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Behringer Eurorack Modular Modular Synthesizers
Old 2 weeks ago
  #571
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Sorry if I offended you with my inferior intellect. This was my first post, and your response wasn't exactly: welcome to the community. It would have been more useful if you would have given an example of what you think is wrong with my post - instead of saying that almost everything is wrong. The problem is that you gave my post the worst possible interpretation. I didn't say that these synths are the best ever made - like that's an objective fact for every person; like you should agree with me. I was talking from my personal preference, my aesthetic choice, and my subjective truth, and when you talk about what you like, you can never be wrong. It's only when you talk about what others should like that you become wrong. I was also trying to complement Uli because he deserves it. What you said sounds like you also think Uli is a moron because he picked the mini d. He deserves better than that, and so do I.

Here is what I think was wrong with my post. Uli is looking for our single module preferences, and I didn't give him that because I trust in his ability to make good choices, and because I'm more interested in a new version of the ARP and EMS. You don't need to be interested in that - by the way. It's just what I want.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #572
Gear Addict
 
Uli Behringer's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by LucidDreamStudio View Post
Hi Uli,
It might help if we look at this from the East Coast and West Coast approaches, and ask what is the very best synthesizer from each. I am not saying this is an objective fact; it's just my subjective opinion that the Minimoog D was the best old-school East Coast monophonic lead synthesizer ever made. For me, you could not have made a better choice. Eurorack strikes me as more of a West Coast philosophy, so the Mini d is great for getting East Coast artists interested in eurorack.

What was the best West Coast synthesizer? For me that's the EMS VCS3. Although I would love to have this and the ARP 2600 as full-size exact clones, separate eurorack modules would be a no-brainer purchase for me.

Thanks you for everything you are doing.

John Chiappone
Hello John,

Thank you for your comment and welcome. I appreciate your input.

Uli
Old 2 weeks ago
  #573
My criticism had absolutely nothing to do with personal preference, or even my interpretation of your post.
Your post was full of wrong 'facts'.
All this stuff about me thinking Uli is a moron because he picked the 'mini-d'

That's completely wrong and actually nothing to do with what I posted.
Like I said, it would take me a long time to explain 'east coast' and 'west coast' synthesis properly, which is why I didn't bother to elaborate on my post.


Quote:
Originally Posted by LucidDreamStudio View Post
Eurorack strikes me as more of a West Coast philosophy, so the Mini d is great for getting East Coast artists interested in eurorack.
Firstly, Eurorack was an format invented by Dieter Doepfer in the mid-1990's. the whole first series of modules he produced were based on subtractive synthesis (East Coast as you want to call it). His first oscillators and filters were of that Moog style philosophy. For about the first ten years of Eurorack it was largely based in subtractive synthesis, nothing to do with Buchla or Serge (what you would call West Coast).
Over the last ten to fifteen years or so, more and more Buchla and Serge influenced designs have crept into Eurorack, but overall most modules are still based on subtractive synthesis. Eurorack has never had 'more a 'West Coast philosophy'. Which makes me think you don't know what a West Coast Philosophy is.
Secondly, apart from all the other subtractive (East Coast) modules that are available in Eurorack, AJH have comprehensively covered the classic Moog sound with their modules, plus Moog themselves have released the Mother 32 and DFAM systems which work in a Eurorack environment.
So how you think Behringer needs to do something to attract 'East Coast artists to Eurorack' is completely beyond me. Eurorack started as 'East Coast' and is still predominantly that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by LucidDreamStudio View Post
What was the best West Coast synthesizer? For me that's the EMS VCS3.

John Chiappone
Err no, it is not even a 'West Coast' synthesiser, let alone 'the best'.
It is a subtractive synthesiser, albeit a different design to Moog. But it's oscillators being shaped by a filter (Subtractive).
Classic West Coast synthesisers are essentially only Buchla or Serge. Many new instruments have joined the West Coast philosophy in recent years, but not EMS.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #574
Lives for gear
 

Things I’d love to see in Eurorack format that don’t currently exist:

1) Quad or even octo versions of classic oscillators and filters with a single set of controls, for facilitating modular polysynth construction. We’re starting to see more quad modules in development and even a few octo ones but at the moment you’re limited to one or two generic choices of each unit type; I’d love for instance to be able to build a four- or eight-voice polysynth with ARP or Roland filters (or better still to have a quad or octo version of each!)

2) A real analog divide-down string synth.

