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DP 10 Announced!
Old 15th February 2019
  #61
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by loopy View Post
How is the scalable GUI working?
Are you on Windows or a Mac?

Thanks!
Jumping in here, the scalable GUI on MacOS works as advertised. What a visual relief!

Much more to dig into.
Old 16th February 2019
  #62
Quote:
Originally Posted by loopy View Post
How is the scalable GUI working?
Are you on Windows or a Mac?

Thanks!
You can simply use the shortcut that is used for many other programs on a Mac - Command + to Zoom in and Command - to Zoom out. All the DP windows open including smaller ones with only type change sizes. In my first 2 days with it it seems fast and easy.
Old 16th February 2019
  #63
Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
Stretch feature not working whatsoever here...
It did not work for me as well until I did a few things. I turned on the beat detection feature in DP preferences (its under background processing). Not sure if that is needed but its the first thing I did. Then the more mysterious thing - at least for me to find - was in the sequence window for audio tracks their is an upside down triangle to the right of the name of the track. I had to click on that for each track and select Stretch. When its selected it has a check mark by it. After doing that when I change the tempo of the song most everything moves to the correct place. I few hard to find beats were off which I moved manually - took a few extra minutes for those misbehaving tracks that could not be time locked. Worked great and saved me from re-tracking a bunch of vocals and drum tracks.

On this project I wanted a clean look and easy editing. So once the time change was done: For each audio track I duplicated the take in case I wanted to go back and did what DP calls Merge Audio. This consolidates each broken up track into one single track - basically a stem without any of the effects burnt in. I find these easier to work with rather than a complicated broken up looking time changed tracks - but thats me. It would work without that last step.
Old 16th February 2019
  #64
Lives for gear
 
oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioSoundzz View Post
It did not work for me as well until I did a few things. I turned on the beat detection feature in DP preferences (its under background processing). Not sure if that is needed but its the first thing I did. Then the more mysterious thing - at least for me to find - was in the sequence window for audio tracks their is an upside down triangle to the right of the name of the track. I had to click on that for each track and select Stretch. When its selected it has a check mark by it. After doing that when I change the tempo of the song most everything moves to the correct place. I few hard to find beats were off which I moved manually - took a few extra minutes for those misbehaving tracks that could not be time locked. Worked great and saved me from re-tracking a bunch of vocals and drum tracks.

On this project I wanted a clean look and easy editing. So once the time change was done: For each audio track I duplicated the take in case I wanted to go back and did what DP calls Merge Audio. This consolidates each broken up track into one single track - basically a stem without any of the effects burnt in. I find these easier to work with rather than a complicated broken up looking time changed tracks - but thats me. It would work without that last step.
I will experiment some more on a fresh session.

But there is ENABLE STRETCH button right there in the Tracks column. As SOON as I clicked that, the track was out of sync, and this was with a track that had been analyzed. So I turned it back off, and it was even wackier. I had to close the session and re open . Fortunately it was just a test session using one audio file that had already been tempo mapped manually (I believe in Pro Tools) so DP was following the imported tempo map, which normally it does just fine.

Will update, wrote MOTU and passed on what had happened.
Old 16th February 2019
  #65
Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
I will experiment some more on a fresh session.

But there is ENABLE STRETCH button right there in the Tracks column. As SOON as I clicked that, the track was out of sync, and this was with a track that had been analyzed. So I turned it back off, and it was even wackier. I had to close the session and re open . Fortunately it was just a test session using one audio file that had already been tempo mapped manually (I believe in Pro Tools) so DP was following the imported tempo map, which normally it does just fine.

Will update, wrote MOTU and passed on what had happened.
Does that have the letters "CSH" column heading in the tracks window? Those are all off in my case. I never touched those.
Old 16th February 2019
  #66
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
.... but every bus can introduce tiny amounts of latency,
Are you sure about that? How are you sure?
Old 16th February 2019
  #67
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by magicd View Post
I wrote a large part of the FAQ on tempo mapping. It's something I've used for a long time and with great success.

The basic concept is you identify typically downbeats in your music and drag sequence bar-lines to those points. That creates a tempo map and you can then further manipulate the tempo of the recorded music.

As with any technique there are tricks and shortcuts to getting the most out of the function. Feel free to hit me with specific questions.

Dave
ts really cool how a user can drag a bar line to a detected beat, and set DP to just snap to that beat. I wonder if any other program can do it so easily this way?
Old 16th February 2019
  #68
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by magicd View Post
I wrote a large part of the FAQ on tempo mapping. It's something I've used for a long time and with great success.

