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DP 10 Announced!
Old 24th January 2019
  #1
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DP 10 Announced!

No reason to not have its own thread, no predictions needed anymore!


NAMM 2019: MOTU Unveils Digital Performer 10

Digital Performer


I'm stoked, various forums have pointed out what is still missing, but with a list as long as end users throw out there, it's hardly anything new that not everyone's wish made it. A lot of little improvements I know will be really appreciated, the content browser etc. I'm actually glad they went with scalable GUIs over redesigning the whole interface, since it's highly unlikely that the various Themes I love would have made it over to the new GUI.

The list of features that didn't make it might be striking too soon. DP7 mostly improved the interface at first then had an update that added a ton of UX improvements. XML, MPE, etc. etc. could be added into an update like they added in NextGen to 9 and contextual menus to 7.

Anyway figured posting in the speculation thread made no sense anymore!

Last edited by machinesworking; 24th January 2019 at 11:39 PM..
Old 24th January 2019
  #2
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Oh and for those of you wondering why VST3 support is a good thing.
Quote:
Managing large plug-in sets and multiple virtual instruments on typical studio computer systems can often be difficult because of CPU performance limits. VST3 helps to improve overall performance by applying processing to plug-ins only when audio signals are present on their respective inputs. Instead of always processing input signals, VST3 plug-ins can apply their processing economically and only when it is needed.
This along with PreGen should be interesting to see how it tames spiking etc.
Even VST2 has improvements over AU in terms of instruments like Reaktor, MPC2, Maschine etc. vastly improved MIDI routing that DP does just fine. I've mostly used VST since it came out because of this

Full list of VST3 improvements here:
VST3 | Steinberg
Old 25th January 2019
  #3
Gear Head
 

Any advise on switching to VST3 from AU? One question I ave is, can an AU session, just be switched over to VST for better performance in the event all plug ins being used are VST 3 compatible.
Old 25th January 2019
  #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toodamnhip View Post
Any advise on switching to VST3 from AU? One question I ave is, can an AU session, just be switched over to VST for better performance in the event all plug ins being used are VST 3 compatible.
That's a difficult question. The answer is maybe. A lot of it depends on the convention the plug in developer uses for presets. If they use the generic components AU preset type then it's difficult. I know this from issues doing this with Kore back in the day. Certain VSTs used the DAWs built in preset management, which meant NI couldn't convert them to their own Kore format.

These days, NI use NKS, and anything using that format "should" be easily ported. Same with U-He and their own format for presets. Same with Ohm Force and any plug in that has it's own built in preset browser. The issue will come up with lessor known AU's that don't have their own preset banks. I think even ones saving in FXB (VST) format that use their own browser for presets are doing that even with AU's.

It's really a matter of setting up a dummy DP project with all scenarios and seeing how it goes though.

This also makes me realize what a dumb ass I've been while using Reaper, I just never think to use the VST3 version.
Old 25th January 2019
  #5
Gear Maniac
 

I like scalable UI and zoom in windows, but this looks more like version 9.5 update. Probably not enough for me to upgrade....
Old 25th January 2019
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chao View Post
I like scalable UI and zoom in windows, but this looks more like version 9.5 update. Probably not enough for me to upgrade....
To each their own for sure, but the complete overhaul of the Wave editor, VCA faders, stretch audio, Clips window, overhaul of the bowser, VST3 etc. is far from a simple update. Honestly I'm trying to think of a bigger release? 7 was cool but it was all UX improvements really.
Old 25th January 2019
  #7
Gear Head
 

Old 25th January 2019
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokeandShadow View Post
OMFG that typo! Someone is getting reamed when that gets found by the boss!
Old 25th January 2019
  #9
Gear Maniac
 

It's still there!

On the other hand, kudos to the MOTU team for all that is in DP10. I was pretty sure that 9.5 was going to be my last DP upgrade. Hopefully the development team will keep the momentum going.
Old 25th January 2019
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Controller 11 View Post
It's still there!

On the other hand, kudos to the MOTU team for all that is in DP10. I was pretty sure that 9.5 was going to be my last DP upgrade. Hopefully the development team will keep the momentum going.
Lol same here. I bought a Logic/Final Cut bundle last year for MPE support, and ended up buying and using Reaper instead. I really do like Reaper, but I'm super comfortable in DP, can't get rid of it. With all that's said about the GUI in Reaper tracks beyond 16 get tiny, and DP with all it's cluttered tiny interface issues etc. works really well with 24+ tracks in the Arrange. I'm buying this one out of the door, as soon as it's available.