3) A reasonably small and not insanely expensive sample playback system with per-key assignment, round-robin multisamples, and as much memory and as many voices of polyphony as possible. This would be useful for everything from percussion to loading (for instance) Mellotron samples to be processed through the rest of the modular system to being able to play bread and butter piano/EP sounds without having to bring a separate laptop for those (I’d love to be able to split a controller keyboard and play a sampled piano/Rhodes with my left hand and an analog monosynth with my right, all from the same Eurorack setup. )
Old 2 weeks ago
  #575
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Coorec's Avatar
I hope Music group starts to ramp up their Eurorack know how by making clones of the classics.

Classic Roland and Moog modular systems are the obvious choices.

Cant wait
Old 2 weeks ago
  #576
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimS View Post
Things I’d love to see in Eurorack format that don’t currently exist:

1) Quad or even octo versions of classic oscillators and filters with a single set of controls, for facilitating modular polysynth construction. We’re starting to see more quad modules in development and even a few octo ones but at the moment you’re limited to one or two generic choices of each unit type; I’d love for instance to be able to build a four- or eight-voice polysynth with ARP or Roland filters (or better still to have a quad or octo version of each!)
FYI Doepfer have just released a "polyphonic" subsystem. (4 voices per module)
Oscillator based on their A-111-2, and filters with SSM2044.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #577
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptil View Post
FYI Doepfer have just released a "polyphonic" subsystem. (4 voices per module)
Oscillator based on their A-111-2, and filters with SSM2044.
True, but then you’re stuck with their predesigned system (which is probably great but doesn’t give you any real choice in building your system which is a large part of the fun of Eurorack.) Imagine if Behringer released polyphonic versions of all the oscillators and filters from their current and upcoming synths (or at least the most popular ones) - you’d be able to build a polysynth with your favorite pieces from some of the greatest synth circuits in history!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #578
This is getting so far away from the whole philosophy of modular.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #579
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
This is getting so far away from the whole philosophy of modular.
The 500 series has also expanded far beyond what API had originally envisioned. Nobody’s forcing anybody to use modules that they don’t like so I fail to see what the problem is.

There are already polyphonic modules available as well as sampler systems of varying degrees of complexity; I’m merely suggesting that Behringer get into the game as the options in those areas are still quite limited and they could make a big impact both by expanding the options available for polysynth construction and by making a better and more usable sampler module for triggering keyboards sounds as opposed to drum hits.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #580
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimS View Post
The 500 series has also expanded far beyond what API had originally envisioned. Nobody’s forcing anybody to use modules that they don’t like so I fail to see what the problem is.
Yeah.....
It's like making an Api 500 lunchbox a complete mixing console, with fader modules, fx return modules, vu meter modules, stereo buss modules and group tracks modules.
What I'm saying is it's probably easier just to buy a mixing desk, not make it out of individual 500 series modules.
I don't personally get this need to make 'classic polyphonic synths' in Eurorack modules. Two different things. Play to the strengths of modular, not try and make it fit another form and function.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #581
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Derp's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Yeah.....
It's like making an Api 500 lunchbox a complete mixing console, with fader modules, fx return modules, vu meter modules, stereo buss modules and group tracks modules.
What I'm saying is it's probably easier just to buy a mixing desk, not make it out of individual 500 series modules.
I don't personally get this need to make 'classic polyphonic synths' in Eurorack modules. Two different things. Play to the strengths of modular, not try and make it fit another form and function.
Agree on so many levels. Even Behringer-priced polyphonic modules would make for an expensive polysynth that would take a lot of work to patch and program for every sound you use it for. Play to the modular's strengths. If you want a classic-sounding polysynth, go buy one. Monophonic versions of classic voices I'm all for, but polyphonic versions just because? Not to mention, they just wouldn't sell well.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #582
Lives for gear
 

Doepfer (as in the guys who created the Eurorack format) are making polyphonic modules, so clearly they don’t think it’s against the philosophy of modular. There are numerous threads on various forums about building a polyphonic modular so there certainly seems to be demand, and a handful of other manufacturers besides Doepfer are making poly modules so I’m not the only one who sees it. As far as cost is concerned Doepfer’s poly modules aren’t much more expensive than their mono equivalents.