The basic concept is you identify typically downbeats in your music and drag sequence bar-lines to those points. That creates a tempo map and you can then further manipulate the tempo of the recorded music.

As with any technique there are tricks and shortcuts to getting the most out of the function. Feel free to hit me with specific questions.

Dave
I am wondering if you know of any downsides to changing future sequences to VST3? I have always used AU, but I hear it is even better with cpu efficiency among other things. Would you advise everyone switch over to VST3 now that DP supports it? Or are the things to be cautious of?
Old 16th February 2019
  #69
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by toodamnhip View Post
I am wondering if you know of any downsides to changing future sequences to VST3? I have always used AU, but I hear it is even better with cpu efficiency among other things. Would you advise everyone switch over to VST3 now that DP supports it? Or are the things to be cautious of?
I'm not MagicD but I can tell you what I know.

At least half of the VST3 capable plug ins on my system failed evaluation, so definitely there's still some work to do on the VST developers side.

VST3 did some things that make it really difficult for developers, this is why it's taken ten years to adopt it. U-He has issues with MIDI learn and VST3.

It's supposed to release all CPU back to the host a lot better than VST and AU, I stupidly tested that with Amplitube which isn't going to release CPU back to the host VST3 or not. I'll try again later.

You will still be using AU and VST2 for a couple years, Waves, NI, Nomad Factory, UVI, Plugin Allience, PSP, FXpansion, etc. etc. do not have VST3 out. Every IK plug in I own besides Amplitube fails evaluation in DP10.

And that's it, that's what I know about it.
Old 16th February 2019
  #70
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
I'm not MagicD but I can tell you what I know.

At least half of the VST3 capable plug ins on my system failed evaluation, so definitely there's still some work to do on the VST developers side.

VST3 did some things that make it really difficult for developers, this is why it's taken ten years to adopt it. U-He has issues with MIDI learn and VST3.

It's supposed to release all CPU back to the host a lot better than VST and AU, I stupidly tested that with Amplitube which isn't going to release CPU back to the host VST3 or not. I'll try again later.

You will still be using AU and VST2 for a couple years, Waves, NI, Nomad Factory, UVI, Plugin Allience, PSP, FXpansion, etc. etc. do not have VST3 out. Every IK plug in I own besides Amplitube fails evaluation in DP10.

And that's it, that's what I know about it.
I too tried to make VST3 plug ins set up. Got weird crashes where there was an indication of a crash, but DP 10 was still working. Like you said, many VST3s didn’t pass.
I did see Waves VST 2 options, as well as VST3 individual plug in where you’re saying such is not supported. Trying to pass the Waves VST 3 resulted in fails, so I am guessing they show in DPS plug ins window erroneously, as well as other plugs..

So my questions are:
1) Am I right to assume any VST 3s can and will need to be run ALONGSIDE AU’s and possibly VST 2s too. And DP can support all running together right?
2) Are there conflicts that come about from running VST 3, and AU in the same DAW, let alone on the same channel even?
3) Should the philosophy be that one uses as many VST 3s as possible, knowing each one used will lower CPU expenditures via its efficienty?
4) Does using VST 2’s over AUs create any advantages? I saw WAVES VST 2 kernel plug ins.

Thanks in advance..
Old 16th February 2019
  #71
Lives for gear
 
oceantracks's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by toodamnhip View Post
ts really cool how a user can drag a bar line to a detected beat, and set DP to just snap to that beat. I wonder if any other program can do it so easily this way?
Cubase does this quite easily..
Old 16th February 2019
  #72
Lives for gear
 
loopy's Avatar
 

Thank you Controller 11 and AudioSoundzz.. Appreciate it!
Old 16th February 2019
  #73
Lives for gear
 
davey boy's Avatar
 

Can DP 9 open DP 10 sessions or can you “save as” to an earlier version of DP Incase you’re collaborating with someone who hasn’t upgraded yet?
Old 17th February 2019
  #74
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by toodamnhip View Post
I too tried to make VST3 plug ins set up. Got weird crashes where there was an indication of a crash, but DP 10 was still working. Like you said, many VST3s didn’t pass.
I did see Waves VST 2 options, as well as VST3 individual plug in where you’re saying such is not supported. Trying to pass the Waves VST 3 resulted in fails, so I am guessing they show in DPS plug ins window erroneously, as well as other plugs..