I really wish they would team up with some control surface companies though, Ableton Live and the AKAI APC40s or Novation Launchpads looks nice, nicer than generic MIDI assignments to pads on a generic controller.
Old 26th January 2019
  #11
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
I'm buying this one out of the door, as soon as it's available.
Same here. I'm now checking the MOTU site hourly daily.

My aging eyes are most keenly interested in the new scalable GUI. And yes, the other new features as well.
Old 27th January 2019
  #12
Gear Head
 

I am look forward to the scalable UI and VST3 support. In addition to the other new features, IMHO, version 10 is the best DP update in years. Definitely, a pleasant surprise, since I was doubting whether or not MOTU was still committed to developing DP much further.

As a Windows user, I hope the stability has improved in version 10. It is not bad in version 9.5, but more platform specific bug fixes are welcome.
Old 27th January 2019
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TxH003 View Post
I am look forward to the scalable UI and VST3 support. In addition to the other new features, IMHO, version 10 is the best DP update in years. Definitely, a pleasant surprise, since I was doubting whether or not MOTU was still committed to developing DP much further.

As a Windows user, I hope the stability has improved in version 10. It is not bad in version 9.5, but more platform specific bug fixes are welcome.
I'm not on windows, but the performance meter has always indicated some significant spiking obviously coming from certain VSTs. VST3 is supposed to have better CPU management, so that will be one of the first things I'm testing, is whether certain projects of mine aren't remedied using VST3.
Old 28th January 2019
  #14
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emrr's Avatar
I'll be jumping from 8 to 10 pretty soon.....
Old 28th January 2019
  #15
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

it certainly looks like some great things coming in DP10, but I had forgotten how insanely difficult beat mapping (manually, using ADJUST BEATS) is...it's like medieval torture. Surely they must be joking...?
Old 28th January 2019
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
it certainly looks like some great things coming in DP10, but I had forgotten how insanely difficult beat mapping (manually, using ADJUST BEATS) is...it's like medieval torture. Surely they must be joking...?
Not sure what you mean by this? Are you talking about the old way, or the new way? 10 is doing it like Ableton Live etc. DP already can grab info from Apple Loops etc. to adjust beats, quantize etc.

Was about to post this video anyway, about 3:45 for the new stretch features..

Old 30th January 2019
  #17
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A hope I have for the new Clip Window etc. I'm sitting here with Push 2 and Live, which it of course works with, but it also works with Bitwig and Reaper.
I think the time spent coding in solid Push control surface support would come back to them in new users. Especially if they also supported AKAI's APC line and Novation Launchpads.
Old 30th January 2019
  #18
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
Not sure what you mean by this? Are you talking about the old way, or the new way? 10 is doing it like Ableton Live etc. DP already can grab info from Apple Loops etc. to adjust beats, quantize etc.

Was about to post this video anyway, about 3:45 for the new stretch features..

Cubase has had essentially automatic tempo mapping for years, with some adjustments for some content of course. Logic Pro X now has Smart Tempo. Will the new Stretch lane in DP 10 provide a similar tempo mapping functionality? The old way to beat map (tempo map) in DP was torturous as it was in Logic 8 and 9.
Old 30th January 2019
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Controller 11 View Post
Cubase has had essentially automatic tempo mapping for years, with some adjustments for some content of course. Logic Pro X now has Smart Tempo. Will the new Stretch lane in DP 10 provide a similar tempo mapping functionality? The old way to beat map (tempo map) in DP was torturous as it was in Logic 8 and 9.
The old way was closer to the types you mention though, stretch audio is more like Ableton Live than that. They say the old way is also improved. The old way worked fine on audio recorded in DP and with Apple Loops, REX files etc. I just didn't like it for audio that you don't know the tempo exactly of that wasn't recorded in DP and has no tempo map. Stretch looks to be more like that.
Old 30th January 2019
  #20
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
The old way was closer to the types you mention though, stretch audio is more like Ableton Live than that. They say the old way is also improved. The old way worked fine on audio recorded in DP and with Apple Loops, REX files etc. I just didn't like it for audio that you don't know the tempo exactly of that wasn't recorded in DP and has no tempo map. Stretch looks to be more like that.
I have alot of important 4 track cassette content that was transferred to digital. Most of it does have drums or some percussive element, but none have a tempo map. It will be interesting to see what Stretch can do.
Old 1st February 2019
  #21
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gradivus's Avatar
 

All of this and still no Trim pot on mixer channels of their "state-of-the-art mixer"?