You’re right that patching could be a bit of a pain, which is why Doepfer is building their quad modules so that they can be normalized via ribbon cable; there’s no reason why Behringer couldn’t follow suit (ideally with the same format so as to standardize quad normalization connections between manufacturers.) Once you’ve got the most common connections normalized “under the hood” you’ve solved much of the clutter problem; if the format takes off I could also see somebody developing a module with multiple ribbon inputs and outputs to allow for more complex source/destination routing of poly signals under the panels. Beyond that if you want to do something really crazy with a polyphonic modular you’re going to have to accept the inconveniences that come with that. But the more practical approach in most cases would be to think of it as a standard non-modular polysynth that can also be patched as a fully modular mono/duo synth. And with a few more mono control modules you can make it either a modular monosynth with a non-modular three-voice poly, or two independent modular monos/duos. So you could play a mono lead and bass simultaneously, or play one of those along with three-note polysynth chords.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #583
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoardsOfBurnley View Post
A vocoder module based on the circuits from your vp330 clone would be pretty mint
having heard the VC340, I'm 100% on board with this idea.
Old 1 week ago
  #584
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Coorec's Avatar
Looking forward to the System 100 modules. Be carefull to nail the envelopes. Thats the crucial part there.

I would suggest to go for Moog modules next. Especially oscillators 901 and 921 are unobtainium in eurorack.
Old 1 week ago
  #585
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BTByrd's Avatar
I'm looking forward to the Behringer Eurorack Eurorack Mixer.

Kinda joking, but I'd like to see someone make a mixing solution that allows people with lots of modular effects and processors can run sends and returns in the modular environment itself. I know they exist, but many of the existing options are clunky, noisy, or too expensive. I don't know how profitable it would be, but it's something in the format that needs development.
Old 1 week ago
  #586
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babsbosney's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Err no, it is not even a 'West Coast' synthesiser , EMS.
its currently built in west cornwall , south west uk so i think maybe thats where the confusion lies ? yeah thats totally tripped out i know but geographically speaking its west coast , just not usa west coast
Old 1 week ago
  #587
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Derp's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BTByrd View Post
I'm looking forward to the Behringer Eurorack Eurorack Mixer.

Kinda joking, but I'd like to see someone make a mixing solution that allows people with lots of modular effects and processors can run sends and returns in the modular environment itself. I know they exist, but many of the existing options are clunky, noisy, or too expensive. I don't know how profitable it would be, but it's something in the format that needs development.
This I agree with x1,000. Something like a Blue Lantern BMX, but that doesn't sound like poopies.
Old 1 week ago
  #588
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Yeah.....
It's like making an Api 500 lunchbox a complete mixing console, with fader modules, fx return modules, vu meter modules, stereo buss modules and group tracks modules.
Actually you can do this, either in a Lunchbox or a dedicated console like the Tree Audio 500 console.
Plenty of high end manufacturers are offering such solutions.

Maybe that's for people who can't afford a high end mixing desk and just need a few channels. I don't know anybody who can afford such a desk.
Old 1 week ago
  #589
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subdo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summer Of Nebula View Post
...I don't know anybody who can afford such a desk.
That was pretty much the point, although defo an exaggeration. 500 series modules come with an even higher rack tax than eurorack. Bento boxes being the cheapest I know about and still come in at $300 for 6 slots. Not many people would be willing to use one on a utility like an aux send module that could (re)create a console.

I do think developing polyphonic modules could pave the way for easier implementations in euro. That's clearly what the new 4 voice deopfers are about. But I still think there are some serious challenges. Most euro sequencers are not poly friendly the way most of us think of it working in a DAW or similar. And anything more than a single VCO per voice would just be agonizing on the tuning front. That's before considering all the cables that would have to go into the whole EG/VCF/VCA chain.
Old 1 week ago
  #590
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A bigger, less expensive, version of WMD's Performance Mixer would be dandy. Just make one that's 84hp wide, with the same degree of quality and pro-mixer meets CV features, and not make it cost $2500 or something. Mixers are SO well understood, ANY big company who makes quality mixers already ought to be able to knock it out of the park so easily. Short of digital mixers, almost nothing new has happened in Mixer-World for decades. We (humans) could make amazing analog mixers 50yrs ago. Now just make them euro and less expensive.
Old 1 week ago
  #591
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by subdo View Post
Not many people would be willing to use one on a utility like an aux send module that could (re)create a console.
Sure. But for somebody who wants high end sound in mixing and can't afford SSL, Neve, Harrison, API, then that's a much cheaper way.