So my questions are:
1) Am I right to assume any VST 3s can and will need to be run ALONGSIDE AU’s and possibly VST 2s too. And DP can support all running together right?
2) Are there conflicts that come about from running VST 3, and AU in the same DAW, let alone on the same channel even?
3) Should the philosophy be that one uses as many VST 3s as possible, knowing each one used will lower CPU expenditures via its efficienty?
4) Does using VST 2’s over AUs create any advantages? I saw WAVES VST 2 kernel plug ins.

Thanks in advance..
Yeah sorry, I missed that since every VST3 Waves plug in fails evaluation.

VST3's can exist alongside AU's and other VST2 plug ins, shouldn't be an issue.

As far as VST3's being better PCU wise, the jury is out. Personally I'm going to investigate it as much as I can in the next couple days.

VST2 instruments can send MIDI to the host, to other plug ins. AU cannot. This is useful for plug ins like drum machines and Reaktor instruments etc. Say you have a drum sound in a Kontakt instrument, you can send a MIDI note to that kontakt instrument to trigger that sound from a sequencer in Maschine, MPC, Reaktor etc.

It's also arguable that most VST's might be more stable than AU. AU was supposed to prevent instability on OSX with cross platform VST plug ins messing up things on OS9 all the time. Problem is developers don't necessarily make the AU GUI themselves, FXPansion make a wrapper, at the very least that wrapper over the course of 20 plug ins is going to cost CPU compared to a VST. I don't see much of a difference, and use both.
Old 17th February 2019
  #75
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by davey boy View Post
Can DP 9 open DP 10 sessions or can you “save as” to an earlier version of DP Incase you’re collaborating with someone who hasn’t upgraded yet?
Yes!
Old 17th February 2019
  #76
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by oceantracks View Post
I will experiment some more on a fresh session.

But there is ENABLE STRETCH button right there in the Tracks column. As SOON as I clicked that, the track was out of sync, and this was with a track that had been analyzed. So I turned it back off, and it was even wackier. I had to close the session and re open . Fortunately it was just a test session using one audio file that had already been tempo mapped manually (I believe in Pro Tools) so DP was following the imported tempo map, which normally it does just fine.

Will update, wrote MOTU and passed on what had happened.
I'm getting even deeper problems with an Apple Loop. I'll probably call them on Tuesday just to find out what the deal is... Downloaded the new Loops that come with DP10 to test with audio that should do this seamlessly.
Old 17th February 2019
  #77
Lives for gear
So after importing the loop from MOTU's loop partner everything is working..
Well except for some interface bugs. 5 day old software type stuff..
Old 17th February 2019
  #78
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musicman691's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post

You will still be using AU and VST2 for a couple years, Waves, NI, Nomad Factory, UVI, Plugin Allience, PSP, FXpansion, etc. etc. do not have VST3 out. Every IK plug in I own besides Amplitube fails evaluation in DP10.

And that's it, that's what I know about it.
Beg to differ on this:
Waves, IKMM, PSP and Plugin Alliance all have vst3.
Add to that Arturia, Fabfilter, Izotope, EW Play engine, Blue Cat, Vengeance Avenger and Vienna.


This is just stuff I have on my system - there may be others.
Old 17th February 2019
  #79
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
Beg to differ on this:
Waves, IKMM, PSP and Plugin Alliance all have vst3.
Add to that Arturia, Fabfilter, Izotope, EW Play engine, Blue Cat, Vengeance Avenger and Vienna.


This is just stuff I have on my system - there may be others.
Waves, IK (except Amplitube 4), PSP all fail evaluation here. I see only Vintage Warmer as VST3 here. When you said PSP was VST3 I got all excited, N2O has a tiny interface, and was hoping... Never ponied up for the new Play Engine, mine's still just VST2, I only own VEP from Vienna, still VST2 only. The Plug in Alliance I own is only VST2... Every U-He fails...

Fabfilter and iZotope get props for passing evaluation with no issues here.

The only outright failures in every category are Hybrid and Xpand..
Old 17th February 2019
  #80
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musicman691's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
Waves, IK (except Amplitube 4), PSP all fail evaluation here. I see only Vintage Warmer as VST3 here. When you said PSP was VST3 I got all excited, N2O has a tiny interface, and was hoping... Never ponied up for the new Play Engine, mine's still just VST2, I only own VEP from Vienna, still VST2 only. The Plug in Alliance I own is only VST2... Every U-He fails...

Fabfilter and iZotope get props for passing evaluation with no issues here.

The only outright failures in every category are Hybrid and Xpand..
Have you updated your Plugin Alliance stuff lately? They've been vst3 for a while now. The small interface in N2O has nothing to do with vst3. Again - are you running the latest versions of your PSP plugins?

