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Behringer Eurorack Modular Modular Synthesizers
Old 16th April 2018
  #331
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by dysonant View Post
If you are going by quantity of responses, maybe, but definitely not quality.
I was referring to the "locked" status of the thread. Discussion of the topic was shut down.
Old 16th April 2018
  #332
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Since I've been into modular from the mid-90's....and over time I've ended up buying more of the niche modules from one person module makers, I care about it.
To see all these people who have never used modular cheering behringer on....well that's ok I guess, but it's also ok for me to voice my concern.
Absolutely, and you are likely posting in that clusterf*ck of a thread in muffwiggler too. But thats not what this thread is about. Why dont you just answer “Id like you to produce no eurorack” and move on?

Maybe the folks cheering it on cant afford modular as it is and hope behringer will produce more interesting modules at a price normally reserved for DIY or passive utilies...or like me, just want a big case
Old 16th April 2018
  #333
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the_soulcatcher's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uli Behringer View Post
We want to collaborate with you

Since I opened this thread a few days ago, I have been approached by some of you and asked if we would consider to manufacture their design in return for a potential design fee.

I think this is a great idea and I truly believe in this vision. It will allow many of you who do not have the funds or experience to enter the market with your designs.

So, if you are a creative designer/developer/small company, we would like to invite you to collaborate with us for us to build modules together.

What does that mean?

You present is with your design (you need to have at least a working prototype) and perhaps show us a video etc. so we can understand your concept.

Provided you are OK with it, we could then post the video here and if there is enough interest, we would consider manufacturing and distributing the product for you. In return we would allow you to get a percentage of the revenue.

At the same time we would be featuring you and your designs so you get the well deserved exposure.

In short, we are willing to share our complete manufacturing, supply chain and marketing power with you, while you can focus on designing great modules. Of course we are more than happy to sign an NDA (Non-Disclosure Agreement) so you are protected.

What do you think?

Uli
Not sure if this forum is the best place for B2B related stuff.
Old 16th April 2018
  #334
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Uli Behringer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevH View Post
I've already posted some detailed ideas on this thread. I would love to share another project proposal I've developed. How do I get in contact? Thanks.
Hi TrevH,

just drop me a PM and we can take it from there.

Uli
Old 16th April 2018
  #335
Gear Maniac
 

I would like to see tight colab with Bitwig. They very quick at inovating SW and you can join to their modular thing with easy modular integration of their devices. Fast and reliable Bitwig/Midi to CV interface with audio and CV inputs/outputs. For others there could be Midi to cv variant/settings.
Old 16th April 2018
  #336
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kurzweil's Avatar
How about a hybrid approach?
Complete voice system, with CV and audio patch points for each part of the synth so that vco or vcf can be patched out our bypassed as required. But the normal voice signal path is hard wired too.
Similar approach to the Neutron overall, bit with more patch points to bypass components if needed.

I'm not a big fan of having to use ten patch cables just to get a basic voice going and it seems arcane to me; use the patching to do unusual patching or to replace/bypass components I suggest.
Old 16th April 2018
  #337
Here for the gear
 

We've got oscillators and filters up to our eyeballs. And we do love our boutique builders and are never leaving them. Ever. So I believe one area where a company with Behringer's resources and abilities could make the most difference is in the area of Performance Sequencer/Realtime Controller innovations. I've dreamed for years of a perfect interactive "instrument" interface that took the most advantage of the tools we have at our fingers. Imagine some wonderful kind of infinitely playable monster child with modular scraps of DNA from the Buchla Thunder, Serge TKB, Linnstrument, Koma Komplex, FutureRetro512, Sequentix Cirklon, Buchla MARF, Electron 'trigs', Numerology, the mythical Snyderphonics JD-1 and more - all geared up in the service of live performance and improvisation. Now we're talking, right?
Old 16th April 2018
  #338
Here for the gear
 

Buchla in Eurorack

Hi Uli
Please clone Buchla modules at an affordable price
Thanks
cheers klanglicht
Old 16th April 2018
  #339
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Entrainer View Post
I was referring to the "locked" status of the thread. Discussion of the topic was shut down.
Oh, hmm... did not see that. Thanks.
Old 16th April 2018
  #340
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kurzweil's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex View Post
Here's the elephant in the room.

Eurorack is a fad, and we're approaching the peak of the fad with the introduction of cheap mass-produced modules. The industry moves in cycles (1970s mono synths, early 80s polys, digital synths and workstations through the 1990s, the emergence of softsynths in the 2000s, the rise of Eurorack in the 2010s).

