe a little editing with only using stock plugs;
it would be fine. Heavy VSTi and multiple 3rd party plugin users may want to look elsewhere......

Check this out if you're seriously considering
https://ubuntustudio.org/tour/audio/
If I ever get some free time, I'd like to try this again..
haven't tried UB studio in about 5 years. But it looks pretty cool.

Mixbus, Reaper and Bitwig are some more native Linux DAWS
that are cross platform.
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