Then again from what I'm seeing with DP10 is a bunch of bugs that should have been caught in beta test. You know my past history with DP and was hoping there was something that would make me part with the $195 upgrade and so far there is nothing. I'd sooner pony up the extra $104 and upgrade ProTools considering they way DP10 is working (or is not) for people.
Old 17th February 2019
  #81
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
Have you updated your Plugin Alliance stuff lately? They've been vst3 for a while now. The small interface in N2O has nothing to do with vst3. Again - are you running the latest versions of your PSP plugins?
VST3 plug ins are supposes to have built in resizing, Plug in Alliance being an alliance means we probably own different things. The only VST 3 I see in PSP's downloads is Vintage Warmer, I own most of their compressors etc.

Quote:
Then again from what I'm seeing with DP10 is a bunch of bugs that should have been caught in beta test. You know my past history with DP and was hoping there was something that would make me part with the $195 upgrade and so far there is nothing. I'd sooner pony up the extra $104 and upgrade ProTools considering they way DP10 is working (or is not) for people.
Whatever works for you. DP10 is doing OK for a .0 release really. Personally I'm really into all the new features. Hopefully an update fixes the quirks, none of them are game changing to me.
Old 18th February 2019
  #82
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musicman691's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by machinesworking View Post
VST3 plug ins are supposes to have built in resizing, Plug in Alliance being an alliance means we probably own different things. The only VST 3 I see in PSP's downloads is Vintage Warmer, I own most of their compressors etc.


Whatever works for you. DP10 is doing OK for a .0 release really. Personally I'm really into all the new features. Hopefully an update fixes the quirks, none of them are game changing to me.
I have 40+ Plugin Alliance plugins and all of them have vst3 versions. I'm sure we have a number of plugs in common from them.

As far as PSP I have VW 1 and 2, L'Otary, Scanner and a couple of others and they all have vst3 versions.

If you consider what's going on with the issues with DP10 okay then I don't know what to say except if my livelihood depended on it I would NOT update to it. How the issues that people are having escaped beta release is beyond me. But if you like working with mediocre s/w then be my guest.
Old 18th February 2019
  #83
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
I have 40+ Plugin Alliance plugins and all of them have vst3 versions. I'm sure we have a number of plugs in common from them.

As far as PSP I have VW 1 and 2, L'Otary, Scanner and a couple of others and they all have vst3 versions.

If you consider what's going on with the issues with DP10 okay then I don't know what to say except if my livelihood depended on it I would NOT update to it. How the issues that people are having escaped beta release is beyond me. But if you like working with mediocre s/w then be my guest.
Oh surprise here comes the Reindeer raining only negative things to say about DP. Are you a paid troll or what? We get it - your angry. Constructive criticism is all fine, but saying DP is mediocre - that is simply bs. I don't like Logic for a lot of reason but it's not awful software or mediocre. It simply is not my cup of tea. The new DP upgrade 10 has some cool stretch features which so far are working fine for me. Do I really need that - not at all. I needed it for 1 song and it saved my behind. Am I staying with 10 and buying it now? - probably not as the new features are not what I need. Others may love the new features. We do get it - you hate DP. So what? Why do you even bother visiting this thread? I use it almost every day and it works just fine. It's not perfect like any other software. You went on and on about wanting windows that would resize and now they have it. The version 9 zoom feature works fine for me with my monitors. I could care less about that feature. Everyone has different perspectives.

Last edited by AudioSoundzz; 22nd February 2019 at 12:23 PM.. Reason: spelling fix
Old 18th February 2019
  #84
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicman691 View Post
I have 40+ Plugin Alliance plugins and all of them have vst3 versions. I'm sure we have a number of plugs in common from them.

As far as PSP I have VW 1 and 2, L'Otary, Scanner and a couple of others and they all have vst3 versions.
I only have a few Pugin Alliance plug ins and all the VST3 versions fail evaluation in DP10. I'm not blaming MOTU for that, a lot of plug ins are poorly written for VST3, it's a PITA of a plug in format to support for developers, just look at anything FXpansion and U-He have said about it. FXpansion are stating they will not support it until certain things have changed, U-He doesn't support MIDI learn in VST3 until things change on Steinberg's part. NI still don't support it, that's your biggest clue it has issues. I'm all for VST3, but it's still not truly ready for prime time.


