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cheap daw controller with motorised faders ? Control Surfaces
Old 10th May 2015
  #1
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cheap daw controller with motorised faders ?

Ok so the x touch is delayed. Any other cheap controllers out there (touch sensitive ) ? I do not need audio ins and outs preamps etc just something to control fades in my daw. Less than 500 pounds ideally.
Old 10th May 2015
  #2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
Ok so the x touch is delayed. Any other cheap controllers out there (touch sensitive ) ? I do not need audio ins and outs preamps etc just something to control fades in my daw. Less than 500 pounds ideally.
Behringer still makes and sells their B-Control fader unit. It has been reviewed here.

Otherwise:
Let me google that for you
Old 10th May 2015
  #3
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GearAndGuitars's Avatar
 

BCF2000... amazing for the price, pretty damn good at any price...
Old 10th May 2015
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enlightened Hand View Post
Behringer still makes and sells their B-Control fader unit. It has been reviewed here.

Otherwise:
Let me google that for you
I've already Googled it smartass couldn't find anything thus the post. Yeah the old behringer looks ok but not touch sensitive and I just know if I buy one they ll bring out the x touch the next day
.. All the others I found had preamps that I don't need. There's that avid artist thing but it's too pricey.
Old 10th May 2015
  #5
ipad with v control works great for me

Edit: you can get a 1 gen for 100$ and vcontrol is 50$ all for less then 100 pounds
Old 11th May 2015
  #6
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
I've already Googled it smartass couldn't find anything thus the post. Yeah the old behringer looks ok but not touch sensitive and I just know if I buy one they ll bring out the x touch the next day
.. All the others I found had preamps that I don't need. There's that avid artist thing but it's too pricey.
Unless you want a single fader (personus fader port) then you're SOL. Or find a used command 8. Just examine how much riding you'll actually be doing maybe the faderport is what you want
Old 11th May 2015
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sam guaiana View Post
Unless you want a single fader (personus fader port) then you're SOL. Or find a used command 8. Just examine how much riding you'll actually be doing maybe the faderport is what you want
thanks Sam
Old 11th May 2015
  #8
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tehlord's Avatar
 

You often see Avid/Euphonix Artist Mix/Control come up used for about £500

Won't beat that for the money.
Old 11th May 2015
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxwellcrespo View Post
ipad with v control works great for me

Edit: you can get a 1 gen for 100$ and vcontrol is 50$ all for less then 100 pounds
Have to say Im not a great fan of touchscreen control for faders etc - I want to feel something physical , tactile. However the ideal for me would be real physical faders but with some kind of touchscreen interface as well so you could use the fancy graphic eqs by touching them . I can see that Avid artist mix is heading in that direction. I think thats the future.
I chatted to behringer and they said the xtouch is delayed bacuase they are pouring all their resources intot heir new ipad touchscreen thing. This seems to me like an error. We have 5 senses and touch is one of them - for artists and engineers touch is as important as sight and sound - I think for this reason things will neve rbe totally virtual - we like touching stuff you know
Old 11th May 2015
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
Ok so the x touch is delayed. Any other cheap controllers out there (touch sensitive ) ? I do not need audio ins and outs preamps etc just something to control fades in my daw. Less than 500 pounds ideally.
The problem you're going to face with low budget hardware DAW controllers is the lack of tight integration. I have tried the most popular DAW controllers ranging from £1k to £4k and not one of them offered me the accuracy I could achieve when using a mouse.