Do I have to sacrifice my first born to get something so basic?

Ditto those requesting a VU meter we can hide and show on each channel along with Trim. These are basic things ffs.
Old 1st February 2019
  #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gradivus View Post
All of this and still no Trim pot on mixer channels of their "state-of-the-art mixer"?

Do I have to sacrifice my first born to get something so basic?

Ditto those requesting a VU meter we can hide and show on each channel along with Trim. These are basic things ffs.
I've never even thought of using a trim pot in a DAW for input gain.
My sound card covers that. RME has a full blown mixer for inputs. Same with MOTU's sound cards. Not a single DAW I use does that, and I'm ridiculous that way, DP, Logic, Reaper, Live, MPC etc. Just saying, it's not common for a DAW, not saying you're request is crazy etc.

Same with a VU meter, there's a numeric db meter on every track, and a regular fader meter. Don't know of a DAW with a VU meter as the default or even as customizable option? Cool idea though.
Old 1st February 2019
  #23
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gradivus's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
I've never even thought of using a trim pot in a DAW for input gain.
My sound card covers that. RME has a full blown mixer for inputs. Same with MOTU's sound cards. Not a single DAW I use does that, and I'm ridiculous that way, DP, Logic, Reaper, Live, MPC etc. Just saying, it's not common for a DAW, not saying you're request is crazy etc.

Same with a VU meter, there's a numeric db meter on every track, and a regular fader meter. Don't know of a DAW with a VU meter as the default or even as customizable option? Cool idea though.
Every analog console (even cheap crap) and nearly every other modern DAW gives the user an option to have trim on each channel in the mixer. This is for mixing, not for input gain when recording, which is what I assume you meant by the mixer software that comes with interfaces. I don't want to use a plug-in to mess with trim when I begin a mix. Several of us on here have been sending MOTU repeated requests over the years for a trim pot that can be toggled on and off (visibility) in the mixer. This should be a simple implementation and is much faster than messing with clip gain.

I've seen numerous people requesting VU meter in other threads over the years, particularly they want it for setting recording levels, because they're used to the reading on VU from analog consoles which is faster for them than reading the dB meters.
Old 1st February 2019
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gradivus View Post
Every analog console (even cheap crap) and nearly every other modern DAW gives the user an option to have trim on each channel in the mixer. This is for mixing, not for input gain when recording, which is what I assume you meant by the mixer software that comes with interfaces. I don't want to use a plug-in to mess with trim when I begin a mix. Several of us on here have been sending MOTU repeated requests over the years for a trim pot that can be toggled on and off (visibility) in the mixer. This should be a simple implementation and is much faster than messing with clip gain.
OK, I get what you want, essentially a Trim plug in knob on each track like we now have EQ and dynamics knob. When you say nearly every other DAW, I just find it curious that I've used and own five plus DAWs and not one that I know of includes the Trim plug in as a knob on the fader? Clip gain on an audio file isn't the same as trimming the db of an incoming signal.
It's a good request for sure, but it's obviously not as common of a feature as you think. Looking into it a bit, of course Reaper has an elaborate work around that allows you to have it, and Cubase does it.

Quote:
I've seen numerous people requesting VU meter in other threads over the years, particularly they want it for setting recording levels, because they're used to the reading on VU from analog consoles which is faster for them than reading the dB meters.
OK, but again, the only DAW I can think of that has VU meters instead of LED style faders is Harrison Mixbus. It's not exactly the type of request that merits the exaggerated anger and consternation that you're throwing out there.

I wanted MPE and multiple choices for audio export like Live and Reaper have, but I'm still really impressed with the amount of work that went into DP10 and think it's a no brainer to upgrade to it. I get being passionate about features you want, but I'm just not really understanding the hyperbole that's all.
Old 2nd February 2019
  #25
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Looks like the new instruments and loops are part of the library they created with UVI, they will be hosted in the UVI Player.
At 3:40 he talks about it.
Old 3rd February 2019
  #26
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3rdpath's Avatar
Well, it looks like DP10 is basically going to do many of the things I do in Live either standalone or via rewire. I tend to record music in DP with many tempo changes, it'll be nice to just keep the loops in DP and not toggle back and forth between programs. Since I have Kontakt (and have transferred almost all of my M5 libraries to Kontakt), their UVI bread and butter player won't be of much use to me. The included synth category seems to be a place where DP is really behind but maybe they'll put more R&D into that now that they've addressed some of DP's major shortfalls. Gonna be hard to catch up to Live because Ableton owns M4L and so many instruments are based on that open source.