Eurorack is an expensive and fiddly collector's hobby. A desktop mono or polysynth is far more practical than a eurorack system. Patching is fun. Step sequencing is fun. Having oscillators from three different companies is fun. But at the end of the day, my cheap $400 Novation Bass Station II with patch memories and a lack of spaghetti wires all over the control surface is much more musical, useful and transportable.
While I can also see the good side of modular for doing experimental patching, we have a Doepfer system in the studio that often sounds much less interesting and much more noisy than the Bass Station II sitting next to it. It's also constantly needing repair as the patch points get broken by heavy-handed users, and we need to replace patch cables constantly too. If the reactions of the younger musicians are anything to go by, modular in its current form needs to evolve.
Old 17th April 2018
  #341
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex View Post

Eurorack is an expensive and fiddly collector's hobby. A desktop mono or polysynth is far more practical than a eurorack system.
A Eurorack system should not be compared to a bunch of standalone synths, it's not the idea.. it's more comparable to a DAW with plugins but with hands-on controls. It's a great for live performances, unlike a DAW.

Collectors hobby, sure. Same can be said for people using a DAW and collecting plugins.
Old 17th April 2018
  #342
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analogsynth's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by White Falcon View Post
For the modules:

- Start with the basic (musical) stuff. A more expensive 99$ (discrete) line with a Moog oscillator, filter, LFO, envelope and mixer based on the Mini and/or Moog modular. A cheaper 49$ line with a 3340 oscillator, 3320 filter, V2164 envelope etc. from CoolAudio.

'What legacy modular systems would you like us to make?'

This:

I've read all the posts and suggestions so far and post #2 is still the best, a miniature Eurorack sized clone of a System 15 seems to be the obvious one to make. I'd pre-order it in a heartbeat if it's less than $1000 (provided it's the same build quality and attention to detail as the Behringer Model D which I have two of now).

Also really like the System 100m style prototypes that Uli presented, if those modules are $100 each, I'd pre-order five of those too plus the case.
Old 17th April 2018
  #343
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robinkle's Avatar
I’d love a miniature system 55 with wood cabinet.
Old 17th April 2018
  #344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squarehead View Post
A Eurorack system should not be compared to a bunch of standalone synths, it's not the idea.. it's more comparable to a DAW with plugins but with hands-on controls. It's a great for live performances, unlike a DAW.

Collectors hobby, sure. Same can be said for people using a DAW and collecting plugins.
Wouldn't compare it to a "DAW with plugins". It's a system for cobbling up wtv audio* generating/manipulating device you desire, similar to how LEGO bricks are a system for building your own toys (or other things). While not always the most efficient, it is the most flexible, customizable, and open ended.

*Mainly audio, can be control alone, can also be video, or other things.
Old 17th April 2018
  #345
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcearl View Post
Why dont you just answer “Id like you to produce no eurorack” and move on?
Seeing as I've been on the forum since the year it started you could probably stop telling me what to post, but yeah....
I have no problem with Behringer making affordable Eurorack cases. I have no problem with Behringer offering unique Eurorack modules at an affordable price. I have a problem with Behringer undercutting currently offered modules, just copying others with a cheap knockoff approach.
And there is form on this, as so far the only modules proposed by Behringer are cheap Roland knockoffs.
Old 17th April 2018
  #346
Few people are asking for unique modules.
Just above this post for example....
Moog '15' modules, when small company AJH already have a full suite.
Buchla modules, when Catalyst and Make Noise already have that covered.
Roland 100M, when Roland themselves have that covered, as well as Frequency Central, Intellijel and System80.
So it really just comes down to undercutting smaller makers in the Euro scene.
Old 17th April 2018
  #347
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurzweil View Post
If the reactions of the younger musicians are anything to go by, modular in its current form needs to evolve.
It's more likely that younger musicians will 'evolve'; out of it.
Old 17th April 2018
  #348
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurzweil View Post
Complete voice system, with CV and audio patch points for each part of the synth so that vco or vcf can be patched out our bypassed as required. But the normal voice signal path is hard wired too.
.
Isn't that the Moog Mother 32 and DFAM?
Old 17th April 2018
  #349
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Coorec's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
How so?
They put in the hours of R&D.
They go out on a limb, investing their own money hoping people will like it and they'll recoup. Then a bigger outfit comes along, copies the idea and sells it more cheaply.
And by the way, I've seen it with my own eyes in a different area of equipment.
Because they will have innovative products, which should sell due to the innovation.

I have yet to see a product from Berhinger thats a copy of someone elses recent innovation.