This is the reason I went down the multi touchscreen path and now I never look back as I use the mouse 80% plus less of the time.
Old 11th May 2015
  #11
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I had one for a short time, but it was too noisy for me. The faders click very audibly when bank switching. I ended up getting an old Mackie HUI, and am very pleased with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GearAndGuitars View Post
BCF2000... amazing for the price, pretty damn good at any price...
Old 11th May 2015
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
I had one for a short time, but it was too noisy for me. The faders click very audibly when bank switching. I ended up getting an old Mackie HUI, and am very pleased with it.
those huis look really cool too kind of startrekky... are they possible to get working with say flstudio or cubase ? Can you do the right click "midi learn" thing ?
Old 11th May 2015
  #13
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Lamster's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
I had one for a short time, but it was too noisy for me. The faders click very audibly when bank switching. I ended up getting an old Mackie HUI, and am very pleased with it.
There is also this? Not my Video


I just got a D8B with no computer cheap £100 seen them cheaper and more expensive on ebay and got the Probox from the guy that makes them for 200euros.
Still modding mine and building a PSU (some people build them into the D8B) so haven't used it yet hiopefully will be running in a week or two.
Could have got a HUI for that but this thing is 3x HUIs so if the Mackie works should be good?

Last edited by Lamster; 11th May 2015 at 11:33 PM..
Old 11th May 2015
  #14
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I would have no way of knowing since I don't have either Cubase or FL. Most DAWs have a template for the HUI, but I can't say so for sure.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
those huis look really cool too kind of startrekky... are they possible to get working with say flstudio or cubase ? Can you do the right click "midi learn" thing ?
Old 11th May 2015
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Oracle View Post
The problem you're going to face with low budget hardware DAW controllers is the lack of tight integration. I have tried the most popular DAW controllers ranging from £1k to £4k and not one of them offered me the accuracy I could achieve when using a mouse.

This is the reason I went down the multi touchscreen path and now I never look back as I use the mouse 80% plus less of the time.
That's weird because I have a really crap one that cost 30 quid that works fine. See the post above your for my take on touchscreens.
Old 11th May 2015
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
That's weird because I have a really crap one that cost 30 quid that works fine. See the post above your for my take on touchscreens.
So if the one you have for £30 works just fine, why are you looking for a new one?

Try moving your fader up and down in the most tiny of increments and see if the hardware fader matches the exact movements of the DAW fader.

My Command 8 couldn't even come close to matching the movement. Hence why I sold it.
Old 11th May 2015
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Oracle View Post
So if the one you have for £30 works just fine, why are you looking for a new one?

Try moving your fader up and down in the most tiny of increments and see if the hardware fader matches the exact movements of the DAW fader.

My Command 8 couldn't even come close to matching the movement. Hence why I sold it.
It's too small it's just a little box with 8 faders on it, I want a few more bells and whistles. As well as post and engineering I also play live and it's completely liberated me from the mouse much nicer being able to move more than one thing at a time. Also as I stated touch is also an important sense and I think people will always want something tactile. I hate touchscreen faders I've already tried them, not my cup of tea at all , each to their own I guess .
Old 12th May 2015
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamster View Post
There is also this? Not my Video


I just got a D8B with no computer cheap £100 seen them cheaper and more expensive on ebay and got the Probox from the guy that makes them for 200euros.
Still modding mine and building a PSU (some people build them into the D8B) so haven't used it yet hiopefully will be running in a week or two.
Could have got a HUI for that but this thing is 3x HUIs so if the Mackie works should be good?
mmmm mm pretty. So when you say no computer does that mean you can just plug it into your own computer and say, an rme raydat sound card with some adat converters ?
What is a "pro box" I noticed there's a guy working on hacking this to be a daw controller - is this possible now ?

Last edited by Gusss; 12th May 2015 at 12:47 AM..
Old 12th May 2015
  #19
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Lamster's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
mmmm mm pretty. So when you say no computer does that mean you can just plug it into your own computer and say, an rme raydat sound card with some adat converters ?
What is a "pro box" I noticed there's a guy working on hacking this to be a daw controller - is this possible now ?
Hi Gusss
Computer less. The D8B has a separate PSU that was also a computer with a propriatory software by Mackie.The computer is low spec by todays standards but the hardware is critical as only drivers for those exact components are written into the software ( bit like a mac then?)Without this the D8B was usless.

Hence I got one without the computer off ebay???