Quote:
If you consider what's going on with the issues with DP10 okay then I don't know what to say except if my livelihood depended on it I would NOT update to it. How the issues that people are having escaped beta release is beyond me. But if you like working with mediocre s/w then be my guest.
You're sure blowing things way out of proportion, not surprising since you've spent nearly every post in this forum bashing on DP. I'm not making that up, you literally never have anything good to say about it. I'm enjoying the release, and you like AudioSoundzz mentioned haven't even given much credit to what DP10 did add that you were wanting.GUI resizing, VCA faders, and a fader on the Clips. All things you wanted, but nope, just this tirade about the stability of a .0 release. You're obviously never going to be happy with DP, that's not even up for debate. So the real question is when are you going to sell your copy and get over it?

I ranted and raved on the Ableton forums for years because for me Live isn't enough and I've always had to use a regular DAW along with it. Thing is there are plenty of people using Live who love it, have no real complaints etc. This may come as a surprise to you but that's true of DP as well.

What are you hoping to accomplish here? I think it's obvious no one from MOTU reading your posts is going to want to post here. Is that what you want? for other users to hate DP as much as you do? I truly do not get what you're trying to accomplish here?
Old 18th February 2019
  #85
Gear Maniac
 

I'd like to see is this GS DP forum become a vibrant alternative to the other forum.
Old 18th February 2019
  #86
Quote:
Originally Posted by Controller 11 View Post
I'd like to see is this GS DP forum become a vibrant alternative to the other forum.
Yes if it were not for the couple of tolls this could be a very good source of information. Motu has emailed me personally about some software issue I had posted in GS so they seem to be paying attention. I have my own personal wish list which I would go into if not for certain people attacking Motu's credibility as a company. Really, people who run that course are the ones with no credibility. Companies have real people with feelings running them. MOTU works hard to have great products just like all the other DAW companies. The kind of dysfunctional angry attacking that goes on in GS is the reason lots of professions have given up even looking at it. I am one of those that hardly even bothers any more. Some of the trolls that visit the GS forums have already been booted off other forums. GS is way too lenient.
Old 19th February 2019
  #87
Gear Addict
 

Upgraded to DP10 this week. Installed perfectly. Opens old files fine.

Just starting to check out the new features.

Because I do make my living with the software I kept a copy of DP9 on the drive. So far I haven't needed to go back.

Dave
Old 19th February 2019
  #88
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by magicd View Post
Upgraded to DP10 this week. Installed perfectly. Opens old files fine.

Just starting to check out the new features.

Because I do make my living with the software I kept a copy of DP9 on the drive. So far I haven't needed to go back.

Dave
Hello Dave

No issue with DP10 running across DP9 ? I want to demo DP10 but need DP9 to not be corrupted by upgrade installer...

Is there now a spectral editor ? since they add spectral view in DP9 I suppose the goal is to have edition one day...

Best
Zam
Old 19th February 2019
  #89
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zamproject View Post
Hello Dave

No issue with DP10 running across DP9 ? I want to demo DP10 but need DP9 to not be corrupted by upgrade installer...

Is there now a spectral editor ? since they add spectral view in DP9 I suppose the goal is to have edition one day...

Best
Zam
Zam,

I am not the last word on anything! Please take my words with the appropriate grains of salt.

DP9 still launches ok on my computer. I haven't noticed anything different in DP9 since I installed 10. I did notice that a file I created in 10 would not open in 9. So the safe thing to do is if you open a DP9 project in 10, immediately Save As and make a new version of the file. The old version will remain intact as a DP9 file.

Dave

PS, You can view audio in a spectrogram view. As far as I can tell you can not do any editing in this view that will change the spectrogram. AFAIK, to change the spectrogram an edit has to be printed to the audio.

Last edited by magicd; 19th February 2019 at 03:03 PM..
Old 19th February 2019
  #90
Gear Addict
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by magicd View Post
Zam,

I am not the last word on anything! Please take my words with the appropriate grains of salt.

DP9 still launches ok on my computer. I haven't noticed anything different in DP9 since I installed 10. I did notice that a file I created in 10 would not open in 9. So the safe thing to do is if you open a DP9 project in 10, immediately Save As and make a new version of the file. The old version will remain intact as a DP9 file.

Dave

PS, You can view audio in a spectrogram view. As far as I can tell you can not do any editing in this view that will change the spectrogram. AFAIK, to change the spectrogram an edit has to be printed to the audio.
Hey

Ok, I'll see, anyway I always work on a copy of the whole project files in this kind of upgrade.

For sure a spectrogram editing is destructive and need to be made at the soundfile, still my guess is that if they put effort in an algorithm to visualise audio in a spectrogram manner, editing should be on the agenda...and will be great !!!

Best
Zam
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