If they copy, they copy old designs. And their innovations so far came from their own development teams.
Old 17th April 2018
  #350
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I think it's worth noting that B's interest in vintage designs isn't just because they're in high demand: it's also because they're getting old enough now to become unprotected free for all designs.

By my understanding anyway. Not a lawyer.
Old 17th April 2018
  #351
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Yoozer's Avatar
Reissue the stuff nobody is making, not even the small cottage industries. E-mu modular. Polyfusion.

Alternatively, allow smaller mfgs that have trouble meeting demands to publish signature series at bigger scale.
Old 17th April 2018
  #352
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Stolle's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
Buchla modules, when Catalyst and Make Noise already have that covered.
I love the sound of the Buchla 100 (from recordings and youtube videos, as I've never heard one in person), but the Catalyst modules are out of my price range. I would love for Behringer to co-operate with Catalyst to manufacture the same modules for a cheaper price. (Though, maybe it is a little weird to license designs from Catalyst when the designs are really Buchla.)

My own prediction is that innovative makers such as Mutable instruments have nothing to fear from the competition of Behringer, whereas people just selling old classic designs at a premium price will suffer. But maybe that is just a risk you take if you release modules based on a minimoog for example. Doepfer's a-120 Moog filter is sold at a third of the price at which AJH sells their Moog filter. What is different about Behringer doing the same? Is the difference that we have reason to think that Behringer, unlike Doepfer (supposedly), will make a Minimoog filter which is of the same high quality as AJH?

I'm positive to this development. Other makers will just have to adapt and I think we consumers will be better off for it.

Last edited by Stolle; 17th April 2018 at 08:34 AM..
Old 17th April 2018
  #353
I think the Catalyst Buchla are that price because he’s tried as much as possible to stay true to the original designs. It isn’t cheap, common chips that approximate the Buchla design.
As to Doepfer vs AJH, I think it’s a common view that AJH absolutely nailed the vintage Moog sound. I’ve never seen that said about the Doepfer ladder filter. It’s just a decent lpf for the price.
Old 17th April 2018
  #354
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pppch's Avatar
 

why not 6he double eurorack. what has always bothered me so far is the dwarfish size plus the modules like to disappear under the cables.
could also make it broader.
the approach of the neutron all patch jacks on one side, I think synonymous not bad.

if you look at the deterrent example it is useless

Old 17th April 2018
  #355
Here for the gear
 

A serge VCS/DUSG/p-slew/n-slew clone
Old 17th April 2018
  #356
Gear Maniac
 
Stolle's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
I think the Catalyst Buchla are that price because he’s tried as much as possible to stay true to the original designs. It isn’t cheap, common chips that approximate the Buchla design.
Cool! But then, doesn't that suggest that Catalyst audio has nothing to fear from Behringer since Behringer will not be using those special chips? People who want the genuine stuff will pay the premium price. The situation would be same as Doepfer 120 vs AJH filter. I don't see why you are so worried about Catalyst.
Old 17th April 2018
  #357
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Mushy Mushy's Avatar
 

Bluetooth modular is the way forward. I can't stand the mess of cables.
Old 17th April 2018
  #358
Gear Nut
 

Really glad to see this thread, this is awesome. Some various things I'd like to see:

4 (or >) channel Midi-to-CV/gate module, AD envelope, VCA, - A space-efficient way of getting four or more midi signals out for percussive sounds

Basic sample playback module with an audio input or usb (rather than SD card) sample xfer

Filter module with a series of bandpass/notch filters+ a delay, sort of a pared-down adaptation of the Eventide H3000 "band delays"

As others have mentioned: whole array of CV-controllable fx modules, perhaps inspired by some of your existing products

Any other unique sound generators/processors, etc.
Old 17th April 2018
  #359
RiF
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RiF's Avatar
FX
FX
FX
FX
Please put all your pedals in Eurorack format! Eurorack is missing FX heavily.

Don‘t just copy existing modules, please.
Old 17th April 2018
  #360
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso View Post
So it really just comes down to undercutting smaller makers in the Euro scene.
Is that necessarily bad? What if 2,000 people of different economic realities now have access to something previously unaffordable?

Did Warm Audio's cheaper clones of the LA2A, 1073, u87 destroy the desire/market for the more expensive boutique clones or official versions? Did the Deepmind 6 kill sales of the OB-6? Or are they a different tier of market? I don't know the answer, which is why I'm asking.

My inclination is people who can afford the more expensive versions still purchase them, for whatever reason (sound quality, percieved status, etc).

I think people will still support the boutique eurorack makers and a different, new market will buy Behringer Eurorack.

Last edited by Entrainer; 17th April 2018 at 06:15 PM..
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