Yes it is possible there are 2 options there is ProBox by Ralph Weritz or Marc Girrards D8Bridge.
The Probox is a USB power self contained unit that sends software to D8B to function as a DAW controller. And communicate via usb/midi to your DAW.

The D8Bridge is software that you run on another computer and connect to the D8B in the same way the link to your DAW computer is Via ethernet This may have been updated and I know both projects are being further developed.

Obviously the risk is buying an unknow D8B from ebay that's the issue as both systems are proven to work with D8B. Mine was sold as "Was working before the PC /PSU died. Mine looks to power up and load the probox so looking good for starters I got to finish building my PSU and the install the thing in my Studio Area.
Old 12th May 2015
  #20
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If you're interested in an Avid Artist Mix then drop me a PM. I have two in mint condition (9 or 10 months old) that I'm about to sell as I just bought an Avid S3. I used them with Cubase. I've owned several controllers and personally I'd say a Eucon controller is far superior than any MCU or HUI controller for Cubase. No idea about FL Studio though.

Sorry, wouldn't normally try and use a thread like this to sell my gear but seems appropriate in this case!
Old 12th May 2015
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamster View Post
Hi Gusss
Computer less. The D8B has a separate PSU that was also a computer with a propriatory software by Mackie.The computer is low spec by todays standards but the hardware is critical as only drivers for those exact components are written into the software ( bit like a mac then?)Without this the D8B was usless.

Hence I got one without the computer off ebay???

Yes it is possible there are 2 options there is ProBox by Ralph Weritz or Marc Girrards D8Bridge.
The Probox is a USB power self contained unit that sends software to D8B to function as a DAW controller. And communicate via usb/midi to your DAW.

The D8Bridge is software that you run on another computer and connect to the D8B in the same way the link to your DAW computer is Via ethernet This may have been updated and I know both projects are being further developed.

Obviously the risk is buying an unknow D8B from ebay that's the issue as both systems are proven to work with D8B. Mine was sold as "Was working before the PC /PSU died. Mine looks to power up and load the probox so looking good for starters I got to finish building my PSU and the install the thing in my Studio Area.
Can I have a link to the other project you mentioned and the probox . So when it works do the lights on the meter bridge and motorised faders work too ? What's involved in getting the psu working ? Awesome project btw hope you get it working.
Old 12th May 2015
  #22
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Squawk's Avatar
Don't get anything without scribble strips. You'll regret it...
Old 12th May 2015
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squawk View Post
Don't get anything without scribble strips. You'll regret it...
Agreed. This is also one area where Eucon is better than the MCU protocol. MCU is limited to 6 characters, unless anything has changed since I owned one a while ago. I found that quite frustrating at times. e.g. If you've got a dozen vocal tracks, try giving them all a 6 character name that actually makes them quickly identifiable on the controller!

Can't remember what Eucon allows but it's more than 6.
Old 12th May 2015
  #24
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Some controllers pull the track name from the DAW. Mackie HUI does that. For me, that would be the most common usage of scribble strips so I don't miss them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Squawk View Post
Don't get anything without scribble strips. You'll regret it...
Old 12th May 2015
  #25
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Unique first or last characters. Not a big deal. The abbreviation uses the last char. But if you have more than 10 vocal tracks, it can be an issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by J-S-Q View Post
Agreed. This is also one area where Eucon is better than the MCU protocol. MCU is limited to 6 characters, unless anything has changed since I owned one a while ago. I found that quite frustrating at times. e.g. If you've got a dozen vocal tracks, try giving them all a 6 character name that actually makes them quickly identifiable on the controller!