Ableton owns the clips market with Bitwig running second so not sure how many DP customers will be excited by that. Who knows? Can't hurt I guess.

I like the Live browser window a lot so having that in DP will be great. Seems crazy to say that most of DP's enhancements will be useful because they mimic Live but hey, maybe that's a good thing. I use Live for my electronic stuff and DP for bands and scoring, so the more similar they are, the faster I can work.

Still need MPE. That's a biggie for me.
Old 3rd February 2019
  #27
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
OK, I get what you want, essentially a Trim plug in knob on each track like we now have EQ and dynamics knob. When you say nearly every other DAW, I just find it curious that I've used and own five plus DAWs and not one that I know of includes the Trim plug in as a knob on the fader? Clip gain on an audio file isn't the same as trimming the db of an incoming signal.
It's a good request for sure, but it's obviously not as common of a feature as you think. Looking into it a bit, of course Reaper has an elaborate work around that allows you to have it, and Cubase does it.

OK, but again, the only DAW I can think of that has VU meters instead of LED style faders is Harrison Mixbus. It's not exactly the type of request that merits the exaggerated anger and consternation that you're throwing out there.

I wanted MPE and multiple choices for audio export like Live and Reaper have, but I'm still really impressed with the amount of work that went into DP10 and think it's a no brainer to upgrade to it. I get being passionate about features you want, but I'm just not really understanding the hyperbole that's all.
I just use a Trim plug in, not a big deal, and if you need them on every track make a template....
Old 3rd February 2019
  #28
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3rdpath View Post
Well, it looks like DP10 is basically going to do many of the things I do in Live either standalone or via rewire. I tend to record music in DP with many tempo changes, it'll be nice to just keep the loops in DP and not toggle back and forth between programs. Since I have Kontakt (and have transferred almost all of my M5 libraries to Kontakt), their UVI bread and butter player won't be of much use to me. The included synth category seems to be a place where DP is really behind but maybe they'll put more R&D into that now that they've addressed some of DP's major shortfalls. Gonna be hard to catch up to Live because Ableton owns M4L and so many instruments are based on that open source.

Ableton owns the clips market with Bitwig running second so not sure how many DP customers will be excited by that. Who knows? Can't hurt I guess.

I like the Live browser window a lot so having that in DP will be great. Seems crazy to say that most of DP's enhancements will be useful because they mimic Live but hey, maybe that's a good thing. I use Live for my electronic stuff and DP for bands and scoring, so the more similar they are, the faster I can work.

Still need MPE. That's a biggie for me.
They still need render in place and NON REAL TIME FREEZE....and to straighten out their MULTI BOUNCE feature which could be a real killer no one else has but the way it works now is just plain weird...
Old 3rd February 2019
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
They still need render in place and NON REAL TIME FREEZE....and to straighten out their MULTI BOUNCE feature which could be a real killer no one else has but the way it works now is just plain weird...
Reaper's #1 feature IMO that's above the rest is the bounce options:
Bounce by track, master fader, or selections (so stems only say). Tag by name, date, project, time, tempo, etc. etc. and in any order you want.

As far as the trim plug in, it's really too bad that you can't substitute it for EQ or compression in the tracks, it would be nice to have the trim volume built in to the track and visible all the time etc. Honestly though with VCA faders its not as necessary, you can adjust volume automated tracks without opening up a trim plug in if you've got them grouped to a VCA fader.
Old 3rd February 2019
  #30
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oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
Reaper's #1 feature IMO that's above the rest is the bounce options:
Bounce by track, master fader, or selections (so stems only say). Tag by name, date, project, time, tempo, etc. etc. and in any order you want.

As far as the trim plug in, it's really too bad that you can't substitute it for EQ or compression in the tracks, it would be nice to have the trim volume built in to the track and visible all the time etc. Honestly though with VCA faders its not as necessary, you can adjust volume automated tracks without opening up a trim plug in if you've got them grouped to a VCA fader.
Since watching a couple of videos on mixing I noticed a few producers used a MIX BUSS fader. So everything in the session goes to that fader eventually. Then that fader feeds the main mix out. Easy to grab, acts as trim.
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