I added a third Happy Nerding Panmix Jr, put them side by side and it feels like a mini console now =) Also looking forward to the new Roland 531!
Old 1 week ago
  #592
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void23's Avatar
Give me 6 channels of a old school VLZ knockoff in Eurorack form with a couple of aux sends and you'd have something.
Old 1 week ago
  #593
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I like those PanMix modules.

And I agree, stuff a VLZ 1604 into 84hp with CV Pan per channel and I'd be delighted.
Old 1 week ago
  #594
Quote:
Originally Posted by babsbosney View Post
its currently built in west cornwall , south west uk so i think maybe thats where the confusion lies ? yeah thats totally tripped out i know but geographically speaking its west coast , just not usa west coast
The phrase 'West Coast' was coined to describe a philosophy most associated with Serge and Buchla. The location was really just a convenient tag. No one calls Sequential Circuits 'West Coast' in terms of synthesis philosophy.
Old 1 week ago
  #595
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subdo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Summer Of Nebula View Post
Sure. But for somebody who wants high end sound in mixing and can't afford SSL, Neve, Harrison, API, then that's a much cheaper way.

I added a third Happy Nerding Panmix Jr, put them side by side and it feels like a mini console now =) Also looking forward to the new Roland 531!
I'm not saying anything bad about 500 series. My Neve 551s are in the cold dead hands category.
Old 3 days ago
  #596
Gear Maniac
Just want to chime in and say I would really love a keyboard controller that is also a Eurorack case. Something like the Waldorf KB37 but without the $1000 price tag. You could make two and three octave versions and I think you'd sell a bunch if the price was reasonable enough. I'm sure lots of D and Neutron owners would love something like this, as well as everyone else who wants to incorporate a keyboard into their Eurorack setup.
Please and thank you
Old 3 days ago
  #597
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void23's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jurfin View Post
Just want to chime in and say I would really love a keyboard controller that is also a Eurorack case. Something like the Waldorf KB37 but without the $1000 price tag. You could make two and three octave versions and I think you'd sell a bunch if the price was reasonable enough. I'm sure lots of D and Neutron owners would love something like this, as well as everyone else who wants to incorporate a keyboard into their Eurorack setup.
Please and thank you
@jurfin, I haven't had a keyboard (Keystep Pro) hooked up to my system in over a year, and I rarely even use the BSP now. A eurorack keyboard controller still harkens back to that, I'm going to build a single subtractive voice mentality. If that's one's goal, then eurorack is not the right platform for them.
Old 3 days ago
  #598
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by void23 View Post
@jurfin, I haven't had a keyboard (Keystep Pro) hooked up to my system in over a year, and I rarely even use the BSP now. A eurorack keyboard controller still harkens back to that, I'm going to build a single subtractive voice mentality. If that's one's goal, then eurorack is not the right platform for them.
I understand where you're coming from, but isn't the idea with Eurorack to build the synth that YOU want? If that happens to be a simple subtractive synth for your sweet bluez licks or whatever, then power to you. As far as I'm concerned at least

Also, does having a keyboard attached really limit what kind of modules you put in the thing? I don't know...

Either way, its something I would like and would almost certainly buy.

PS - Any interest in selling that Keystep? Might be willing to take it off your hands for you.
Old 3 days ago
  #599
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void23's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jurfin View Post
I understand where you're coming from, but isn't the idea with Eurorack to build the synth that YOU want?
Touche', that's my line That said, when I first started I was really tempted to get one of those Waldorf controllers. I got a Mantis instead and used the Keystep until I got into my second row and added my first sequencer / quantizer combo. Euro really starts to get fun when you start letting it play itself, or sequencing the sequencers. Look at my racks in my sig and you'll see what I mean.
Old 2 days ago
  #600
Here for the gear
 

So excited for this. There are so many barriers to entry for eurorack if you're not rolling in it, thanks for making this more accessible. I'm sure someone above me has asked but when might things be available?
Quantisers always seem overpriced to me. If you could do an affordable quantiser that we can use custom .scl files with that'd be awesome.
Polyphonic midi to cv? Even a little poly synth in eurorack form? (or a semimodular deepmind?) Euroracked buchla modules? Would love an affordable way to run puredata patches in a module but not sure that's behringer's style.
Attenuverters, attenuators, amplifiers and offseters?
Everything up on modular grid so far looks brilliant

OH AND YOUR (TC's) JUNO CHORUS PLEASE!!!!
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