Can't remember what Eucon allows but it's more than 6.
Old 12th May 2015
  #26
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Keep us posted on how it works out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lamster View Post
There is also this? Not my Video


I just got a D8B with no computer cheap £100 seen them cheaper and more expensive on ebay and got the Probox from the guy that makes them for 200euros.
Still modding mine and building a PSU (some people build them into the D8B) so haven't used it yet hiopefully will be running in a week or two.
Could have got a HUI for that but this thing is 3x HUIs so if the Mackie works should be good?
Old 12th May 2015
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
Unique first or last characters. Not a big deal. The abbreviation uses the last char. But if you have more than 10 vocal tracks, it can be an issue.
Yes of course I can have a unique character but that's not very good if you ask me. Fine if you have a 10 or twenty track projects I guess but my projects generally very have high track counts and trying to remember what each 6 character name means wasn't fun.

The thing I find with controllers is that the small details matter a LOT. So, if I have to spend even one or two seconds trying to identify which track I'm looking for because the track name is unclear, forget it.... I'll grab my mouse thank you.
Old 14th May 2015
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusss View Post
Can I have a link to the other project you mentioned and the probox . So when it works do the lights on the meter bridge and motorised faders work too ? What's involved in getting the psu working ? Awesome project btw hope you get it working.
Hi gusss
The D8 Bridge is here:
Bluaudio D8Bridge MCU Emulator for D8B v1.1 - MIDI DAW Remote Controller / Console Emulation

You will have to PM me for ProBox info. I have manuals, PSU requirments and mackie service manuals

Yes the meter bridge does work the youtube video I posted ( although not mine) up is a D8B running a VST session on probox.
I think the video may be by the developer of probox.

I've just built my PSU and have been testing it out As I say I had the ProBox running on my laptop and connected to the Mackie the Mackie loads the Probox software and initialises. At this point it looks for a DAW I didn't have the Mackie set up in my DAW so it didn't do anything ( reading the probox manual would have helped at this point) other than register midi input on the transport of the DAW.
I was informed by Ralph ( Mr ProBox) that my system was basicly working but I hadn't set it up yet so it failed to connect to the DAW.
Later I addded 3x mackie controls to my DAW and was going to test the next day. But I decided to do a mod on my PSU and managed to drop one of my meter probes accross the power output while testing and blew up my PSU so had to order some parts. They arrived today I repaired the PSU and tested again this evening. I will try to run the Mackie tomorrow.
As for the PSU you need 12V 8-10A 5V 12A and +/-16v 1-2A
most people buy Switch mode PSU's for 12V and 5V and a kit for the +/-16v supply. I buil tmine into a 19" 3U rack case but others build it directly into the D8B the later means its all self contained. I would imagine that if you wanted you could build the probox into the mackie aswell the you would only need to connect it via usb.
The other advantage is that as you won't be needing the audio cards for the D8B you could sell them on ebay and get most of your money back that you shelled out on the D8B
Old 16th May 2015
  #29
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Lamster's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
Keep us posted on how it works out.
Had a first try at running with a laptop in my shed this evening.( Still Testing)
PROBOX loaded to D8B and asked for Daw opened Cubase SX (thats what on my laptop) and It responded to that. I opened a song and faders powered up to levels to match those in cubase.
Transport and jog wheel working and digital read out on mackie matches the read out on the transport in cubase.
Now for the not so good I've somehow ganged the controllers together so faders 1,9,17 2,10.18 and so on are moving in unison with each other. Some of the faders affect pitch bend on some of my soft synths that sounds horrible.
On the whole a few minor teething problems but considering the D8B was untested from ebay it could have been a lot worse.
Old 16th May 2015
  #30
wow that DB8 HUI trick/mod is very cool!

The DB8 is a very nice and compact surface for 24+1 faders

I used a Tascam US2400 (very cool, only no scribble strips)
MACKIE MCU PRO + 2 x XT Pro extenders (those XT displays slowly start dying after getting em new within weeks, sold the whole bunch)

I now use the SSL Nucleus.


I wish there was some sort of hybrid between the 3....
24+1 faders (SSL only has 16), Good scribble strip (SSL), Fully metering and MCU control (MCU ) And pls no Preamps/IOs..Ive got that covered already.
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